Necron and Space Marine Codex and upcoming releases discussion

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**Tiberius501**

Emissary wrote:
There's a stratagem for 2 cps that allows ALL the c'tan's attacks to ignore inv saves for that melee phase.

This. Is nuts. I love it.

**Cynista**

unitled wrote:
Cynista wrote:
The necron nerfs just keep coming boys! They were so overpowered before, thanks GW very cool

What are you even talking about? The core mechanic of the whole army has been revamped to actually, yknow, work

And units themselves have been heavily nerfed or their points are incredibly high

**tneva82**

unitled wrote:

Sasori wrote:

Abilities: With each attack of this weapon, the rules for ignoring injuries cannot be used.

I take it this is for FNP type saves?

Plus stuff like ghaz

Automatically Appended Next Post:

unitled wrote:
Cynista wrote:
The necron nerfs just keep coming boys! They were so overpowered before, thanks GW very cool

What are you even talking about? The core mechanic of the whole army has been revamped to actually, yknow, work

Sidestep. For warriors maybe 4-5 extra models if lucky. Rest ignorable.

**Dudeface**

Cynista wrote:
unitled wrote:
Cynista wrote:
The necron nerfs just keep coming boys! They were so overpowered before, thanks GW very cool

What are you even talking about? The core mechanic of the whole army has been revamped to actually, yknow, work

And units themselves have been heavily nerfed or their points are incredibly high

Which units have been nerfed?

**H.B.M.C.**

Anyone wanna translate this?

**Cryptek of Awesome**

Stick of Light
and
Gauss Flashlight
are officially going on every army list from now on.

**Platuan4th**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
Anyone wanna translate this?

Essentially, it has For the Greater Good when Friendly units are charged.

**Cynista**

Dudeface wrote:
Cynista wrote:
unitled wrote:
Cynista wrote:
The necron nerfs just keep coming boys! They were so overpowered before, thanks GW very cool

What are you even talking about? The core mechanic of the whole army has been revamped to actually, yknow, work

And units themselves have been heavily nerfed or their points are incredibly high

Which units have been nerfed?

Wraiths have been dunked on and gaining RP doesn't fix it. The models that everyone has at least 6 of. QS has been nerfed (and yes, it has, because of the sheer damage potential of everything these days), Reanimation Protocols are straight up bad for anything with more than 1 wound, so that's a poor argument as noted already. There is really heavy amounts of restrictions built into the entire book. Can't do X if Y etc etc. Void Dragon 350 points!

Don't get me wrong, there's so much content in the codex that you'll be able to put something decent together but a lot of it is dead on arrival IMO

**Drakmord**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
Anyone wanna translate this?

It's been like 10 years since I've spoken French, BUT with some leaning on Google Translate:

"
In your Command phase, you can choose a single <DYNASTY> Necron Warriors unit within 6" of this model. If you do, up to D3 units destroyed from the unit Reanimate. Each unit can only be affected by this ability once per phase.

Important note is that when it says they can reanimate, it references the Reanimation Protocols RULE, instead of just having them stand back up. So, similar to the orb, d3 <DYNASTY> Necron Warriors can make RP rolls for that unit, and assumedly you can go back up to starting strength, over time.

**the_scotsman**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
Anyone wanna translate this?

Ghost ark can make d3 warriors roll reanimation in the command phase.

New quantum shields confirmed on GA.

Doomstalker can overwatch vs any enemy unit that charges a friendlt unit within 6"

Doomstalker has a 4++ but no Quantum.

Thats all I can see thats changed but I dont play crons

**changemod**

Sasori wrote:
H.B.M.C. wrote:
So Destroyers have the two gun options, but Heavy Destroyers don't. What?

They're under heavy support.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

H.B.M.C. wrote:
So Destroyers have the two gun options, but Heavy Destroyers don't. What?

No, you can take Heavys in a regular destroyer squad like before for +15 points. The Heavys are 70 for either option in ther slot.

Heavies are entirely squatted sadly, no more semiefficent lascannon fire, just a bigger gun in an army that already hurts for anti-vehicle and monster options.

**Sasori**

changemod wrote:
Sasori wrote:
H.B.M.C. wrote:
So Destroyers have the two gun options, but Heavy Destroyers don't. What?

They're under heavy support.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

H.B.M.C. wrote:
So Destroyers have the two gun options, but Heavy Destroyers don't. What?

No, you can take Heavys in a regular destroyer squad like before for +15 points. The Heavys are 70 for either option in ther slot.

Heavies are entirely squatted sadly, no more semiefficent lascannon fire, just a bigger gun in an army that already hurts for anti-vehicle and monster options.

You can take the Lokhust Heavy Destroyers in regular squads for +15 point snow.

**Tiberius501**

So, I’m really bad with forums, could someone link me where these French leaked pics are coming from? I can’t seem to find anything under /necrontyr

**Dudeface**

Cynista wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
Cynista wrote:
unitled wrote:
Cynista wrote:
The necron nerfs just keep coming boys! They were so overpowered before, thanks GW very cool

What are you even talking about? The core mechanic of the whole army has been revamped to actually, yknow, work

And units themselves have been heavily nerfed or their points are incredibly high

Which units have been nerfed?

Wraiths have been dunked on and gaining RP doesn't fix it. The models that everyone has at least 6 of. QS has been nerfed (and yes, it has, because of the sheer damage potential of everything these days), Reanimation Protocols are straight up bad for anything with more than 1 wound, so that's a poor argument as noted already. There is really heavy amounts of restrictions built into the entire book. Can't do X if Y etc etc. Void Dragon 350 points!

Don't get me wrong, there's so much content in the codex that you'll be able to put something decent together but a lot of it is dead on arrival IMO

Wraiths went down 1 on their invuln and got fall back and charge back in return, that's not really a nerf. QS is different, not sure it's a nerf for everything, it'll be better against overcharges plasma etc.

RP is worse for multi wound models, but having the chance to use it might be better overall, hard to say. 350 points for a mortal wound spouting combat monster you can't target and still can only lose 3 wounds per phase isn't unfair exactly.

It really doesn't seem that bad, the only worse part so far seems to be the relics.

**vipoid**

So going off the relics, Warscythes and the base Staff of Light are still garbage.

Sigh.

**Sasori**

Quantum deflection now increases the invuln save by 1. That's nice at least.

**Drakmord**

I see a post on reddit saying that all named C'tan are up to 350, and the transcendent is at 270.

Nothing posted beyond that, only that allegedly the named C'tan have unique powers, and "some" do more damage than they did in 8th.

**Necronmaniac05**

The Monolith is underwhelming. T8 S8 and 24 wounds but absolutely no inv. save and only living metal to boost its survivability. If you are going to spend over 300 points on a unit I'd take the void dragon. Screenable, has an inv. save and can only lose 3 wounds per phase anyway.

**Cryptek of Awesome**

Drakmord wrote:
I see a post on reddit saying that all named C'tan are up to 350, and the transcendent is at 270.

Nothing posted beyond that, only that allegedly the named C'tan have unique powers, and "some" do more damage than they did in 8th.

This was posted on the 40k General discussion thread - reposting it here for anyone who hasn't seen it.
It lists some unique C'tan power for the named C'tan. Looks like Gaze of Death is switching to a mortal wounds power attack.

Ghaz wrote:
Some images are starting to pop up on /40kg/ on /tg/.

Spoiler:

**Super Ready**

Necronmaniac05 wrote:
The Monolith is underwhelming. T8 S8 and 24 wounds but absolutely no inv. save and only living metal to boost its survivability. If you are going to spend over 300 points on a unit I'd take the void dragon. Screenable, has an inv. save and can only lose 3 wounds per phase anyway.

Sorry, did you just call 24 wounds combined with Living Metal underwhelming...?!
Bear in mind that to do 24 wounds in one go, you'd have to put a LOT of firepower into it... quite likely much of it only wounding it on 6's. In 99% of games it's going to be able to take full advantage of Living Metal turn after turn, so in effect it's more like it's approaching 30 wounds. That's unprecedented - and on the offchance your opponent does kill it outright, the rest of your force gets off scot-free.

That's pretty good going if you ask me.

I will say that from what I've seen so far, the Void Dragon looks like much more of a dangerous, direct threat.

**nintura**

Super Ready wrote:
Necronmaniac05 wrote:
The Monolith is underwhelming. T8 S8 and 24 wounds but absolutely no inv. save and only living metal to boost its survivability. If you are going to spend over 300 points on a unit I'd take the void dragon. Screenable, has an inv. save and can only lose 3 wounds per phase anyway.

Sorry, did you just call 24 wounds combined with Living Metal underwhelming...?!
Bear in mind that to do 24 wounds in one go, you'd have to put a LOT of firepower into it... quite likely much of it only wounding it on 6's. In 99% of games it's going to be able to take full advantage of Living Metal turn after turn, so in effect it's more like it's approaching 30 wounds. That's unprecedented - and on the offchance your opponent does kill it outright, the rest of your force gets off scot-free.

That's pretty good going if you ask me.

I will say that from what I've seen so far, the Void Dragon looks like much more of a dangerous, direct threat.

THe rest of your forces minus 300-380 points that is. LIving Metal doesn't really do much right? Just a wound a turn?

**Dudeface**

Super Ready wrote:
Necronmaniac05 wrote:
The Monolith is underwhelming. T8 S8 and 24 wounds but absolutely no inv. save and only living metal to boost its survivability. If you are going to spend over 300 points on a unit I'd take the void dragon. Screenable, has an inv. save and can only lose 3 wounds per phase anyway.

Sorry, did you just call 24 wounds combined with Living Metal underwhelming...?!
Bear in mind that to do 24 wounds in one go, you'd have to put a LOT of firepower into it... quite likely much of it only wounding it on 6's. In 99% of games it's going to be able to take full advantage of Living Metal turn after turn, so in effect it's more like it's approaching 30 wounds. That's unprecedented - and on the offchance your opponent does kill it outright, the rest of your force gets off scot-free.

That's pretty good going if you ask me.

I will say that from what I've seen so far, the Void Dragon looks like much more of a dangerous, direct threat.

Stop bringing your reasonable logic into here. Obviously unless it literally personally nukes your opponents house it's not worth putting on the table top!

**Sasori**

C'tan Powers

Antimatter Meteor: Pick an enemy unit within 24" and visible to a C'tan shard. on a 3-5, deal 3 mortals. A 6 does 3+D3

Time's Arrow: Chose an enemy unit within 18" and visible to a C'tan shard. Roll a D6. If it's greater than a model's wounds characteristic, it is slain.

Sky of Falling Stars: Chose an enemy unit within 24" of a C'tan shard. Roll a D6. 1-5 deals D3 mortals if the number is less than the total number of models in that unit.

Cosmic Fire: Roll a D6 for each enemy unit within 9" of a C'tan shard. On a 4+, deal D3 mortals.

Seismic Assault: Chose an enemy unit within 18" and visible to a C'tan shard. Roll a dice for each model in that unit. For each 6+, deal a Mortal Wound up to 10.

Transdimensional Thunderbolt: Chose an enemy unit within 24" and visible to the C'tan (you cannot chose a character while they are within 3" of enemy models and they are 9 wounds or less). On a 2+, D3 mortals. Plus, roll a D6 for each other enemy unit within 3". On a 4+, they suffer 1 mortal.

Cosmic Madness (Deceiver): Choose a visible enemy unit within 12" and roll a D6. Add the result to the Deceiver's Leadership. Then your opponent rolls a D6 and adds that result to the targeted unit's Leadership. The targeted unit takes MW equal to the difference.

Death Gaze (Nightbringer): Choose a visible enemy unit within 9". Role 3 dice. On each 4+, that unit suffers d3 wounds

Voltaic Storm (Void Dragon): Choose a visible enemy unit within 18" following Look Out Sir rules. Roll a d6; on a 2+, that unit suffers d3 MW. If that unit was a vehicle, it suffers d6 MW. If that unit was a vehicle and it brackets, its wounds characteristic is considered halved for the purpose of bracketing.

**changemod**

Sasori wrote:
changemod wrote:
Sasori wrote:
H.B.M.C. wrote:
So Destroyers have the two gun options, but Heavy Destroyers don't. What?

They're under heavy support.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

H.B.M.C. wrote:
So Destroyers have the two gun options, but Heavy Destroyers don't. What?

No, you can take Heavys in a regular destroyer squad like before for +15 points. The Heavys are 70 for either option in ther slot.

Heavies are entirely squatted sadly, no more semiefficent lascannon fire, just a bigger gun in an army that already hurts for anti-vehicle and monster options.

You can take the Lokhust Heavy Destroyers in regular squads for +15 point snow.

I know, that’s what I was complaining about.

**Tiberius501**

For those who’ve seen the Monolith, now that it’s a LoW, will it cost 3CP to add to your list?

**Sasori**

Tiberius501 wrote:
For those who’ve seen the Monolith, now that it’s a LoW, will it cost 3CP to add to your list?

Yes. Monoliths are probably Dead on arrival due to this.

**nintura**

So according to marine logic, 2 cp is 40 points, so 3 cp is 60 points. So why is it so many points to begin with?

**Tiberius501**

Sasori wrote:
Tiberius501 wrote:
For those who’ve seen the Monolith, now that it’s a LoW, will it cost 3CP to add to your list?

Yes. Monoliths are probably Dead on arrival due to this.

No special rule or anything to mitigate this? :C

Maaaan... I was so looking forward to getting the new one but that really bums me out.

**tneva82**

Super Ready wrote:
Necronmaniac05 wrote:
The Monolith is underwhelming. T8 S8 and 24 wounds but absolutely no inv. save and only living metal to boost its survivability. If you are going to spend over 300 points on a unit I'd take the void dragon. Screenable, has an inv. save and can only lose 3 wounds per phase anyway.

Sorry, did you just call 24 wounds combined with Living Metal underwhelming...?!
Bear in mind that to do 24 wounds in one go, you'd have to put a LOT of firepower into it... quite likely much of it only wounding it on 6's. In 99% of games it's going to be able to take full advantage of Living Metal turn after turn, so in effect it's more like it's approaching 30 wounds. That's unprecedented - and on the offchance your opponent does kill it outright, the rest of your force gets off scot-free.

That's pretty good going if you ask me.

I will say that from what I've seen so far, the Void Dragon looks like much more of a dangerous, direct threat.

It's　knight stats without inv saves. And any army worth anything aims to one shot knight.

Since any half decent army one shots knight witq ris they can one shot 2 monoliths.

Oh and no hiding out of los either.

And sorry but what weapon you fire at it that wounds on 6? It's t8. Not t14. You don't shoot bolter at it. Are you supposed to plan opponent be stupid enough to shoot　bolters at monolith and lascannons etc at necron warriors? Sorry. I don't like to make plans that depend opponent being such a level of idiocy.

**Necronmaniac05**

Super Ready wrote:
Necronmaniac05 wrote:
The Monolith is underwhelming. T8 S8 and 24 wounds but absolutely no inv. save and only living metal to boost its survivability. If you are going to spend over 300 points on a unit I'd take the void dragon. Screenable, has an inv. save and can only lose 3 wounds per phase anyway.

Sorry, did you just call 24 wounds combined with Living Metal underwhelming...?!
Bear in mind that to do 24 wounds in one go, you'd have to put a LOT of firepower into it... quite likely much of it only wounding it on 6's. In 99% of games it's going to be able to take full advantage of Living Metal turn after turn, so in effect it's more like it's approaching 30 wounds. That's unprecedented - and on the offchance your opponent does kill it outright, the rest of your force gets off scot-free.

That's pretty good going if you ask me.

I will say that from what I've seen so far, the Void Dragon looks like much more of a dangerous, direct threat.

We will see i guess. My view is it is hard to screen/hide and in the age of 3 eradicators hitting on 3's, wounding on 4's and doing 4+2d6 damage each at -3/-4 AP, while they may not kill it outright they are going to quickly drop its effectiveness such that it will struggle to make a mark. We will see however. Knights, wraithknights and stormsurges all fill the same space and all have an inv (and more wounds in the case of knights).