[Trench Crusade] Skirmish game by Tuomas Pirinen

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**Astmeister**

The TC 1.0 rules are out.
Goonhammer has coverage of them and also of the factions.

https://www.goonhammer.com/goonhammer-reviews-trench-crusade-1-0-core-rules/

**Alpharius**

OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
I think they need to stick with the rules as is (baring any essential 'oops that doesn't work' fixes) as nothing will kill people enthusiasm faster than their not yet delivered physical rule book being invalidated

and these are the people who the game is going to be depending on to post about it, play games in stores etc

As usual, Orlando has the right of it.

For better or worse, this is the version of TC that we'll be playing with for 2 or 3 years min.

Meanwhile, my all in physical miniatures box arrived yesterday.

It is currently doing a Schrödinger's cat impersonation, sitting unopened as I'm dreading the amount of QC I'm going to have to do as from most of what I've read the actual miniature porducer didn't do enough QC themselves...

Miniature quality update to follow...eventually!

**beast_gts**

Version 1.0 of the rules is out - https://www.trenchcrusade.com/rules/

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Project Update #59 wrote:Last chance to update Backerkit addresses!

Greetings Crusaders,

The team is back from Spiel in Essen, and after taking a few days to rest, we’re back with a new update.

The Physical Book
Rather than tell you where the book is currently at in production, it may be better to simply show you the photos and video we received from the printers:

https://youtu.be/8DEoQgYw3Fg

As you can see, production of the book is well underway.

The EU books should be ready to start shipping out towards the end of November, and the US books around early-mid December. Of course, there are a few more steps between now and the books being ready to ship from warehouses, so we’ll confirm precise dates as soon as we have them.

This means that it is now time to lock addresses.

Last call for book address changes.
We will be locking down address changes on Monday the 10th, 09h00 CET.

To change your address, you must log into your Backerkit account and change it manually. You can also use the link in your original email or access your account using this link: https://trench-crusade-tabletop.backerkit.com/

After this date all the info will be going straight to our logistics partners and we will not be able to change it. Please note that if your book is sent to the wrong address there is very little chance we can recover it and your order will be lost.

S3D deliveries
S3D sent us a report yesterday evening: they missed the end of the month deadline: there are now around 100 orders remaining from Wave 1. We apologize once again to backers who are still waiting. These will be sent by the beginning of next week (Monday the 10th of November).

Wave 2 will begin shipping shortly after Wave 1 is completed. This is for those of you who completed your Backerkit after the deadline, or S3D’s shipping surveys after shipping began. We’ll post more info about this once it begins, but the procedure will be identical to that announced earlier in the year.

The Digital Rules
Some of you may have already noticed, but the digital 1.0 rules went online today!

For all the information and links, you can check out the article on our website.

Backerkit closing date
With the delivery of Wave 2 and the Book on the horizon we are rapidly closing in on the end of fulfillment for this project.

If you haven’t yet filled out your Backerkit, please note that you must do it before the end of the year or you risk not getting your rewards.

You can log into your Backerkit account to finalise it. You can also use the link in your original email or access your account using this link: https://trench-crusade-tabletop.backerkit.com/.

Apple Pay IDs
As a reminder: Backers who pledged to the campaign using an AppleID but haven't completely set up their Apple Pay account (linking their email address to their Apple Wallet) will have issues receiving their emails from BackerKit. Please contact us here and provide us with an alternative email address.

**BrookM**

kodos wrote:
but for the game to stick around it must be more intresting to play it and not just paint 10 guys to post on instagram and forget about it after.

That about sums up our own experiences in the club thus far with this game..

**beast_gts**

BrookM wrote:
kodos wrote:
but for the game to stick around it must be more intresting to play it and not just paint 10 guys to post on instagram and forget about it after.
That about sums up our own experiences in the club thus far with this game..

At my club 2 people have printed gangs (teams? squads?) and I've started printing terrain, but nothing is painted and no games have been played...

**lord_blackfang**

Most games on the indie #28/blanchitsu self-publish scene are all vibe, no substance. But they tend to be from creators with substantial followings because of their high level artistic output, so receive a lot more attention than they deserve. It's another manifestation of hustle culture I suppose, pretty much everyone with any clout in the space is selling a rulebook these days. Or, even more likely, sucking at the Patreon teat on the promise of publishing a rulebook someday.

**Mario**

TheGuest wrote:it feels the people who feel "betrayed" by this decisicion don't want a good alternative game to GW with great art and minis to thrive and more toys to go "brrr" with their 3D printer honestly.

Didn't they say that they are kinda "miniature agnostic" in that they encourage people to make and kitbash their own minis for the game? Meaning that anybody could make miniatures (like for 3D printers) for Trench Crusade, they'd just not be from the makers of the game.

**Overread**

Mario wrote:
TheGuest wrote:it feels the people who feel "betrayed" by this decisicion don't want a good alternative game to GW with great art and minis to thrive and more toys to go "brrr" with their 3D printer honestly.

Didn't they say that they are kinda "miniature agnostic" in that they encourage people to make and kitbash their own minis for the game? Meaning that anybody could make miniatures (like for 3D printers) for Trench Crusade, they'd just not be from the makers of the game.

Honestly any game can be "miniature agnostic" if someone makes a model on the right base size and comparable height (for those games where the latter has importance).
GW don't market Warhammer as "miniature agnostic" but there are dozens of firms making proxies for individual and whole armies.

Also a lot of small firms are very open about being agnostic at the start because they need "games on tables" more than anything else. Once they get to a point where they've a healthy active playerbase on their own products they tend to not so much "shut down" as just do what GW did - stop talking about other firms and focus on their own marketing because now its a serious business making it's way.

TC have sold licences and teamed up with other creators; so perhaps part of their feeling is that they can focus on physical whilst their partners will do digital stuff and satisfy that market of die-hard STL only gamers

**CthuluIsSpy**

I'm out of the loop, what's the new controversy?

**kodos**

The makers of TC announced that they focus on plastic models and the models released in plastic won't be released as STL

Prior to that the announced that only creators with a licence being allowed to make official models and distribute designs

Something to be expected given the money they made with Kickstarter but the 3D printing community now sees this as betrayal on them because they jumped into it believing everyone can create models and sell them off etsy or get the models for free
For them TC was like the big alternative to 40k, looking similar but they can legally do what they cannot do with 40k. Now both games being "the same" regarding STLs hence people who expected something else are angry

**Astmeister**

However it was never an alternative to 40k regarding actual gameplay, because it is a real skirmish game with 5-15 minis per side.

**RexHavoc**

The game doesn't really interest me, it feels like another 'we're not a 40k clone' clone that regularly pops up but gained a lot of success not only because of the names attached to creating it but because 'its not 40k' and some people really seem desperate to play 40k without giving GW money. I also found TC became tiresome quickly due to the amount of unsolicited comments popping up from people pushing it in the way they were across the 40k community "Why not drop 40k for TC because...". Its the 'watchtower' of the wargaming community.

The new plastic minis really confuse me though. Trench Crusades one USP is that the game was meant to be more artistic + creative. A convertors dream. But the first plastic set they release is super generic and very 'Games-workshop-y' both in style and cost. Now new players are all going to have identical looking warbands. I know the resin minis all look the same, but I always assumed that they were just a 'sample' of things from the universe to get people into it. For the time, effort, and cost that went into making a plastic kit I would have thought they would have put together a kit that more like historical kits or older GW kits, that could be put together in a huge variety of ways, with tons of spare parts. Yes all plastic 'can' be converted, but for the most part the kit that has been released is more what I'd expect from something that releases 'named' characters for a skirmish game with limited options.

The reason I prefaced this with my opinion that the game doesn't interest me, is that perhaps a plastic kit with lots of options isn't the sort of thing the TC fan base is after/needed for the game after all. I'm not super knowledgable after all, as I've not been following the game properly. But I find it a very weird choice. I'm only interested in it as far as curiosity that there is so much money having been made on the kickstarter which seems to have totally altered the games own original design philosophy.

**JamesY**

kodos wrote:
Now both games being "the same" regarding STLs hence people who expected something else are angry

They aren't the same regarding STLs. They are still enabling 3rd party manufactures, like Westfalia and Creature Caster to produce official STL releases. Printers will still have access to all the core factions and going forward many more sub-factions.

**Olthannon**

kodos wrote:
The makers of TC announced that they focus on plastic models and the models released in plastic won't be released as STL

Prior to that the announced that only creators with a licence being allowed to make official models and distribute designs

Something to be expected given the money they made with Kickstarter but the 3D printing community now sees this as betrayal on them because they jumped into it believing everyone can create models and sell them off etsy or get the models for free
For them TC was like the big alternative to 40k, looking similar but they can legally do what they cannot do with 40k. Now both games being "the same" regarding STLs hence people who expected something else are angry

Thanks for writing that up, I also didn't know what the deal was, just read the whinging.

Boggles my mind a bit because surely people have worked out by now that a free reign of printing whatever they like under an IP would never be sustainable?

**Overread**

It's basically because all they are thinking is that STLs are cheap (and they are insanely cheap) and they don't want to spend more.

They don't really concern themselves with the fact that manufacture using STLs scales up poorly; or that growth of the firm into physical allows them to tap into a huge market of customers; nor that many STL customers are "one and done" or burn out pretty fast so they don't have as good a long term viability - at least compared to physical customers who have to buy product to continue to get product.

So yeah I suspect this will all blow over fairlyfast; its likely just a bit worse because TC have gone SO fast with this change. The KS is still fresh in people's mind.

**Tabletop_Magpie**

on the painting vs playing - I have a fully painted Heretic Legion faction, and my Iron Sultanate are primed. I was supposed to be playing a buddy tomorrow but yet again, family things have got in the way. He's had a game recently and loved it. So that's three of us locally, which is a good start. There aren't many bat rep channels so I'll definitely be filming and uploading some games, even if they're solo efforts.

**Alpharius**

RexHavoc wrote:
The game doesn't really interest me, it feels like another 'we're not a 40k clone' clone that regularly pops up but gained a lot of success not only because of the names attached to creating it but because 'its not 40k' and some people really seem desperate to play 40k without giving GW money.

This segment of our gaming population probably exists, but TC isn't even close to being a 40K clone/killer/etc.

Maybe more of a Kill Team 'clone', or Mordenheim, or...Necromunda?

It is its own thing, sorta, and it will be interesting to see where it goes from here.

There will still be plenty of licensed 3D minis I'd think, eventually - as well as lots of unofficial but sure as hell (!) close enough anyway miniatures too!

**warboss**

I didn't follow the campaign but did they promise more STLs explicitly in the future? Are they going back on their kickstarter promises now and changing the deal after the fact Vader-style? Or did/will they fulfill their obligations and then afterwards entirely switch their business model?

**Platuan4th**

All they promised during the KS was new miniatures in the future, nothing stated about how they would be produced or released.

**kodos**

the actual game size is irrelevant for that as this can change over time for both (TC won't stay a 10 model skirmish for long if the company wants to be around for some time)

TC replicates very much the original style and size of 40k, just being alt history instead of the far future
it isn't like Kill Team or Necromunda in that regard as those games are following a different style and never had that old school 40k vibe

**Prometheum5**

Necromunda never had an old school 40k vibe?

**His Master's Voice**

Olthannon wrote:

Boggles my mind a bit because surely people have worked out by now that a free reign of printing whatever they like under an IP would never be sustainable?

That a company needs to sell things both today AND tomorrow to remain in operation was obvious, but the messaging from TC before and around the Kickstarter was... well, let's just say it failed to acknowledge some basic realities of running a business.

Whatever storm they're reaping from their fledgeling community is one they've sown themselves.

**Shakalooloo**

Prometheum5 wrote:
Necromunda never had an old school 40k vibe?

It traded on and developed the Rogue Trader-era Confrontation setting. Also, no-one would look at you weird for letting out a 'yee-ha'.

**Alpharius**

Ha! Exactly!

TC is not chasing after 40K in any real way, and won't for...quite some time.

And given that its setting is even potentially more problematic than 40K...