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 H.B.M.C. wrote:

JWBS wrote:
It seems to be about a 10% increase, looking at my shopping list, so yeah they lied.

They didn't lie. They didn't tell the whole truth.

Like with Australian/New Zealand/Japanese prices. They said that they would not be raising the prices like they had in the rest of the world. This is technically true, it's just not the whole truth. The whole truth was that:

1). They didn't raise the prices on any existing products.
2). All future products got the same 5%-20% price increase that everything else got.

They said that a few things would be going up by 10%, look at the announcement. This was a flat out lie.

I kind of hope, with the ever increasing prices, that players around the world will start playing lower point games. Because with the current price increases and sticking at 2000 points the game can soon fall prey to the same forces that hobbled Warhammer Fantasy.

I just know that locally I am playing more and more 1000 point AoS games and having a blast.

 Eldarsif wrote:
I kind of hope, with the ever increasing prices, that players around the world will start playing lower point games. Because with the current price increases and sticking at 2000 points the game can soon fall prey to the same forces that hobbled Warhammer Fantasy.

I just know that locally I am playing more and more 1000 point AoS games and having a blast.

GW counters by slashing the point costs of models, forcing even players wanting to play 1000 point games to buy double the models. The plastic crack house always wins

I'm going to buy my GSC, Chaos Knights, and a load of the new HH boxes and then I'm also done buying. I had considered myself hobby price insensitive for the past couple of years, with a monthly budget of £300 (not because I have a huge amount of discretionary cash but because when I quit smoking for the final time I decided to spend my cigarette money entirely on hobby I thought this would help the process and it did, and this happened to be £10 every single day). But yeah that was some time ago now that I kicked my addiction, the splurging was fun but probably not necessary, and if I look at this objectively, with this latest rise, it's no longer fun either. The prices are too high and they have now lost me after they release the stuff I've been looking forward to for the past little while.

JWBS wrote:
I'm going to buy my GSC, Chaos Knights, and a load of the new HH boxes and then I'm also done buying. I had considered myself hobby price insensitive for the past couple of years, with a monthly budget of £300 (not because I have a huge amount of discretionary cash but because when I quit smoking for the final time I decided to spend my cigarette money entirely on hobby I thought this would help the process and it did, and this happened to be £10 every single day). But yeah that was some time ago now that I kicked my addiction, the splurging was fun but probably not necessary, and if I look at this objectively, with this latest rise, it's no longer fun either. The prices are too high and they have now lost me after they release the stuff I've been looking forward to for the past little while.

Congrats tho!

I wonder if we'll see the rise of acceptance of recasters like you see in the HH community.

In HH no one really bats an eye if you've got recasts. It often operates on a "don't ask, don't tell" policy, but in some places it's openly discussed and rarely will anyone call you out for it.

The higher prices get the more accepted recasts will become.

Eesh, a lot of these rises seem massively out of touch with reality. Single, regular size, hero figures were already absolutely delusional in their price, but they've now gotten even more expensive?

Looks like ebay will be my main source of models from now on, which is a huge shame for FLGS's, but I can't justify paying some of these prices.

Weirdly, makes me more tempted to sign up to the Stormbringer magazine set though as that collection of models suddenly got a lot more valuable.

The question is how much does it cost to get an average 2000pts army with rules and all. What is the overall number we are looking now?
This total will now compete with things like gaming PCs or Last gen consoles etc.
It already competed with that but now I think its evidently a lesser value in comparison.

There are some cars cheaper than full GW armies and that is a much better gift than some freaking plastic toy miniatures.

I know some will argument the type of entertainment it gives is different enough but for me at the end of the day plastic miniatures are just plastic. Theres nothing technological or worth framing on a wall about them.
And before someone says about modelling as craft activity... well my friends wanna do crafting you can do it with a fraction of price and with no plastic.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

JWBS wrote:
I'm going to buy my GSC, Chaos Knights, and a load of the new HH boxes and then I'm also done buying. I had considered myself hobby price insensitive for the past couple of years, with a monthly budget of £300 (not because I have a huge amount of discretionary cash but because when I quit smoking for the final time I decided to spend my cigarette money entirely on hobby I thought this would help the process and it did, and this happened to be £10 every single day). But yeah that was some time ago now that I kicked my addiction, the splurging was fun but probably not necessary, and if I look at this objectively, with this latest rise, it's no longer fun either. The prices are too high and they have now lost me after they release the stuff I've been looking forward to for the past little while.

Congrats tho!

Thanks!

JWBS wrote:
I'm going to buy my GSC, Chaos Knights, and a load of the new HH boxes and then I'm also done buying. I had considered myself hobby price insensitive for the past couple of years, with a monthly budget of £300 (not because I have a huge amount of discretionary cash but because when I quit smoking for the final time I decided to spend my cigarette money entirely on hobby I thought this would help the process and it did, and this happened to be £10 every single day). But yeah that was some time ago now that I kicked my addiction, the splurging was fun but probably not necessary, and if I look at this objectively, with this latest rise, it's no longer fun either. The prices are too high and they have now lost me after they release the stuff I've been looking forward to for the past little while.

That's the way to do it! Replace a harmful addiction with uh... a slightly less harmful one!

But wow, £300 Makes me look like a miser.

Maybe now I'll finally address the closet of Shame. Every single item in it was once a coveted purchase with a whole plan behind it.

 NAVARRO wrote:
The question is how much does it cost to get an average 2000pts army with rules and all. What is the overall number we are looking now?
This total will now compete with things like gaming PCs or Last gen consoles etc.

There are some cars cheaper than full GW armies and that is a much better gift than some freaking plastic toy miniatures.

Snipped bits out, but come on? 2nd hand cars are worth almost as much as new cars right now and new ones are like pixie dust and shooting up in price. Being a stickler for low model count cheaper armies as well: Rulebook, codex, basic knight army (not saying it's good) - 4 helverins, castellan, knight of choice and 2 warglaives is £313.15 from a retailer like darksphere. What cars are you buying?

Dudeface wrote:

 NAVARRO wrote:
The question is how much does it cost to get an average 2000pts army with rules and all. What is the overall number we are looking now?
This total will now compete with things like gaming PCs or Last gen consoles etc.

There are some cars cheaper than full GW armies and that is a much better gift than some freaking plastic toy miniatures.

Snipped bits out, but come on? 2nd hand cars are worth almost as much as new cars right now and new ones are like pixie dust and shooting up in price. Being a stickler for low model count cheaper armies as well: Rulebook, codex, basic knight army (not saying it's good) - 4 helverins, castellan, knight of choice and 2 warglaives is £313.15 from a retailer like darksphere. What cars are you buying?

There's a difference between "some cars are cheaper than full GW armies" and "some cars are cheaper than the cheapest army I can think about", you know.

That said... this one?

https://www.coches.net/chrysler-neon-20-16v-le-4p-gasolina-2001-en-madrid-51506978-covo.aspx

Which is funny because it's about as old as the cadian sprues.

Dudeface wrote:

 NAVARRO wrote:
The question is how much does it cost to get an average 2000pts army with rules and all. What is the overall number we are looking now?
This total will now compete with things like gaming PCs or Last gen consoles etc.

There are some cars cheaper than full GW armies and that is a much better gift than some freaking plastic toy miniatures.

Snipped bits out, but come on? 2nd hand cars are worth almost as much as new cars right now and new ones are like pixie dust and shooting up in price. Being a stickler for low model count cheaper armies as well: Rulebook, codex, basic knight army (not saying it's good) - 4 helverins, castellan, knight of choice and 2 warglaives is £313.15 from a retailer like darksphere. What cars are you buying?

I was referring to average sized armies not the cheaper you can find and not on discount.
What I was trying to say is that for a parent thinking on his kids gifts or someone above 18 just curious about starting, going to a GW store to check how much he would need in therms of starting and getting a full army for play... Dont forget you will need paints, brushes, tools and all.
Most people starting point is getting all official products on official GW stores this is the ideal situation for GW ( not for us I know) but this is where you first start crunching the numbers and check the total... I was thinking something around £500 - £800.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

JWBS wrote:
I'm going to buy my GSC, Chaos Knights, and a load of the new HH boxes and then I'm also done buying. I had considered myself hobby price insensitive for the past couple of years, with a monthly budget of £300 (not because I have a huge amount of discretionary cash but because when I quit smoking for the final time I decided to spend my cigarette money entirely on hobby I thought this would help the process and it did, and this happened to be £10 every single day). But yeah that was some time ago now that I kicked my addiction, the splurging was fun but probably not necessary, and if I look at this objectively, with this latest rise, it's no longer fun either. The prices are too high and they have now lost me after they release the stuff I've been looking forward to for the past little while.

That's the way to do it! Replace a harmful addiction with uh... a slightly less harmful one!

But wow, £300 Makes me look like a miser.

Maybe now I'll finally address the closet of Shame. Every single item in it was once a coveted purchase with a whole plan behind it.

I stopped shoving the entire £300 into the pile of shame after a while, and I also bought a lot of nice hobby stuff that wasn't entirely minis (eg I got a nice printer and I refreshed all my paints which I guess are both still minis, but I bough a bunch of timber and lighting and built myself a nice hobby area with home made desks and great lighting setup, which optimistically I classified as a home improvement) but yeah my pile of unpainted minis built up quite fast and can definitely not be considered as planned purchases, I literally just bought whatever I wanted and put it aside, occasionally admiring the big stack of boxes.

well, if we talk about "cheap armies" with 400€ of total costs
that is twice as much as the average historical R&F army, you know those game type no one ever wants to play because it is too expensive to buy enough models for a standard sized game

 Albertorius wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

 NAVARRO wrote:
The question is how much does it cost to get an average 2000pts army with rules and all. What is the overall number we are looking now?
This total will now compete with things like gaming PCs or Last gen consoles etc.

There are some cars cheaper than full GW armies and that is a much better gift than some freaking plastic toy miniatures.

Snipped bits out, but come on? 2nd hand cars are worth almost as much as new cars right now and new ones are like pixie dust and shooting up in price. Being a stickler for low model count cheaper armies as well: Rulebook, codex, basic knight army (not saying it's good) - 4 helverins, castellan, knight of choice and 2 warglaives is £313.15 from a retailer like darksphere. What cars are you buying?

There's a difference between "some cars are cheaper than full GW armies" and "some cars are cheaper than the cheapest army I can think about", you know.

That said... this one?

https://www.coches.net/chrysler-neon-20-16v-le-4p-gasolina-2001-en-madrid-51506978-covo.aspx

Which is funny because it's about as old as the cadian sprues.

I didn't invalidate the statement in any way, even if you double that £600 is not going to get you anything other than an old banger in the UK. Further to that when you add the caveat of "must be full price" and "average sized" whatever that means and it's not exactly quantifiable. I could buy a 2k army at full RRP for the same price as a mid-range gaming PC and far cheaper than any car worth it's salt, never mind using discounters or 2nd hand purchases. They're just daft comparisons.

It's like saying "gee bread sure has gone up in price, imagine how many loaves (from a local artisan bakery, freshly baked) I'd need for a space marine captain now!"

Dudeface wrote:

 Albertorius wrote:

Dudeface wrote:

 NAVARRO wrote:
The question is how much does it cost to get an average 2000pts army with rules and all. What is the overall number we are looking now?
This total will now compete with things like gaming PCs or Last gen consoles etc.

There are some cars cheaper than full GW armies and that is a much better gift than some freaking plastic toy miniatures.

Snipped bits out, but come on? 2nd hand cars are worth almost as much as new cars right now and new ones are like pixie dust and shooting up in price. Being a stickler for low model count cheaper armies as well: Rulebook, codex, basic knight army (not saying it's good) - 4 helverins, castellan, knight of choice and 2 warglaives is £313.15 from a retailer like darksphere. What cars are you buying?

There's a difference between "some cars are cheaper than full GW armies" and "some cars are cheaper than the cheapest army I can think about", you know.

That said... this one?

https://www.coches.net/chrysler-neon-20-16v-le-4p-gasolina-2001-en-madrid-51506978-covo.aspx

Which is funny because it's about as old as the cadian sprues.

I didn't invalidate the statement in any way, even if you double that £600 is not going to get you anything other than an old banger in the UK. Further to that when you add the caveat of "must be full price" and "average sized" whatever that means and it's not exactly quantifiable. I could buy a 2k army at full RRP for the same price as a mid-range gaming PC and far cheaper than any car worth it's salt, never mind using discounters or 2nd hand purchases. They're just daft comparisons.

It's like saying "gee bread sure has gone up in price, imagine how many loaves (from a local artisan bakery, freshly baked) I'd need for a space marine captain now!"

I think, Pc, consoles, car are on the list of anyone thinking on gifting their kids or simply young adults thinking on spending money in entertainment/hobbies ... But yep eat your artisan buns if that entertains you.

I spent about £150 on my Star Wars Legion army.
That includes all the rules I need to play (including core and faction rules), all brand new in boxes, and gave me a force about 1.5x standard size so I have options with my lists.

I then spent about the same on a Tau army, this includes buying a couple of kits 2nd second and off friends.
That gives me maybe 1500pts if I really squeeze the points out, that's only about 75% of a "normal" 40k game let alone flexibility in what I take!
It also doesn't include any of the rules I need to play and I haven't bought anything that would be a low "price-value" ratio like characters.

I've also spent probably about the same again on Blood Red Skies - a 10mm WW2 dogfighting game.
Here I have medium sized squadrons of about a dozen different aircraft, including several aces (~characters). It's a collection so large for the scale of the game I can't imagine what else I might buy.

What this shows is that even if scraping every penny to get a 40k army on a similar budget I end up with significantly less value given the scope of the game.
Part of that is because the expectation of a 40k army is a lot larger than those other games, particularly Blood Red Skies, but that's still quite relevant.

You don't necessarily have to play the game to collect and enjoy the models.

I think we can safely say this is no longer News or Rumours and this thread should be locked. Complaining about said price rises should be taken to the thread in 40k discussion.

 kirotheavenger wrote:
I spent about £150 on my Star Wars Legion army.
That includes all the rules I need to play (including core and faction rules), all brand new in boxes, and gave me a force about 1.5x standard size so I have options with my lists.

I then spent about the same on a Tau army, this includes buying a couple of kits 2nd second and off friends.
That gives me maybe 1500pts if I really squeeze the points out, that's only about 75% of a "normal" 40k game let alone flexibility in what I take!
It also doesn't include any of the rules I need to play and I haven't bought anything that would be a low "price-value" ratio like characters.

I've also spent probably about the same again on Blood Red Skies - a 10mm WW2 dogfighting game.
Here I have medium sized squadrons of about a dozen different aircraft, including several aces (~characters). It's a collection so large for the scale of the game I can't imagine what else I might buy.

What this shows is that even if scraping every penny to get a 40k army on a similar budget I end up with significantly less value given the scope of the game.
Part of that is because the expectation of a 40k army is a lot larger than those other games, particularly Blood Red Skies, but that's still quite relevant.

I think this is the real measure, how does it compare to its peers for value for money (which is always subjective) rather than an obscure set of parameters for comparing to other unrelated life purchases.

 Rolsheen wrote:
I think we can safely say this is no longer News or Rumours and this thread should be locked. Complaining about said price rises should be taken to the thread in 40k discussion.

...or behind the sheds and shot, being a topic that's been done to death. Just a thought.

Nomeny wrote:
You don't necessarily have to play the game to collect and enjoy the models.

I know and many many of us dont, but that comes after your first contact and also thats not the Pitch GW is selling you when you start.

What happens is that they want to sell you a game first and foremost because they know a painter getting a character mini and paints, brushes, glues etc to paint will buy a lot less product than a gamer who will buy many rulebooks, cards, dices, multiples of the same models and many more paint refills than the painter.

GW aims to sell you a contained experience and they clearly know their products are overpriced for their core target demographic ( New client getting started and needs pretty much all from scratch to build an army and play a game instore)... thats why they try to smoke the actual true Full price of a 2000pts army with (starter sets, or start collecting).

Im not even mentioning the full home experience which is 2 player game, with table terrain and actually 2 full armies and all relevant products to keep rules updated etc.

Its hard for veterans to actually detach from what they already have on their collections and also know where to get the cheap deals. For the new guys I cannot even imagine how much money will it take today to make it happen.

It’s a topic that will always be relevant. Every new GW release will have some price-related issue (because they usually go up), so we’ll always have news regarding GW prices.

 Rolsheen wrote:
I think we can safely say this is no longer News or Rumours and this thread should be locked. Complaining about said price rises should be taken to the thread in 40k discussion.

Fair enough but Is it not news that they actually raised the prices more than the percentage they initially mentioned?

 NAVARRO wrote:

 Rolsheen wrote:
I think we can safely say this is no longer News or Rumours and this thread should be locked. Complaining about said price rises should be taken to the thread in 40k discussion.

Fair enough but Is it not news that they actually raised the prices more than the percentage they initially mentioned?

Something something don't be entitled something something they're a business something something it's' a luxury hobby.

Yknow it occurs to me that GW probably could have achieved the same effect without the massive spike in ill will if they had just cut points values by 10-20% across the board. Suddenly everyone needs to buy another 200-400 pts worth of models to make points. Make up for lost margin with increased volume of sales.

 Rolsheen wrote:
I think we can safely say this is no longer News or Rumours and this thread should be locked. Complaining about said price rises should be taken to the thread in 40k discussion.

Why should it be a thread in 40k discussion? This was a change that affected every game currently in production, after all.

I picked up 4 SC boxes from a 3rd party just prior to the price increase and it will most likely be my last of purchase of GW product.

Given rapidly deteriorating economic conditions, I cannot in good conscious, justify these levels of expenditures on hobby time. While I am currently in a solid financial position, that could dramatically shift depending on national/global events and I would like to be prepared for that unpleasant possibility. A realignment of priorities if you will.

I am not trying to be all doom and gloom, but I have this sinking suspicion that there are no brakes on this train and things are going to get a lot worse before they get better. IMHO.

 GrosseSax wrote:
I picked up 4 SC boxes from a 3rd party just prior to the price increase and it will most likely be my last of purchase of GW product.

Given rapidly deteriorating economic conditions, I cannot in good conscious, justify these levels of expenditures on hobby time. While I am currently in a solid financial position, that could dramatically shift depending on national/global events and I would like to be prepared for that unpleasant possibility. A realignment of priorities if you will.

I am not trying to be all doom and gloom, but I have this sinking suspicion that there are no brakes on this train and things are going to get a lot worse before they get better. IMHO.

Thats a good point actually, the global economical changes due to current conflicts will affect most of us, I wonder how GW will react to it...