10th Edition Rumour Roundup - in the grim darkness of the far future, there are only power levels

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**Vovin**

Tsagualsa wrote:
Vovin wrote:
Tsagualsa wrote:
Keep in mind that trolls went as far as compiling fake multiple-dozen page rulesets with art and everything in the past just for their enjoyment

Pancake edition?

Iirc it was back in 6th edition or something like that, i distinctly remember Blood Angel Bat riders and stuff like that

Pancake edition was a fake rulebook for 6th. Complete with layout, examples, copied art, the right typset, etc. The ruleset was also working. This had to be month's of work. So the argument "This is too much effort for a troll." sahll never be uttered again.

The bat rider stuff was seperate.

**Tsagualsa**

Vovin wrote:
Tsagualsa wrote:
Vovin wrote:
Tsagualsa wrote:
Keep in mind that trolls went as far as compiling fake multiple-dozen page rulesets with art and everything in the past just for their enjoyment

Pancake edition?

Iirc it was back in 6th edition or something like that, i distinctly remember Blood Angel Bat riders and stuff like that

Pancake edition was a fake rulebook for 6th. Complete with layout, examples, copied art, the right typset, etc. The ruleset was also working. This had to be month's of work. So the argument "This is too much effort for a troll." sahll never be uttered again.

The bat rider stuff was seperate.

Yeah, that's probably what I'm remembering. IIRC it was eventually tracked back to some jokers on 4chan?

**Vovin**

Tsagualsa wrote:
Vovin wrote:
Tsagualsa wrote:
Vovin wrote:
Tsagualsa wrote:
Keep in mind that trolls went as far as compiling fake multiple-dozen page rulesets with art and everything in the past just for their enjoyment

Pancake edition?

Iirc it was back in 6th edition or something like that, i distinctly remember Blood Angel Bat riders and stuff like that

Pancake edition was a fake rulebook for 6th. Complete with layout, examples, copied art, the right typset, etc. The ruleset was also working. This had to be month's of work. So the argument "This is too much effort for a troll." sahll never be uttered again.

The bat rider stuff was seperate.

Yeah, that's probably what I'm remembering. IIRC it was eventually tracked back to some jokers on 4chan?

No. It was a homebrew ruleset, which one of the group members altered to make more official looking and then released it. The password for the cloud storage of the initial dump was "pancake", hence the name.

**xttz**

Yeah as I recall it was a bunch of guys who decided to write their own 40k rules due to the lack of rules support / FAQs at the time.

Then someone got hold of a copy online and thought it would be funny to release it as a hoax a few months before 6E.

**Dudeface**

https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/377648-blood-angels-box-set/

This is obviously not my main account. I wanted to post this last week in my main community, but this didn’t work out because secondary accounts can’t post there. I am not active here, but made an account nonetheless, because you are fellow children of Sanguinius. But then I u-turned, it didn’t seem to be worth it to share my excitement with strangers. But here is another U-Turn..... I can’t hold it any longer.

I got access to a pretty random collection of future releases.
... Arks of Omen 5 (which I won’t spoil, because the interesting bits are only background anyway, but it is NOT about the Lion and there is no new primarch model at this point) ...

But the kicker is that I got hold of a box called Strangleweb.
It is some kind of starter box and has a new 40k logo *excitement* and is full of Blood Angels stuff

The box has a booklet, two colors and some push fit miniatures in it. The miniatures are Tyranid gargoyles. They are called Pheragaunts in the assembly. They have two wings and four scything talons. The overall design is different. The ribs are covered with a membrane. Membrane has holes where the flesh and chitin is breaking through. Muscles are sculpted, where there is no chitin. They are 20% amphibious, 80% insectoid instead of 100% insectoid. Color scheme is the old Leviathan, but the cream is a lighter bone color. Second sprue is Intervenators, primaris jump troops, painted in Blood Angel colors. They have eviscerators, but no gravis armor. They have the old cross straps incorporated into their chest. The eviscerators have only a one-sided chainblade, but are two-handed. Finally there are a couple of barricades: toppled over ornamented columns, with crates and imperial aegis scraps welded together with metal girders in between and on top. The colors included are old ones: Agrellan Badland and Tyrant Skull.

I could glean more from the booklet. There are two missions, unit profiles, some background, assembly guide and basing guide. There are additional unit placements in the mission, but no pictures: Captain Lucael, Indomitus Elite Velani, Tyranid Shrikes, Termagants brood with fleshborers, Termagant brood with spike rifles, Scout squad Sempre. In the basing guide, you can see a termagant. It has the same less boney, more fleshy design as the pheragaunts. The head is longer and has larger plates. it uses its middle arms to run, the front arms are still connected to the fleshborer. There is no magazine, but two hoses go into its throat.

Didn’t read much, but the scenario is about the marines encircled in a wasteland encampment. first mission is to hold, second is to break free and bring a mcguffin for a ritual to safety
The unit profiles are more interesting: the stat block is now divided into two dials. The left one has Move, Initiative, Morale. The right one has Evade, Save and Wounds. The evade stat is empty, except for a single symbol for the pheragaunts. Underneath come some keywords (infantry,sturdy,fly for the marines and infantry,light, fly for the pheragaunts) and then the weapon profile and some special rules
know no fear (3): unit is disadvantaged to hit for the rest of the game. I don't know what that is.
Instinctive behaviour (5): unit is broken and runs away unless in synaptic range.
at the bottom of the datasheet is the usual keyword soup.

Intervenators have 3+ stats all around, pheragaunts 5+, except initiative also 3+.
10”,2 wounds vs 12”,1 wound
Weapons are:
Eviscerators are range 2, 2 attacks, 3+ hit, 3 damage, some symbols and a rule, that reduces the damage against infantry
Shock Assault: range 0, 1 attack, 4+ hit, 1 damage
Scything talons are range 1, 5 attacks, 4+ hit, 1 damage
Acid tongue: range 0, 1 attacks, 5+ hit, 1 damage, some symbols

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

And the nonsense argument the rules for Starship Troopers were Andy Chamber’s original rules for 4th Ed. Which neatly ignored that anything done on company time is company property. And it’s been actively denied,

**Tsagualsa**

Dudeface wrote:
https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/377648-blood-angels-box-set/

This is obviously not my main account. I wanted to post this last week in my main community, but this didn’t work out because secondary accounts can’t post there. I am not active here, but made an account nonetheless, because you are fellow children of Sanguinius. But then I u-turned, it didn’t seem to be worth it to share my excitement with strangers. But here is another U-Turn..... I can’t hold it any longer.

I got access to a pretty random collection of future releases.
... Arks of Omen 5 (which I won’t spoil, because the interesting bits are only background anyway, but it is NOT about the Lion and there is no new primarch model at this point) ...

But the kicker is that I got hold of a box called Strangleweb.
It is some kind of starter box and has a new 40k logo *excitement* and is full of Blood Angels stuff

The box has a booklet, two colors and some push fit miniatures in it. The miniatures are Tyranid gargoyles. They are called Pheragaunts in the assembly. They have two wings and four scything talons. The overall design is different. The ribs are covered with a membrane. Membrane has holes where the flesh and chitin is breaking through. Muscles are sculpted, where there is no chitin. They are 20% amphibious, 80% insectoid instead of 100% insectoid. Color scheme is the old Leviathan, but the cream is a lighter bone color. Second sprue is Intervenators, primaris jump troops, painted in Blood Angel colors. They have eviscerators, but no gravis armor. They have the old cross straps incorporated into their chest. The eviscerators have only a one-sided chainblade, but are two-handed. Finally there are a couple of barricades: toppled over ornamented columns, with crates and imperial aegis scraps welded together with metal girders in between and on top. The colors included are old ones: Agrellan Badland and Tyrant Skull.

I could glean more from the booklet. There are two missions, unit profiles, some background, assembly guide and basing guide. There are additional unit placements in the mission, but no pictures: Captain Lucael, Indomitus Elite Velani, Tyranid Shrikes, Termagants brood with fleshborers, Termagant brood with spike rifles, Scout squad Sempre. In the basing guide, you can see a termagant. It has the same less boney, more fleshy design as the pheragaunts. The head is longer and has larger plates. it uses its middle arms to run, the front arms are still connected to the fleshborer. There is no magazine, but two hoses go into its throat.

Didn’t read much, but the scenario is about the marines encircled in a wasteland encampment. first mission is to hold, second is to break free and bring a mcguffin for a ritual to safety
The unit profiles are more interesting: the stat block is now divided into two dials. The left one has Move, Initiative, Morale. The right one has Evade, Save and Wounds. The evade stat is empty, except for a single symbol for the pheragaunts. Underneath come some keywords (infantry,sturdy,fly for the marines and infantry,light, fly for the pheragaunts) and then the weapon profile and some special rules
know no fear (3): unit is disadvantaged to hit for the rest of the game. I don't know what that is.
Instinctive behaviour (5): unit is broken and runs away unless in synaptic range.
at the bottom of the datasheet is the usual keyword soup.

Intervenators have 3+ stats all around, pheragaunts 5+, except initiative also 3+.
10”,2 wounds vs 12”,1 wound
Weapons are:
Eviscerators are range 2, 2 attacks, 3+ hit, 3 damage, some symbols and a rule, that reduces the damage against infantry
Shock Assault: range 0, 1 attack, 4+ hit, 1 damage
Scything talons are range 1, 5 attacks, 4+ hit, 1 damage
Acid tongue: range 0, 1 attacks, 5+ hit, 1 damage, some symbols

I'll add that to the OP soon-ish, after i figured out how to boil it down

The 'two dials' pretty much say that this thing is similar to AoS unit profiles without calling it out directly - overall it seems like too much of a change for me, other 'playtesters' ought to have mentioned some of that if what pretty much looks like a total rewrite of basic concepts did indeed happen... but who knows - right now we can only conclude that some of the more recent rumours have to be fake, but we can't really say which ones!

**NAVARRO**

Nids overall redesign? YES PLEASE!

**Wayniac**

Intervenators is a ridiculous name even by GW naming.

Some of these get stranger and stranger, as expected. Definitely pancake edition vibes, the irony of course being that pancake edition was actually better than the official one that we got

**Tsagualsa**

Quick question:

Are people in general comfortable how i structured the OP? Is it okay to have 2-4 rumours as 'current' and the rest under 'old rumours' to keep the OP semi-legible, or do you favour another solution or split? Thematic summaries are/will be updated on the weekends exclusively as mentioned before, to keep me relatively sane

**Goose LeChance**

NAVARRO wrote:
Nids overall redesign? YES PLEASE!

Ehh.. it's always a gamble, especially when most of the current models still look good.

Every refresh is more worrying than exciting at this point.

**Dudeface**

The poster refused to post any pics from their burner account, they apparently are no longer in possession of the item, did not take pics and do not want any ire from GW.

**Tsagualsa**

Dudeface wrote:
The poster refused to post any pics from their burner account, they apparently are no longer in possession of the item, did not take pics and do not want any ire from GW.

Added.

**NAVARRO**

Goose LeChance wrote:
NAVARRO wrote:
Nids overall redesign? YES PLEASE!

Ehh.. it's always a gamble, especially when most of the current models still look good.

Every refresh is more worrying than exciting at this point.

Nothing to worry about if you ask me.

If you like the designs that have been going on for 2 decades long, then stick to it and stock up. If you like the new designs better then just buy them.
Win win.

**Chikout**

The arks of Omen comment has me dubious. There was a rumour from 4 months ago that correctly predicted the name of the first arks of Omen book, Azrael and Farsight. The same rumour said the Lion is coming in book 5. Saying they got book 5 but didn't even share the name of the book is a bit dodgy.

**JWBS**

I'm more inclined to believe BA over DA simply because Infernal Brush is painting his Dante conversion this month. This is a guy that definitely knows almost all of what's coming short/mid term at all times. ofc there's a very good chance his Dante timing is a coincidence but it's a small nod in the direction of BA imo.

**Segersgia**

Tsagualsa wrote:
Quick question:

Are people in general comfortable how i structured the OP? Is it okay to have 2-4 rumours as 'current' and the rest under 'old rumours' to keep the OP semi-legible, or do you favour another solution or split? Thematic summaries are/will be updated on the weekends exclusively as mentioned before, to keep me relatively sane

The structure is absolutely fine. Spoiler-tagging the older rumours allows it to be way more digestible.

I do have a question.

While this thread was specifically created as a reaction to Valrak's videos on the subject, I recall these 10th edition rumours started back in july with two reddit posts.

One about the early roadmap:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/vqo5yk/2023_10th_edition_roadmap/

Another clarifying the other one two days later with extra information on Kill Team and future codices:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/vrizn6/i_feel_the_need_to_clarify_the_leaks/

I don't remember or can find if Valrak ever acknowledged these rumours and I am not aware of the opinion the forum has on these.

What do people feel about these ones? And do these qualify to perhaps be added to the older rumour list? Apologies if this is bringing back stuff that has already been discussed.

**Wayniac**

Well that second one was correct, just the timing was off. Kasrkin, space hulk, guard then World Eaters. Also correctly mentioned the Desolation squad ("Primaris Devastators w/missle launcher) and melee redemptor.

I guess if the next thing is Marines 2.0 it will lend more credence to that.

**Tsagualsa**

Segersgia wrote:
Tsagualsa wrote:
Quick question:

Are people in general comfortable how i structured the OP? Is it okay to have 2-4 rumours as 'current' and the rest under 'old rumours' to keep the OP semi-legible, or do you favour another solution or split? Thematic summaries are/will be updated on the weekends exclusively as mentioned before, to keep me relatively sane

The structure is absolutely fine. Spoiler-tagging the older rumours allows it to be way more digestible.

I do have a question.

While this thread was specifically created as a reaction to Valrak's videos on the subject, I recall these 10th edition rumours started back in july with two reddit posts.

One about the early roadmap:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/vqo5yk/2023_10th_edition_roadmap/

Another clarifying the other one two days later with extra information on Kill Team and future codices:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/vrizn6/i_feel_the_need_to_clarify_the_leaks/

I don't remember or can find if Valrak ever acknowledged these rumours and I am not aware of the opinion the forum has on these.

What do people feel about these ones? And do these qualify to perhaps be added to the older rumour list? Apologies if this is bringing back stuff that has already been discussed.

I was actually not aware of those, they seem to have been mostly right to almost spot-on. I think i'll add these to the OP as old rumours, in hindsight it's pretty clear that Valrak did incorporate some of that material in his videos. The thread has moved away from being solely Valrak-based anyway, and i'm not dead-set on focusing only on his videos.

**tneva82**

SM2.0 next would pretty much kill 10e being reset.

**Vovin**

Chapter Master Valrak has waded in on B&C and called the starter box rumour bull****
https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/377648-blood-angels-box-set/?do=findComment&comment=5912483

**Tsagualsa**

Vovin wrote:
Chapter Master Valrak has waded in on B&C and called the starter box rumour bull****
https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/377648-blood-angels-box-set/?do=findComment&comment=5912483

And the OP of that thread waded in too, and spilled the fabacea: according to them, AoO5 is about the Sanguinor!

This of course puts both of them on a very short fuse, as we'll probably get the solution to this question on friday, with the next Tarot card!

**Wayniac**

tneva82 wrote:
SM2.0 next would pretty much kill 10e being reset.

No it wouldn't, this is GW we're talking about. How many times have they put out a new book and then invalidated it shortly thereafter? Traitor Legions in 7th springs to mind.

**tneva82**

Marine codex AND supplements before summer? Release slots run out. By now there would be more concrete info including from GW.

To be even comparable codex and supplements would have to come out RIGHT NOW and it would still have shorter gap...

**xttz**

*grabs popcorn*

**Tsagualsa**

xttz wrote:
*grabs popcorn*

This approaches something bordering on excitement

Either this or next friday we'll get the solution to that, unless they'd ramped up the Tarot cards to maximum obscurity to mess with us.

**Apple fox**

I would prefer the sanguinor, but I don’t expect it to be right at this point.

**xttz**

Segersgia wrote:

Another clarifying the other one two days later with extra information on Kill Team and future codices:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/vrizn6/i_feel_the_need_to_clarify_the_leaks/

I don't remember or can find if Valrak ever acknowledged these rumours and I am not aware of the opinion the forum has on these.

What do people feel about these ones? And do these qualify to perhaps be added to the older rumour list? Apologies if this is bringing back stuff that has already been discussed.

There's a couple of things that work both for and against this rumour. As I remember the Kasrkin and details on the new marine units were both posted elsewhere before this link, so it's possible that those rumours were incorporated into this schedule to make it seem more real.

On the other hand, schedules for 6+ months away are still subject to change and may well be very different to what GW originally intended. This is part of why they typically aren't usually keen on showing new models more than 3-4 months before release. We've seen other rumours state that plans for marine chapter supplements were dropped. It may well be the case that GW originally planned to do a WE vs Marines boxed set followed by chapter supplements to finish 9E. Then for whatever reason they changed their mind and decided to drop the supplements until 10E, and instead released the models as we see now.

**Tsagualsa**

Apple fox wrote:
I would prefer the sanguinor, but I don’t expect it to be right at this point.

Me neither. It all seems a bit too convenient: random burner account one pops up and mentions some stuff about BA and Tyranids, then account two comes up and says something about 'modular' starter sets that you collect and that let you play a reasonably-sized game once you have a handful of them, and then the third account appears and claims to have had their hands on just such a box, but of course had no opportunity to get a picture or other forms of proof. It just fits too well, and reeks of a story someone constructed to 'sell' a fake.

**Dudeface**

We are truly in the wild west of 10th rumours now, let the great rumour game commence!