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 Easy E wrote:
I am also curious how much of a K47 army can just be other generic WWII minis?

That remains to be seen. In the current edition, you could easily field an entire army of standard WW2 units, though stats weren't included for every unit in Bolt Action.

I assume the same be true in this edition, but what the designers have said does seem to indicate the game will emphasize the Weird things and characters.

I wouldn't be surprised if all-historical armies find themselves at a disadvantage but I have no proof in that regard.

 Eilif wrote:

 Easy E wrote:
I am also curious how much of a K47 army can just be other generic WWII minis?

That remains to be seen. In the current edition, you could easily field an entire army of standard WW2 units, though stats weren't included for every unit in Bolt Action.

I assume the same be true in this edition, but what the designers have said does seem to indicate the game will emphasize the Weird things and characters.

I wouldn't be surprised if all-historical armies find themselves at a disadvantage but I have no proof in that regard.

They will likely be at a big disadvantage, they mentioned that the Konflikt specific units will generate some form of extra order dice to encourage using them.

I will wait to see the final product before passing too hard of a judgement, but that made me quite a bit less interested.

 NH Gunsmith wrote:

 Eilif wrote:

 Easy E wrote:
I am also curious how much of a K47 army can just be other generic WWII minis?

That remains to be seen. In the current edition, you could easily field an entire army of standard WW2 units, though stats weren't included for every unit in Bolt Action.

I assume the same be true in this edition, but what the designers have said does seem to indicate the game will emphasize the Weird things and characters.

I wouldn't be surprised if all-historical armies find themselves at a disadvantage but I have no proof in that regard.

They will likely be at a big disadvantage, they mentioned that the Konflikt specific units will generate some form of extra order dice to encourage using them.

I will wait to see the final product before passing too hard of a judgement, but that made me quite a bit less interested.

Personally, I like my weird war to be weird, but I'd prefer advantages of weird unit to simply be in improved stats and rules and have that reflected comparatively in their points.

This is likely a ruleset I'll be checking reviews of first before I buy. I'm still reasonably excited about it, but there's just enough going on that this is probably not a pre-order for me.

I really loved BA v1 (v2 less so, and v3 even less), but I really enjoyed K47 because we were playing BA with a few 'wierd' units thrown in.

Reading about this version, it seems that your army needs to made entirely of the 'wierd' stuff. The comment Warlord posted (shown below) pretty much put me off bothering with this version, not to mention, even more proprietary dice.
K47 v2 will be a miss from me.

 Gimgamgoo wrote:
I really loved BA v1 (v2 less so, and v3 even less),

Genuine interest, why would you say BA is getting worse?

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Gimgamgoo wrote:
I really loved BA v1 (v2 less so, and v3 even less),

Genuine interest, why would you say BA is getting worse?

Keeping it short...

v1 - Loved.

v2 - Templates came in, with micromanagement of positioning for spacing. Much preferred the random dice.

v3 - Brought in massive changes to army construction. For someone that had a complete collection of the original army lists (which was playable), it meant having to now go out and buy multiple extra HQs, multiple more troop units, just to 'allow' some of the choices. Seemed like Warlord designed it with the 'must buy more stuff' attitude. I know they need to sell stuff to keep in business, but once an army is complete, we all tend to go on and buy another army to work on anyway, so it's not like they stop selling stuff.

I know I'm in the minority about Templates, but the Army construction rules in v3 ruined it for me.

I like my Weird War to have a good mix of historical and weird stuff.

I mean, if everything is weird than nothing is weird, it is just sci-fi at that point.

Your mileage can and should vary.

 Gimgamgoo wrote:
I really loved BA v1 (v2 less so, and v3 even less), but I really enjoyed K47 because we were playing BA with a few 'wierd' units thrown in.

Reading about this version, it seems that your army needs to made entirely of the 'wierd' stuff. The comment Warlord posted (shown below) pretty much put me off bothering with this version, not to mention, even more proprietary dice.
K47 v2 will be a miss from me.

I wonder what they mean by effective though. I mean I'd expect the weird war stuff to be more lethal, tougher, or a mixture of both. That alone could be said to be more effective, even if they are pointed fairly.

 Easy E wrote:
I like my Weird War to have a good mix of historical and weird stuff.

I mean, if everything is weird than nothing is weird, it is just sci-fi at that point.

Your mileage can and should vary.

Our mileage in this case is in lock step!

 Gimgamgoo wrote:
I really loved BA v1 (v2 less so, and v3 even less), but I really enjoyed K47 because we were playing BA with a few 'wierd' units thrown in.

Reading about this version, it seems that your army needs to made entirely of the 'wierd' stuff. The comment Warlord posted (shown below) pretty much put me off bothering with this version, not to mention, even more proprietary dice.
K47 v2 will be a miss from me.

That should not be a problem if they're priced accordingly... that is, unless they make it a problem.

WG updated the US starter army pre order to include two of the new plastic Linebacker mechs instead of one.

I figure the points ceiling for this game will be slightly higher to account for taking the more expensive rift units. You can still take the cheaper historical units but your army will have a higher model count. This is one of the things I hope they go into detail about soon, how large a regular army is supposed to actually be. I wish they would tell us how many points are in the starter army sets too.

One of the things I disliked about the new Bolt Action edition was the increased model count, shift from platoon to a company style game. I do have some worries that armies in K47 will be Horus Heresy sized, I sure hope not.

 Thargrim wrote:
WG updated the US starter army pre order to include two of the new plastic Linebacker mechs instead of one.

I figure the points ceiling for this game will be slightly higher to account for taking the more expensive rift units. You can still take the cheaper historical units but your army will have a higher model count. This is one of the things I hope they go into detail about soon, how large a regular army is supposed to actually be. I wish they would tell us how many points are in the starter army sets too.

One of the things I disliked about the new Bolt Action edition was the increased model count, shift from platoon to a company style game. I do have some worries that armies in K47 will be Horus Heresy sized, I sure hope not.

If the new rules can accommodate a larger game with the same, or less time per turn, that would be a great thing in my book. Part of it was having to look things up in a poorly organized rulebook, but the current/previous version of K47 was just a bit slower and a bit smaller in scope than we would have liked.

Not to say we wanted 40k size battles, but it would have been nice to have somewhat bigger battles with more cool vehicles.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Alpharius wrote:

 Easy E wrote:
I like my Weird War to have a good mix of historical and weird stuff.

I mean, if everything is weird than nothing is weird, it is just sci-fi at that point.

Your mileage can and should vary.

Our mileage in this case is in lock step!

I feel similarly, but I don't mind if all the units are Weird if it's a weird version of something historical. For example, if all the ground troops have slightly advanced individual weapons with otherwise standard'ish gear. Or if most or all of the vehicles have advanced weapons, as long as many of the vehicles are historical vehicles. I wouldn't be as excited about all jump pack troops and mechs, though even there if it fit the Scenario...

As an example, I've got a good chunk of basic troops in my K47 Commonwealth force, They use the standard historical-based unit profiles but every one of them has a gas mask. Makes them weirder. Also a bit sinister so in the absence of an Axis opponent they could be fielded against an Allied army as 5th Column fascist traitors.

 Eilif wrote:

 Easy E wrote:
I am also curious how much of a K47 army can just be other generic WWII minis?

That remains to be seen. In the current edition, you could easily field an entire army of standard WW2 units, though stats weren't included for every unit in Bolt Action.

I assume the same be true in this edition, but what the designers have said does seem to indicate the game will emphasize the Weird things and characters.

I wouldn't be surprised if all-historical armies find themselves at a disadvantage but I have no proof in that regard.

Andy Chambers said in a previous interview that he wanted to give people a reason to pick the WW units (apparently this was not so apparent in V1). I don't think that we can necessarily infer from this that historical units are entirely losing their efficacy.

Think a big appeal of Konflikt is just having some riflemen with vaguely sci-fi gasmarks and a piece of fantastical wargear, rather than us having to have an army comprised entirely of robots & werewolves (I will be surprised if this is the case)

 Pacific wrote:


Think a big appeal of Konflikt is just having some riflemen with vaguely sci-fi gasmarks and a piece of fantastical wargear, rather than us having to have an army comprised entirely of robots & werewolves (I will be surprised if this is the case)

This is indeed what I'd like to see more of and generally the direction I've gone. Right now there seems to be a pretty stark divide between normal and weird units. Why do we not see more weird "Special weapons" or other options that can be added to a standard squad? Seems like a good way to get folks who already have more historical units to buy additional weird figures to add to their units in addition to whole new weird units.

Or just a bits kit to make your units "Weird war"
Kind of like how the 1946 Nazi troops in Wolfenstein The New Order look like "historical" SS troops except with a unique facemask, chest armour and backpack.

I will say if you are trying to get hold of existing Konflikt stock probably better to buy sooner rather than later! It is quite hard to track down outside of Warlords store itself, but I went to buy something today I had put in a shopping cart yesterday and today it is gone

Also been looking at some other ranges. Westwind do quite a good Weird War range (mech suits, werewolves etc) as well as some suitable helmet conversion bits.

West Wind"Secrets of the Third Reich" line is definitely worth looking at.

Almost my entire British army and much of my Americans are Warlord figures with heads from SOTR'S range of WWW2 head packs.

I see pre-orders have now started appearing at retailers (at least in the UK). 20% off so have seen the starter for £76, which isn't bad.

I think they have also done the same as V1 (and perhaps Bolt Action? I cant recall) of there being both a larger hardback rulebook and a smaller A5 softback in the starter set. (If so thats another bonus for the starter set, am sick of carrying lots of heavy hardbacks around with me!)

My Bolt Action starter did have the a5 size book. I kind of prefer that size for ease of play.

Also looking at the K47 book cover I think they give away the plastic kits for the other factions. The japanese ghost warrior design is new and has better detail.

Warlord Games has published a couple of lore articles:

United States:

https://warlord-community.warlordgames.com/konflikt-47-introducing-the-united-states/

Axis:

https://warlord-community.warlordgames.com/konflikt-47-introducing-the-axis/

I like that all the German monster troops, including the werewolves, have chicken feet.

 Easy E wrote:
I like my Weird War to have a good mix of historical and weird stuff.

I mean, if everything is weird than nothing is weird, it is just sci-fi at that point.

Your mileage can and should vary.

Given the fluff changes they just seem to really, really want dissuade people from putting Nazi units on the table.

Yeah, it's not so much Nazis anymore, as it is the (European) 'Axis' wholly under the control of the secret order of The Green Vault.

I think with regards to what GW and even now companies like Trench Crusade have had to go through with 'less desirable' elements of their communities, and this causing very bad PR, I absolutely don't blame Warlord for taking this route.

If you read the background release that came out yesterday about Green Vault, despite the rubbish name, this is still a shadowy group that apparently directed the nazis in WW2, all of their actions, and thinks nothing of splicing dog and human DNA, using their dead troops as zombies etc. i.e. they are not very nice guys. If this stops people with '88' tattoos or otherwise with a pendent for swastikas from playing the game, and some of those will have been attracted to a fantasy universe where the third reich persists, then it is not a bad move in my book.

 Pacific wrote:
... using their dead troops as zombies etc. i.e. they are not very nice guys.

Wait, what's wrong with recycling? Reuse people, save the planet!

 Pacific wrote:
I think with regards to what GW and even now companies like Trench Crusade have had to go through with 'less desirable' elements of their communities, and this causing very bad PR, I absolutely don't blame Warlord for taking this route.

If you read the background release that came out yesterday about Green Vault, despite the rubbish name, this is still a shadowy group that apparently directed the nazis in WW2, all of their actions, and thinks nothing of splicing dog and human DNA, using their dead troops as zombies etc. i.e. they are not very nice guys. If this stops people with '88' tattoos or otherwise with a pendent for swastikas from playing the game, and some of those will have been attracted to a fantasy universe where the third reich persists, then it is not a bad move in my book.

It won't though. Unless Warlord inscribes an arcane nazi-repellent sigil on each of their miniatures, there is nothing stopping those sorts from enjoying a bit of entertainment. Especially when Nazis still exist in universe and Warlord already said you can use your Bolt-action army with K47.
Taking the nazis out of a Weird War 2 game is just silly. What next, no nazis in Wolfenstein, because too many people thought the UberSoldats looked cool? Or maybe just ban Indiana Jones and the Ark of the Covenant. Can't have Nazis there, lest you attract the 88 crowd.

I actually think replacing the Nazis with Green Vault is pro-Nazi. Because instead of Nazis doing all of the objectively evil gak, it's now a completely separate organization that shares no iconography or command structure with them. Congrats Warlord, you basically just exonerated them by relegating the role of "evil bastard faction" elsewhere.
The name isn't even good. What are you going to call them for short? Greenies? It's just a bad change overall that misses the point of what made Wolfenstein and other Weird World 2 settings fun.

Just proves neither move by Warlord (ie, giving Nazis a shadowy overlord faction or saying, "Yes, obviously evil Nazis because this Weird War 2") will satisfy everyone. I can see how both sides can be argued.

I mean... "Evil" nazis in and of itself is funny as a term.

 Pacific wrote:
I think with regards to what GW and even now companies like Trench Crusade have had to go through with 'less desirable' elements of their communities, and this causing very bad PR, I absolutely don't blame Warlord for taking this route.

If you read the background release that came out yesterday about Green Vault, despite the rubbish name, this is still a shadowy group that apparently directed the nazis in WW2, all of their actions, and thinks nothing of splicing dog and human DNA, using their dead troops as zombies etc. i.e. they are not very nice guys. If this stops people with '88' tattoos or otherwise with a pendent for swastikas from playing the game, and some of those will have been attracted to a fantasy universe where the third reich persists, then it is not a bad move in my book.

Strongly disagree. You're never going to stop those people from playing your game and they've always been a tiny minority that the community largely dealt with ourselves by simply not playing with them until they went away or learned to stfu and behave like human beings in public. The problem is, frankly, coddling - nobody's fee-fees are allowed to be hurt nowawadays no matter how unreasonable or disproportionate their demands, and yes I'm aware how grumpy and cloud-shouty that makes me sound but it's true. I hate that the things I enjoy are getting retconned and watered down and genericised to try and appeal to people who largely didn't care about them before and largely still don't care about them after, except insofar as they can feel smug that they made your Action Men have a tea party with their Barbies and Corporate Mummy said they could so neener neener. Previously the starkest example to me is Bretonnia - the 2nd edition of the RPG put a disclaimer in the front of the sourcebook for the faction that basically mocked anyone(quite rightly) who would actually believe that depicting sexism in a fantastical world is the same as endorsing and promoting it IRL, and now with TOW they're rewriting the faction so they aren't sexist at all and putting out novels with bow-wielding ladyknights girlbossing up the place. I play fantasy and sci-fi games to *escape* reality, not attend the same HR seminars they drag you to IRL.

And dag-nabbit, when I play a WW2 game - even a Weird War one - I like blowing up *Nazis*, not Vaguely Authoritarian Mystical Secret Societies That Helped The Nazis Briefly Out Of Convenience.

If it walks like a nazi, talks like a nazi, then..?

I don't know how anyone looking at those new minis (and we have been told Werewolves, totenkorps etc are en route) can say they look like anything other than henchmen from Wolfenstein, if that is the comparator.

It doesn't matter what name Warlord comes up with to disguise it, thats quite patently what they are. What is the issue exactly of not labelling them as 'nazi' for your fantasy game (as that is what this is) if Warlord think that they can dodge a few mouth-breathers from coming to the game?

Agree Yodhrin that the community dealt with those people, but I am sure they would have rather not had to.