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If only what was competitive didn't change faster than it takes most people to build an army you might have a point.

The Admech box looked really cool to me, and then I added up the total number of points if you take the most expensive (points-wise) stuff

It's pretty unbelievable that the *BIG DISCOUNT SET* basically gives you a 2.5:1 points to USD ratio. 5 years ago, if you told me I was going to get into an army at 2.5:1, I would've told you that was way too rich for my blood. I knew prices were going up but boy, these admech units are at a whole new threshold.

If only what was competitive didn't change faster than it takes most people to build an army you might have a point.

That's all the more reason to have a good spread of stuff. Plus I'd also imagine that many people that play only one faction still like to have some variations of armies within that faction. So this box that is apparently divided into some foot sloggers and some mechanised units would surely be fine for such a player - he adds the foot sloggers to his infantry army and the mechanised troops go towards his mech army.

The Ork one does seem really jumbled. There's no real theme to any of it.

 NAVARRO wrote:

Bloody hell drop it man, no one gives a rats ass if you want to be competitive! Its not about you its about different people being happy with different things. Stop pooping on other people pools!

GW designed the current editions of it's main games to be specifically about buffs and build synergies, it's the keystone of the game. If the box is basically a random mix of units that have none of it, it's pretty poorly designed. Why are you upset when someone points that out?

JWBS wrote:

If only what was competitive didn't change faster than it takes most people to build an army you might have a point.

That's all the more reason to have a good spread of stuff. Plus I'd also imagine that many people that play only one faction still like to have some variations of armies within that faction. So this box that is apparently divided into some foot sloggers and some mechanised units would surely be fine for such a player - he adds the foot sloggers to his infantry army and the mechanised troops go towards his mech army.

That was what I was sarcastically trying to point out. I should have quoted the post I was responding to, but didn't realize I'd be the first post on a new page.

 NAVARRO wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:

Andykp wrote:
There are people that play out there who don’t care so much about winning and just want a game and a cool looking army. The combat patrol box is another good place to start but this whole,” you must take x,y or z” nonsense is utter rubbish and a massive issue with dakka. It’s like there’s only one way play the game.

I’ve been an ORK player since 1st edition and find the tactics thread very disappointing, it does state it’s just for competitive play but it literally just promotes the same old boring army builds and won’t allow any other discussion at all. The other posters saying that the load out for the boyz is bad, it is what it is, Grots being a “bad” unit is irrelevant, they will feature in pretty much every ORK army I filed because they are integral part of an ORK army fluff wise. It isn’t optimised, but that doesn’t matter, the models are lovely. This box is for new folk buying a new army. If existing players want to grab a ‘bargain’ then they can but it’s not designed for expanding from an existing army.

So it’s not WRONG, as you say. It’s just wrong if you care about winning and not about having a cool looking army.

If you enjoy having your orks blasted off the table in one turn, that's your thing. The vast majority of people don't, and especially new players rarely join for the beer and pretzels mentality from three decades ago.

I have been a victim of "I play since 1st edition and you can play anything you want" people like you that wasted my money when starting out by giving crap advice just like you did. I've also seen many people disappear from 40k who followed similar advice all throughout many editions, while people who start out with a functional army and branch out from there into whatever style of gaming they enjoy tend to stick around.

Misleading new players who don't know better into buying armies that are unable to win is malicious and harmful to the community.

Oh, and you are flat out lying about the content of the ork thread, so there is that.

In any case, your advice is literally "buy this box if you want to lose", which is the same as I'm saying. You just should more honest about it.

Bloody hell drop it man, no one gives a rats ass if you want to be competitive! Its not about you its about different people being happy with different things. Stop pooping on other people pools!

I mean this is a warGAME, with game being the operative word. The objective is to win, even if the goal is to have fun. And fun in most people's minds is at least having a bit of a sporting chance when you play against someone, where its a relative playing field. Telling people to pick this up as a standalone army for newbies is pretty much setting them up to fail. Not all armies are built equal with different ones having various learning curves, and Orks are one of those armies that have a much steeper one than you would expect. Even within a narrative or open play context, Orks still need to have a focused army to function properly (because don't forget this also means the restrictions for other armies are loosened, transhuman on multiple units anyone?). If you give someone a strong foundation, they will do well in both competitive games AND casual. I never understood this binary between thinking that somehow a casual context means you must build terrible army lists that no one enjoys playing. If you want to make pew pew noises and go full old-school rock em sock em robots with your models, you're free to do so, but even within that context you could probably do a lot better than buy this box or just buy the actual warhammer action figures and save yourself the trouble of assembling them.

I find it very funny that the people who say "not everything needs to be competitive" is trying to assert that people like me and Jidmah are the ones ruining people's fun when we are ensuring that they have a higher likelihood of having fun through a solid start by preventing them from getting railed early on in their Ork Warboss careers. Like you don't deliberately teach people to play other games like chess or othello badly because it's "all about the fun" do you? Or I guess a better comparison would be selling chess sets, where the white chess pieces have less rooks, bishops, and knights than the black pieces. I would say it's more selfish to assert that your own casual gaming bubble is the norm than it is to prepare somebody for the competitive possibilities of a tabletop gaming environment.

The only bubble needs to be bursted is the one that assumes everyone wants or is happy with what you personally want or are happy with as gamer, competitive or not.

Box is bad for some and good for others for different reasons and thats all good but the moment you go on a tangent claiming who ever does it differently is "WRONG" and is "malicious and harmful for the community" then yeah keep the drama to yourself.

Be competitive be casual be collector be all that, just dont be a party pooper cause you dont understand divergent points and levels of enjoyment.

 Grimskul wrote:

 NAVARRO wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:

Andykp wrote:
There are people that play out there who don’t care so much about winning and just want a game and a cool looking army. The combat patrol box is another good place to start but this whole,” you must take x,y or z” nonsense is utter rubbish and a massive issue with dakka. It’s like there’s only one way play the game.

I’ve been an ORK player since 1st edition and find the tactics thread very disappointing, it does state it’s just for competitive play but it literally just promotes the same old boring army builds and won’t allow any other discussion at all. The other posters saying that the load out for the boyz is bad, it is what it is, Grots being a “bad” unit is irrelevant, they will feature in pretty much every ORK army I filed because they are integral part of an ORK army fluff wise. It isn’t optimised, but that doesn’t matter, the models are lovely. This box is for new folk buying a new army. If existing players want to grab a ‘bargain’ then they can but it’s not designed for expanding from an existing army.

So it’s not WRONG, as you say. It’s just wrong if you care about winning and not about having a cool looking army.

If you enjoy having your orks blasted off the table in one turn, that's your thing. The vast majority of people don't, and especially new players rarely join for the beer and pretzels mentality from three decades ago.

I have been a victim of "I play since 1st edition and you can play anything you want" people like you that wasted my money when starting out by giving crap advice just like you did. I've also seen many people disappear from 40k who followed similar advice all throughout many editions, while people who start out with a functional army and branch out from there into whatever style of gaming they enjoy tend to stick around.

Misleading new players who don't know better into buying armies that are unable to win is malicious and harmful to the community.

Oh, and you are flat out lying about the content of the ork thread, so there is that.

In any case, your advice is literally "buy this box if you want to lose", which is the same as I'm saying. You just should more honest about it.

Bloody hell drop it man, no one gives a rats ass if you want to be competitive! Its not about you its about different people being happy with different things. Stop pooping on other people pools!

I mean this is a warGAME, with game being the operative word. The objective is to win, even if the goal is to have fun. And fun in most people's minds is at least having a bit of a sporting chance when you play against someone, where its a relative playing field. Telling people to pick this up as a standalone army for newbies is pretty much setting them up to fail. Not all armies are built equal with different ones having various learning curves, and Orks are one of those armies that have a much steeper one than you would expect. Even within a narrative or open play context, Orks still need to have a focused army to function properly (because don't forget this also means the restrictions for other armies are loosened, transhuman on multiple units anyone?). If you give someone a strong foundation, they will do well in both competitive games AND casual. I never understood this binary between thinking that somehow a casual context means you must build terrible army lists that no one enjoys playing. If you want to make pew pew noises and go full old-school rock em sock em robots with your models, you're free to do so, but even within that context you could probably do a lot better than buy this box or just buy the actual warhammer action figures and save yourself the trouble of assembling them.

I find it very funny that the people who say "not everything needs to be competitive" is trying to assert that people like me and Jidmah are the ones ruining people's fun when we are ensuring that they have a higher likelihood of having fun through a solid start by preventing them from getting railed early on in their Ork Warboss careers. Like you don't deliberately teach people to play other games like chess or othello badly because it's "all about the fun" do you? Or I guess a better comparison would be selling chess sets, where the white chess pieces have less rooks, bishops, and knights than the black pieces. I would say it's more selfish to assert that your own casual gaming bubble is the norm than it is to prepare somebody for the competitive possibilities of a tabletop gaming environment.

I am not asserting anything is the norm, just that the competitive way is the only way is a false narrative. Never said you shouldn’t play to be competitive, your version of doing “well” is all about winning, the game has scope and design in place to be more about telling a story, they make a big thing of it. But this is the typical reaction to anyone who says, “you know what, it’s not all about winning and having a powerful army”. Shout them down and call them liars.

Jidmah is not on some moral crusade to save players from mediocrity. Just accept there are other ways to play. This box set would make me very happy if I didn’t already have an ORK army and some one got me it because I like the stories I have read about ORKS. I would would be pleased as punch. I would paint it up and make up back ground for the units and have a blast. And if I played against someone like you guys I would lose most likely but I doubt that would happen.

So my review of this box set stands, it gives you a couple of lovely hq models, some amazing troop models and even the flavour of the month, a flyer (which is also an amazing model btw). And then I would want to buy Kanz and the cool buggies and maybe some of those new-fangled squig rider things.

If they made a box set that appealed to the way you guys like to play it would be nerfed in six months and you would all be complaining about how they had sold a load of competitive boxes and nerfed them!! It’s almost like you are never happy.

chaos0xomega wrote:

The American flag next to your username indicates that you are white-knighting for people that probably don't need to be white-knighted for. Where there is a will, there is a way. You can absolutely order from retailers who don't deliver to your country through various forwarding services and intermediaries. I do it all the time. It comes at an additional cost, but then again its no different from the additional costs incurred from shipping and paying full retail from GW. As I said before, if your first thought is to go to GWs website to try to get something, you either lack imagination, experience/knowledge, or googling skills.

Imagine naming the country between Canadá and México "America" and assuming someone nationality because a flag wrongly displayed, and calling someone "whiteknighting" because of that.

I am mexican, living in México and I've put that on my profile, and I've put my location on display here on the forum, but Dakka x2 apparently thinks my country is part of the glorious 'Muhrican Capitalist Empire. I'm speakeing of personal experience, and you could also check by yourself, asking the e-retailes if they do deliver to every country in the world. Plenty of e-retailers only deliver to their own country.

ERJAK wrote:
That battle sister box is straight garbage tbh. Battle sisters are the kit everyone has, the exorcist and immolator are both trash. You're basically just buying the box for the dogmata and the sacrosancts.

It's still a discount and that's always nice, but man...the only way it would have been worse is if they had put in a castigator instead.

Funnily enough the box is pretty decent for me. I held back on loading up on Sisters in anticipation of a discount box so the Sisters squad is welcome. I haven't gotten around to buying the shield girls, couldn't bring myself to buy the character and another Immolator is welcome. The only thing I don't necessarily need is the Exorcist, and I would have very much preferred if the Not!Predator was in the box, but I don't exactly mind having the spare Exorcist either.

I hope it's reasonably available so I can get one, preferably from an independent store for the extra discount. Sisters kits, especially the vehicles, are pretty pricey.

Sisters is the box I am definitely going for if I can get one discounted.

Also want the Rohan town if that's available for a good price. Suspect wont be discounted at all.

Quite tempted by the Soulblight. I already have a unit of Skeletons and Zombies though so need to work out if 40 and 60 (plus Cursed City models) is too many.

I need most of the Ad Mech and could use most of the Space Marine boxes but very conscious of the every expanding boxes in my attic of shame so intend to give them a miss. Might grab one or two cheap units from eBay from people splitting if the price is right,

 CMLR wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:

The American flag next to your username indicates that you are white-knighting for people that probably don't need to be white-knighted for. Where there is a will, there is a way. You can absolutely order from retailers who don't deliver to your country through various forwarding services and intermediaries. I do it all the time. It comes at an additional cost, but then again its no different from the additional costs incurred from shipping and paying full retail from GW. As I said before, if your first thought is to go to GWs website to try to get something, you either lack imagination, experience/knowledge, or googling skills.

Imagine naming the country between Canadá and México "America" and assuming someone nationality because a flag wrongly displayed, and calling someone "whiteknighting" because of that.

I am mexican, living in México and I've put that on my profile, and I've put my location on display here on the forum, but Dakka x2 apparently thinks my country is part of the glorious 'Muhrican Capitalist Empire. I'm speakeing of personal experience, and you could also check by yourself, asking the e-retailes if they do deliver to every country in the world. Plenty of e-retailers only deliver to their own country.

Again. Parcel forwarders. Its not that hard. My family in Santo Domingo uses them regularly to get their goodies from American and EU retailers that wouldn't ship there otherwise, as do some friends of mine in Panama. I know others in Venezuela, Peru, Honduras, Guatemala, Colombia, Ecuador, El Salvador, and Nicaragua who do the same. Imagine thinking that theres no channels to get stuff you want in the second largest economy in Latin America (and one of the largest in the world) while people living in some of the poorest countries in the world - just outside your own borders - are doing exactly that. If you think running the gauntlet with every other fool to try to score something from GW directly the morning preorders go live is your only chance then you're doing it wrong - you lack imagination, you haven't done your homework, you haven't explored the options. There are far better ways of doing it, if you can't find them and have to rely on what seems the obvious solution then thats definitely a "you" problem.

chaos0xomega wrote:


Again. Parcel forwarders. Its not that hard. My family in Santo Domingo uses them regularly to get their goodies from American and EU retailers that wouldn't ship there otherwise, as do some friends of mine in Panama. I know others in Venezuela, Peru, Honduras, Guatemala, Colombia, Ecuador, El Salvador, and Nicaragua who do the same. Imagine thinking that theres no channels to get stuff you want in the second largest economy in Latin America (and one of the largest in the world) while people living in some of the poorest countries in the world - just outside your own borders - are doing exactly that. If you think running the gauntlet with every other fool to try to score something from GW directly the morning preorders go live is your only chance then you're doing it wrong - you lack imagination, you haven't done your homework, you haven't explored the options. There are far better ways of doing it, if you can't find them and have to rely on what seems the obvious solution then thats definitely a "you" problem.

It is hard. I tried. No discounts, in fact, if I find someone willing to sell and send something, it ends up being over two times the price I would get by just ordering directly from GW. National gs are located almost exclusively on the capital city and no one sell cheaper than GW, in fact, they all sell above the actual price by a fair amount. Just because I live in the second largest economy of Latinamerica it does not mean I swim in money; reseources redistribution is something I have to deal daily. Remember the hobo problems that California has? ain't 'Mehrica suppoused to be "first world"? USA pays one kidney for University and other for health care, while I don't have to, but that's pretty much it. Other than that I can try chinese sites that have no licenses, but I don't want to lose money nor get my info exposed. Also, not everyone has family or friends outside of the country, or have them willing to make you the favor to buy expensive toy soldiers because not everyone has the resources to borrow to you, more when importation duties to your country go from reasonable to "am I trafficking with illegal sustances?" on the fly.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
The Ork one does seem really jumbled. There's no real theme to any of it.

The theme is that it’s actually a fieldable Battalion detachment, that leaves 350 points of room to expand on to hit 1000 points.



But let’s be real, these boxes don’t even need to make sense, we only want them because they offer a discount.

Noooooo! The box must be 100% FotM, anything else is worthless! An insult to consumers!

I really like the vampirey undead AoS box, but just can’t get into AoS and would want to rank and file them, anyone had any experience with square basing them? Do they rank up easily?

 CMLR wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:


Again. Parcel forwarders. Its not that hard. My family in Santo Domingo uses them regularly to get their goodies from American and EU retailers that wouldn't ship there otherwise, as do some friends of mine in Panama. I know others in Venezuela, Peru, Honduras, Guatemala, Colombia, Ecuador, El Salvador, and Nicaragua who do the same. Imagine thinking that theres no channels to get stuff you want in the second largest economy in Latin America (and one of the largest in the world) while people living in some of the poorest countries in the world - just outside your own borders - are doing exactly that. If you think running the gauntlet with every other fool to try to score something from GW directly the morning preorders go live is your only chance then you're doing it wrong - you lack imagination, you haven't done your homework, you haven't explored the options. There are far better ways of doing it, if you can't find them and have to rely on what seems the obvious solution then thats definitely a "you" problem.

It is hard. I tried. No discounts, in fact, if I find someone willing to sell and send something, it ends up being over two times the price I would get by just ordering directly from GW. National gs are located almost exclusively on the capital city and no one sell cheaper than GW, in fact, they all sell above the actual price by a fair amount. Just because I live in the second largest economy of Latinamerica it does not mean I swim in money; reseources redistribution is something I have to deal daily. Remember the hobo problems that California has? ain't 'Mehrica suppoused to be "first world"? USA pays one kidney for University and other for health care, while I don't have to, but that's pretty much it. Other than that I can try chinese sites that have no licenses, but I don't want to lose money nor get my info exposed. Also, not everyone has family or friends outside of the country, or have them willing to make you the favor to buy expensive toy soldiers because not everyone has the resources to borrow to you, more when importation duties to your country go from reasonable to "am I trafficking with illegal sustances?" on the fly.

CMLR, I feel like you missed the key point of Chaos0xomega's post.

You don't need friends in other countries. Parcel forwarders are companies that exist in places like the USA and the UK that allow you to buy product online with a US or UK shipping address. Basically, you pay them a fee, they give you a mailbox. Then you buy all the toys you want and get them shipped to that mailbox. When you're ready, they'll box all the product up and mail it out to you.

The problem is that you may end up getting hit with customs/taxes and import duties. However, the likelihood is that even including these, and adding the cost of shipping, if you buy enough product from discount retailers you will still save money over your local prices. Unless you live in Brazil - Brazil's import taxes are insane (like 100% of the value and up kind of insane).

Didn't see that anyone already did this, so here are the approximate points values in the box sets:

-Space Marines: >= 900, depending on options. Pretty solid!

-Death Guard: >= 950, again, depending on options (mainly on the Plague Marines). Highest points of the lot.

-Sisters: >= 620. Not great.

-AdMech: >= 550, depending on which variants of some of the units you take. Lowest of the bunch.

-Necrons: >= 720, middle of the road.

-Orks: >= 670, depending on what you put on the Nobz and which plane you build. 670 is with a Dakkajet with extra Supa Shootas and no upgrades at all on the Nobz or Boyz. You could easily squeeze 750 points out of this box.

Let's face it, we expected AdMech to be the lowest, considering how expensive their kits are (worst dollars-to-points ratio in the game, excluding overpriced FW toys). Didn't expect Sisters to be that low, and the points I calculated was with some toys on the Battle Sister Squad.

After this, I definitely can confirm my opinion that the Marines box is the best one of the bunch, and that the DG one is also good if you already have a couple of HQ options hanging around (if not, pick up the Patrol and maybe a Daemon Prince and you've got yourself a decent little force). The Necrons one is good but won't work as a stand-alone Patrol due to three Heavy choices (could be a Spearhead though). Again, easy enough to make a Battalion out of if you have the Combat Patrol and at least one of the Recruit/Elite edition starters. AdMech I expect is good value for money compared to buying the kits separately, but it just really shows how expensive the army is. The Ork box is a bit schizophrenic in terms of what kind of Ork force you can build, but as an expansion to an existing collection that may already have some of both types of WAAAGH! in it I think it is still decent. The Sisters one might be the biggest miss to me; low amount of points, and the vehicles are total poop on a stick currently as far as in-game viability.

Now all we need are the prices for these to see just how good of a deal they are.

Joyboozer wrote:
I really like the vampirey undead AoS box, but just can’t get into AoS and would want to rank and file them, anyone had any experience with square basing them? Do they rank up easily?

Why do you want them square?

Might as well wait for TOW. VC should be some of the earliest factions to be released, and I'm confident that they will release the current Soulblight range that would fit in TOW with square bases.

Anyway, wolves should be easy to rank, skeletons slightly less, but not really an "easy" task. Zombies just no: possible but you might need to put them on a specific order and won't face front. Can't tell with BK, but I'm pretty sure they won't fit regular cavalry bases.

I've seen the Blood Knights on standard rectangular cavalry bases. Takes a little bit of creative positioning and they're going to significantly overhang the base edge, but they can rank up just fine.

 CMLR wrote:

Anyway, wolves should be easy to rank, skeletons slightly less, but not really an "easy" task. Zombies just no: possible but you might need to put them on a specific order and won't face front. Can't tell with BK, but I'm pretty sure they won't fit regular cavalry bases.

Zombies are surprisingly tiny and super easy to rank an even look decent while doing so. Unlike Cursed City models, most of them are standing upright. Skeletons are a head taller than Zombies for some reason and their disco poses and flowing cloaks make ranking up a pain. It may be technically possible but doesn't look particularly good.

Dire Wolves rank up without issues. I don't own any Blood Knight myself but I believe they fit on square bases. Personally I would 3D print slightly larger, such as 30x60mm bases for them and ignore anyone that raises an eyebrow about base sizes. A unit that is too tightly packed doesn't look good in my opinion.

Well I see we've all had a wild time with the new battleforce thoughts. I have to agree on the Ork box being a dud. Savings like these only really matter if you need everything in them, or want all in them at least. I think the fact they don't make even an ok army on their own or close to it is a real negative imo. I mean if someone really loves them, more power to them, just I can see why people call it crap as well.

As of yet we don't know prices and that will hint to how good or bad these boxes are. Some of them just don't feel too amazing, if I'm honest, and I wanted to be happy with them. Now I could be wrong but if its pretty expensive anyways, even with a discount I'd call them all pretty dud.

If I had a favorite one, I'd say I love the feel of the vampire one from AoS. I won't buy any of these as I think they will end up feeling like a marginal discount and really none of them add anything great to my forces I couldn't do cheaper in precise purchases rather than shotgun these and get a bunch of stuff I don't need.

For those excited, enjoy them ! They end up these days feeling like bad deals as opposed to when they used to really excite me.

Problem with the Deathguard box for me is that although it's good value, it has a lot of the same content as the previous Hachette magazine offered. I already bought multiples of the issues that had vehicles, for example.

The Sisters one seems very lacklustre. :(

 Ian Sturrock wrote:
Problem with the Deathguard box for me is that although it's good value, it has a lot of the same content as the previous Hachette magazine offered. I already bought multiples of the issues that had vehicles, for example.

The Sisters one seems very lacklustre. :(

Ditto on the Deathguard one for me.

I'm wondering if the AdMech one would be good to supplement what I'll be getting from Imperium.

 NAVARRO wrote:
The only bubble needs to be bursted is the one that assumes everyone wants or is happy with what you personally want or are happy with as gamer, competitive or not.

Box is bad for some and good for others for different reasons and thats all good but the moment you go on a tangent claiming who ever does it differently is "WRONG" and is "malicious and harmful for the community" then yeah keep the drama to yourself.

Be competitive be casual be collector be all that, just dont be a party pooper cause you dont understand divergent points and levels of enjoyment.

Sorry, but you clearly are lacking both the experience and the knowledge to understand any of the posts about the ork army. A player will absolute not get any enjoyment out of an army built from this box, no matter how casual this environment its. It doesn't even make sense from a fluff perspective.
A marine box messed up to the same level would be having a rhino, two squads of primaris crusaders, a squad of wulfen, Calgar and a ravenwing dark talon. And, yes that's a legal army to play, guess why no one is running stuff like this?

I have suggested a multitude of ork archetypes that are by no standards competitive, but will build into lists that are fun to play in a casual environment, make enjoyable crusade forces and allow you to fight someone who started out the same way you did on an equal level. And those lists tend to survive meta changes with no issues, since they already aren't meta.
Heck, if I was as WAAC as you are claiming, why would I suggest for people to buy the combat patrol?

You are merely a CAAC claiming moral high ground for no reason whatsoever. Intentionally setting up others to fail is wrong, malicious and harmful to the community, no matter how high you think of yourself for ignoring the list building part of the hobby.

The one point I surrender is what JWBS said - the extra models are free, if you sell them, you get a good deal on the models you want.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Andykp wrote:
Jidmah is not on some moral crusade to save players from mediocrity. Just accept there are other ways to play. This box set would make me very happy if I didn’t already have an ORK army and some one got me it because I like the stories I have read about ORKS. I would would be pleased as punch. I would paint it up and make up back ground for the units and have a blast. And if I played against someone like you guys I would lose most likely but I doubt that would happen.

The irony is that someone could still enjoy your way of playing the game if they followed the advice given not just by me, but by at least 5 different veteran ork players in this thread.

Meanwhile, everyone following your advice that is playing in another way than you will be set up for failure.

You are the one not accepting that there are other ways to play, not me.

Yeah, ork box is good for collectors/painters and those who already have a large collection of models and want to add these units anyway. Absolutely terrible for people that want to start the army, I'd never recommend it.

I hope the dislike for the Ork box is replicated outside of this forum. It is the only box I am interested in from the 40k side as I already have sizeable Marine, Necron and Death Guard armies.

 Jidmah wrote:

 NAVARRO wrote:
The only bubble needs to be bursted is the one that assumes everyone wants or is happy with what you personally want or are happy with as gamer, competitive or not.

Box is bad for some and good for others for different reasons and thats all good but the moment you go on a tangent claiming who ever does it differently is "WRONG" and is "malicious and harmful for the community" then yeah keep the drama to yourself.

Be competitive be casual be collector be all that, just dont be a party pooper cause you dont understand divergent points and levels of enjoyment.

Sorry, but you clearly are lacking both the experience and the knowledge to understand any of the posts about the ork army. A player will absolute not get any enjoyment out of an army built from this box, no matter how casual this environment its. It doesn't even make sense from a fluff perspective.
A marine box messed up to the same level would be having a rhino, two squads of primaris crusaders, a squad of wulfen, Calgar and a ravenwing dark talon. And, yes that's a legal army to play, guess why no one is running stuff like this?

I have suggested a multitude of ork archetypes that are by no standards competitive, but will build into lists that are fun to play in a casual environment, make enjoyable crusade forces and allow you to fight someone who started out the same way you did on an equal level. And those lists tend to survive meta changes with no issues, since they already aren't meta.
Heck, if I was as WAAC as you are claiming, why would I suggest for people to buy the combat patrol?

You are merely a CAAC claiming moral high ground for no reason whatsoever. Intentionally setting up others to fail is wrong, malicious and harmful to the community, no matter how high you think of yourself for ignoring the list building part of the hobby.

The one point I surrender is what JWBS said - the extra models are free, if you sell them, you get a good deal on the models you want.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Andykp wrote:
Jidmah is not on some moral crusade to save players from mediocrity. Just accept there are other ways to play. This box set would make me very happy if I didn’t already have an ORK army and some one got me it because I like the stories I have read about ORKS. I would would be pleased as punch. I would paint it up and make up back ground for the units and have a blast. And if I played against someone like you guys I would lose most likely but I doubt that would happen.

The irony is that someone could still enjoy your way of playing the game if they followed the advice given not just by me, but by at least 5 different veteran ork players in this thread.

Meanwhile, everyone following your advice that is playing in another way than you will be set up for failure.

You are the one not accepting that there are other ways to play, not me.

The sheer arrogance of this post is mind blowing. Utterly mind blowing. More your response to NAVARRO than to me. To me you go along with more of the old “I’m right your wrong so there!” Rubbish that I am used to from you. But in the first part is pure unadulterated arrogance.

The idea that a box with a warboss, mek, 2 squads of boyz, some Nobz, grotz and a flyer is some who the equivalent of an army gathered from 3 or 4 different codexs is bollocks. Fluff wise, that should be be the basis of most ORK armies. It is the basic ORK household, even if the boss is on a bike. It just isn’t one of your competitive build “archetypes”.

You come across as a) rude, b) arrogant and c) so narrow minded that you cannot accept there other ways to build an army. Get a grip mate. As for your response to me you demonstrate again that the only way you can see the game being enjoyed is your way. Anything else is failure apparently. Failing at what exactly I don’t know, failing at enjoyment? At being happy? At life in general? Who knows? Ridiculous.

The ork box isn't a competitive army, nor the basis for one *now* but if you want a rounded ork force for casual play/painting/collecting or just to future proof or have an array to select from, it's really not that bad.