Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

The main purpose of it is just to keep momentum. Social media has everyone chasing the new thing and people just get bored after a year or two. A consistent errata schedule helps with retention, but starts to turn off players that don't want to keep up with it, causing the game to only appeal to dedicated players.

New editions just make people feel like its new again. It gets everyone's attention and brings all the lapsed players back to try again. It's definitely not for the benefit of the rules themselves, but having seen how quick people are to declare a game "dead" without a major overhaul even after 5 years, I can't say GW is in the wrong about it.

The sonic-looking pistol is a new thing, isn't it? I remember the sonic blaster and the blastmaster - as well as the Doom Siren - but I don't recall a sonic pistol before.

 Dysartes wrote:
The sonic-looking pistol is a new thing, isn't it? I remember the sonic blaster and the blastmaster - as well as the Doom Siren - but I don't recall a sonic pistol before.

I know George Clinton of P-funk had a Bop-gun in the 70s, but yeah, dont think Noice marines had a hand gun before.

 Dark Apostle 666 wrote:
I don't have a dog in the rules discussion, but I do have a theory on the sonic weapon tanks - I reckon they are full of promethium, but only for pyrotechnic purposes. I'm imagining the full Rammstein experience with every blast

That or to just make explosions for the guns to amplify. Big booms are nothing but supersonic pressure waves after all.

 Mr_Rose wrote:

 Dark Apostle 666 wrote:
I don't have a dog in the rules discussion, but I do have a theory on the sonic weapon tanks - I reckon they are full of promethium, but only for pyrotechnic purposes. I'm imagining the full Rammstein experience with every blast

That or to just make explosions for the guns to amplify. Big booms are nothing but supersonic pressure waves after all.

If that is the idea, it's cool and I approve. Although a shame the Kakophoni lack them

Yes sir, I like it!

Nevelon wrote:It’s the churn for the sake of churn. They don’t incrementally improve things, they pound the reset button every 3 years to make you re-buy everything.

Lathe Biosas wrote:This reminds me of the comic book world, where DC and Marvel hit the cosmic reset button to draw in new fans.

Sadly, it reminds me of the sales model of printer cartridges.

One for Eldar, one for Dark Eldar - interesting.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/2c53mlkj/grotmas-calendar-day-13-santas-larger-angrier-helpers/

Many of these new detachments have looked super fun, and the Reaper's Wager is no different. I love the feel of so many of these! This is what the game needs more of.

reaper's wager is the sort of thing that makes me want to start a Drukhari army. that sounds like a lot of fun

Not the direction I expected the Asuryani detachment to go.

These new detachments are so different from everything else in 10th that I've got to wonder if person writing them is drunk? If so next round is on me because we need to keep them that way, the flavour of the game is actually back! Please keep it coming.
Next codices have a lot to live up to.

These detachments seem like fun... and that's what's been missing lately.

Everything else has that mother ing META/Tournament feel that turns me off from looking at itm

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Everything else has that mother ing META/Tournament feel that turns me off from looking at itm

The amount of upset caused by "people playing the game to win" is so comically over the top, so utterly insane and riddled with seething bitterness, that it never gets old to read. I wonder if the ultra-casual people will ever get over this absurd chip on their shoulder - they probably won't.

 blood reaper wrote:

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Everything else has that mother ing META/Tournament feel that turns me off from looking at itm

The amount of upset caused by "people playing the game to win" is so comically over the top, so utterly insane and riddled with seething bitterness, that it never gets old to read. I wonder if the ultra-casual people will ever get over this absurd chip on their shoulder - they probably won't.

I used the ork emoji as an attempt at sarcasm.

 blood reaper wrote:

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Everything else has that mother ing META/Tournament feel that turns me off from looking at itm

The amount of upset caused by "people playing the game to win" is so comically over the top, so utterly insane and riddled with seething bitterness, that it never gets old to read. I wonder if the ultra-casual people will ever get over this absurd chip on their shoulder - they probably won't.

Believe it or not, some of us ARE actually more interested in having fun than trying to win. I know people that just aren't fun to play against because even in a non-tournament setting they just seek out the most busted wombo-combos.

 BorderCountess wrote:

 blood reaper wrote:

 Lathe Biosas wrote:
Everything else has that mother ing META/Tournament feel that turns me off from looking at itm

The amount of upset caused by "people playing the game to win" is so comically over the top, so utterly insane and riddled with seething bitterness, that it never gets old to read. I wonder if the ultra-casual people will ever get over this absurd chip on their shoulder - they probably won't.

Believe it or not, some of us ARE actually more interested in having fun than trying to win. I know people that just aren't fun to play against because even in a non-tournament setting they just seek out the most busted wombo-combos.

What if people have fun by trying to win, and or bringing "busted wombo-combos"?

People have this tendency to, in an exceedingly vulgar manner, just say "The game is about having fun" - but this comment is a completely empty one. Some people have fun playing the game in certain ways. Casuals do not have a monopoly on what is and what is not fun.

This is where the pre-game conversation comes in, to try to prevent a clash of expectations.

In an ideal world, some games they dial it back a bit, and some games you dial it up a bit - equally, if you MUST WIN, there are these events where you can play with like-minded individuals, so you shouldn't need to bring that mentality to every game.

 Dysartes wrote:
This is where the pre-game conversation comes in, to try to prevent a clash of expectations.

Exactly, so imo, the casuals who seethe and gnash at teeth at the people who enjoy competitive, tight games, should instead consider learning these vital communication skills.

But even then, I'll say this now; I play to win. I do not pull punches. My regular opponents know this, and they can adjust their games around me as they see fit. My joy comes from building tight, powerful lists. I am sure someone will pipe up to say, "But that's the wrong way to play!", but if I'm having fun, how can it be wrong? You may now be able to see why this exceedingly generalised way of trying to chide competitive people with the oft quoted "the aim of the game is fun" crumbles the moment even slight pressure is applied (the next empty statement someone will pull out is but what about the spirit of the game?).

It is nice that Lathe Biosas added an ammendum of sarcasm, but it is undeniable fact there's an exceeding number of posts with the exact same tone which are made in full seriousness. "The game is about fun! Unless it's fun which doesn't fall into my very narrow definition of it..."

maybe, just maybe it would be an idea if casual players who want to have fun playing the game and not just win or lose, should look for games that actually can give that experience and not just play a game because it is the most popular tournament game out there

A looong time ago, lost in the mists of time (somewhere around 3rd or 4th edition) I had an evil army that no one enjoyed playing against.

(And my sole claim to fame was being immortalized in a TSoaLR webcomic)

It was a telephone pole armored company, where my basilisks were troops choices and my HQ was Lord Solar Macharius, who had only one rule I cared about... I go first.

It was a tournament army that my opponents hated, because no one enjoys pie plates on turn 1. And they used to give me low sportsmanship scores, because they disliked my army so much.

That honestly ticked me off. In a tournament there isn't really room for "casual" builds.

But my friends never really played against that list, unless I was tweaking it for a tournament.

They mainly played against my Gouldar. My bright yellow and Blue Iyanden Wraith army.

Which, looking back, these two armies are what led me down the path to Custodes and Knights (and now 21 Mechanicus allies)

 kodos wrote:
maybe, just maybe it would be an idea if casual players who want to have fun playing the game and not just win or lose, should look for games that actually can give that experience and not just play a game because it is the most popular tournament game out there

You mean like……40K? Because it’s been a narrative driven game long before tournaments for it existed.

The good thing? Nobody is doing it wrong.

But, when someone is trying to impose their preferred style of play? That’s when problems occur. Such as demanding every opponent adopt whatever tournament rules you’re used to, and/or demanding every game is tournament practice.

Bit of give and take? It’s all good.

Maybe we could keep the discussion related to 40k news and rumors instead of talking about whether or not casual play is the only way to have fun with the game. That kind of thing kind of needs its own thread.

 ZergSmasher wrote:
Maybe we could keep the discussion related to 40k news and rumors instead of talking about whether or not casual play is the only way to have fun with the game. That kind of thing kind of needs its own thread.

You're right we did kinda skew the thread.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

 kodos wrote:
maybe, just maybe it would be an idea if casual players who want to have fun playing the game and not just win or lose, should look for games that actually can give that experience and not just play a game because it is the most popular tournament game out there

You mean like……40K? Because it’s been a narrative driven game long before tournaments for it existed.

for example, just play 3rd Edition with 4th Edition Codices
not like there are 4 different games around with the same name, people just play all 1 version because it is the most popular one at tournaments and aren't happy with it but instead playing a different game it is the others players fault that they are not happy

Relative to most of GW's wacky prices, the Space Marine Heroes Terminators actually look almost reasonable.

Next to the Command Squad they look like a bargain

I'm really curious about the Heroes Terminators as a MTO, since those are not normal GW sprues. We've seen other round-sprue no-clipper models from GW recently, so it seems like they've taken that manufacturing in house, whereas I thought the Space Marine Heroes models were originally manufactured by MegaHouse? Not sure we've got a clear lineage there...

 Lord Damocles wrote:
Relative to most of GW's wacky prices, the Space Marine Heroes Terminators actually look almost reasonable.

Next to the Command Squad they look like a bargain

The terminators were a nice surprise, but the three characters really bloat the price of the command squad.

Santtu wrote:

 Lord Damocles wrote:
Relative to most of GW's wacky prices, the Space Marine Heroes Terminators actually look almost reasonable.

Next to the Command Squad they look like a bargain

The terminators were a nice surprise, but the three characters really bloat the price of the command squad.

Exactly, its the ancient command squad +captain +chaplain +librarian, and rather cool characters. Considering prises for single charcters these days...
Im mostly confused because i thought they removed these models juat a few months ago?

 Fayric wrote:

Santtu wrote:

 Lord Damocles wrote:
Relative to most of GW's wacky prices, the Space Marine Heroes Terminators actually look almost reasonable.

Next to the Command Squad they look like a bargain

The terminators were a nice surprise, but the three characters really bloat the price of the command squad.

Exactly, its the ancient command squad +captain +chaplain +librarian, and rather cool characters. Considering prises for single charcters these days...
Im mostly confused because i thought they removed these models juat a few months ago?

I think they did that kind of stuff a couple of times lately. IIRC ork characters were thrown out of the codex only to feature in a mto shortly after. In general not the worst approach to catch people that always had those miniatures on their list but just missed the point when they went oop. Personally hoping they'll do that with some of the Middleearth stuff they just took out of the game...