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Of course they can, and they have done this in the past.
Yet as they don't do this any more we conclude that it was not worth it for them
(like Cursed City which a lot of shops still have in stock after a MTO like print run)
it is not about models they can produce in house, but boxed games were they need to order externally and ship it.
like if the initial order is 1 shipping container full of boxes/cardstock, and it sells out, making an MTO that only fills halve a container, the cost for the cardstock is doubled, meaning less profit
with the only gain being some customers being less grumpy and may not buying the upcoming box as they wait for the one they ordered
in addition, KT is running on a season model, so any orders that take longer as the current season last have no benefit for GW
Harry, bring this ring to Narnia or the Sith will take the Enterprise
We feel that we need to address some issues that are coming to light due to the current Games Workshop release issues as there seems to be a lack of perspective accompanying peoples rightly felt disappointment at missing out, please consider the following:
1. Games Workshop has seen unprecedented growth with the fallout of COVID and returning lapsed hobbyists to the fold that no one could have forecast. 2. Games Workshop is 6 months behind with new releases meaning they have had no time to produce more of items coming out in advance due to lead times being truncated. Not to mention they are taking up storage space needed for Leviathan. 3. A lot of these releases contain printed material not just models and these items come from China as it is far cheaper to print there and is the industry standard. 4. Games Workshop is devoting well over 80% of its manufacturing power to producing copies of Leviathan and if our sources are correct there are 4 times as many as the total number of Indomitus even after Cast on Demand. 5. This is very much a lesser of two evils choice from Games Workshop with Leviathan having to take priority due to it being a core product needed for the new edition
As a result of this and the fear mongering that seems to be ever present on social media, we are being inundated with emails etc regarding Leviathan that we just cannot answer. So, we will address the main points here:
1. No, we cannot do a pre-pre-order especially when we do not know the price. 2. We do not know the release date or any numbers for stock. 3. We have looked at sales numbers from Indomitus to get a rough idea of what we need. 4. There will be plenty of stock to go around of Leviathan 5. We don’t know anymore than you do and get our information on Sundays like you all for any pre-order 6. There’s no point doing an interest list as people sign up to multiple places meaning they are not a fair reflection of interest. 7. We will offer the best price we can as always
Hopefully, this allows some tempering and understanding of both your anger and disappointment of missing out on the last few releases but we can very much imagine you all would be more upset if you missed out on copies of Leviathan.
As always, we love each and every one of you and are so thankful that you allow ourselves to support your hobby journey.
Kindest Regards
The Manager
So much of this sounds like problems of GW's own creation.
They're behind on new releases? Stop insisting that you have to put them out every single week of the year. We're in the dark as much as the rest of you? That's on GW for their insane secrecy. Stores here can't even tell us the price until they go up for pre-order. That's insane.
And the "We're behind because of COVID" excuse isn't just wearing thing, it's torn through.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2023/05/21 11:39:03
We feel that we need to address some issues that are coming to light due to the current Games Workshop release issues as there seems to be a lack of perspective accompanying peoples rightly felt disappointment at missing out, please consider the following:
1. Games Workshop has seen unprecedented growth with the fallout of COVID and returning lapsed hobbyists to the fold that no one could have forecast.
2. Games Workshop is 6 months behind with new releases meaning they have had no time to produce more of items coming out in advance due to lead times being truncated. Not to mention they are taking up storage space needed for Leviathan.
3. A lot of these releases contain printed material not just models and these items come from China as it is far cheaper to print there and is the industry standard.
4. Games Workshop is devoting well over 80% of its manufacturing power to producing copies of Leviathan and if our sources are correct there are 4 times as many as the total number of Indomitus even after Cast on Demand.
5. This is very much a lesser of two evils choice from Games Workshop with Leviathan having to take priority due to it being a core product needed for the new edition
As a result of this and the fear mongering that seems to be ever present on social media, we are being inundated with emails etc regarding Leviathan that we just cannot answer. So, we will address the main points here:
1. No, we cannot do a pre-pre-order especially when we do not know the price.
2. We do not know the release date or any numbers for stock.
3. We have looked at sales numbers from Indomitus to get a rough idea of what we need.
4. There will be plenty of stock to go around of Leviathan
5. We don’t know anymore than you do and get our information on Sundays like you all for any pre-order
6. There’s no point doing an interest list as people sign up to multiple places meaning they are not a fair reflection of interest.
7. We will offer the best price we can as always
Hopefully, this allows some tempering and understanding of both your anger and disappointment of missing out on the last few releases but we can very much imagine you all would be more upset if you missed out on copies of Leviathan.
As always, we love each and every one of you and are so thankful that you allow ourselves to support your hobby journey.
Kindest Regards
The Manager
So much of this sounds like problems of GW's own creation.
They're behind on new releases? Stop insisting that you have to put them out every single week of the year.
We're in the dark as much as the rest of you? That's on GW for their insane secrecy. Stores here can't even tell us the price until they go up for pre-order. That's insane.
And they "We're behind because of COVID" excuse isn't just wearing thing, it's torn through.
They formulated that one badly, but that's the only one you can actually give them - it's not so much that they're (probably) behind on releases, it's that the container time from China to Europe inflated from ~60 days to more than 120 days on average, so there's basically a hole of 2-3 months in their processes. That's the only fact that can be proven/shown with data from impartial, external sources and is definitely more than a made-up excuse.
That being said, this situation has been going on for more than three years now, you can't blame everything on Covid forever. If you haven't figured some way to cope with that in a professional way as a company by now, that's squarely on you. And of course the issue is made worse by GW's habitual unwillingness to communicate and explain things.
not like containers are the only way to get stuff from china, it is just the cheapest way to do it
so being behind 6 months is not a big enough problem for GW to invest the money necessary to solve it
hence it is just an excuse
and in general being behind on release can also be solved by pausing them, but guess this is not an option for GW as of their own marketing (a game not getting something new every month is dead and not worth playing)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/05/21 11:47:55
Harry, bring this ring to Narnia or the Sith will take the Enterprise
LMAO @ "...but we can very much imagine you all would be more upset if you missed out on copies of Leviathan"
They think Leviathan is like the second coming.. when it's a box I already know for sure I am not going to be buying
There is no need to sympathise with GW, and in fact, I have not heard them complaining. Retailers are probably the ones who suffer from stock shortages the most
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2023/05/21 11:58:48
"The larger point though, is that as players, we have more control over what the game looks and feels like than most of us are willing to use in order to solve our own problems"
NAVARRO wrote: Poor things. I think we should give a bit of help to GW and not buy at all.
That's certainly my plan. I really don't get the FOMO on this:
The teams are either out already or will get their own release relatively soon
The campaign may or may not, but I don't think for a moment people are falling over themselves to spend £95 to get the campaign rules
Sure, there's a discount on the individual releases but it's not significant enough to get worked up about missing out on (especially as FLGS will be carrying the individual boxes anyway).
You don't need to get everything on initial release. It's ok to miss out on stuff
Seems like somthing that should be illegal. Advertising things that you can't even buy? If stock runs out after 1min and it happens more than twice a year then this should be illegal. Make more or advertise in a much smaller area otherwise these are just psychological tactics to invoke a sense of scarcity and encourage FOMO. Wich should be illegal. The time when these big companys can get away with everything under the sun needs to end.
Boosykes wrote: Seems like somthing that should be illegal. Advertising things that you can't even buy? If stock runs out after 1min and it happens more than twice a year then this should be illegal. Make more or advertise in a much smaller area otherwise these are just psychological tactics to invoke a sense of scarcity and encourage FOMO. Wich should be illegal. The time when these big companys can get away with everything under the sun needs to end.
These advertisements are automated though, e-mails and website posts set to go up at a certain time, much as the pre-order window itself.
Charax wrote: Sure, there's a discount on the individual releases but it's not significant enough to get worked up about missing out on (especially as FLGS will be carrying the individual boxes anyway).
You don't need to get everything on initial release. It's ok to miss out on stuff
Last time I saw someone run the numbers, the miniatures aspect of the box worked out at about 1/2 RRP, even ignoring any of the paper/card content - what level of discount is required before you can start getting wound up about it selling out before the pre-order window opens?
=][= KT - Unknown
Scions - £27.50
SoS - £35
Dark Commune - £32.50
Accursed Cultists - £32.50
Cultists - £30
Total - £157.50 + =][= KT (probably £37.50?)
Gamgee on Tau Players wrote:we all kill cats and sell our own families to the devil and eat live puppies.
Kanluwen wrote: This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.
Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army...
tneva82 wrote: You aren't even trying ty pretend for honest arqument. Open bad faith trolling.
- No reason to keep this here, unless people want to use it for something...
NAVARRO wrote: Poor things. I think we should give a bit of help to GW and not buy at all.
Agreed. It's the only way to change GW's marketing practices for the better. Not sure exactly what percent of consumers would be necessary to start a panic in the GW boardroom, but (for example) if 75% of the market base stopped buying for a year, I think GW would stop overproducing core boxes like Indomitus and Leviathan, and at least slow the churn and FOMO marketing. This would also dismay the scalpers and professional resellers, and perhaps get them to stop.
Of course that will never happen, as if enough consumers did boycott for a year, enough would break the boycott to buy stuff now that new releases did not sell out before official pre-release orders go live.
And I agree with those who say these are problems of GW's own making. There is no reason to weep for them, "oh poor little rich boy!" It is a deliberate marketing strategy capitalizing on FOMO and encouraging impulse buying. It is to their benefit and their stockholders, though not the consumer's.
"The larger point though, is that as players, we have more control over what the game looks and feels like than most of us are willing to use in order to solve our own problems"
Like much of the 'x units sold' or 'only y left' things in online stores, it's pretty much guaranteed to be a lie / dark pattern marketing. These numbers are almost never real, but carefully calculated fictions to instill a sense of urgency and at the same time trust in the vendor. Much like ticking countdowns that tell you that an offer will only be valid for x minutes or whatever, they exploit weaknesses in human cognition.
Decided I will use Palanite Enforcer torsos for the Scions, they are also 25mil based so should match nicely and still keeps the og base size
"The larger point though, is that as players, we have more control over what the game looks and feels like than most of us are willing to use in order to solve our own problems"
tauist wrote: Decided I will use Palanite Enforcer torsos for the Scions, they are also 25mil based so should match nicely and still keeps the og base size
The Palanites do have two legs to attach to their torso rather than the waist of the Scions, so they might be difficult to combine. Also, watch out for their annoying, intrusive shoulder-pads!
tauist wrote: Decided I will use Palanite Enforcer torsos for the Scions, they are also 25mil based so should match nicely and still keeps the og base size
The Palanites do have two legs to attach to their torso rather than the waist of the Scions, so they might be difficult to combine. Also, watch out for their annoying, intrusive shoulder-pads!
Oh, I'll just be using the Scion arms and accessories. Palanite shoulder pads will get the saw. I already found some nice reference picts via Google Image search
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/05/22 07:37:40
"The larger point though, is that as players, we have more control over what the game looks and feels like than most of us are willing to use in order to solve our own problems"
I won't play ball with regards to GW's tactic of selling via fomo, although I'll admit I have in the past. Fed up of it now.
If it were to go up as a made to order I would get one, other than that this is money GW won't be getting from me.
I've been playing a while, my first model was a lead marine and my first White Dwarf was bound with staples
Whoever it was that predicted 'Their answer will be Go down to your local GW' was spot-on. Other than that, it's noncommittal faff as usual.
Better answer than I got, it suggests they at least recognise selling out before pre-orders officially go live might be a bit off... To be honest, I think there would be a lot less disappointment if they were at least up for 24 hours or so.
The rubbish response I got:
Good Afternoon,
Thanks for contacting us regarding this query.
I can see that this Ashes of Faith pre-order was extremely popular and did sell out very quickly.
I'm very sorry to see that you received the email for the pre-order after this sold out. Unfortunately I believe that this was an automated email.
However I will certainly pass the feedback on regarding this.
Our Retail stores and local trade stores should be getting copies of this set on Release Day 27/05/2023.
If still no luck, then never fear the individual teams are slated for release SUMMER 2023
Gamgee on Tau Players wrote:we all kill cats and sell our own families to the devil and eat live puppies.
Kanluwen wrote: This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.
Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army...
tneva82 wrote: You aren't even trying ty pretend for honest arqument. Open bad faith trolling.
- No reason to keep this here, unless people want to use it for something...
kodos wrote: the problem is the webstore, and the solution is to buy the stuff as stand alone release in summer
yeah, everything is fine
The Inquisition Kill Team may well be out later - no guarantee the campaign side of things will be.
By the economics of the whole situation, campaing stuff is mostly sourced from producers elsewhere and thus the least likely to be released separately. Things like the reusable stickers etc. is not something they do in-house afaik.
They’ve done this before in recent years; heck my Goff rocker only just arrived from an order last year!
Yes mine only turned up in April.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
kodos wrote: Of course they can, and they have done this in the past.
Yet as they don't do this any more we conclude that it was not worth it for them
(like Cursed City which a lot of shops still have in stock after a MTO like print run)
That is a good example as to why limited releases are a good idea, but it left stock on shelves for a different reason/ lots of people like me were all primed to buy. We didn't get a copy. We then got to play someone elses. And discovered it is a poor game and not worth it.
KT doesn't have that poor game problem, the game is already a known quantity. Doing a made to order would just be bringing in the cash, or at least confirm the books, upgrade sprues etc will be there separately.
in addition, KT is running on a season model, so any orders that take longer as the current season last have no benefit for GW
So why later part of season send out boxes to reviewers. That is at this point an additional wind up.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/05/22 11:21:44
You assume GW can tell the difference between a good game and a bad game and that some of their games don't sell after the initial hype because they are just bad games
GW still thinks in terms of a model company and that you want their stuff because of the setting and models and not because you want to play a good game
Harry, bring this ring to Narnia or the Sith will take the Enterprise
