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leopard wrote:

also not seeing a huge issue with allowing a pure knight household, can ally in "supporting troops"

I don't think it would be terribly effective, but don't see a reason to prohibit it

Not a big fan of either Marines or Solar, but I'm happy with the idea of Solar being the 30% support.

Would play the 30% allied Solar Axilliar as Houshold Men-at-Arms.

Here in my City, Legions Imperalis (and HH) seems to run nice. The local Warhammer Store now gets a weekly refill of two Core Sets and two detachment Sets (both with the same Unit). The space for 28mm Horus Heresy Stuff also got doubled.

Finally found a Thunderhawk at an online store! If next week's preorders are happening like the rumours claim they will, I might finally start making slight inroads into collecting an LI army. Drop Pods, Land Speeders and Land Raiders were precis the stuff I was waiting for.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
The Spartan was announced as well, with actual laser destroyer sponsons

missed that, in that case I sit corrected

Spartan was actually announced first much causing bit of a rackus.

tneva82 wrote:
Spartan was actually announced first much causing bit of a rackus.

that may be why I missed it

 Crablezworth wrote:

SamusDrake wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/01/25/the-first-warhammer-the-old-world-events-at-warhammer-world-are-coming-soon/

Of particular interest...

Muster a 1,500-point army filled with infantry, heavy armour, flyers, and god-engines for three games of Legions Imperialis in one day at this snappy weekday Warhammer event.

...and not 3000 points.

If you look up the suggested point size from space marine 2nd edition, it's also 1500pts. That's actually the sad reality of the game as it is currently, it seemingly plays better at 1500, 3000 is impossible with all the stilly crap they added about tracking formations and add to that endless overwatch everywhere turns the movement phase into an early shooting phase wayyyyyy to much. A 3000pt tournament is impossible, you'd need like 5 hour rounds.

That's also why I'm praying they lock overwatch behind first fire for non point defense. Allowing overwatch on advance order in an alternating activation game has shown to be a bridge too far.

Early overwatch is a counter to infantry and flyers and that's it. And frankly infantry is already ridiculous.

 Mr_Rose wrote:
Also we’re currently betting that the ship with the books diverted south, around the Cape, specifically to avoid all that.

Further, there’s exactly zero guarantee that the books would be on a British flagged vessel, especially since they’re more expensive to operate.

the chance of the ship getting hit even going through the red sea is, frankly, tiny.

And yet news of ship being hit pop up regularly. Unsurprisingly many ship prefer not to take risk when there's people deliberately shooting at cargo ships and ships been provenly hit.

Oh and overwatch takes less time than reqular shooting so more overwatch, less time spent on shooting

Neither ow nor formation tracking been issue here. Guess I'm lucky as finnish schoolsystem teaches all the skills needed to make that easy. As is li is quick enough 3k even now would be usable timewise if one could buy armies. 3k once more point expensive units come will be trivial.

stratigo wrote:


Early overwatch is a counter to infantry and flyers and that's it. And frankly infantry is already ridiculous.

ridiculously high efficient for their points you say.

Efficient in providing wounds. Kills less so.

But overwatching isn't overall good idea as you suffer -2 to hit meaning most of the time hitting on 6's. If somebody wants to waste all shooting hitting on 6's feel free. I then shoot without penalties causing much more damage.

It's tool to be used when situation calls. Not something every unit should be doing. It's primarily to give defence vs charging which otherwise would be too easy. Without ow need at least require los to charge

the effective alternative to using overwatch can be as simple as getting somewhere first, occupying it, then using first fire. will shoot before the mobile enemy does anyway and little need for overwatch

plus get to see all movement before deciding, I'd found overwatch can be a bit of a trap, use it sparingly when its the best option but "because I can" is seldom worth it unless you are trying to prove a point I guess

its decent v aircraft as you will likely be hitting on a 6, maybe a 5, anyway so the loss isn't that much

leopard wrote:


its decent v aircraft as you will likely be hitting on a 6, maybe a 5, anyway so the loss isn't that much

But that's half the problem, advance is a super order because it doesn't have enough downsides, the idea that there is zero difference between a non moving braced vehicles and a tank bumping down a road at full speed shooting at planes is just sorta bad. It's already not ideal that they can even target the planes to begin with, I get why it's allowed from a balance perspective, but it is silly to think 1/6 main battle tank shots hit planes.

Anyway, if they at least had to be on first it'd be another consideration for first fire. Overwatch on advance just makes advance too good.

Finally!

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/02/11/sunday-preview-space-marines-return-from-battling-leviathan/

Not everything we’re awaiting. But I’ll be in for three sets of the Marine Support, the book and a set of Spartans.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2024/02/11/sunday-preview-space-marines-return-from-battling-leviathan/

LI at last!

Expansion book, support boxes, Malcador variants, and Spartans

So the rumours of a preorder where true but the contents where wrong. What is here is pretty nice, though I would have preferred any SA transport instead of the malcador versions.
What I don't like is that we still don't have the tanks from the core set.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Table of contents for the book:


For the 22 cards 10 should be the units in the preorder, another 4 will be the units in the fast attack box, SA are also getting artillery and transport detachments in the book so medusa/basilisk (assuming only one card) and dracosans.

That's 16 cards. Assuming the infernus is a heavy armour and the valdor is a battle tank (infernus is a low in HH while the valdor is not) that would fill all the categories seen here.

That leaves 6 more cards. I also expect all the drop pods versions in here since they got an image in the reveal article which would be another 4 cards which leaves two for the vanguard formation and the drop pod formation known from the WD battlereport. So these should be all the rules we are getting from the book.

So five more boxes (2 droppod versions, fast attack, dracosans, artillery) plus the core box tanks and the missing flyers/titans should be next

Correct me if I'm wrong, but does this mean there still aren't rules for using whole armies of Knights and/or Titans outside of Titandeath?

Correct

Hmm... I was hoping that there would be more, given how much is still missing from the core rulebook.

Assuming that these four are really it, I'm guessing that the following reasoning was used -

The Bastion Detachments are seen as a big gap in the available models right now (both factions have a formation type that requires them), so a priority on getting them out. And you can't justify the release of a new rulebook without at least *some* units from that book (otherwise people won't buy it). So they felt they had to release at least one model from each army from the new book to encourage players to buy it. Having said that, the Malcador Infernus and Valdor Tank Destroyer seem like odd choices. Artillery would have been better, imo. Maybe they wanted to give the SA some Battle Tank options that didn't require multiple core boxes, and they think these are the best (or only) options available? I'm guessing that the Spartan was included so that the Astartes would have an easy way to transport their Terminators.

The only bit of good news on the tank front is that it will be fairly easy for the SA to proxy the new tanks as regular Malcadors.

Given what's missing so far, it still feels too early for the new book. But I'm guessing that they wanted to rush out the lists for Titan Legions and Knight Households.

Prediction - going forward (for the time being), we'll see LI units (not counting the ones from AT and AI) released in groups of four boxes. There will be one box for each faction with figures from the original book, and one box for each faction with units from the new rule book.

Eumerin wrote:


Prediction - going forward (for the time being), we'll see LI units (not counting the ones from AT and AI) released in groups of four boxes. There will be one box for each faction with figures from the original book, and one box for each faction with units from the new rule book.

I think if true that may be preferable if it means better supply, I think a giant release they can't even begin to support meaningfully is worse than a smaller one they can hopefully get out without much delay/disruption. It is really weird though in terms of the boxes from the starter like pred/malc/russ/sicaran seemingly not being part of this.

Super interested to see the new Formations as well.

The Marine ones in the rule book are solid building blocks, so more specialised ones are very welcome.

It'll probably end up as coincidence, but both LI and AT's first supplements cover Titandeath. It would be nice if the following book covered Molech...

I don't need a 4th and a 5th Rulebook....

Just release those ghaking Tanks from the Core Set...

Common Warhound Weapon options are still a AT Core Box thing too.

 Matrindur wrote:


For the 22 cards 10 should be the units in the preorder, another 4 will be the units in the fast attack box, SA are also getting artillery and transport detachments in the book so medusa/basilisk (assuming only one card) and dracosans.

That's 16 cards. Assuming the infernus is a heavy armour and the valdor is a battle tank (infernus is a low in HH while the valdor is not) that would fill all the categories seen here.

That leaves 6 more cards. I also expect all the drop pods versions in here since they got an image in the reveal article which would be another 4 cards which leaves two for the vanguard formation and the drop pod formation known from the WD battlereport. So these should be all the rules we are getting from the book.

So five more boxes (2 droppod versions, fast attack, dracosans, artillery) plus the core box tanks and the missing flyers/titans should be next

I just went and checked the card packs from the original release, the contents of the support boxes already got their cards in there and each unit got two copies of their card.

So far we've had previewed for the Great Slaughter ( I presume)

Legion Drop Pods
Dreadnaught Drop Pods
Land Raider Proteus
Spartan Assault Tank
Javelin Landspeeders
Proteus Landspeeders
Scimitar Jet Bikes
Outrider Bikes
Medusa/Basilisk Artillery
Dracosan Transport
Malcador Infernus/Valdor

11 units, unless they collapse the Landspeeders and Bikes to a single card while being quite different models. I suppose they could do one copy of each card instead of two, but that would change the previous pattern. To squeeze in some formations, it's possible that a unit like a Land Raider isn't in the Great Slaughter.

Boxes we don't have yet after this preorder are

Predators
Sicarans
Leman Russ
Malcadors
Warbringer Titan
Warmaster Titan
Warmaster Iconclast Titan
Dire Scout Titan
Thunderbolts
Xiphon Interceptors
Fire Raptors
Storm Eagles
Arvus Lighters
Legion Drop Pods
Dreadnaught Drop Pods
Land Raider Proteus
Legion Fast Attack
Medusa/Basilisk Artillery
Dracosan Transport
Bunch of Knight Boxes

More cards that will be in limited quantities

Astartes Legion Support box while I'm at it

Think I'll be buying a single Spartan from ebay before deciding whether or not to splurge on a whole box however.. Why couldn't they release the regular Land Raiders first

Way I see it, an Astartes Det box, Legion Support box, Rhinos & Land Raiders should be the first items to release for the nostalghia hungry 2nd ed Space Marine crowd. Feels weird having to wait for the 'raiders

Could there be an announcement for AT soon? A new book would be a good excuse to release the missing repackaged Titan and Knights kits, as well as the Direwolves and Legio & House bundles, without overwhelming the LI marine and solar release slots...

I wonder if they will update the AT starter box, it's basically the only part of the Epic range still with the old style bases.

An AT-themed wave makes sense, but I really hope we get the LI core box units released either before it or at least at the same time.

Cynical me thinks GW wants people to keep buying the starter for the meat & potatoes, and they wont mind postponing releases of the indiv. kits some time still

So good to finally get some new releases, however better order them quick before being out of stock for weeks on end.
Can't see anything there I don't want at least one of and quite a few I'd like multiple boxes of.

Why couldn't they release the regular Land Raiders first

Because Spartans can carry a lot more Terminators than regular Land Raiders can. GW is giving Astartes players a viable option to move a full-sized Terminator detachment.

No Dire Wolf, when it's on the cover :(

The dreadnought/rapier box is lovely.