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Land Raiders can now transport Gravis armour marines too hey.

12 Adeptus Astartes infantry includes Primaris so bladeguard veterans or the new infernus squad could be transported too. Interesting.

 Daedalus81 wrote:
Love Guilliman. No rerolls. Just really good interactions and they don't overload all at the same time, but instead toggle. Super happy with this design.

No rerolls . . . apart from the rerolls to hit and wound for every unit in your army against a designated enemy unit.

 vipoid wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:
Love Guilliman. No rerolls. Just really good interactions and they don't overload all at the same time, but instead toggle. Super happy with this design.

No rerolls . . . apart from the rerolls to hit and wound for every unit in your army against a designated enemy unit.

Compared to now, which is full rerolls of everything for everyone against everything? It's most definitely a dramatic reduction and it has criteria associated with it. Agreed it's not "none" though.

Probably Tyranids tomorrow.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
12 models in a Land Raider? Now you can finally fit a 5-man squad of Termies and a character! Rejoice!

Back to how it was in 5th edition! ...or the 3rd ed. Chapter Approved transport rules! Much innovation!

 vipoid wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:
Love Guilliman. No rerolls. Just really good interactions and they don't overload all at the same time, but instead toggle. Super happy with this design.

No rerolls . . . apart from the rerolls to hit and wound for every unit in your army against a designated enemy unit.

After you kill the first one, yea. Being in range and having enough guns to take out one large target let alone two won't likely be simple.

There's no additional AP, monsters and tanks are getting cover pretty easily, weapon APs are reduced and/or their strength is rebalanced, and some weapon ranges are reduced ( see MM at 18" ).

These factors make it much less likely to clear through a target without a consolidated effort.

The new Land Raider under Oath can just barely kill a Screamer Killer in cover. At present that's 250 vs 130. For a second Land Raider to kill a SECOND SK you need Bobby so an additional 550 points ( current costs, of course ).

Throw in that he can only be body blocked by INFANTRY means he needs some non-specialist unit that isn't going to get blown off the table thereby exposing him.

I can imagine the 0CP strat getting used more than the extra oath if there's something worthwhile.

One thing of note about Roboute Guilliman, his abilities work on Adeptus Astartes... so even none Ultramarine Loyal Marines will get the benefit.

Pretty sure his current rules only work in Ultramarines, could be wrong, I sort of zoned out of 9th.

 Nevelon wrote:
I like how the doctrines make the marines more mobile and flexible, but not just a bump in lethality.

Looks like fun.

I think they're neat, Tactical Doctrine is my favorite of the bunch.

 stonehorse wrote:
One thing of note about Roboute Guilliman, his abilities work on Adeptus Astartes... so even none Ultramarine Loyal Marines will get the benefit.

Pretty sure his current rules only work in Ultramarines, could be wrong, I sort of zoned out of 9th.

Some benefits were um only. Others imperium. He wasn't totally unheard in other armies when purity bonuses didn't get screwed.

I really hope that this will be a same gun for Gladiator Lancer. That thing needs love.

So they could def fit all the text onto one card but not lets do it on two and have large expanses of wasted space

It's a double-sided or fold-out card in all likelihood. AoS has a few of them for big monsters/heroes.

 Mr Morden wrote:


So they could def fit all the text onto one card but not lets do it on two and have large expanses of wasted space

I'm not impressed by the layout either, but I feel they are intentionally blank ATM.

The blank area either has points costs for the options, additional rules they don't want to show here or something else we aren't thinking of.

 Kanluwen wrote:
It's a double-sided or fold-out card in all likelihood. AoS has a few of them for big monsters/heroes.

There's text under that picture in the article:

What’s this? The BACK of a datacard? It’s where you’ll find things like unit composition, wargear options and transport capacity.

So it's pretty clear that it it, in fact, the back.

I should have figured it was explained but good to know they're not just throwing stuff onto a second card!

So far...

The Good:
- Absolutely thrilled to see engagement / melee return to base-to-base contact.
- I really like the change to the Overwatch stratagem. Very reminiscent of 2nd edition. Opens up the usage and gives some better counterplay.
- Characters joining units (again) but limited to one and restricting what units. Fantastic!
- The mission generation deck looks promising.


The Bad:
- Removing psychic disciplines for fixed psychic abilities. This was already tried (3rd and 4th edition IIRC) and it was strongly hated.


The Ugly (or GW being disingenuous)
- Not seeing the expected reduction in rerolling dice. Quite a few of the previewed rules involve rerolling.
- Definitely not seeing the expected reduction in AP they keep touting.
- The OC stat is good at face value and will seemingly make morale more meaningful, but this stat is going to be like AP - only good as long as GW can keep it under control.
- Terrain... We still don't have the full picture, but we're currently led to believe that all terrain is little more than a +1 to Sv. While this makes terrain rules less burdensome, it's a bit too simplistic.
- Army creation... Another one that's still not fully known, but the elimination of bitfield roles and a FOC make this contentious at best until we can know more.
- 10th edition will still be an overflowing landfill of stratagems. It's not six per faction it's six per detachment. If a faction has four detachments to choose from, that's still 24 stratagems that you need to know.

 Kanluwen wrote:
It's a double-sided or fold-out card in all likelihood. AoS has a few of them for big monsters/heroes.

So rather than having ALL the infomation on one side...lets make you cosntantly flip

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
It's a double-sided or fold-out card in all likelihood. AoS has a few of them for big monsters/heroes.

So rather than having ALL the infomation on one side...lets make you cosntantly flip

You moaned when you thought it was two cards.

You moan because they have the audacity to use….don’t worry, I’m clutching the pearls so you don’t have to, use…..both sides of a card.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
It's a double-sided or fold-out card in all likelihood. AoS has a few of them for big monsters/heroes.

So rather than having ALL the infomation on one side...lets make you cosntantly flip

The only thing you'd theoretically need to look up on the backside during a game could be the transport capacity, everything else is pre-game stuff like unit composition and wargear options. You do not need to flip the card once you remember what units can go into what transport.

 Sotahullu wrote:


I really hope that this will be a same gun for Gladiator Lancer. That thing needs love.

I could see the Glad Cannon being similar, but say S 15 or 14 and Dam d6+2 or 3.

I hope Titan scale weapons also get a promotion. Currently a warhound Turbolaser is 2d3 shots S16 AP -4 Dam d6 plus 3 blast, vs this gun on a tank a sixth the price.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
It's a double-sided or fold-out card in all likelihood. AoS has a few of them for big monsters/heroes.

So rather than having ALL the infomation on one side...lets make you cosntantly flip

You moaned when you thought it was two cards.

You moan because they have the audacity to use….don’t worry, I’m clutching the pearls so you don’t have to, use…..both sides of a card.

Mate - I fething "moaned" because they could obviously fit all the information on ONE fething side - do you actually get that? Or is to much to fething ask for EH??????

Just because they can fit it on one side for this specific unit doesn't mean all units can. So they likely made a single template that covers all their needs for the sake of cohesion. I am here for it, since reference cards were already a common fan game aid and this will be official.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
It's a double-sided or fold-out card in all likelihood. AoS has a few of them for big monsters/heroes.

So rather than having ALL the infomation on one side...lets make you cosntantly flip

You moaned when you thought it was two cards.

You moan because they have the audacity to use….don’t worry, I’m clutching the pearls so you don’t have to, use…..both sides of a card.

Mate - I fething "moaned" because they could obviously fit all the information on ONE fething side - do you actually get that? Or is to much to fething ask for EH??????

Some units could fit it all on one side, others may not. Just keep it standardized.

 Mr Morden wrote:


So they could def fit all the text onto one card but not lets do it on two and have large expanses of wasted space

Well for one land raider unlikely to be simplest model. Just because you can fit land raider doesn't mean you can fit everything. Ducy?

Also...that is one card. Think 2 random units in 1 card better?

You did read the article, yes?

But almost certainly not, I guess. wrote: What’s this? The BACK of a datacard? It’s where you’ll find things like unit composition, wargear options and transport capacity.

One card. Two sides. Each with very specific information. Hardly something you’d have to “constantly” be flipping.

Do you struggle with books, with all the page turning involved? Surely those should just use tiny enough type to fit it all on one page?

As I fething said - WHY use two cards when 1 is needed - Expain WHY it needs to be on 2 sides

Do you struggle with books, with all the page turning involved? Surely those should just use tiny enough type to fit it all on one page?

Do you struggle with English - although obviously not with making stupid comparisons.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
It's a double-sided or fold-out card in all likelihood. AoS has a few of them for big monsters/heroes.

So rather than having ALL the infomation on one side...lets make you cosntantly flip

You moaned when you thought it was two cards.

You moan because they have the audacity to use….don’t worry, I’m clutching the pearls so you don’t have to, use…..both sides of a card.

Mate - I fething "moaned" because they could obviously fit all the information on ONE fething side - do you actually get that? Or is to much to fething ask for EH??????

Some units could fit it all on one side, others may not. Just keep it standardized.

I guess stuff like Superheavies that can also transport and/or even transport weird stuff like dreadnoughts etc., or powerhouses like Magnus with a billion spells and abilities will need the whole front and then some to have space for it all, so they'll either put more stuff on the back side or do the foldout solution like AOS. It's not like the card back would have much use otherwise, it's either a gaming aid or a stupid logo, using it makes sense.

Folks above answered that.

Two sets of info. One for list assembly on one side. One for in-game info on the other.

Landraider is a relatively straight forward unit. Other units have more weapons and/or options, rules etc, taking up more space.

Just…admit you didn’t bother reading the article, would you?

One side for army building.
One side for game play.

Seems reasonable.

However, I'm still really curious to see a unit that has 15+ weapon options. I think these cards will be cringe worthy.