Our Codex is da biggest an da best! - Orks 10th Edition Tactics

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**gungo**

Jidmah wrote:
gungo wrote:
Depends on what your standard of medium or heavy infantry is but ya 2 wounds and 2 or 3+ save, t5 is ideal for pks..

I think gave a rather conclusive list of what I consider "heavy infantry" a few posts ago. In short, a marine is not heavy infantry, a terminators is. PKs are pretty bad against terminator and other armies' equivalents.

what I mean is devastating wounds was handed out regularly to most armies making mortal wounds common and yes the most efficient (or overpowered) units are those which stack high amount of attacks or anti- weapons with it… and those combos are in almost every army.

Once again, I'm asking for specific examples. Because I'm not seeing those combos in any army.

In some cases like deathwatch and wraithknights absurdly to much on (like 20-30mw), but those amounts are the abusive outliers whereas several armies have index units that can easily push out 8-12 mortal wounds (like an ork nob on squig w headwhompa in a unit with squig riders and 2 bomb squigs). Those units become almost necessary to take out heavy vehicles like knights.

The only thing 'eadwhomas really does in this scenario is double the wounds done by the big choppa, as it ignores a knight's 4+ armor save. Squig riders with 2 bomb squigs and 'eadwompa combined add an average of ~7 MW once per game and only if the Waaagh! is active.

In the same scenario, the attacks of six squighogs lead by a smasha squig amount to:
4 from big choppa
0.42 from smasha squig
12 from stikkas
6.66 from squighogs
1 from thrown stikka
for a total of ~24 damage against a knight without dealing a single mortal wound, outright killing even one of the big ones.

While the Waaagh! is active, 5 Nobz with warboss can still deal 10-12 damage to a knight, if you align other units with them (for example Mozrog or a bunch of rokkits) they can kill one as well.

In other words, no you don't have to bring mortal wounds to kill a knight.

Not sure where you are getting your numbers for nob on squig w killchoppa
But it’s 6 atks on Waagh w 2+ to hit and 3+ anti vehicle meaning 6.67 mortals and the 2 bomb squigs average 3.33 mortal wounds… which is 10 mortals on average even if the knight had 6+ fnp that’s still 8.333 mortals..

And without mortals the big choppa is 6 atks 2+ hit, 3+ wound, 4+ save 2dam on knight that’s only 3.33 on choppa less if 6+ fnp.
Your math seems off, but regardless that damage potential from killchoppa on nob is only 3.33 more damage from the nob vs a knight. I get what you’re saying.

**TedNugent**

RedNoak wrote:
Is badruk really that usefull? Haven't played him yet, but he costs the same as 5 flashgitz. I mean at that point... Aren't 5 extra snazzguns better then rerolls? Also the rerolls won't work if they're embarked right? Do you guys just play em slogging?

10 flashgits in a trukk + mek for +1toH... Thats the same cost as 10 gits + badruk on foot. As are 10 + 5 flashgitz on foot.

When I was running the math, the reroll really played into lethal hits. Bear in mind more hits = more chances to score lethal hits when you use the runt.

The reroll alone makes 5 gits pretty close to the output of 10 gits, not including Badrukk's shooting, not including lethal hits.

If you take base stats against MEQ as a generic example:

10 gits:

.33*.66*.5*35
3.8 unsaved wounds

5 gits with rerolls starts to get complicated, but bear with
extra hits on a 6 with rerolling 1-4
(.66*.16) + (.16)
.266 chance of sustained hits, .266 * 15 = 4 extra attacks

.55*.66*.5*19 = 3.45 unsaved wounds

Badrukk:
.266 chance of sustained hits, (.266 * 3) + 3 = 3.8 attacks

.55*.83*.83*3.8 = 1.44 unsaved wounds at D3

So yeah, in terms of raw damage output, I think it's better, moreso if you add the runt, as their output goes up considerably based on the number of 6's, which the rerolls increase that number by 2/3. With a respectable 6 wounds behind a 3+ save, he seems to be a viable addition to me. Provided you disembark them, and I'd think you would want to, to make use of the runt. Lethal hits only goes up in value at higher T values due to lethal hit being autowound, and that's what makes them able to wound big stuff at a surprising rate with the runt.

**Jidmah**

gungo wrote:
Not sure where you are getting your numbers for nob on squig w killchoppa
But it’s 6 atks on Waagh w 2+ to hit and 3+ anti vehicle meaning 6.67 mortals and the 2 bomb squigs average 3.33 mortal wounds…

Hm, maybe my math is off, it was late yesterday...

So 6 attacks generate 5 hits and 1 substained hits trigger, wounds on 3+ for 4 wounds, AP-1 vs 3+ armor save (some knights have 2+, but most are limited 3+/5++) is 2x2 = 4 damage from the big choppa.
On big models devastating wounds just skipps the saves, so it essentially adds another 4 damage.

Bomb squigs "hit" on 1.66 for d3 damage each, making it 3.33. Though it has to be pointed out that this is a very misleading average and does not reflect the actual distribution and should instead be treated as 2-4

So the difference between just punching the knight without any help and using 'eadwompa and the squigs is just 6-8 mortal wounds which I averaged to ~7.

IMO 'eadwompa is a nice way to sink your last few points, but doesn't help that much with killing big stuff. It's actually much better against the models I classified as heavy infantry and monsters, because those rely heavily on saves to stay alive. I'd rather use 1 CP on unbridled carnage when facing knights.

**cody.d.**

Had my first game of 10th the other week and decided to take a silly list for a silly edition

Spoiler:

My opponent took custodes and by gorks fat green backside are they durable.

Spoiler:

Morkanaut was the first causality, got shot then charged by some wardens but did put out some dakka before hand.
deffdreads can take out a landraider with full claws it seems and also clear up small units of elites by themselves. Yeah they're expensive but durable and killy enough to justify it.
Bikers are good enough objective grabbers, but unless you spam them i doubt they'll get much done damage wise.
Grots are great for objective hugging and cp generating, especially since you can get multiple in one turn as they generate in the command phase so get around the 1cp only per turn rule.
Meks are awesome, as long as you can "heal" a full health model to give them the to hit buff
Stompa is fairly good, great use of overwatch, it's guns can hit hard and it has solid combat. My opponent had a 1+ to wound stratagem and even then he was struggling to wound that big T14 zogger. I'm sure some stuff may be able to wipe it out, but it's not a instant loss unit by any means.

Other things we learned, transports are fantastic units to pin down objective grabbers. Unless you have fallback and charge or enough spare firepower they'll follow and just keep charging.

I reckon i may give beastsnaggas a shot next.

**flaming tadpole**

Since we’ve been talking about green tide I thought it’d be interesting to see what the group would think to run if/when it becomes a viable option once indirect and mortals calm down a bit. My guts tell me I’d want to go balls to the wall with a turn 1 waaagh and try and pin the opponent in their deployment all game and basically be up in points so much by end of 3/4 that they can’t come back. This is what I came up with, surprisingly no beastsnaggas:

Spoiler:

Strat would be to always turn 1 waaagh. Use Zodgrod, kommandos, and da jump squad of boys turn 1 to pin the opponent in, then basically keep sending in wave after wave of boys while grots and storm boys focus on primary/secondary.

**Vineheart01**

curiosity, whats so bad about indirect? its still weaker than it was in 9th since it imposes -1 to hit and now also automatically grants cover if you cant see the target.
Or is it the actual weapons with indirect are overtuned and not the core rule being a problem?

**PaddyMick**

Vineheart01 wrote:
curiosity, whats so bad about indirect? its still weaker than it was in 9th since it imposes -1 to hit and now also automatically grants cover if you cant see the target.
Or is it the actual weapons with indirect are overtuned and not the core rule being a problem?

Yeah loads of them have ways, some bullt into the datacard, that ignore the penaltys. Desolators are stoopid. But they've said they are addressing that, early this month.

@tadpole looks great mate, can't argue with 100 boyz. What about vs fast opponents who go first? Try and block them with kommandos? get in behind then with snikrot and da jump?
Good luck, Take some painkillers for the back ache ;0

**Vineheart01**

ah, yeah fi you ignore either of those penalties then yeah i see why it'd be a problem.
Only played 3 games of 10th so far and havnt encountered any indirect except tau's missiles.

**Jidmah**

flaming tadpole wrote:
Since we’ve been talking about green tide I thought it’d be interesting to see what the group would think to run if/when it becomes a viable option once indirect and mortals calm down a bit. My guts tell me I’d want to go balls to the wall with a turn 1 waaagh and try and pin the opponent in their deployment all game and basically be up in points so much by end of 3/4 that they can’t come back. This is what I came up with, surprisingly no beastsnaggas:

Spoiler:

Green tide (2000 Points) CHARACTERS

Boss Snikrot (105 Points)
• 1x Mork’s Teeth
1x Slugga

Warboss (95 Points)
• Warlord
• 1x Big choppa
1x Kombi-weapon
1x Twin slugga
• Enhancements: Follow Me Ladz

Weirdboy (55 Points)
• 1x Weirdboy staff
1x ’Eadbanger

Zodgrod Wortsnagga (80 Points)
• 1x Da Grabzappa
1x Slugga

BATTLELINE

Boyz (170 Points)
• 1x Boss Nob
• 1x Power klaw
1x Slugga
• 19x Boy
• 17x Choppa
2x Close combat weapon
2x Rokkit launcha
17x Slugga

Boyz (170 Points)
• 1x Boss Nob
• 1x Power klaw
1x Slugga
• 19x Boy
• 17x Choppa
2x Close combat weapon
2x Rokkit launcha
17x Slugga

Boyz (170 Points)
• 1x Boss Nob
• 1x Power klaw
1x Slugga
• 19x Boy
• 17x Choppa
2x Close combat weapon
2x Rokkit launcha
17x Slugga

Boyz (170 Points)
• 1x Boss Nob
• 1x Power klaw
1x Slugga
• 19x Boy
• 17x Choppa
2x Close combat weapon
2x Rokkit launcha
17x Slugga

Boyz (170 Points)
• 1x Boss Nob
• 1x Power klaw
1x Slugga
• 19x Boy
• 17x Choppa
2x Close combat weapon
2x Rokkit launcha
17x Slugga

Boyz (170 Points)
• 1x Boss Nob
• 1x Power klaw
1x Slugga
• 19x Boy
• 17x Choppa
2x Close combat weapon
2x Rokkit launcha
17x Slugga

OTHER DATASHEETS

Gretchin (90 Points)
• 2x Runtherd
• 2x Grot-smacka
2x Slugga
• 20x Gretchin
• 20x Close combat weapon
20x Grot blasta

Gretchin (45 Points)
• 1x Runtherd
• 1x Grot-smacka
1x Slugga
• 10x Gretchin
• 10x Close combat weapon
10x Grot blasta

Gretchin (45 Points)
• 1x Runtherd
• 1x Grot-smacka
1x Slugga
• 10x Gretchin
• 10x Close combat weapon
10x Grot blasta

Kommandos (135 Points)
• 1x Boss Nob
• 1x Choppa
1x Slugga
• 9x Kommando
• 9x Choppa
9x Slugga

Kommandos (135 Points)
• 1x Boss Nob
• 1x Choppa
1x Slugga
• 9x Kommando
• 9x Choppa
9x Slugga

Stormboyz (65 Points)
• 1x Boss Nob
• 1x Choppa
1x Slugga
• 4x Stormboy
• 4x Choppa
4x Slugga

Stormboyz (65 Points)
• 1x Boss Nob
• 1x Choppa
1x Slugga
• 4x Stormboy
• 4x Choppa
4x Slugga

Stormboyz (65 Points)
• 1x Boss Nob
• 1x Choppa
1x Slugga
• 4x Stormboy
• 4x Choppa
4x Slugga

Strat would be to always turn 1 waaagh. Use Zodgrod, kommandos, and da jump squad of boys turn 1 to pin the opponent in, then basically keep sending in wave after wave of boys while grots and storm boys focus on primary/secondary.

What's your plan when you don't go first or face infiltrators?

**PaddyMick**

RedNoak wrote:
Is badruk really that usefull? Haven't played him yet, but he costs the same as 5 flashgitz. I mean at that point... Aren't 5 extra snazzguns better then rerolls? Also the rerolls won't work if they're embarked right? Do you guys just play em slogging?

10 flashgits in a trukk + mek for +1toH... Thats the same cost as 10 gits + badruk on foot. As are 10 + 5 flashgitz on foot.

Reckon the trick here is to put badrukk and 10 gitz in the trukk, drive up and disembark within 6'' of the target to get his -1T aura in play as well; my maths says if you do this, you can wipe 10 marines and their attached character, which probably makes your points back. Then overwatch in opponents turn, kill some more stuff before you get got.

**Forceride**

Vineheart01 wrote:
ah, yeah fi you ignore either of those penalties then yeah i see why it'd be a problem.
Only played 3 games of 10th so far and havnt encountered any indirect except tau's missiles.

Let me give an example, you probably know this, the rukkatruck can fire at 36 it's main gun indirect, it get's already natively the ignore cover, also get's the +1 to hit against infantry ability, so shooting at infantry you just ignored all the penalties of indirect, add a mek and you now are shooting with +1 to infantry and no penalty to anything else. But at 110 + 45pts this is not a very good platform for D6+6 blast..

I been thinking on the dragsta since that game with necrons, it's gun with precision and mek + it's amazing mobility at 85pts is starting to be very interesting.. i am going to give it a spin + deth dread next game, load up on nobz and beast snaggas and see what i can do.

**flaming tadpole**

PaddyMick wrote:
@tadpole looks great mate, can't argue with 100 boyz. What about vs fast opponents who go first? Try and block them with kommandos? get in behind then with snikrot and da jump?
Good luck, Take some painkillers for the back ache ;0

Cheers mate! Ya still trying to work out the kinks of what would be best in those scenarios. If they have infiltrators that are able to block my da jump squad then I was thinking I’d use ere we go on the warboss squad for a 10” move so they’d have a 22-23” charge threat range essentially to clog up one of the side obj. If it was daemons going first they likely have at least 2 big monsters that go 12” that’d be able to snag two obj but luckily they only have oc5 and a lot of their infantry like daemonettes and blood letters are fairly easy for boys to kill and they don’t do much damage to us in return.

The nightmare matchup I think would be a 14 war dog chaos knight list. I think green tide probably just loses like 9/10 automatically. The avenger chain cannons will just whittle us down too quickly and brigands will hit on 3’s in cc and probably have little incentive to fall back since we can’t do much damage to them.

**Grimskul**

Based on my experience from last game and some of the discussions in the thread so far, I'm having my next 1500 point game, this time with the actual Leviathan card pack rather than the basic Only War scenario from the core rules. This is the kind of list I have drafted so far:

Spoiler:

The idea is that one trukk will be transporting the 2 units of Nobz and Warbosses and the other two will be carrying the Beast Snagga boyz, one of which has a Beastboss. Gretchin hold the backfield while Badrukk and his Gitz go into Strategic reserve to outflank and shoot up ideal targets. Kommandos infiltrate up the board to hold objectives and put pressure early on before I get my T2 WAAAGH! on.

I'm wondering if I should fit in Snikrot somehow into this list or if dropping one of the Snagga units for Squighog Riders might be a better idea. Haven't tried Beast Snaggas yet, so would love some feedback if that's something I need to go all in with or if they work out in terms of being sprinkled into different armies.

**Tomsug**

Nobs with PK

WARBOSS or PAINBOY?

I have already 2 Beastbosses and Mozdrog in the list so I feel I have enough of melee power and think about my 10Nobz blob like about a central objective more turns fighters.

And 5+++ and regain D3 models per game seems fine againts mortal wounds flying around.

Of course, there is an alternative based on MANz with MA Big Mek.

But invu in shooting seems to be not enough

**Jidmah**

I still prefer the warboss because of the -1 to wound. It pushes nobz' durability to a level where main guns of tanks have be pointed at them in order to get rid of them quickly while most anit-infantry guns just bounce off.

**Tomsug**

Just to be absolutely sure

Grots with Zogrod sitting in the Transport (Battlewagon, Killtank, Nauts, Stompa…) giving this transport Scout 9” ability. Right?

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Sounds like a fun Stompy plan…

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh no! It is DEDICATED Transport. So just a Trukk.

Damn!

**Coh Magnussen**

Tomsug wrote:
Just to be absolutely sure

Grots with Zogrod sitting in the Transport (Battlewagon, Killtank, Nauts, Stompa…) giving this transport Scout 9” ability. Right?

I'm no expert, but my read of this said that only works in a trukk since the scouts rules specifes "dedicated transport", which made me sad because my grots prefer to ride around in their grotzwagon (battlewagon) acting a fool.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh lol, sorry, just now saw that you already said that.

**CthuluIsSpy**

Grots seem pretty useful this edition.
Having a couple of small squads of them sitting on your backfield objectives and harvesting command points looks handy.

**Coh Magnussen**

Is it worth piling a ten-grot-mob with da Red Gobbo, err, i mean Zogrod into a truck to zoom zoom onto the battlefield and disembark on an objective T1?

**Forceride**

The grotz become solid across the board, in melee they have some decent durability close to the nobz.

They also fight a lot better for only 125pts.

The question is, if it is worth it?

In general your packing 2 to 3, one of those will be in contested vp. it might or not pay itself, not sure. Haven't tried.

**Jidmah**

Coh Magnussen wrote:
Is it worth piling a ten-grot-mob with da Red Gobbo, err, i mean Zogrod into a truck to zoom zoom onto the battlefield and disembark on an objective T1?

With Zodgrod, they are fast enough to just run there

**Tomsug**

You can take 3 Kommandos incl. Zagstruk and 1 grots with Zogrod in 4 Trukks and Scout 9”.

**Beardedragon**

Jidmah wrote:
Coh Magnussen wrote:
Is it worth piling a ten-grot-mob with da Red Gobbo, err, i mean Zogrod into a truck to zoom zoom onto the battlefield and disembark on an objective T1?

With Zodgrod, they are fast enough to just run there

was about to say the same.

You dont really need a trukk with scout move 9 just to get to an objective.

**Jidmah**

Tomsug wrote:
You can take 3 Kommandos incl. Zagstruk and 1 grots with Zogrod in 4 Trukks and Scout 9”.

Why though?

I get how all the internet is aflame with trukks being super cheap, but they also do super nothing outside of tankshock and those cost valuable CP.

Putting a unit which can make use of the speed or durability into trukks, sure, but I'm not convinced that spamming trukks is actually better than spending the same amount of points on mek guns or any of the other dozen mobility options that we have.

**Afrodactyl**

Yeah, I'd suggest that Kommandos don't need Trukks and neither do Grots with Zodgrod. They're fast enough as is.

**Insularum**

A mass of scouting Trukks could do some tricks worth considering though. Scouting 9" leaves the back end of the Trukk in easy range of a non scouting unit to embark. Just disembark the scout units, move other non-scouting units up and embark, then rush the fully loaded Trukks forward (along with the disembarked scouts). Finishing your Trukks move parked bumper to bumper would stop a lot of wrapping/block access to objectives.

**cody.d.**

Jidmah wrote:
Tomsug wrote:
You can take 3 Kommandos incl. Zagstruk and 1 grots with Zogrod in 4 Trukks and Scout 9”.

Why though?

I get how all the internet is aflame with trukks being super cheap, but they also do super nothing outside of tankshock and those cost valuable CP.

Putting a unit which can make use of the speed or durability into trukks, sure, but I'm not convinced that spamming trukks is actually better than spending the same amount of points on mek guns or any of the other dozen mobility options that we have.

Utility I suppose. A cheap transport can stop a unit from shooting by charging. (as long as they don't have fall back and shoot but that seems rarer these days) If the enemy doesn't apply anti tank to the truck it can charge and recharge a falling back unit all game. Throw a couple at a target, fully surround the unit and you can force them to roll for traveling through models.

**Jidmah**

cody.d. wrote:
Utility I suppose. A cheap transport can stop a unit from shooting by charging. (as long as they don't have fall back and shoot but that seems rarer these days) If the enemy doesn't apply anti tank to the truck it can charge and recharge a falling back unit all game. Throw a couple at a target, fully surround the unit and you can force them to roll for traveling through models.

Sorry, but I don't see this happening. A trukk can be shut down by any random screening unit charging it, a combat character or monster will easily tear it apart in two fight phases and it can be shot at while it is in combat with most units.
You don't even need dedicated anti-tank to kill trukks, but if they do point those big guns at them they won't stand a chance of survival. Unless you are following some sort of target saturation strategy (rigs? battlewagon? dreads?), shooting those things at trukks isn't even a bad choice over shooting them at infantry instead.

Well, and surrounding anything of value in that matter requires so many stars to align, might as well just pick a gambit and hope for 30VP because of nothing but lucky dice. We are still talking about the same game where seven to eight buggies instantly create a traffic jam on the board, trukks are no different in that regard.
I'd also wager that 200 points invested in other units would have just killed the same unit you worked so hard to surround just to have it roll five 3+ and escape unscathed.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Insularum wrote:
A mass of scouting Trukks could do some tricks worth considering though. Scouting 9" leaves the back end of the Trukk in easy range of a non scouting unit to embark. Just disembark the scout units, move other non-scouting units up and embark, then rush the fully loaded Trukks forward (along with the disembarked scouts). Finishing your Trukks move parked bumper to bumper would stop a lot of wrapping/block access to objectives.

Zodgrod's Supa-Runts are the only scout unit we have though, so a scouting trukk clocks in at 175. Two SJD which can deep-strike wherever the heck they want each turn are 170.
The only units I see gaining any benefit from those shenanigans would be flash gits or burnas, but if you add their points, you are firmly into "this could have been a morkanaut" territory.

IMO if you bring Zodgrod, you absolutely should bring 20+2 gretchin with him to get the most out of his insane buffs.

**the_scotsman**

Mainly I've just been using trukks to position my melee units I want to do damage with. Move them up out of LOS, then pile out. then yeah, they zip around doing "i'm not worth killing anymore" shenanigans as has been their role since time immemorial.

Every battewagon I was using to deliver nobz/flash gitz/MANz I've now swapped out for a trukk.

Burna Boyz are the most definitive value "actually use the trukk for more than just insulation turn 1" unit IMO. Make good use of the new disembark and shoot after moving rule, and they like the ability to hop in and zip somewhere else.

**Tomsug**

Jidmah wrote:
Tomsug wrote:
You can take 3 Kommandos incl. Zagstruk and 1 grots with Zogrod in 4 Trukks and Scout 9”.

Why though?

I get how all the internet is aflame with trukks being super cheap, but they also do super nothing outside of tankshock and those cost valuable CP.

Putting a unit which can make use of the speed or durability into trukks, sure, but I'm not convinced that spamming trukks is actually better than spending the same amount of points on mek guns or any of the other dozen mobility options that we have.

Honestly? No idea. Just surfing around and discovering the options.

Trukks can do a lot of stuff. Roadbloking in the first place.

I ´m looking at the mission cards and honestly - you need a lot of cheap units to do the stuff. Another role for the trukks.