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2021/05/28 00:55:45
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
NinthMusketeer wrote: note how the regular human of the warband in the last image is the exact same height as the guardsman
Uhhhh... no.
I'll admit that the mini is shorter than the others, but its very dramatically action posed and hunched over - much moreso than the Guardsmen - if it was standing upright it would be as tall as the marine.
Cebalrai wrote: The new blood knights are noticeably bigger than the previous ones.
NinthMusketeer wrote: It IS lame that there is no nightmare-mounted vlord option. I feel like it would not have been difficult to include a special head/weapon/torso in the blood knight kit to make one of the models as a vlord.
The kits aren't really designed for that. You buy 5 blood knights, you get exactly 5 blood knights. The old days where kits could be bashed easily and a captain for example could be built from mixing bits from vanguard and tacticals is gone. No model, no rules. However, I think they'll get an update next year like Lumineth did, adding in a lot more kits. So it's possible that one such kit might arrive in the near future. However, I do believe their is a lord on a Terrorgeist, which is cav and can keep up.
Evocator kit with Knight-Incantor option, Seraphon flyer kit with character options, FEC kits with character options all say hi.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
drbored wrote: I don't buy the 'but it's hunched overrrrr' argument anymore.
It's all about battlefield size and presence. Either it's too big or it's too small, and either way it's up to personal opinion.
In my mind, Warcry models are a lot like Necromunda. They're scaled up to fit a smaller scale game, so I don't mind it.
But, what do I know? They'll likely come out with new guardsmen for 40k that are twice the size of primaris yet still somehow 28mm scale.
I own both warcry models and empire plastics, I can look at them and tell very clearly they are the same scale. People just like to cherry pick the biggest humans from a warband and put them next to the smallest from another army, instead of actually comparing them to what their WHFB equivalent would be. Marauders are bigger than empire infantry too! Scale creep!
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/05/28 03:42:45
Its extremely frustrating that they put options in a unit kit to make one model a character, when that doesn't leave you with enough models to actually use in a unit...
So yeah I can make a Knight Incantor, but now I have 4 Evocators I can't use... sure I could ebay an extra model, but thats likely to cost as much as just having bought the character in the first place. It's really dumb.
It would make sense if we could add models one by one to units past the minimum strength and only pay for those models, but that would require a fundamental rework of unit pointing.
2021/05/28 12:06:42
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
Just looking at Lauka Vai's lower body ( behave! ) and with green stuff and a large skull head it could be an alternative model to a Mourngul. Maybe give it green stuff robes and it'll fit right in with the rest of a Nighthaunt army...
Speaking of which, just noticed this amazing conversion of the same kit, although one seems to need a Thunderwolf cavalry wolf head...
Stux wrote: Its extremely frustrating that they put options in a unit kit to make one model a character, when that doesn't leave you with enough models to actually use in a unit...
So yeah I can make a Knight Incantor, but now I have 4 Evocators I can't use... sure I could ebay an extra model, but thats likely to cost as much as just having bought the character in the first place. It's really dumb.
It would make sense if we could add models one by one to units past the minimum strength and only pay for those models, but that would require a fundamental rework of unit pointing.
There are two options for that kit...
For such kits I cast the missing pieces or better still, sculpt them. Some parts of a body can be hidden by scenery, which is a feature on many GW models these days. Clever use of kitbashing accessories can also work.
Alternatively, purchase the current Getting Started magazine for £5. This includes the Knight Incantor which is perfect for converting into a 5th Evocator.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/05/28 18:08:03
Casual gaming, mostly solo-coop these days.
2021/05/28 18:10:36
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
That's just one example, there are several other kits that do that. And I shouldn't have to kitbash or cast parts to be able to use the models I've bought in army.
I also think it was pretty darn shady of them to put multiple of models in the starter sets that aren't legal unit sizes. 3 Retributors and so on...
It would make sense if we could add models one by one to units past the minimum strength and only pay for those models
That's crazy talk!
Who ever heard of such a system?
If it made that much sense, surely GW would have used that system for decades...
Indeed
I dont hate only building units in multiples of the base size inherently. It's just when the numbers of models you end up with don't match those multiples it makes it seem really bad.
Also when you build a list and have like 30 pts left over hah. Sure, I could take an endless spell ill get no use out of I guess...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/28 18:12:45
2021/05/28 19:45:25
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
Stux wrote: That's just one example, there are several other kits that do that. And I shouldn't have to kitbash or cast parts to be able to use the models I've bought in army.
I also think it was pretty darn shady of them to put multiple of models in the starter sets that aren't legal unit sizes. 3 Retributors and so on...
Thats understandable, Stux. Most of the Stormcast unit models I've been collecting from Mortal Realms are sprues from the starter sets and have only one legal unit of five Liberators. Nighthaunts fared far better as a complete army.
Tyranids are a different matter altogether. The warriors and swarmlord kits are fantastic value with a bit of resourcefulness. For only £32.50 one can have a Tyranid Prime and 3 Warriors, and for £35 one has both a Hive Tyrant and Swarm Lord.
Where they got it right is with the Harlequin Troupe. It contains a minimum number of five players for a unit, but also one can either make the sixth Harlequin as either a Troupe Master or another player, which can be added to the unit without concern other than paying the points or power. Alternatively, that last Harlequin provided a complete body to kitbash with into an alternative character such as a Deathjester or Solitaire. Love that kit!
Casual gaming, mostly solo-coop these days.
2021/05/28 20:45:42
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
I also think it was pretty darn shady of them to put multiple of models in the starter sets that aren't legal unit sizes. 3 Retributors and so
Sigh....
1) it's a STARTER SET. You know, to get games going quickly, with minimal extra rules. Hence the basic rule pamphlet included.
2) please read the rules (BRB + tome) When you do you'll notice 2 things.
1st, there are two more modes of play other than matched. People do play them.
2nd, the units scroll, under unit size, almost always starts off with "this unit may contain any # of models". This matters (somewhat) in open & narrative play.
2021/05/28 21:04:20
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
Stux wrote: Its extremely frustrating that they put options in a unit kit to make one model a character, when that doesn't leave you with enough models to actually use in a unit...
So yeah I can make a Knight Incantor, but now I have 4 Evocators I can't use... sure I could ebay an extra model, but thats likely to cost as much as just having bought the character in the first place. It's really dumb.
It would make sense if we could add models one by one to units past the minimum strength and only pay for those models, but that would require a fundamental rework of unit pointing.
I really understand this viewpoint, but at the same time I would much rather have the option. After all, you can build 5 evocators from the box no matter what, the only difference is if the character option is there. Plus, half the reason is just getting the box checked for GWs no-model-no-rules policy so we can all have a warscroll that we are going to convert characters for anyways.
NinthMusketeer wrote: It IS lame that there is no nightmare-mounted vlord option. I feel like it would not have been difficult to include a special head/weapon/torso in the blood knight kit to make one of the models as a vlord.
The kits aren't really designed for that. You buy 5 blood knights, you get exactly 5 blood knights. The old days where kits could be bashed easily and a captain for example could be built from mixing bits from vanguard and tacticals is gone. No model, no rules. However, I think they'll get an update next year like Lumineth did, adding in a lot more kits. So it's possible that one such kit might arrive in the near future. However, I do believe their is a lord on a Terrorgeist, which is cav and can keep up.
Evocator kit with Knight-Incantor option, Seraphon flyer kit with character options, FEC kits with character options all say hi.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
drbored wrote: I don't buy the 'but it's hunched overrrrr' argument anymore.
It's all about battlefield size and presence. Either it's too big or it's too small, and either way it's up to personal opinion.
In my mind, Warcry models are a lot like Necromunda. They're scaled up to fit a smaller scale game, so I don't mind it.
But, what do I know? They'll likely come out with new guardsmen for 40k that are twice the size of primaris yet still somehow 28mm scale.
I own both warcry models and empire plastics, I can look at them and tell very clearly they are the same scale. People just like to cherry pick the biggest humans from a warband and put them next to the smallest from another army, instead of actually comparing them to what their WHFB equivalent would be. Marauders are bigger than empire infantry too! Scale creep!
Those are old kits, the last what, two years or less it's become quite clear that they're moving in a total what you see is what you get in terms of bits?
2021/05/29 10:37:38
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
Stux wrote: Its extremely frustrating that they put options in a unit kit to make one model a character, when that doesn't leave you with enough models to actually use in a unit...
So yeah I can make a Knight Incantor, but now I have 4 Evocators I can't use... sure I could ebay an extra model, but thats likely to cost as much as just having bought the character in the first place. It's really dumb.
It would make sense if we could add models one by one to units past the minimum strength and only pay for those models, but that would require a fundamental rework of unit pointing.
I really understand this viewpoint, but at the same time I would much rather have the option. After all, you can build 5 evocators from the box no matter what, the only difference is if the character option is there. Plus, half the reason is just getting the box checked for GWs no-model-no-rules policy so we can all have a warscroll that we are going to convert characters for anyways.
The one positive for me is that its nice to get a load of character type bits for the bits box. That is nice, compared to just having an easy build type kit
I also think it was pretty darn shady of them to put multiple of models in the starter sets that aren't legal unit sizes. 3 Retributors and so
Sigh....
1) it's a STARTER SET. You know, to get games going quickly, with minimal extra rules. Hence the basic rule pamphlet included.
2) please read the rules (BRB + tome) When you do you'll notice 2 things.
1st, there are two more modes of play other than matched. People do play them.
2nd, the units scroll, under unit size, almost always starts off with "this unit may contain any # of models". This matters (somewhat) in open & narrative play.
I'm sorry, but I've time again seen new players be frustrated at not having models usable for matched play. Yes, technically you can understrength the unit, but that again feels awful. It being a starter set is no excuse, it would be so easy to change around the contents when making units for the sets to give people normal quantities of models.
Handwave it all you want, it's an awful practice.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/05/29 10:47:23
2021/05/29 11:00:09
Subject: Re:How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
I just think having character upgrades as alt-builds in kits is a great way for us to get extra hero options without GW doing a whole extra kit for them. Anyone who is unhappy with the models not matching up in number can simply not assemble the character, just like they can now. It would be an objective improvement over not having the option at all.
Well there are battletomes which did not get endless spells and also did not get a new tome in about a year, and there are battletomes which already had endless spells and did get a new tome in about a year (or less), so I do not see any reason to assume as such. What evidence are you looking at to reach your conclusion?
Well there are battletomes which did not get endless spells and also did not get a new tome in about a year, and there are battletomes which already had endless spells and did get a new tome in about a year (or less), so I do not see any reason to assume as such. What evidence are you looking at to reach your conclusion?
Coin flip + the basic assumption GW wants to sell me the same book again with minimal additions (see Karidon, & DoK).
It's as valid evidence as anyone else can present for/against something GW might do.
2021/05/30 10:09:20
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
Coin flip is the way to put it, I'd agree that far.
Sometimes they do stuff, sometimes they don't. There is little discernable pattern. I wouldn't be too surprised if it just came down to having model designers spare to work up some spell models at just the right time or not.
2021/05/30 16:43:21
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
Probably because they couldn't make the models in time for the release date and that the summoning mechanic already makes for some sort of equivalent. I think the AoS team was a bit rushed when it came to the Gravelords. They obviously wanted to release all new Death armies in 2nd edition, but with COVID recking plans and deadlines arriving they had to rush the development a bit and cut some corners. When it comes to models, Gravelords are in a very good position. They have enough variety to stand on their own so the absence of endless spells isn't so bad. As for rules issues, they can always be fixed in FAQ or that kind of thing. Plus, in about three or four years, they will probably receive a new book and it's always good to already have a few known missing piece to expend an army.
2021/05/30 16:59:58
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
Well there are battletomes which did not get endless spells and also did not get a new tome in about a year, and there are battletomes which already had endless spells and did get a new tome in about a year (or less), so I do not see any reason to assume as such. What evidence are you looking at to reach your conclusion?
Coin flip + the basic assumption GW wants to sell me the same book again with minimal additions (see Karidon, & DoK).
It's as valid evidence as anyone else can present for/against something GW might do.
Well we can see from the past plenty of prior battletomes without endless spells that have not played out that way, and prior battletomes with endless spells that did. So clearly a battletome being released with endless spells does not prevent GW from performing the action you indicate, nor does releasing a battletome without guarantee it.
So there is no historical precedent or evidence to suggest that conclusion is valid. Again, I ask what are you basing this on? If it is just a theory you made up you can just say so--people come up with their own theories all the time.
Further, DoK was multiple years after their old (first edition) battletome and the KO battletome was a major overhaul that added and dramatically changed a number of mechanics. So those are, objectively, not examples as you claim them to be.
I thought I was quite clear on that. Maybe I wasn't? So I'll repeat it to you: Coin flip + the assumption they'll want to sell me a another, slightly changed, book in the nearish future.
NinthMusketeer wrote: If it is just a theory you made up you can just say so--people come up with their own theories all the time.
No ! The difference between me & others is I'm not pretending to be able to divine evidence from zero info. My conclusion is just as valid as the next guys paragraphs of reasoning. We both start & end with zero actual info.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Further, DoK was multiple years after their old (first edition) battletome and the KO battletome was a major overhaul that added and dramatically changed a number of mechanics. So those are, objectively, not examples as you claim them to be.
1) The original DoK tome is a 2e book.
2e logo, 2018 copyright (2e came out in 2018), PTG pages. I forget what month it landed, but a very early 2e book is still a 2e book.
2) You & I will just have to disagree wether the changes in those books were major/minor/other.
2021/05/30 18:59:15
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
ccs wrote: 1) The original DoK tome is a 2e book. 2e logo, 2018 copyright (2e came out in 2018), PTG pages. I forget what month it landed, but a very early 2e book is still a 2e book.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/30 19:22:19
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
2021/05/30 19:57:23
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
I thought I was quite clear on that. Maybe I wasn't? So I'll repeat it to you: Coin flip + the assumption they'll want to sell me a another, slightly changed, book in the nearish future.
NinthMusketeer wrote: If it is just a theory you made up you can just say so--people come up with their own theories all the time.
No ! The difference between me & others is I'm not pretending to be able to divine evidence from zero info. My conclusion is just as valid as the next guys paragraphs of reasoning. We both start & end with zero actual info.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Further, DoK was multiple years after their old (first edition) battletome and the KO battletome was a major overhaul that added and dramatically changed a number of mechanics. So those are, objectively, not examples as you claim them to be.
1) The original DoK tome is a 2e book.
2e logo, 2018 copyright (2e came out in 2018), PTG pages. I forget what month it landed, but a very early 2e book is still a 2e book.
2) You & I will just have to disagree wether the changes in those books were major/minor/other.
I have something to admit; I knew from the start this theory has no basis in reality. But I wanted to know how you had arrived at it, and your responses have been informative so I thank you for that.
As someone who used to play Vampire Counts, back when AoS was WHFB, I can't say Soulblight has given me a reason to take my army off the shelf.
As far as I can see, every issue I had with Vampires in AoS is still there. In fact, Vampire Lords have actually gotten worse in their own battletome, which is impressive given how abysmal they were already.
Hey, remember those models that used to be among the strongest in the game? You know, the ones that combined impressive melee statlines with powerful spellcasting and vampire abilities? Yeah, now they're just Lv1 wizards with pitiful defensive profiles and melee that's mediocre at best. Oh, and now you get no options at all. No flight. No blood chalice. Nothing.
Boy, what a thrilling unit to lead my army. Truly the possibilities are endless.
But of course, I'm not meant to be using them for that, am I? Because like everything in AoS units are only allowed to be worth a damn if they're the size of a 3-story building. Alas, Vampires are only worth a damn if they have a mount glued to their buttocks.
Also, I fear I find most of the relics and general traits to be uninspired at best.
Sadly, it seems what little creativity there was went into the special characters, which I have zero interest in. Some of the models are nice (very nice, in fact) but I hate special characters and I hate the increasing degree to which both 40k and AoS are focussing on them.
All in all, whatever its merits, it's just too far removed from the army I'd want to play.
blood reaper wrote: I will respect human rights and trans people but I will never under any circumstances use the phrase 'folks' or 'ya'll'. I would rather be killed by firing squad.
the_scotsman wrote: Yeah, when i read the small novel that is the Death Guard unit options and think about resolving the attacks from a melee-oriented min size death guard squad, the thing that springs to mind is "Accessible!"
Argive wrote: GW seems to have a crystal ball and just pulls hairbrained ideas out of their backside for the most part.
You're not. If you're worried about your opponent using 'fake' rules, you're having fun the wrong way. This hobby isn't about rules. It's about buying Citadel miniatures.
Please report to your nearest GW store for attitude readjustment. Take your wallet.
2021/06/05 10:42:26
Subject: How are you liking the soul Blight so far?
vipoid wrote: As someone who used to play Vampire Counts, back when AoS was WHFB, I can't say Soulblight has given me a reason to take my army off the shelf.
As far as I can see, every issue I had with Vampires in AoS is still there. In fact, Vampire Lords have actually gotten worse in their own battletome, which is impressive given how abysmal they were already.
Hey, remember those models that used to be among the strongest in the game? You know, the ones that combined impressive melee statlines with powerful spellcasting and vampire abilities? Yeah, now they're just Lv1 wizards with pitiful defensive profiles and melee that's mediocre at best. Oh, and now you get no options at all. No flight. No blood chalice. Nothing.
Boy, what a thrilling unit to lead my army. Truly the possibilities are endless.
But of course, I'm not meant to be using them for that, am I? Because like everything in AoS units are only allowed to be worth a damn if they're the size of a 3-story building. Alas, Vampires are only worth a damn if they have a mount glued to their buttocks.
Also, I fear I find most of the relics and general traits to be uninspired at best.
Sadly, it seems what little creativity there was went into the special characters, which I have zero interest in. Some of the models are nice (very nice, in fact) but I hate special characters and I hate the increasing degree to which both 40k and AoS are focussing on them.
All in all, whatever its merits, it's just too far removed from the army I'd want to play.
Same exact thoughts, this army doesnt work for me anymore and it just sucks that it does. It just feels terrible and non sensical.
Also, they aren't Vampires, they are SoulBlep Blebloplop TM.
! The difference between me & others is I'm not pretending to be able to divine evidence from zero info. My conclusion is just as valid as the next guys paragraphs of reasoning. We both start & end with zero actual info.
