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Happygeorge wrote:
Wow what a lot of people whose lives have been utterly ruined bu not getting some plastic figures exactly when they wanted them. I was not surprised when I didn't get an order and then was nicely surprised to learn I had actually secures one despite the out of stock messages when I checked out.

But the range of these emotions was entirely inline with them being a plastic toy and I was still warm, dry, had running water and was not likely to be shot at any point in the near future.

The scale of emotion leads me to believe my box could make someone very happy if they want to put a price on that happiness.

But isn't this just evidence of the triumph of GW's marketing apparatus? That they can make grown men and women so desperate for their tiny plastic soldiers that GW not being able to immediately take their money and exchange it for said plastic toys causes such profound mental anguish?

Those that live by the sword die by the sword. GW can't on the one hand spend so much time and effort creating this brand loyalty and desperation and on the other hand wash their hands of it and say "these people are crazy" when they flub something up.

Thing is some scalpers have had preorders up on ebay for nigh on two weeks, no doubt the suckers will have been expecting more boxes than they actually got. Most of their pre order auctions are filled with provisos that the auction is dependent upon getting a supply so hopefully a lot of them have been burned and are now furiously having to offer refunds. Not sure if PayPal or ebay take any cut on that but even if they have not lost some money they will certainly have wasted a lot of time. Small joys and all that.

ListenToMeWarriors wrote:
Thing is some scalpers have had preorders up on ebay for nigh on two weeks, no doubt the suckers will have been expecting more boxes than they actually got. Most of their pre order auctions are filled with provisos that the auction is dependent upon getting a supply so hopefully a lot of them have been burned and are now furiously having to offer refunds. Not sure if PayPal or ebay take any cut on that but even if they have not lost some money they will certainly have wasted a lot of time. Small joys and all that.

I don't know about financial but their store might get black marks from Ebay for a lot of returns and they might also get negative reviews from those customers. That said a pro scalper will likely have several store names and rotate stock around. Casually using easy sale items to build up a good base reputation and having back-ups to dump incase of problems.

I see it as the most amazing feat of marketing in gaming pretty much ever.

On one hand its arguably to many people the worst ruleset in existence with the worst balance skews ever known.

On the other hand, it sells out in 5 minutes every time they do a new edition and people can't stop buying it regardless of how bad the rules are.

Its certainly worth a case study and entire chapter in university level marketing and game development courses.

it's only woefully insufficient stock if they had planned on making X(#) and didnt. I'm quite sure that GW made the amount they did based on previous/projected sales. If they messed up and made too many, no one would be irate(except for accountants) & if they made too few...ooooh gak watch out.

I dont understand why people aren't in uproar over the ridiculous scalping going on. The easiest way to hurt them is to exercise some restraint and NOT SUPPORT THEIR PRICE GOUGING! As long as morons(little ittybitty babies cant get the toys they want)are willingly throwing money at 3rd parties to split up the boxes, they will continue to thrive.

Let's be honest here, we(the community) have a problem & that problem is entitlement. GW straight up said it was limited & even tho they made a shittonne, it was limited nonetheless.

Has GW gak the bed with regards to this release? Short answer, Yes. is it complete diarrhea everywhere in the sheets, bedspread etc.... no.
The world is not gonna end if you dont get your plastic toys

 Overread wrote:

Icegoat wrote:

 Crusaderobr wrote:
I honestly wouldent worry too much if you missed out. They will realize they need to make more and it will go up for sale again. Just keep your eyes peeled in the coming days/weeks.

aah yes just like the sob box and the looncurse and the feast of bones box did??? Why are you even defending this. They are not producing more and if they could why didn they before the pre order? If they wanted to produce more they easily could have the fact they didnt is very telling. Heck if they are making more why would it go out of stock print on demand for ever and ever a million boxes a million million. No GW have once again created false hype and false exclusivity to maximise profits and screw their loyal customers

Looncurse, Feast of Bones and Sisters of Battle are indeed out of production.
ALL Of the models that were present in those sets are, however, now on individual model sale. You can go right now and buy them from the GW website.

The only exception is some of the SOB models are being sold now as full kits not as single pushfits so there is some sculpt variation, though the complete sets have way more parts and options to them so many would consider them an improvement.

So sure GW only makes short term sales - short term. However the models are all on individual sale. The Primaris and Necron content you'll be able to one day go into your GW store or online or to a 3rd party and buy them fresh off the shelf in a box. Some, like the 4 legged necron walker, will likely even come with optional parts to make other variations and some might be put into a getting started set for some discount (eg warriors)

GW puts some significant lag time between new models in a bundle and new models on their own.

Now, they almost certainly won't for most of indomitus, because space marines, and necrons are being set for a new release. But my AoS army, KO, still doesn;t have the new, frankly required, character (I don't mind, I stopped playing AoS). Many Ghoul players waited months and months and months to get their essentially required character. And this is, of course, a marketing ploy.

While bikes and new cron warriors will get a new release quick, I'd keep an eye on how long it takes for the judicar, or the skorpekh lord to come out on its own.

I wasn't really all that bothered about getting one but I went on the website and saw the price and decide to get it, no crashing, no out of stock. I may even get another when they go on sale in store. All those people who thinks it's the end of the world that they didn't get to feed their plastic crack habit for two weeks need to have their attitudes adjusted.

The basic problem is that GW have seemingly sold something massively below what the market is willing to bear. Thats great for those who get it, and obviously induces frustration in those who miss out.

GW will have to ask themselves whether selling something like £450 of stuff for £125 (or less in all the FLGS across the globe) makes sense - but at the end of the day, if they have produced 150k kits (no idea if this was the total, but it was a figure thrown around on forums), and they have all sold, making circa £15m in a Saturday morning isn't exactly bad business.

I'm sure they will be asking questions of whether another 50-100k of kits will sell, and so another print run is justified. But the question of supplying ebay sales for years, and so undermining all the individual kit sales, will remain.

 auticus wrote:
I see it as the most amazing feat of marketing in gaming pretty much ever.

On one hand its arguably to many people the worst ruleset in existence with the worst balance skews ever known.

On the other hand, it sells out in 5 minutes every time they do a new edition and people can't stop buying it regardless of how bad the rules are.

Its certainly worth a case study and entire chapter in university level marketing and game development courses.

Right? I had the option of ordering one, when I checked the website out of curiosity. But $200, for 23 fewer minis than Pelennor, and junk rules? No way.

I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

If people are having a good time and enjoying themselves, how are they burning their money? That sounds like what anyone wants out of a good hobby.

 auticus wrote:
I see it as the most amazing feat of marketing in gaming pretty much ever.

On one hand its arguably to many people the worst ruleset in existence with the worst balance skews ever known.

On the other hand, it sells out in 5 minutes every time they do a new edition and people can't stop buying it regardless of how bad the rules are.

Its certainly worth a case study and entire chapter in university level marketing and game development courses.

Dripping with arrogance and hyperbole. Good job.

 Sasori wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

If people are having a good time and enjoying themselves, how are they burning their money? That sounds like what anyone wants out of a good hobby.

A good point.

Lots of folk - both rich and poor - spend their money on some very ridiculous things, because they can and it makes them happy.

I'm not about to get into a philosophic debate regarding the whole "money can't buy happiness" thing.
Just pointing out that most of us know what we're getting into with 40K as far as spending cash, and we do it because it brings us something close to or precisely upon the feeling of fulfillment.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I see it as the most amazing feat of marketing in gaming pretty much ever.

On one hand its arguably to many people the worst ruleset in existence with the worst balance skews ever known.

On the other hand, it sells out in 5 minutes every time they do a new edition and people can't stop buying it regardless of how bad the rules are.

Its certainly worth a case study and entire chapter in university level marketing and game development courses.

Dripping with arrogance and hyperbole. Good job.

I forget, is it arrogance when its just something someone disagrees with?

 auticus wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I see it as the most amazing feat of marketing in gaming pretty much ever.

On one hand its arguably to many people the worst ruleset in existence with the worst balance skews ever known.

On the other hand, it sells out in 5 minutes every time they do a new edition and people can't stop buying it regardless of how bad the rules are.

Its certainly worth a case study and entire chapter in university level marketing and game development courses.

Dripping with arrogance and hyperbole. Good job.

I forget, is it arrogance when its just something someone disagrees with?

No, but the way you presented this is incredibly arrogant.

Why are you even here? Did you get tired of making everyone miserable in the AoS forums, so you figured you'd do the same thing here?

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

It certainly is terrible if people are having fun. We can't have that.

I bough the box because the models are amazing. Easily worth the money.

 Crimson wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

It certainly is terrible if people are having fun. We can't have that.

I bough the box because the models are amazing. Easily worth the money.

Value for money on that box is extremely good. Its about $3 per model (slightly less, in fact) and $20 for a hardback game book (with lots of the usual full color art and etc). Even if you talk about normal people's pricing and not GW pricing, that is quite good.
I wouldn't recommend it for people who don't have an interest in marines or necrons, but its quite the reasonable thing to want and buy for people that do have an interest.
And a few hiccups aside, they are indeed largely great models.


And if you want to consider GW pricing- there are 9 characters in this box, several with direct equivalents (lieutenant, chaplain, Overlord, etc). If/when they come out individually, those models alone will top $300


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 auticus wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I see it as the most amazing feat of marketing in gaming pretty much ever.

On one hand its arguably to many people the worst ruleset in existence with the worst balance skews ever known.

On the other hand, it sells out in 5 minutes every time they do a new edition and people can't stop buying it regardless of how bad the rules are.

Its certainly worth a case study and entire chapter in university level marketing and game development courses.

Dripping with arrogance and hyperbole. Good job.

I forget, is it arrogance when its just something someone disagrees with?

Well, for one thing, it is objectively wrong. Almost no edition of 40k, fantasy or AoS ever sold out before.

Though in fairness, this one didn't either. You can still get the rulebooks, just not the box set (whether that's because they understocked to sell out like they've done with 'new hero and old stuff' boxes, or because of the Covid shutdown is up in the air to anyone outside the company)

Ok my mistake, I'm reading on various facebooks right now that it sold out right away and that there are people already hawking it on ebay for $400 and $500, so thats where I got the "sold out in 5 minutes" thing from, since I have read from several posters that they tried for five or so minutes and couldn't get it because it sold out that fast.

8th edition as I recall also had a similar thing happen. It went fast and you couldn't get the books for a solid month or so until the restocking started happening.

AOS is... well. I won't get into what AOS is (IMO).

 auticus wrote:
I see it as the most amazing feat of marketing in gaming pretty much ever.

On one hand its arguably to many people the worst ruleset in existence with the worst balance skews ever known.

On the other hand, it sells out in 5 minutes every time they do a new edition and people can't stop buying it regardless of how bad the rules are.

Its certainly worth a case study and entire chapter in university level marketing and game development courses.

Dakka dakka is a forum with the collective id of a grumpy old man. Just how it is.

Also, this is hardly unique to GW. Video games do the exact same harmful psychological manipulation, and often much worse, and people, even when they hate it, still buy in. Because that's what psychological manipulation is supposed to do.

Kind of. The thing with video games though is typically unless its just blatant pay to win, if I buy a video game thats pvp, I don't have to invest a ton of money into buying the faction first, and the company doesn't then invalidate my faction by making it crap at their annual FAQ/"rebalancing" session that forces me to buy a new faction to keep playing.

I can just jump over to a different faction typically.

As bad as GW is about exploiting the FOMO fears of their more rabid fans, they don't have a candle on a company like EA and what they do in, say, the FIFA franchise.

Racerguy180 wrote:
it's only woefully insufficient stock if they had planned on making X(#) and didnt. I'm quite sure that GW made the amount they did based on previous/projected sales. If they messed up and made too many, no one would be irate(except for accountants) & if they made too few...ooooh gak watch out.

I dont understand why people aren't in uproar over the ridiculous scalping going on. The easiest way to hurt them is to exercise some restraint and NOT SUPPORT THEIR PRICE GOUGING! As long as morons(little ittybitty babies cant get the toys they want)are willingly throwing money at 3rd parties to split up the boxes, they will continue to thrive.

Let's be honest here, we(the community) have a problem & that problem is entitlement. GW straight up said it was limited & even tho they made a shittonne, it was limited nonetheless.

Has GW gak the bed with regards to this release? Short answer, Yes. is it complete diarrhea everywhere in the sheets, bedspread etc.... no.
The world is not gonna end if you dont get your plastic toys

They have had several super short sell outs, They would have know this product would. They know what they are doing. There marketing for the most part has been really good, no other way to put it. The debate is how deliberate is it. Make a Limited product, the last thing you want is for it all to go on sale in 2 weeks as you way overshot demand, But instead throw a second wave up to meet that demand in 2 weeks. no worry if you overshoot then, everyone just says you are making sure everyone that wants one gets one.


Also, having a look on the aus website since i like being depressed. They have the english box sold out online, and the german box on temp sold out Just of amusing to me today.

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

I don't understand that type of thinking. If socializing is the priority, why play 40k? Why not a cheaper game? Why not just hang out over a couple beers?

Blastaar wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

I don't understand that type of thinking. If socializing is the priority, why play 40k? Why not a cheaper game? Why not just hang out over a couple beers?

Because they like the models? Because they like the setting? Maybe, and this is a crazy thought, they actually like 40K as a game?

Blastaar wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

I don't understand that type of thinking. If socializing is the priority, why play 40k? Why not a cheaper game? Why not just hang out over a couple beers?

under 18 year olds can't go to pubs. stores won't risk investing in to a game, which maybe 5-6 people will play, who will not buy out the whole stick leaving them with money frozen in merch that never sells. And not everyone is good or interested in the social stuff, but are interested in doing something else then looking at a wall at home.


Quick related questions about the cost of the CA book, did in dollars or pound it also almost double in price comparing to 2019 one?

 Crimson wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

It certainly is terrible if people are having fun. We can't have that.

I bough the box because the models are amazing. Easily worth the money.

I wouldn't call them "amazing." The sculpts have some serious flaws. The captain posing for a photo shoot on the middle of the battlefield. The veterans who donned their tabards and armor in the wrong sequence. The grip on the super-meltas. The pig-nosed necrons. The goofy drapes on the characters. The unnecessarily-huge support structure for the tripods' melee weapons. I don't care for GW's move away from gauss rods, either- thankful 3rd parties still make them.

Continuing to buy minis, however pretty, does not encourage GW to write better rules, either.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Platuan4th wrote:

Blastaar wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

I don't understand that type of thinking. If socializing is the priority, why play 40k? Why not a cheaper game? Why not just hang out over a couple beers?

Because they like the models? Because they like the setting? Maybe, and this is a crazy thought, they actually like 40K as a game?

You misunderstand me. If socializing is the priority, not gaming, why bother with any game? Is it impossible for some folks to converse without chucking dice?

What's to like in 40k's gameplay, anyway? It's an exercise in rolling dice and removing models. 7th was more fun than this, despite the massive imbalance. Or maybe the brain-dead aspect is desirable, in our checked-out, lazy world.

Karol wrote:
Quick related questions about the cost of the CA book, did in dollars or pound it also almost double in price comparing to 2019 one?

Going by the RRP listings on one of my FLGS' website, CA19 was £20, while CA20 is £25. So a 25% increase, but not doubled.

CA18 has been offline for a while, so I can't compare back to that right now.

 auticus wrote:
Kind of. The thing with video games though is typically unless its just blatant pay to win, if I buy a video game thats pvp, I don't have to invest a ton of money into buying the faction first, and the company doesn't then invalidate my faction by making it crap at their annual FAQ/"rebalancing" session that forces me to buy a new faction to keep playing.

I can just jump over to a different faction typically.

At least GW's boxes tell you what's in them on the cover. Most video games these days don't give you that luxury...

Platuan4th wrote:

Blastaar wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

I don't understand that type of thinking. If socializing is the priority, why play 40k? Why not a cheaper game? Why not just hang out over a couple beers?

Because they like the models? Because they like the setting? Maybe, and this is a crazy thought, they actually like 40K as a game?

it's the sum total of its parts.

Blastaar wrote:

 Crimson wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

It certainly is terrible if people are having fun. We can't have that.

I bough the box because the models are amazing. Easily worth the money.

I wouldn't call them "amazing." The sculpts have some serious flaws. The captain posing for a photo shoot on the middle of the battlefield. The veterans who donned their tabards and armor in the wrong sequence. The grip on the super-meltas. The pig-nosed necrons. The goofy drapes on the characters. The unnecessarily-huge support structure for the tripods' melee weapons. I don't care for GW's move away from gauss rods, either- thankful 3rd parties still make them.

Continuing to buy minis, however pretty, does not encourage GW to write better rules, either.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Platuan4th wrote:

Blastaar wrote:

 auticus wrote:
I mean my area is going ga ga over it. They are pumping money hand over fist at GW. Its amazing.

Caveat most of those guys don't care if they get mudhole stomped by ITC lists, they think thats equally "fun". The socialization aspect of the game (the fact that every week in a non rona environment there are 20-30 40k guys piled into the room) is largely why they gleefully set their money on fire and throw it at GW.

I don't understand that type of thinking. If socializing is the priority, why play 40k? Why not a cheaper game? Why not just hang out over a couple beers?

Because they like the models? Because they like the setting? Maybe, and this is a crazy thought, they actually like 40K as a game?

You misunderstand me. If socializing is the priority, not gaming, why bother with any game? Is it impossible for some folks to converse without chucking dice?

What's to like in 40k's gameplay, anyway? It's an exercise in rolling dice and removing models. 7th was more fun than this, despite the massive imbalance. Or maybe the brain-dead aspect is desirable, in our checked-out, lazy world.

One thing that always keeps me and my friends coming back is the 40k universe. The setting. The factions. The detailed images and stories in all the books. 40k is not just about chucking dice, it rewards people who sit back and read a codex or a book on it and have an imagination. Just talking about 40k can be fun sometimes. Its just something to do other than have a few beers, which can get old. If your that bored go ride a fast sportbike on your way to the 40k hangout, you can stuff your models in a backpack. It will be alot more fun than driving a slow car there and on the way back. You will look forward to playing that day more I would think, especially if you like to pop some wheelies down the highway.