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Hey folks,

I'm not sure if this has been a poll previously (apologies if so!)

I was listening to a discussion on a podcast recently where the hosts were discussing how to pronounce 'Ynnari', 'Aelves' and that 'Fyreslayers' is spelt with a Y (there was some disagreement!)
I'll be honest that while I think it's fair enough that AoS (as a new game) had it's own branding as large parts of it are essentially a new game universe, some of the changes applied to 40k and existing ranges hasn't sat as well with me.
So for example:
Imperial Guard -> Astra Militarum
Eldar -> Ynnari

I also think even within AoS, as an effort to 'build brand' and copyright some of the names are a lot less relatable; I think Sky Dwarves would have been a better name than Kharadron Overlords for example!

Is this just because I'm a grognard and set in my old ways? I do find it a lot more complicated these days to keep on track with all of the names*. Sea Elves would have meant a lot more to me than Idoneth Deepkin for example!

*(although let's not get started on paint names, where I'm trying to track down a paint and find it has been changed three times since!)

How does everyone else feel about it?
(I don't give a damn, gimme them minis is also a legitimate viewpoint!)

I much prefer the old names.

Most of the new names are pretty damn wanky. I struggle to think of any that I actually like, or think sound cool. Especially any of them that fall into the 'adjective noun-verber' category.

I'd be entirely happy with, say, 'Bile-piper Of Nurgle'. But I couldn't bring myself to ever ask for a 'Sloppity Bile-piper' in a shop.

Besides which, it's entirely unnecessary. It's not like GW also make a Skankulous Bile-piper and need to distinguish between the two.


Edit:
Actually, Drukhari isn't too bad. But that's the only one I can really think of.

wh40k-I have no problem with the new names.
AoS-one of the reasons that I cannot get into it are the new names. Cannot stand Orruks, Ogors, Troggoths, Duardin etc. Also, the names for the new factions/units are sometimes simply stupid.

Old names, 100%.

It is a really junevile stance to believe that you Copyright issues may be solved by an "ae" instead of an "e" or a "y" for a "i".

Especially in a globalized world where country without any IP protection can import and export everywhere

For 40K, I can accept there's are pig latin versions of the names, as long as they can be understood as being in 'high gothic'. Though I wish there's more of a format to the names.

I mean, there are Adeptus Astartes, Adeptus Mechanicus, Adeptus Terra, Adeptus ministorum, Adeptus Administratum, Departmento Monitorum, Ordo Malleus, Ordo Tempestus, Ordo Prefectus, etc., you know, adept/department/order of something. The imperial navy has Navis Imperialis, and Navis Nobilite, etc. Navy something. And there's Astra Militarum -- star military. Why can't it be Militarum Stellarum or Militarum Astrorum, or something.

I dunno, I'd refer to the armies in their filthy plebeian 'low gothic' names most of the time.

 Cybtroll wrote:
Old names, 100%.

It is a really junevile stance to believe that you Copyright issues may be solved by an "ae" instead of an "e" or a "y" for a "i".

Especially in a globalized world where country without any IP protection can import and export everywhere

Or any 3rd party manufacturer just advertises, say, 'Space Elf bits, compatible with 28mm war gaming systems'

I really preferred the anachronism of using dog-latin or whatnot to name things rather than 'made-up' names. It's that kind of made-up name stuff that puts me off most fantasy and sci-fi, whereas using historical names is what made Warhammer more engaging for me.

I feel like there's a lot of emphasis placed on having two words in a name. Idoneth Deepkin feels unnecessary when Deepkin would do, with "Idoneth" being the in-setting name they have for themselves, like Asuryani for high elves.

The Death Guard book is particularly guilty of this. Many distinct names with two parts which all blend into each other.

I don't really mind either,

if you already know the old names the new ones are going to be a bit annoying as you have to translate them in your mind,

if you're a new layer the new names will become part of your game world, just as the old names did for us

Definitely the old names. They did the job better. More descriptive/evocative and less awkward to use.

But I think the worst thing is that GW adopted "grimdark" as a template for names. They're just mashing words together and the words all have similar sounds and connotations. Warhammer Underworlds: Bleakhaunt comes with four Dreadwrack Cursegrinders and six Blightscorn Wrathmourners!

The old names are evocative and full of meaning.

New names are just dumb and confusing - really puts me off.

 Pacific wrote:
...and that 'Fyreslayers' is spelt with a Y (there was some disagreement!)

Someone needs naming and shaming for thinking there is no Y in there - what did they think the word was, Fireslaiers?

I don't prefer either. But I certainly don't mind the names now.

Some I do prefer more. Drukhari is way cooler than Dark Eldar, for example. I like wacky names though. Certainly it's better than it was in the Matt Ward era, where all the common weapons were given a whole slew of wacky names. Blood Missiles, Doomfists etc. Certainly has toned down a lot recently in some regards.

I prefer intelligent old names like tyranid units being named after anciant roman military ranks or british slang for horrid old women.

Nowadays the Lictor would probaby named something like Chamelelurking Stealthscyther.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

Nowadays the Lictor would probaby named something like Chamelelurking Stealthscyther.

You're not wrong. Urgh. *shudder*

lord_blackfang wrote:I prefer intelligent old names like tyranid units being named after anciant roman military ranks or british slang for horrid old women.

Nowadays the Lictor would probaby named something like Chamelelurking Stealthscyther.

Brilliant

Agree about the Harridan (and remember the Dominatrix!)

jaredb wrote:I don't prefer either. But I certainly don't mind the names now.

Some I do prefer more. Drukhari is way cooler than Dark Eldar, for example. I like wacky names though. Certainly it's better than it was in the Matt Ward era, where all the common weapons were given a whole slew of wacky names. Blood Missiles, Doomfists etc. Certainly has toned down a lot recently in some regards.

Drukhari is one of the few new ones I actually like! Or is better than Dark Eldar at least.
Although for some reason I don't mind Dark Elves..

Fabio Bile wrote:Definitely the old names. They did the job better. More descriptive/evocative and less awkward to use.

But I think the worst thing is that GW adopted "grimdark" as a template for names. They're just mashing words together and the words all have similar sounds and connotations. Warhammer Underworlds: Bleakhaunt comes with four Dreadwrack Cursegrinders and six Blightscorn Wrathmourners!

I had to look those up to see if you were joking or they were genuine! Wow that really is just crap!

As a person for whom english is a foreign language, all the names were dumb from the start. What even is a "Blood Claw", sounds like something my dog would have to get treated at a vet. And of course Some of the old names were nice, but overall all of them are made up garbage cause GW doesn't have and never had a single original bone in their organization.

I think Drukhari is a good example - I don't mind new names if they sound cool, at least as cool as the old names or cooler.

Space Sharks to Carchadons is cool, but for some reason we still have Space Wolves and that is also cool? It isn't consistent.

And a lot of the new names are not cooler to my mind, they are cludgey and bad and lack any appeal.

But I think what gets me about the new names is that they are often literally formulaic, they have a formula that they follow to make the names, often smushing words together or slightly changing a word to make a new one. I think it is really samey and makes the units sort of blend together into a sludge.

This is most notable to me with the new Space Marine stuff. The Primaris Marines have names that are kinda meaningless and samey to me, and when I read them I have no clear idea of what they are describing. Assault Marines, Tactical Marines and Scouts were at least clear. Terminators and Devastators, a bit less so, and I have always thought Terminator was a bit of a crappy name - Cataphract is actually a much better one, conjuring up heavy armour in my mind.

Seraphon is another one, it conjures angels, but then instead you have all these Aztec dinosaur people and it just clashes horribly.

So, I prefer the old names because I think overall the were cooler, communicated what things were better, were less formulaic and less confusing.

I have to say the new names really put me off GW games more than they should. I just feel silly reading and saying them!

Some of the older names were quite frankly, corny.

Many of the new are incomprehensible.

In my head, orcs never left....nor did dwarves....

I liked the old names mostly, but I understand why they made the change. For fantasy particularly there were dozens of 3rd party versions of "elf spearmen" or "empire halberdiers" etc.

A new player trying to find these things would not be directed to Games Workshop directly necessarily. The new names are annoying but I think serve a functional purpose.

 ph34r wrote:
I liked the old names mostly, but I understand why they made the change. For fantasy particularly there were dozens of 3rd party versions of "elf spearmen" or "empire halberdiers" etc.

A new player trying to find these things would not be directed to Games Workshop directly necessarily. The new names are annoying but I think serve a functional purpose.

As if they are not smart enough to add "warhammer" to the search terms smh.

I like the direction of the new names, but find they're not as catchy as they could be. Gloomspite Gitz, for example, is a catchy non-generic name for Goblins. A lot of the faux-latin lacks gravitas even when pronounced correctly.

The fact that they are so scared of third party manufacturers is pretty pathetic. They are the 300lb Gorilla in the room, the vast majority of people searching for "elf spearmen" are going to find something related to their properties. They should have confidence in their excellent mini designers and artists to draw people in.

On the other hand, someone idly searching without knowing the GW naming conventions is not going to find an Aelf, or a Duradin, or whatever, because those are made up terms that are not used in fantasy generally. It is an ass backwards way of looking at it like GW is the centre of all fantasy stuff and people are coming to it through them first - I just don't think that is so! I think most people would come from general fantasy first and then probably see the models somewhere and search for them.

Yeah, there might be some benefits but I think there are also costs to it. I dunno, they probably have better data than me. I have moved to other games that don't try to lock you into an ecosystem now anyway so I doubt I am the target market any more.

I think it has VERY little to do with 3rd party manufacturers. The issue with Chapterhouse is that it proved that GW's IP couldn't stand up to a guppy. That gives them essentially nothing to bargain with when trying to licence it out for TV and games and all the other projects we've seen. The sharks would flip things into something like Starcraft again on a dime.

I mean someone can already do that pretty much. They still can't really protect any of their IP from people just making similar stuff. They never could.

 Da Boss wrote:
I mean someone can already do that pretty much. They still can't really protect any of their IP from people just making similar stuff. They never could.

Sure, but that's the difference. They go to license out the IP and people ask what they're paying for and they say Space Marines and then they have to try to argue that "their" Space Marines are worth more than other Space Marines to people who don't really appreciate the distinction. Now they go in selling "Adeptus Astartes" to people who are like "sounds important, what's that?". You have better luck convincing people your unique name is something special than you do trying to explain your generic name is a superior version.

Basically the same reason its so important for drug manufacturers to get name recognition before the generics become available. In this case though, the generics already ran free, so GW is trying to rebrand itself as something "new" again.

I think only the GW lawyers are 100% in the 'new name' corner...

I mean, the new names are silly. But the old names often had their own silliness.

The new names do give my dad a good laugh whenever i read them to him though, so that's fun.

 Da Boss wrote:


This is most notable to me with the new Space Marine stuff. The Primaris Marines have names that are kinda meaningless and samey to me, and when I read them I have no clear idea of what they are describing. Assault Marines, Tactical Marines and Scouts were at least clear. Terminators and Devastators, a bit less so, and I have always thought Terminator was a bit of a crappy name - Cataphract is actually a much better one, conjuring up heavy armour in my mind.

I have the same feelings with Primaris, with several of the units beginning with the letter I blending into one another.

The sole exception is Intercessors. The name fits, as an Intercessor is someone who intervenes on behalf of someone else, usually via prayer. They are meant to be the proverbial cavalry that came in the Imperium's darkest hour to save them. Fits perfectly with the "knightly" feel that Marines are supposed to evoke.

I just find my old brain is comfortable with the original names.

Is GW still going after 3rd party companies? Or have they stopped doing that once they realized that most folks who purchase from those vendors (customized bits suppliers), buy GW models first as the basis for the customization.

Cheers,

CB