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 Nazgrim wrote:
Hi,

Do you think a list with morka / gorka or both is playable? Especially in semi-competitive?

I have two that are collecting dust and I don't want to wait another 6 months to play them (even if we are already waiting long enough for our new codex ).
I try to make lists with but nothing that impresses me to put on a table.

The morkanaut is a solid addition to any vehicle list, with sparkly bits and a KFF it actually has a decent chance of making back its points or at least massively soften the blow of an alpha-strike against your buggies. Most of my opponents target my scrapjets and SJD first these days, so the naut actually gets to live quite long and causes massive amounts of damage. The large base also makes it good at defending objectives.
The gorkanaut is rather hit-or-miss in my opinion. For many armies, it's rather easy to screen the large base out of valuable targets, and some - like DG or deathwing - might not have any good targets to begin with. The lack of a 5++ means you need to bring a mek along to protect it, or it will get shredded by all those AP-4 and -5 weapons out there. I usually use it to tune down my lists for friendly games.

Both seems like too many eggs in one basket - you can't hide them well and often you don't have enough room to have two giant walkers stoming down the field.

Mork really needs a durability buff, though.

The Kill tank is 65 points less, has 6 more wounds, ramshackle, and heals itself.

I really hope the Gork and Mork get some love, because Ork dreads are fun AF.

tulun wrote:
Mork really needs a durability buff, though.

The Kill tank is 65 points less, has 6 more wounds, ramshackle, and heals itself.

I really hope the Gork and Mork get some love, because Ork dreads are fun AF.

true. its already quite odd that a titanic model has more wounds, cost less and is.. titanic than a unit thats.. not titanic.

On a side note, i understand that the Gargantuan Squiggoth cannot both fallback, then shoot? I was under the assumption that all titanic models could both fall back, and shoot and charge in the same turn. Like it was some rule written somewhere.

Beardedragon wrote:

tulun wrote:
Mork really needs a durability buff, though.

The Kill tank is 65 points less, has 6 more wounds, ramshackle, and heals itself.

I really hope the Gork and Mork get some love, because Ork dreads are fun AF.

true. its already quite odd that a titanic model has more wounds, cost less and is.. titanic than a unit thats.. not titanic.

On a side note, i understand that the Gargantuan Squiggoth cannot both fallback, then shoot? I was under the assumption that all titanic models could both fall back, and shoot and charge in the same turn. Like it was some rule written somewhere.

Titanic can fall back and shoot due to being Titanic. In main rulebook I think.

And yeah. It's a bit silly. I'm guessing the Gork and Mork go Super Heavy, tbh.

tulun wrote:

Beardedragon wrote:

tulun wrote:
Mork really needs a durability buff, though.

The Kill tank is 65 points less, has 6 more wounds, ramshackle, and heals itself.

I really hope the Gork and Mork get some love, because Ork dreads are fun AF.

true. its already quite odd that a titanic model has more wounds, cost less and is.. titanic than a unit thats.. not titanic.

On a side note, i understand that the Gargantuan Squiggoth cannot both fallback, then shoot? I was under the assumption that all titanic models could both fall back, and shoot and charge in the same turn. Like it was some rule written somewhere.

Titanic can fall back and shoot due to being Titanic. In main rulebook I think.

And yeah. It's a bit silly. I'm guessing the Gork and Mork go Super Heavy, tbh.

so it can fall back and shoot? It just have an ability called "Gargantuan" that states it can fall back and charge, it doesnt say anything about shooting, so that made me confused.

But who knows, maybe the gork/morks will just become cheaper? I dont know. I dont feel like Kill tanks belong to titanic at this price tag to begin with.

Yes. All Titanic keyworded units automatically have fall back and shoot from a core rule.

Fall back and charge is gained through other special rules.

Me personally, I think a Morkanaut should just be BS4 base, since it more shooting dependent. A meka-dread is BS4 and that IA compendium is 9th edition based so it might happen. (Obviously sparkly bitz would go away or at the very least can't be stacked on top of that.

The Gorkanaut should be a bit faster so footslogging it feels more tempting IMO. It should certainly be the cheaper of the two but mayb you can also make it base WS2? Side note, does anyone else become sad when you take the slug gubbin and realise how much better that is than an entire dakkajet?

Other than that, give 'em both ramshackle because, as I've stated earlier I think all ork vehicles should have ramshackle. Comparing it to the kill tank (with the giga shoota) in durability is almost a bit unfair considering how cheap those wounds became for some reason. If bringing super heavies weren't such a pain in 9th then the kill tank would be legit good/almost great.

Honestly, I think the Triple KT list is already pretty damn good. I would be unsurprised with a buffed codex that it becomes a real legit list, as it's partially just held back by the CP cost and the general inefficiencies of Orks.

The only thing that might suck about it post codex is we actually might want CP again as Mech Orks.

In all honesty, after weapon tweaks to bring everything up to speed with the global buffs I'm just hoping that our good units stay as they are (maybe some points adjustments here and there), and our not so good stuff just becomes a viable option.

I'm not asking for much, the sub-par units don't even need to be made great. Just an actual option for vaguely competitive games.

I overall think that Orks are actually in a fairly good spot right now, they just need that extra nudge over the line where they can properly go toe to toe with the big boys.

as with any ork codex you can pretty much assume that anything we are used to using now will become suboptimal at best, most likely useless, and anything useless/suboptimal will become amazing.

Except burnas, they never get a spotlight.

Except buggies and mekboy workshop.

Buggies are hot goods they want to sell and mekboy workshop is a stupid idea in general.

I'd expect the rukkatrukk squigbuggy to get a solid boost. Because all buggies are individual kits I'm guessing that one has sold by far the worst of the bunch (maybe a lot of people like the model and bought it because of that, but I'd wager it still significantly fewer boxes).

But yeah, I'm not hoping we get 8th IH broken but flipping through the new DG 'dex I'm jealous because almost all of it seems viable. If it lands us at upper B-tier or A-tier isn't the end all be all, just make everything seem usable and I'm happy.

it is almost funny how hilariously bad the Squigbuggy is.

It was the most expensive of the bunch at 140 -- went down 40 points, and was still untakeable.

It even got an PSYCHOTICALLY good upgrade in Saga -- +1 to wound -- and it's *still* worse than its cousins.

I hope they give the thing some love, because the kit is great.

Nah they already sold enough of most of the buggies to sate their sales for awhile.
Squigbuggy and probably the Snazzwagon might get buffed but i suspect the others to get whacked.

Definitely the scrapjet and the dragstas, no way are those going to be kept the absolute cream of the crop without some sort of points hike.

One thing I am definitely looking forward to are more interesting WL traits and relics. It's gotten pretty boring seeing only the Killa Klaw and two or three WL traits being taken out in most games. It's a shame almost all the Klan WL traits are suboptimal, I'd love it if we could build more CC monsters than just 1 HQ or Big Meks/Painboyz with more utility than just their base wargear.

tulun wrote:
it is almost funny how hilariously bad the Squigbuggy is.

It was the most expensive of the bunch at 140 -- went down 40 points, and was still untakeable.

It even got an PSYCHOTICALLY good upgrade in Saga -- +1 to wound -- and it's *still* worse than its cousins.

I hope they give the thing some love, because the kit is great.

I recently ran three of them, and I honestly have no idea how it is supposed kill anything without the +1 to wound. Most of its value comes from having the buggy profile, it really feels like having snazzwagon without all the defensive benefits for more points.

Me and my friends argued they should just get grinding advance. Then they could probably do a decent job of being an all rounder, but surely even GW must've realised that the statline sucks considering the kustom job they gave it. I think GW just vastly overvalued how much that squig mine actually ends up doing in any games.

I never did get around to buying 3 and running them with the kustom job (which seems like the only viable way to run 'em), did they end up doing anything then Jidmah?

Well, mostly no. They didn't do nothing, but the bile squig lacks AP to threaten infantry or monsters, the bitey squig has too few shots to matter. The only "good" shot is the boom squig(even when targeting light infantry!), but against its preferred targets, it either wounds on 4+ or loses the few shots that get through due to rolling d3 armor against 2 or 3 wound infantry. All modes have the same problem of simply not causing enough unsaved wounds.

It's also mildly annoying that the regular squig launcher hits on 5+ while the heavy launcher hits on 4s, forcing you to roll them separately.

The mine really doesn't work well due to the traffic-jam problem of buggy lists. The mine is triggered by friend and foe, so I was unable to drop the mines in a meaningful way until the very last turn, where I blocked a wounded farseer from assaulting a lone grot by dropping a mine in between them. Two out of three squigbuggies were dead at that point.

The one redeeming quality of a rukkatrukk is that they have a sawblade and an extra wound, making it at least somewhat able to fight in melee. The extra AP and strength actually make a huge difference when fighting T3 infantry.

There really is no competitive reason to run them ever. Even the snazzwagon is a great unit in comparison.

That pretty much confirms all my suspicions (and mirrors my own experience when I've used one of them).

Maybe GW won't buff their shooting too much but instead just give all those squigs a CC profile as well? If they made it into a CC blender then at least mechanically it'd be a bit more interesting. Or make it shoot without LoS (which'd be okay even though the damage is still super unimpressive).

Speaking of the snazzwagon, I ran it a couple of times recently and didn't hate it. Park it on an objective and enemies are loathe to shoot at it since it doesn't do much and has hard to hit. Honestly the biggest drawback for me is that I don't want to waste an entire FA slot on a singular buggy. Is it better than a KBB? No, but it's at least fun to use a couple of different datasheets every once in a while.. And I don't think it requires too much of a buff for it to be genuinely viable

PiñaColada wrote:
That pretty much confirms all my suspicions (and mirrors my own experience when I've used one of them).

Maybe GW won't buff their shooting too much but instead just give all those squigs a CC profile as well? If they made it into a CC blender then at least mechanically it'd be a bit more interesting. Or make it shoot without LoS (which'd be okay even though the damage is still super unimpressive).

Speaking of the snazzwagon, I ran it a couple of times recently and didn't hate it. Park it on an objective and enemies are loathe to shoot at it since it doesn't do much and has hard to hit. Honestly the biggest drawback for me is that I don't want to waste an entire FA slot on a singular buggy. Is it better than a KBB? No, but it's at least fun to use a couple of different datasheets every once in a while.. And I don't think it requires too much of a buff for it to be genuinely viable

Their is so much potential in the buggies if only GW wanted to make them more balanced and interesting. Lets see if we get any new models that shifts the hotness away from mass boyz or buggy spam.

Non-LOS shooting would be cool for the squigbuggy, but more than that I would enjoy them to be some sort of buff or heal vehice i.e. to boyz (after all its a FOODTRUCK).

What I recon will go away is the buggy squad upgrades aka kustom jobs for all three and also potentially the interaction with WWSWF as that feels awful.

 Jidmah wrote:


I recently ran three of them, and I honestly have no idea how it is supposed kill anything without the +1 to wound. Most of its value comes from having the buggy profile, it really feels like having snazzwagon without all the defensive benefits for more points.

I think they really thought the flexibility of the gun would make it really appealing.

That's a big nope GW.

Honestly, my suggested fix -- make the gun better (more AP), and be able to shoot out of line of sight. Then it fulfills a niche Orks basically have 0 of -- non-LOS shooting.

i'd rather just rework the dang thing entirely.

When i saw the ideal "squigbuggy" i was thinking more of a meals on wheelz sort of thing, not a "tank" as they describe it.

 Afrodactyl wrote:
In all honesty, after weapon tweaks to bring everything up to speed with the global buffs I'm just hoping that our good units stay as they are (maybe some points adjustments here and there), and our not so good stuff just becomes a viable option.

I'm not asking for much, the sub-par units don't even need to be made great. Just an actual option for vaguely competitive games.

I overall think that Orks are actually in a fairly good spot right now, they just need that extra nudge over the line where they can properly go toe to toe with the big boys.

See, i'm not sold on this for a couple reasons.

1: As i have mentioned in the past, I'm not convinced GW is going to give orkz the same level of upgrades to similar weapons they gave to Speese Mehreens. I will not be shocked if Gdubz doesn't upgrade the big shootas at all. Maybe give them a point reduction to...4pts but honestly not at all surprised if nothing happens.

2: I don't think orkz are in a good place in regards to competitive gaming. We compete but only by being a counter-meta to the dominant lists right now. When 1/3rd of the game shows up with a horde of multi-wound infantry and special weapons designed to kill multi-wound infantry, and the remaining players show up with lists to beat them, orkz by contrast show up with 180+ cheap, throwaway infantry that are "relatively" durable for their points if they are buffed with a KFF and/or Painboy.

If you show up to a truly competitive tournament against the current meta lists with Ork buggies you will get gutted by turn 2. I've seen some success with meganobz, but I'm not sold on that yet either, I think the only solid competitive list orkz have is spamming goff boyz and holding objectives as long as you can with Ghaz floating around as a potential beat stick.

 Vineheart01 wrote:
as with any ork codex you can pretty much assume that anything we are used to using now will become suboptimal at best, most likely useless, and anything useless/suboptimal will become amazing.

Except burnas, they never get a spotlight.

Mek Gunz stayed pretty damn good since 7th, boyz have been a solid option for a long time now, the stompa has been terribad forever So really it just becomes a matter of what random intern GW hires to "write" the ork codex.

I saw there are some online TTS tournaments. Does anybody played it already?

 Tomsug wrote:
I saw there are some online TTS tournaments. Does anybody played it already?

My tournament friends attend regulalry the fex TTS tournaments in French organised by the WTC "French TOs". They even played against the/a (i don't know) ukranien team. They are having a great time, but apparently you need to use the clock to avoid getting sucked into 7 hour games.
They seem to be having fun, once the entry cost of learning to use the damn thing is payed. I manage to get enough "real" 40k for now (once every 10 days more or less) but we might get a new lockdown in the paris area soon, so perhaps I'll give it a try too (I really don't want to be behind a screen instead of "in person" on the weekend though...).

You know what i think could be cool but uncertain if we would ever need?

Storm Nobz!

Looking over battlescribe and thinking about buying warbikers or Nobz on bikes, it would appear that battlescribe has the wrong amount of points for Nobz on bikes, as well as having them in the wrong category still.


Because ive grown quite fond of evil sunz, so i wanted some sort of fast infantry type. Maybe ill try out some stormboyz, but its a bit sad that Stormboyz, being regular boyz with rockets on their backs, dont retain the Greentide" ability to gain one more attack when above 20 models.

Honestly you could have that for any unit entry. An elite more heavily armed version of the standard unit. You have bikers and nob bikers. Boyz and nob units. Lootaz and Flashgitz.

Having Nob Kommando, tankbustas, Burna and Stormboyz units would all be fairly fun and interesting. Pay a little extra for better weapons and the extra wounds, maybe a special rule here and there. (I do hope GW drops the ld buff nobz have in exchange for something else or a point or two less.)

I think i would run them with double choppas to keep them cheap, but since they're fast they can tie up enemies and still put the hurt to lightly armored infantry while the rest of your army makes way. AND since they have 2 wounds, using the full throttle wouldnt necessarily instantly kill a nob when it fails.

But ofc we dont have this so that doesnt matter. Guess ill have to do that with warbikers or normal Stormboyz.

Edit:

When it comes to tankhammer tankbustas and Goffs, which of the rules take priority? the tankhammers ability to only have 1 attack, or the Goff ability to gain an extra hit roll in case you rolled a 6? i mean it would be pretty cool to have an extra hit in case you get lucky with tankhammers.

Also, got another game with the triple killtank list. Backed up by some smashagunz, 2 trukks with minimum Meganobs inside. Troops were the 30 boyz to make mech seizures go off easily and then min size grot mobs that rode around in the kill tanks.

Opponent was a white scars player with 2 big blade guard units with all the buffs you can imagine and a few other support units or troops. He did make a few mistakes, like the white scars doctrine and khan's buffs only working on the charge or intervention. Not when I charged him. Can't say that would have changed the game, but the tanks second kill tank would have likely lived a turn longer (the third was one of the few units left I had at the end)

But otherwise it went as you'd expect. I rumbled up the field, did a good amount of damage, was winning until he hit that turn three powerspike and managed to shove me back. Meganobz put in the work. Killing some characters, krumping some units despite their size. Grots jumped out of the tanks mid game, huddled on some objectives and gradually died (the morale changes do keep them alive longer which is nice) Boyz let me pass siezures out easily enough and also did some good work late game wounding some characters and killing some smaller units. Lost the game sadly by about 5 points as the terrain (short board edge deployment) is a bit of a hassle for any vehicle list and he hid out of LOS rather well first turn.

Honestly as is i'm pretty happy with the list. Though I do get greener with envy when comparing the buffs marines can hand out vs our much megre ones. Meks need something special in regards to traits or relics. A buffed KFF would be nice, the ability to improve vehicles would be another option. ATM I just have him for slightly improved healing and the extra CP/run and charge on infantry every now and then. He just can't keep up with the vehicles who want to be running forward. And our painboyz are so laughably weak compared to a buffed apothecary. Some sort of Orky steroid or revive mechanic would be very much appreciated.

cody.d. wrote:
Also, got another game with the triple killtank list. Backed up by some smashagunz, 2 trukks with minimum Meganobs inside. Troops were the 30 boyz to make mech seizures go off easily and then min size grot mobs that rode around in the kill tanks.

Opponent was a white scars player with 2 big blade guard units with all the buffs you can imagine and a few other support units or troops. He did make a few mistakes, like the white scars doctrine and khan's buffs only working on the charge or intervention. Not when I charged him. Can't say that would have changed the game, but the tanks second kill tank would have likely lived a turn longer (the third was one of the few units left I had at the end)

But otherwise it went as you'd expect. I rumbled up the field, did a good amount of damage, was winning until he hit that turn three powerspike and managed to shove me back. Meganobz put in the work. Killing some characters, krumping some units despite their size. Grots jumped out of the tanks mid game, huddled on some objectives and gradually died (the morale changes do keep them alive longer which is nice) Boyz let me pass siezures out easily enough and also did some good work late game wounding some characters and killing some smaller units. Lost the game sadly by about 5 points as the terrain (short board edge deployment) is a bit of a hassle for any vehicle list and he hid out of LOS rather well first turn.

Honestly as is i'm pretty happy with the list. Though I do get greener with envy when comparing the buffs marines can hand out vs our much megre ones. Meks need something special in regards to traits or relics. A buffed KFF would be nice, the ability to improve vehicles would be another option. ATM I just have him for slightly improved healing and the extra CP/run and charge on infantry every now and then. He just can't keep up with the vehicles who want to be running forward. And our painboyz are so laughably weak compared to a buffed apothecary. Some sort of Orky steroid or revive mechanic would be very much appreciated.

Awesome to hear the Kill Tank list still has some teef! It's interesting that we both had similar games against White Scars when using a triple Kill Tank list, it really is key to try and burst them down before the T3 kill-boost they get from their doctrine.

Definitely agree regarding needing stronger support units though, I feel like they're basically the new hotness when it comes to HQ's, less about being a smash captain and more about force multipliers that you can hand out. Would love for the KFF just to be a 5+ invuln against shooting if a unit is within 6" rather than the wholly within we have now since our base sizes for our buggies is so huge. Likewise, I'd like to see them to add an overcharge option/buff for a single Ork unit where we get an additional AP on our shooting weapons or we get an additional hit for DDD! when we roll a 6 (assuming this is how DDD! gets reworded in our codex) but hit rolls of 1 cause mortal wounds or something. Little Meks in particular need a buff, it'd be nice if they could give a passive or active buff to Ork vehicles so they can actually tend to Mek Gunz or other vehicles like they should be. Painboyz should either revive units like you've said or some kind of combat drug buff to Orks so that he's not just some overpriced FNP bubble. I'd also like to see Runtherds have a bigger role in making Gretchin units relevant, maybe buffing their Grot Shield rule or damage output in some way so he does stuff for Mek Gunz and Kanz?