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 Daedalus81 wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
So this has come up in various articles since the started doing previews:

"For the purposes of this ability, if a unit has a Starting Strength of 1, it is considered to be below its Starting Strength while it has lost one or more wounds."

This concerns me, mainly because it doesn't scale. You could have something with 6 wounds, and something with 60 wounds, and both of them are affected equally just by losing a single wound.

I'm concerned that we might see things like Battleshock tests be required for anything below starting strength, meaning multi-wound creatures have to start taking tests the second they take a single wound.

They mentioned a while ago that multi-wound models don't test on normal battleshock until under half wounds.

Yeah, these "below starting strength" things seem to be pretty specific and targeted so I don't see this as being much of a problem right now.

So, miracle dice with 1 and 2 are actually useful for battleshock tests, just checked the article about leadership. You'll need to score low to pass the test.

Battleshock is higher. Termagants have high Leadership, Marines have low leadership. You want to roll above your LD.

 Daedalus81 wrote:
They mentioned a while ago that multi-wound models don't test on normal battleshock until under half wounds.

Well that's a good thing, but you can see how these "all you need is a wound" rules could be a problem?

Tsagualsa wrote:
Sounds not very convincing overall.

I dunno. As a narrative KT box, with terrain, sure. But why would they do a KT-based Space Hulk box after they did a whole season of KT boarding actions and then blew up the damned ship. Doing it after that would be a massive missed oppor... oh... oh! Actually, that makes perfect sense for GW then.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Battleshock is higher. Termagants have high Leadership, Marines have low leadership.

Oh, got it. Duh, I guess I'm so used to 8th & 9th mechanics.

Well, then the miracle dice with low value are crap.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Battleshock is higher. Termagants have high Leadership, Marines have low leadership. You want to roll above your LD.

 Daedalus81 wrote:
They mentioned a while ago that multi-wound models don't test on normal battleshock until under half wounds.

Well that's a good thing, but you can see how these "all you need is a wound" rules could be a problem?

Tsagualsa wrote:
Sounds not very convincing overall.

I dunno. As a narrative KT box, with terrain, sure. But why would they do a KT-based Space Hulk box after they did a whole season of KT boarding actions and then blew up the damned ship. Doing it after that would be a massive missed oppor... oh... oh! Actually, that makes perfect sense for GW then.

Yea low numbered miracle dice don't have a good place anymore. I can see someone using them to change their armor save to a fail to get a unit to die though...

On battleshock - stuff already exists to force a test outside normal parameters ( Screamer Killer, SitW, etc ). As long as they are focused or limited it makes enough sense to me. It's like a new category of weapon.

Now that all characteristic tests seem to require rolling high, uses for low MD's is a bit limited. Best I can come up with is:
Killing your own models off from failed saves to deny a charge
Forcing a single model to die when you really want to trigger the shoot back stratagem
Ensuring a vehicle takes a flesh wound to get the sweet +1 to hit

Middle of the road MD's will remain as good as ever, making a minimum roll to hit is fine and +1 to wound is always good.

With the way things are on twin linked weapons, does anyone think that shooting out of rhino's might replace immolators?

With low miracle dice an opponent has to be careful not to throw out some random splash damage (instead of purposely killing a unit), as the sister player can sacrifice one model to get bonus shooting in return.

I’m going to have to think about how I want to implement my sisters as they are currently very battle sister heavy with only moderate melee.

 Insularum wrote:
Ensuring a vehicle takes a flesh wound to get the sweet +1 to hit

Ooh, yea. That's a decent one. Letting the bolter go through to pick up a bonus.

Selfcontrol wrote:
Is it me or does the Indirect Fire Rule imply that you cannot destroy (=/= target) a model that is not visible (unless the weapon has the Indirect Fire rule) ?

If so, this is a huge change. Like, really huge.

You select your unit to shoot at a 10-models squad but only 4 are visible to your unit ? All your shots are resolved and can be allocated to these 4 visible models. If the models are destroyed and you still have shots to resolved, they are lost as the remaining 6 models are not visible.

oh lord please NO
i am getting very bad flashbacks of previous editions.... where you could position a unit as such, so you can only see specific models and pratically "snipe" em :/
maybe opponent could choose? like either get cover from those not visible and risk killing more than necessary or kill those in the open with worse save but minimize casulties... either way i dont like it. Remember the old nearest model dies first rule?? urgh

Slipspace wrote:

Domandi wrote:

Slipspace wrote:
Is there an implication in the Indirect Fire rules that you can now only kill what you can see? It seems to suggest that's the case.

I am not seeing that at all. It states you can target a unit where you can't see any of the models. If this is the case, you are -1 to hit and the target unit gets cover.

It's the part where it says "these attacks can destroy enemy models in a target unit even though none may have been visible to the attacking unit when you selected that target". That's a separate clause to the one allowing you to target the unit in the first place. There's not enough info to say for sure, but I'm leaning towards the probability you can't ordinarily kill things you can't see.

All that rule implies is:

Can you see models in the target unit when you declare them as the target? If yes congratulations you can shoot/kill them. If not, you can still shoot/kill them if you have indirect fire.

Crusade article:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/05/10/ways-to-play-warhammer-40000-forge-your-legend-on-crusade/

Tsagualsa wrote:
Added to the OP:

Edit 05/10/2023

New video, about KillTeam and a possible Space Hulk box set: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qcPFwdugv8

- KT box will include Space Marine Scouts vs. Striking Scorpions
- Definitely new Plastic Striking Scorpions
- Also new SM Scouts in plastic, similar to Neophytes
- Potentially second wave of Eldar coming after this
- Kill Team: Space Hulk is rumoured
- New Genestealers with this
- Valrak says that he 'always' said that new Genestealers will come with this, instead of the Tyranid range refresh provably false, as this tracker shows
- Genestealers will be the new side in a second-wave box of this new season, Terminators will be the side that gets upgrades to existing models
- mentions Thunderhammers, Lightning Claws and such
- Speculation about Dark Angels theme for the Terminators as part of the DA range refresh

Sounds not very convincing overall.

I think the launch box rumours for S3 sound plausible (Striking Scorpions vs SM Scouts), but the Space Hulk thing sounds off. Only way I could see Space Hulk in the form of KT21 would be via a Narrative Box alà Ashes Of Faith..

Why do I consider SM Scouts for S3 launch box as plausible? SM Scouts are the last remaining "Firstborn" SM infantry type GW hasn't yet rescaled to new proportions.. So once those get released, Firstborn Marine fans will have a complete range refresh (MKVI or MKIII tacticals, New Indomi termies in Leviathan, New Scouts in KT21S3 launch box), plus a selection of "modern" 40K or "vintage" 30K vehicles.

Also, if I think about SM Scouts, even the existing Scout plastic kits range is enough to build quite a specialized Kill Team.. You have either bolter or shotgun armed operatives, ML/HB Gunners, Snipers, as well as melee specialists with pistols and chainswords.. Combine both current scout kits into a single SKU which builds either squad (and buy several kits to fill up your rosters)

 tauist wrote:

Tsagualsa wrote:
Added to the OP:

Edit 05/10/2023

New video, about KillTeam and a possible Space Hulk box set: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qcPFwdugv8

- KT box will include Space Marine Scouts vs. Striking Scorpions
- Definitely new Plastic Striking Scorpions
- Also new SM Scouts in plastic, similar to Neophytes
- Potentially second wave of Eldar coming after this
- Kill Team: Space Hulk is rumoured
- New Genestealers with this
- Valrak says that he 'always' said that new Genestealers will come with this, instead of the Tyranid range refresh provably false, as this tracker shows
- Genestealers will be the new side in a second-wave box of this new season, Terminators will be the side that gets upgrades to existing models
- mentions Thunderhammers, Lightning Claws and such
- Speculation about Dark Angels theme for the Terminators as part of the DA range refresh

Sounds not very convincing overall.

I think the launch box rumours for S3 sound playsible (Striking Scorpions vs SM Scouts), but the Space Hulk thing sounds off. Only way I could see Space Hulk in the form of KT21 would be via a Narrative Box alà Ashes Of Faith..

What makes it sound off to me is that i can neither see Assault Termies practically locked behind a Kill Team, nor can i see overly chapter-specific Termies as the KT - for Space Marines especially, Codex entries will exist in the Online Store under the name they're found in the codex, not as an upgrade kit from another game.

And we haven't seen a multipart terminator kit at all yet, just the starter set squad of 5, which would need to happen to be the base for an upgrade sprue.

I'm actually not so sure about the daemons ability because it has strong win more vibes. After all, you get more of a bonus when you're doing better. Which is when you least need it.

Hold up, from the Crusade article:



Never receives a Charge bonus? What's a Charge bonus?

Probably extra attack on the charge, some units may have other bonuses.

Is this a new model?
https://imgur.com/a/VGVn5KY

Which part of that picture? Behind the Screamer Killer's leg I see a Haruspex and a Mucolid Spore.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Probably extra attack on the charge, some units may have other bonuses.

Thinking about it, a "Charge Bonus" could just mean swinging before anyone who hasn't charged.

James12345 wrote:
Is this a new model?
https://imgur.com/a/VGVn5KY

Comes up as a blank screen for me, so either a new Lictor or you did something wrong.

James12345 wrote:
Is this a new model?
https://imgur.com/a/VGVn5KY

I thought the same, but it seems like it is just Old man Wesker, who owns the amusement park the Mucolid Spore.

Noticed that SoB Boltguns are A1 RF1 while Chaos Marines are just A2.

 Sotahullu wrote:
Noticed that SoB Boltguns are A1 RF1 while Chaos Marines are just A2.

Seems like they are baking a sort of "bolter discipline" for all SM into the weapon profile so they get 2nd shot without need for RF.

I am looking at the profiles for the Battle Sisters and I am really getting the vibe that their equipment will be free. Maybe not all, but most of it. Only time will tell of course.

Multi-Melta goes from 24" range to 18" range that also affects their Melta ability. Meltagun also lost their Assault ability.

They are Strength 9, but Rhinos are now Strength 9 and Land Raiders are 12 so vehicles you used to wound on 3+ and 4+ are now wounding on 4+ and 5+.

Really looking forward to seeing the whole picture.

No plasma pistol or combi-weapon stats for the Battle Sister Superior, so presumably most of the 'character kit' will be on the Armoury card?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
So this has come up in various articles since the started doing previews:

"For the purposes of this ability, if a unit has a Starting Strength of 1, it is considered to be below its Starting Strength while it has lost one or more wounds."

This concerns me, mainly because it doesn't scale. You could have something with 6 wounds, and something with 60 wounds, and both of them are affected equally just by losing a single wound.

I'm concerned that we might see things like Battleshock tests be required for anything below starting strength, meaning multi-wound creatures have to start taking tests the second they take a single wound.

It may not scale perfectly, but it sure makes the rule easier to manage. Much like how vehicles degrade once now. Less bookkeeping is good, imo.

Slipspace wrote:

 Spreelock wrote:
Huh? The datasheet of battle sisters does not say how many models the unit has.. am I missing something?

It's on the reverse of the card, which we haven't seen. I'd assume it's still 5-10, otherwise they probably would have highlighted the change, as they did with Guard.

Squad size was/is 5-20 in 9th edition, and the squad has in the past had max sizes of 10, 15 and even 7 back in 2nd edition, so who knows what 10th will hold?

I know Votann is tomorrow but I’m really looking forward to seeing either an aeldari focus or one of the offshoot marine chapters to see how they differ. Knights will also be an interesting focus.

 bullyboy wrote:
I know Votann is tomorrow but I’m really looking forward to seeing either an aeldari focus or one of the offshoot marine chapters to see how they differ. Knights will also be an interesting focus.

I am waiting for boys in purple.

 bullyboy wrote:
I know Votann is tomorrow but I’m really looking forward to seeing either an aeldari focus or one of the offshoot marine chapters to see how they differ. Knights will also be an interesting focus.

I'm quite keen on orks, though we already know Waagh! is the faction ability.
I just want to see both sides of a couple unit cards.