Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 Red Corsair wrote:
The thing is, whats most frustrating is it's 90% there.

All it needed was higher suspension and larger tires.

It's the minor details that make me laugh. Why do the rear tires have forward facing armor, but not the front?

Somebody really misses the Tumbler from the Nolan Batverse.

Looking at how the front-axle is designed, it looks like its RWD and only has brakes on the rear wheels so there's more to protect back there.

 Crimson wrote:
That techmarine gunner reminds me that I really wish they'd release a proper primaris techmarine. It is the only classic marine specialists not having an upgrade.

The gunner reminds me that they're trying to solve a problem that Space Marines don't have.

I get it conceptually- being able drop support weapons and anti-armor to a forward position is a real thing military people have cared about for almost a hundred years.
Except... space marines have man-portable support and anti-armor weapons that they carry with them normally, and they're able to drop armor units (both dreads and actual tanks) to forward positions already. So a static gun platform doesn't actually fix a problem space marines actually have, and given their emphasis on mobile, offensive strike warfare, its actually a burden to their methodology. (Especially when you throw in the idea that marines don't like the idea of abandoning or spiking wargear, affront to the machine spirits and all that).


Also, snaking ammo belts around corners and bending again to fit into the actual feed mechanism on the front side of the armor plate is... stupid.

GW designers need to stick to far out sci-fi and magic crap. Every time they try to ground models in real world sensibilities they make an awful mess.

 Asmodai wrote:

Looking at how the front-axle is designed, it looks like its RWD and only has brakes on the rear wheels so there's more to protect back there.

More, yes. But you still need to protect where the wheel joins the vehicle!

And the controls, and you might want armor that's wider than the pilot and the gunner.

And the ammo feed on the pointlessly static gun.

How are people noticing the lack of ground clearance but not that the height of the buggy and bike is clearly adjustable?

The buggy looks better on the video than it does in the still picture. The picture makes it look short and stubby, whilst in reality is quite long. The front is definitely the weakest part (both structurally and stylistically) and I think it would have benefited from some extra armour. I have to see what I can do about that.

I would love to see those gun emplacements coming with a primaris drop pod.

Voss wrote:

Danny76 wrote:
The clearance on the bikes just behind that front wheel..

Think about the suspension for that front tire as well. That casing behind the wheel is going to scrape on a perfectly average road if it goes up hill at even slight incline.

Doesn't seem that different from real high performance bikes:


Plus, it's 40K, for all we know it has radar and active suspension that keeps it from hitting road at all times...

 Chamberlain wrote:

They are sort of on a stormcast path with primaris aren't they?

Basic battle dudes
Sneaky guys called vanguard
Riders

So in 18 months should we expect the psyhic primaris to come out to mirror the Sacrosanct chamber of the stormcast?

Dude, I had no idea stormcast were released 10 years ago:

https://www.games-workshop.com/Vanguard-Squad-2015

Oh, wait, no, 30 years ago:

https://www.games-workshop.com/Space-Marine-Bike-Squad-2017

And wait till you find out this exists

https://www.games-workshop.com/Space-Marine-Librarian

Voss wrote:
Lore aside- what kings did the Ultramarines slay? Their video refers to them as 'kingslayers' and I've absolutely no idea why.

Because that had been their fluff quote for like, ages now?

Voss wrote:

ListenToMeWarriors wrote:
The two additional Primaris units are giving me strong Easy To Build vibes. The new Necrons and Marines are overall great stuff...but that ATV is atrocious.

Yeah, That's... uh. Something. Giving me "It's not stupid, it's advanced!" vibes.

But sure. Leave out armor on the front of your vehicle. What could possibly go wrong? Especially when your gunner can only traverse so much, and you'll be facing the enemy basically always.

Yeah, there is no way any real special forces would use exactly this vehicle in multiple major wars. Just look at these clowns:


Oh wait I like how GW can basically copy any number of modern scout buggies and you will still find armchair experts whining real equipment is unrealistic

The turret would be better if it was not crewed. It looks like it should be for guard not new advanced space marines. Also, it says the alternate version has twin las-talons. Why put the shorter range version of a lascannon on this static gun? It makes even less sense when you have the las cannon sniper dudes.

I love the new impractical bikes which makes the ATV even sadder. :( hopefully the landspeeder replacement is better. I want to have cool looking primaris ravenwing. It’s almost funny that one of the ATV weapon options is a multimelta given everything else is oldgun +1.

I like the new Gravis dudes a lot, but I don’t understand why so many people have sticks coming out from their guns at weird angles to hold with the alternate hand instead of a normal grip. It just looks like lazy sculpt to me.

JSG wrote:
How are people noticing the lack of ground clearance but not that the height of the buggy and bike is clearly adjustable?

I must be missing something, where do they seem to be adjustable?

 Leth wrote:
ATV makes me happy, just like the bikes do.

I am always surprised at what breaks immersion for people. 7ft tall super soldiers wielding automatic grenade launchers? Fine.

Bike model doesn’t have enough ground clearance? Hey now, I am missing out on my realism.

7 foot supersoldiers wielding automatic grenade launchers are both conceivable and plausible, in an abstract sense.

The idea someone would purposefully design a military all-terrain bike with less than an inch of ground clearance isn't. I don't care how dark and gothic your future is, the design literally wouldn't function in its intended purpose. It's not about "realism" it's about basic verisimilitude and internal consistency - you can do all kinds of "unrealistic" stuff providing there's some comprehensible logic behind it, even if that logic bears no resemblance to reality. The issue is there's nothing about the logic of 40K that suggests a wheeled ground vehicle doesn't actually function like a wheeled ground vehicle. If you're just going to completely discard any attempt at making sense, why not go all the way? Make the bikes out of cheese, have them shoot breadsticks. Afterall, rEaLiSM iS dUmB BruH right

 Ghaz wrote:

 Shadow Walker wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:
Why do the rear tires have forward facing armor, but not the front?

And now I cannot unsee it

The best I can do is to say it's to protect the tire from the spent shell casing from the minigun.

I appreciate the effort, but god help them if all it takes are casings to immobilize it

 Irbis wrote:

Dude, I had no idea stormcast were released 10 years ago:

And yet we're seeing a pretty close mirror. Reset with endtimes/gathering storm. Basic dudes, sneaky dudes, rider dudes.

It doesn't matter that both stormcast and marines use ideas from decades ago. My point is that things are mirroring enough that I would almost bet money on the next primaris versus set having psychic dudes.

 Asmodai wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:
The thing is, whats most frustrating is it's 90% there.

All it needed was higher suspension and larger tires.

It's the minor details that make me laugh. Why do the rear tires have forward facing armor, but not the front?

Somebody really misses the Tumbler from the Nolan Batverse.

Looking at how the front-axle is designed, it looks like its RWD and only has brakes on the rear wheels so there's more to protect back there.

As a car guy I can tell you it doesn't do this thing ANY favors to start looking at it with that kind of eye.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Random thought: Assault Intercessor Sergeants will have no weapon options outside of HBP/Chainsword because that's all the model has.

I expect power sword and fist option when the multipart kit rolls around. Probably plasma pistol too.

Buggy, not a fan. Much rather a trike with say the gunner rear facing. Or make it a servitor turret. Probably going to pass on it. Firestrike turret though is a huge win. To the point multiple batteries worth for me.

Replying to you both by quoting the whole thing, if that's ok.

endlesswaltz123 wrote:

ERJAK wrote:

 Binabik15 wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Another primaris vehicle that looks like it was designed by Hasbro. It's a good thing it'll probably have ridiculous rules to make it sell.

It looks simply atrocious. Even if they HAD to do something that's not just a bigger attack bike they had all those Landspeeder-on-wheels conversion to copy.

I really like the Primaris bikes, though, and old school attack bikes, so I'll try and cobble together something that looks like a proper support vehicle. Maybe one of the new bikes or two with Landspeeder bits and really go for "bigger attack bike".

The Primaris Dakkagun I'm unsure about, I need more angles (on my phone, so haven't watched the video).

Depending on price I'll have to get some to turn into extreme Dakka Mek Gunz, at least.

Love the buggy. It's ridiculous like all 40k stuff should be. Wish it had a few more guns on it but it's still pretty great as is.

Also, attack bikes looked stupid. Having a sidecar like that is and always has been really dumb.

The side cars on attack bikes are daft, you can't fire to the right of you, ever... And they just look dumb.

The Wehrmacht had bikes with MG-armed sidecars and I was always sure that this was the inspiration for the attack bike. Given how 40k is more "WW1 in space" compared to more modern tactics I found the idea of the more advanced SM having access to "WW2 in spaaaace" units fitting. I dunno, an attack bike is just the right amount of stupid for me. The ATV in my eyes is just more of the impractical-but-tacticool of everything touched by Cawl turned up to 11.

I guess the ATV and spindly Necron walker will be priced like the EtB dread? Guesses on the dakkagun?

I like pretty much everything shown, EXCEPT the buggy.

It lacks the compact chassis of every other SM vehicle and it's a pointlessly wheeled version of an older, superior grav vehicle design, in a SM range that is all about grav vehicles.

I don't even see how one would go about fixing the problems with the overall shape of that thing.

Voss wrote:

 Crimson wrote:
That techmarine gunner reminds me that I really wish they'd release a proper primaris techmarine. It is the only classic marine specialists not having an upgrade.

So a static gun platform doesn't actually fix a problem space marines actually have, and given their emphasis on mobile, offensive strike warfare, its actually a burden to their methodology. (Especially when you throw in the idea that marines don't like the idea of abandoning or spiking wargear, affront to the machine spirits and all that).

But not all space marines are equal? I mean. That thing is perfectly fine for something like Imperial Fists, Dark Angels and Crimson Fists. Maybe not for White Scars but not all marines are expected to use all the units.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Random thought: Assault Intercessor Sergeants will have no weapon options outside of HBP/Chainsword because that's all the model has.

I expect power sword and fist option when the multipart kit rolls around. Probably plasma pistol too.

One of the pictures shows the sergeant holding a plasma pistol.

I expect power sword and fist option when the multipart kit rolls around. Probably plasma pistol too.

There is a Plasma Pistol shown in the images. If the sgt has no power weapon options I don't know what use these guys will be. Regular Intercessors will fight better with their Power Weapon wielding Sgt against almost everything, while shooting better and still having the advantage of being Troops. Unless they really do give Chainswords an AP value. Then things might be different.

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Another primaris vehicle that looks like it was designed by Hasbro. It's a good thing it'll probably have ridiculous rules to make it sell.

My thoughts were almost exactly this. Looks like it could have come right off the 1987 GI-Joe line or early 90's kid's Power Wheels

 Chamberlain wrote:
Not in the starter but some time in the future:

It kinda looks like a new bike was cut in half and the buggy part inserted between the halves.

I know it ISN'T, but that's the vibe it gives off.

Huh.

(Also nice of 'em to pre-paint it looted blue for the Orks!)

 Galas wrote:

Voss wrote:

 Crimson wrote:
That techmarine gunner reminds me that I really wish they'd release a proper primaris techmarine. It is the only classic marine specialists not having an upgrade.

So a static gun platform doesn't actually fix a problem space marines actually have, and given their emphasis on mobile, offensive strike warfare, its actually a burden to their methodology. (Especially when you throw in the idea that marines don't like the idea of abandoning or spiking wargear, affront to the machine spirits and all that).

But not all space marines are equal? I mean. That thing is perfectly fine for something like Imperial Fists, Dark Angels and Crimson Fists. Maybe not for White Scars but not all marines are expected to use all the units.

White Scars are a codex chapter with the exact same organization as the Fists and the Fists. Dark Angels move them around, but the numbers are still similar. The 'bikes bikes bikes' is just a meme- their battle companies still have 10 squads of 6 tacticals, 2 assault and 2 devastators... which except for assault squads, are bringing lots of man portable support weapons (and the assault squads are bringing short ranged stuff). They don't need this. They do need techmarines on foot actually fixing their vehicles.

But fluff organization aside, you're missing the point- there is no point in deploying a fixed point autocannon or lascannon turret when you can just drop in a predator or dreadnought (the latter directly from orbit in a drop pod), which can just do the exact same job and move on afterwards. The autocannon version of the turret is completely pointless with the existing primaris unit that brings in autocannon marines with jump packs- just as easy (or easier) to deploy and more firepower (3 guns vs 2).
It solves a non-existent problem.

I for one like all of it. There isn't a single unit I don't like the look of in either of those previews. I really really like the new cryptek & his bucketmen, the bladeguard stuff is all great to me, the new banner guy also stands out... Man there is just so much I like here and I don't even play either of those armies.

And does anyone else find the paint work on the necron metal plating to be absolutely fantastic? Really pushing the bar there.

The *only* thing I don't like is that the legs of the Biker Marines are physically attached to the bikes at a couple spots.

I hope the general release bike kit doesn't have this same issue.

That buggy is getting some serious work if I decide to get it for my Ravenwing. Not sure if it's really needed though, onslaught gatler vs assault cannon of regular speeders?

However, the front needs changing...some different armour plate, something that protrudes further out the front, heck maybe even an Invictor cage around the driver.

I guess I have a problem with all the primaris vehicles...just pure ugliness...repulsor, impulsor, now this.... awful looking. Thank God my Ravenguard are all foot sloggers.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

And does anyone else find the paint work on the necron metal plating to be absolutely fantastic? Really pushing the bar there.

they said there will be a new bronze primer and washes to paint the Necrons (I guess Contrast was not good enough)

It’s the Imperium, they have gimp controlled perpetual motion machines that they have to transport on treadmills because if they stop moving they can’t start them again. My realism switch is just completely turned off at this point.

No problem with other people having it, I am just surprised by what suspends people’s disbelief rather than assuming some devs ex bs makes it work like there is for everything else.

Never said it was bad or wrong.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Voss wrote:

 Galas wrote:

Voss wrote:

 Crimson wrote:
That techmarine gunner reminds me that I really wish they'd release a proper primaris techmarine. It is the only classic marine specialists not having an upgrade.

So a static gun platform doesn't actually fix a problem space marines actually have, and given their emphasis on mobile, offensive strike warfare, its actually a burden to their methodology. (Especially when you throw in the idea that marines don't like the idea of abandoning or spiking wargear, affront to the machine spirits and all that).

But not all space marines are equal? I mean. That thing is perfectly fine for something like Imperial Fists, Dark Angels and Crimson Fists. Maybe not for White Scars but not all marines are expected to use all the units.

White Scars are a codex chapter with the exact same organization as the Fists and the Fists. Dark Angels move them around, but the numbers are still similar. The 'bikes bikes bikes' is just a meme- their battle companies still have 10 squads of 6 tacticals, 2 assault and 2 devastators... which except for assault squads, are bringing lots of man portable support weapons (and the assault squads are bringing short ranged stuff). They don't need this. They do need techmarines on foot actually fixing their vehicles.

But fluff organization aside, you're missing the point- there is no point in deploying a fixed point autocannon or lascannon turret when you can just drop in a predator or dreadnought (the latter directly from orbit in a drop pod), which can just do the exact same job and move on afterwards. The autocannon version of the turret is completely pointless with the existing primaris unit that brings in autocannon marines with jump packs- just as easy (or easier) to deploy and more firepower (3 guns vs 2).
It solves a non-existent problem.

I mean, don’t marines defend positions? Bet this is a lot cheaper than a predator and easier to get to a higher location. Spending a lot of points on mobility when you don’t need it is rough, same with buying he predator chassis resulting in more of an all in one basket cost.

To be perfectly honest? I think a lot of these units are there to help fill out the force org slots that were prohibitively expensive otherwise. A reasonable cheap fast attack and heavy support will go a long way towards making a battalion feasible.

Only thing you need to "fix" the buggy is 2 bald screaming heads to replace the helmets, and have, at least the driver, vielding a close combat weapon.

Seriously though, most of the stuff looks great. Really impressed with the new Necron direction, just hinting at a Giger style weird biomechanics.

 Chamberlain wrote:
Not in the starter but some time in the future:

How does he aim left? There is a giant metal spike in the way

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
I for one like all of it. There isn't a single unit I don't like the look of in either of those previews. I really really like the new cryptek & his bucketmen, the bladeguard stuff is all great to me, the new banner guy also stands out... Man there is just so much I like here and I don't even play either of those armies.

And does anyone else find the paint work on the necron metal plating to be absolutely fantastic? Really pushing the bar there.

Me too- liking it all and I don't have either faction. The Necrons are really awesome - I love the new look and that paint scheme is amazing. The tall towering constructs are really cool and the army has a real creep factor going on. I could see myself painting the marines as blood angels or flesh tearers and doing the necrons in heavilyweathered and chipped metals ..

The other question. is will there be a starter set as well- you'd think so , so it will be interesting to see how they sale down to that after this..

But the sculpt quality is amazing, really shows how they have moved forward in the last few years, can't wait for them to refresh NIds in a similar manner to Necrons, but very tempted to start a small Necron force in the meantime.

 Leth wrote:

I mean, don’t marines defend positions? Bet this is a lot cheaper than a predator and easier to get to a higher location. Spending a lot of points on mobility when you don’t need it is rough, same with buying he predator chassis resulting in more of an all in one basket cost.

Sure. Put a devastator squad in a trench. Or eliminators. Or hellblasters. Or... etc.
Need a higher position? Well... suppressors do exactly that. With basically the same gun. (there are many other ways to get las-talons or lascannons).

To be perfectly honest? I think a lot of these units are there to help fill out the force org slots that were prohibitively expensive otherwise. A reasonable cheap fast attack and heavy support will go a long way towards making a battalion feasible.

We're talking about marines here- no help is needed 'filling out' the force org. The most limited force org squad is troops... with a staggering 5 options currently (probably soon to be 6 with the assault primaris). FA is going from 8 choices to at least 10 with this release, plenty of which are already dirt cheap.

Also, nothing but 2 HQ and 3 Troops are required for the 9th edition battalion:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/06/04/taking-command-of-your-pointsgw-homepage-post-1/