Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
News to me from DoG’s review, if not anyone else? It’s four hours long.

Four. Hours.

If I can rent it for a few quid, might be worth a whirl.

Yeah thats where I pull out and say "nah I'll just read the clip notes."

It stinks but I have very little hope for Zack Synder, I would be surprised if he pulled it off, but honestly 4 hrs? Thats a bit much even for a nerd like me.

The Guardian have published their 4* review, and that's a 4* review that opens by calling the previous version vapid and calling Affleck and Cavill insipid, so that's not what you'd call a fanboy gushing.

I'm looking forward to it. Just not sure how I'll watch it.

 Lance845 wrote:
Lets remember, the first reviews for BVS were all positive. "Best movie ever made!""Standing applause!"

I'm pretty sure that was the (supposed) internal reaction from WB themselves, not from the first reviews.

 Flipsiders wrote:
An IGN review just came out giving the film an 8/10...

Meanwhile the guy at Gamespot gave it 3/10, and sounded very angry and petty about it.

 Azreal13 wrote:
The Guardian have published their 4* review, and that's a 4* review that opens by calling the previous version vapid and calling Affleck and Cavill insipid, so that's not what you'd call a fanboy gushing.

But you have to use the Bradshaw substitution cypher, which makes it about a 2, maybe even 1 if the print ad adjustment is applicable

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I'm pretty sure that was the (supposed) internal reaction from WB themselves, not from the first reviews.

Yeah...we know now that wasn't exactly the case, LOL. Marvel hypes stuff this way too. Think it's just part of the business now given the way people obsess about films in development.

 Flipsiders wrote:
An IGN review just came out giving the film an 8/10...

Meanwhile the guy at Gamespot gave it 3/10, and sounded very angry and petty about it.

Probably because he had to watch 240 minutes of something he'd already decided he'd hate, LOL. Matt Goldberg at Collider gave it a D- or something, which was predictable. Steven Weintraub from the same site seems to be more positive, however. At least for now.

TL;DR -- Divisive director is still dividing fans and critics.

 Turnip Jedi wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:
The Guardian have published their 4* review, and that's a 4* review that opens by calling the previous version vapid and calling Affleck and Cavill insipid, so that's not what you'd call a fanboy gushing.

But you have to use the Bradshaw substitution cypher, which makes it about a 2, maybe even 1 if the print ad adjustment is applicable

Mornington Crescent?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I'm looking forward to it. Just not sure how I'll watch it.

I’m gonna watch it with my eyes.

Whether they’ll require bleaching afterwards remains to be seen. But Leto’s god awful, charisma and charm free Joker is in it, so chances strike me as high. Got some new stuff in for the old Kidderminster, but some stains must take precedence over others.

 gorgon wrote:

Probably because he had to watch 240 minutes of something he'd already decided he'd hate, LOL. Matt Goldberg at Collider gave it a D- or something, which was predictable. Steven Weintraub from the same site seems to be more positive, however. At least for now.

TL;DR -- Divisive director is still dividing fans and critics.

It's very strange having no horse in this and seeing so many people who still do despite it being a race that most people weren't all that interested in before it even began.

Clearly there's emotion on both sides, LOL. Everyone knew how the Snyder Twitter mob can be. Shoot, they're out there slagging some people who gave this one a GOOD review, simply because the reviewers weren't 'on board' in the past. That gak is getting cult-like.

But I'm a little surprised by certain critics' specific reactions. I fully expected a mixed critical response...it was never going to be any other way. But some of the negative reviews...man, it's like they're taking this every bit as personally as the Snyder mob. Maybe it's partially *because* of the Snyder mob? But that's still no place to be as a movie reviewer IMO.

I think the 'because' of the mob is quite possible. It can be hard, even for professional reviewers to disassociate the final product from the harassment they've received from the products fans, particularly when those fans are responsible for releasing the film in the first place.


In saying that, I also think the critical reviews can be more helpful than the glowing ones for this movie, especially if they wear their opinions on their sleeve like the EW review.

Like, from that I can gather:

It's a better movie than BVS.
There's some humour in it that brightens the mood.
It's still, functionally the same film, with added exposition and story beats.
It's VERY Snyder, but not I don't think it really is BVS/Watchmen/SuckerPunch-like FULL SNYDER, either from the benefit of hindsight, or the first batch of studio notes from before everything went to heck in the original production.


I think, overall,

Snyder 'Associate Producers' will adore and love the movie.
People who are ambivalent to the Snyder style will be fine with the movie.
People who are mildly distasteful of the style will find it an improvement to BVS.
People who have been turned off of the style, or who dislike the style in general, or Snyder's DC universe setup, will continue to dislike it.

I feel like this is a good time to bring up that Fan is the root of both Fandom and Fanatic. You can like something. Even love it. But once you cross into Fandom it becomes something else entirely and it seems at least as a collective that they loose any sense of reason in relation to their particular obsession.

@Compel - Probably right about the audience breakdown.

I think the reviews on Vulture and rogerebert.com seemed...smart to me. They more or less said that it might be flawed and excessive in so many ways...but that's the point. It's a nearly uncompromised, personal artistic vision from a director (after it was compromised perhaps more than any big-budget film in history). Maybe we'll like it and maybe we won't, but how often does this kind of movie get made that way?

So yeah...I think I can get behind that. Bring it on!

 Jadenim wrote:

 Turnip Jedi wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:
The Guardian have published their 4* review, and that's a 4* review that opens by calling the previous version vapid and calling Affleck and Cavill insipid, so that's not what you'd call a fanboy gushing.

But you have to use the Bradshaw substitution cypher, which makes it about a 2, maybe even 1 if the print ad adjustment is applicable

Mornington Crescent?

Sadly not, a mixture of my distrust of The Guardian's film critic along with a suspicion that 'reveiws' in print media may or may not by influenced by ad space purchased

But a gold star for mentioning Mornington

The guys over at Escapist Magazine gave it a resounding "Fine".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKu11bFUtw8

Gail Simone has had some very kind and positive words to say about the movie.

So I'm going to talk a little about me now.

I'm still really struggling to reconcile stuff. It seems like this legitimately is going to end up a fine to good superhero movie, with lots of stuff I expected and worried about just not being there. I mean people can see my lists on this thread for themselves.

But I'm still massively hung up on that 'virginity' speech and the generally harassment from the fanbase, which IS still continuing.

Like Gail has been harassed as much as anyone (and still is now) but can dissociate that from the movie.

I just can't do that I'm still actively annoyed by that speech, it's STILL irritates me that the big announcement of the return of Milestone Comics had a whole bunch of replies of '#restoretheSnyderverse'. It still bugs me that The Plan was Bruce and Lois feel in love and have a baby that Clark raises. AND I really worry about they impact of this kind of fan entitlement will have on the future. EG the #ayerscut too.

But it's ended up apparently not being a cynical and dour grimdark grump fest like I expected. And might end up being legitimately fine-to-good.

And yeah I know I'm too invested and am having trouble squaring this circle but it also feel it's kind of important to say this all here, so my cards and opinions are laid on the table, so that none good and thinks I'm pretending or covering up my previous opinions.

Peoples opinions are allowed to change. If you felt one way before even watching it and feel a different way after watching that isn't only fine it's expected. And if after THAT you think about it and feel differently again? Good. Feel however you do.


About Milestone. That gak is just inherently racist. Why did DC make an entirely different comic universe to have black super heroes? Why not just have the events of the Milestone universe take place in the normal DC universe and then a bunch of new characters just interact with the rest of DC? Static is legit a great character and the events surrounding his origin along with the rest of the Bang Babies is just a good story with interesting implications for regular ol DC. They keep partially introducing him to regular DC and then wiping it out again when they inevitably reboot. Just fething stop.

I guess after Cyclops raised Supe's baby it's Supe's turn to raise Bruce's?

Well, today’s the day.

Work done, and considering a take out curry for dinner.

Think I’m gonna 7 day trial NowTV movies, and potentially scorch my brain with this.

I remain open to being pleasantly surprised.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Thoughts so far, a little over an hour in.




Automatically Appended Next Post:



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Local power cut has forced a recess on my viewing.

Gonna pick it up again on my iPad, as that’s 4g.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh.....oh god.

It started off alright. Certainly signs of improvement. Then it disappeared right up its own arse, refused to come out, and worse? Refused. To. End.

When you’ve successfully translated the landmark fantasy novels to the big screen? You can have a “bye everybody” multiple endings.

When you’ve successfully wrapped up a 20+ movie shared universe leading to that film? You can have your multiple endings.

When you’ve made a handful of distinctly ropey films, why?

Watched it off and on over the course of the day.

Need to digest a bit but... actually I rather liked it.

I'm an hour in and will finish the rest tonight.

Yeah, to me it's clearly an improvement. Of course it runs long, but I already figured that into my calculus. It was planned as a miniseries, and if it was a theatrical release, of course it wouldn't have been 4 hours. And in fact, I'm betting you could cut this down to 3 or close to it without losing most of the added connective tissue.

It's interesting how the story beats are mostly similar so far but the tone is different.

then with Snyder Subtlety, grabs a Sosig out the air...

If I google that, am I going to regret it?
And are they going to sex regrets or third reich regrets? Context is kinda giving me both.

I liked it. If it wasn’t so long, I’d watch it again this weekend.

Random takeaways in no order:

Much more brutal than most Marvel flicks (aside from the now defunct Netflix shows), alot more vulgar too, which caught me off guard.

This Joker doesn’t work. Might’ve been an improvement from Suicide Squad, but I can’t get into it.

The music choices in some scenes were offensively bad and kind of distracting (in my opinion).

Steppenwolf was vastly improved and worked pretty well as a villian. Parademons were also toughened up it seems. Was a pretty awesome scene when they flew out of the water with their boss after the temple fight.

The flashback Green Lantern went out like a chump.

I hope they have a good reason for The Martian to have sat out for so long.

Who is the chick next to Darkseid?

Kind of excited for more solo flicks from the League members. Might finally watch Aquaman.

Definitely feels like a course correction for DC films. But WB will gak the bed again, no doubt. WW1984 kind of proves it.

8/10. Might be my go to “Play this movie will I hobby” movie for awhile.

Edit: Some more thoughts:

That parademon sketch had to have been some kind of inside joke or maybe a young fan sent it to Zach Snyder and he decided to put it into the movie to make that lil fella happy. I lol’d at it and I wasn’t sure if I was supposed to.

I never knew Cyborg was so powerful. Like wipe out the world powerful.

Still bothers me that Batman is so nonchalant about his true identity.

I’m still willing to give this Lex Luthor a chance, perhaps explain that an intrusive alien influence drove him temporarily/annoyingly crazy, and use that to put him back on track. But I’d be cool with a recast/reimagining as well.

I really hope we don’t get a Nightmare movie.

 nels1031 wrote:
Who is the chick next to Darkseid?

I reply, with tears in my eyes and terror in my voice:

 Captain Joystick wrote:

 nels1031 wrote:
Who is the chick next to Darkseid?

I reply, with tears in my eyes and terror in my voice:

Spoiler:

"Granny Goodness."

Not sure what to say to that choice of name. The 70’s were a strange time.

It was fine. It is an improvement to the initial film but I doubt it will change any minds radically. If you didn't like the first you might move up to "ok" but doubt it will leap multiple tiers. It is more consistent in tone with the other films with a lot of "witty banter" removed; there is still some humor but not Whedonesque humor.

Overall I thought they did Darkseid fine and the little changes to Steppenwolf, both physically and his motivations, improved him as an antagonist.

Edit: I really don't understand the choice of 4:3 aspect ratio.

 nels1031 wrote:
Uh, for anyone else out there, don’t do like I did and Google anything in spoiler text. Unless thats your thing. Its the middle part that sends it wayyy off course.

Once again Google proves I should never try to make a joke. I've edited it down.

 Captain Joystick wrote:
I've edited it down.

As did I, to spare the innocent!

Edit: I really don't understand the choice of 4:3 aspect ratio

It's not 4:3 (I mean, it is, but) so much as optimised for IMAX. Weird flex but that's why.

Voss wrote:

then with Snyder Subtlety, grabs a Sosig out the air...

If I google that, am I going to regret it?
And are they going to sex regrets or third reich regrets? Context is kinda giving me both.

No regrets. Safe for work searchable

 Azreal13 wrote:

Edit: I really don't understand the choice of 4:3 aspect ratio

It's not 4:3 (I mean, it is, but) so much as optimised for IMAX. Weird flex but that's why.

He's also been going on about a B&W version of the film. I don't think the worldwide audience for that would even fill a small town...but that's ZS for you.

I finished it last night and need to chew on it a bit. But overall it feels like a much better told story. There's just a lot of little things, and not necessarily the ones that got all the hype, like the cameos from a certain other hero. The characters felt a little truer. Barry was still comic relief but not quite the same one-note scaredy-cat he was in the theatrical cut. The scene with Iris is a gem IMO...really sweet and light and beautifully edited and shot. You watch that and think...Zack man...why can't you bring that more often? Arthur feels more like the guy from the solo film thanks to just a few lines and portion of a scene (when they were discussing Cyborg). Bruce wasn't as weary/cranky...in fact, he seemed fairly cheery and energized.

The Flying Fox turned out to be a metaphor for the state of the team...who knew from the theatrical cut?!? And how about the establishing shots! You actually have a sense of where they are! Amazing. I realize Whedon was chopping every split second he could to achieve that ridiculous 2-hour mandate from the studio, but the lack of establishing shots for scenes is a big reason the theatrical release screams SHOT ON SOUNDSTAGE. Also, gone is the dumb rooftop scene, gone is the pointless Russian family, gone is all the uncomfortable leering at Diana. Yeah, I'm good with all of this.

Superman was a bit of disappointment, even with a normal lip. Loved hearing the Zimmer theme, and the scene in the cornfield wasn't so corny (pun intended). But people are going to joke that Snyder is obsessed with Superman turning evil or being dead...and I'm not sure they're wrong. The idea that Lois is his only tether to humanity -- and the movie kinda beats you over the head with that -- just seems dumb. It's not even true for this Superman based on what we saw in MoS, where it's implied that the town's been covering for him for years, because too many people had seen him DO THINGS. And I don't know why he'd be in the black suit at the very end, other than ZS just thinks it's cool.

More to say later...