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As a paladin I find myself thinking some deep thoughts lately...

There are many religions, and their beliefs and practices are not compatible.

The faiths of the world cannot even agree on simple matters like what may I eat for lunch, to say nothing of the important stuff like harming others, what is harm, and what are my obligations to not harm/help others.

How can this be?

1 - Only one faith is correct. All others are screwed. Shouldn't have ordered the pork.

2 - There is no God and we're all screwed. Should've spent Sunday working on my golf game.

3 - There are many correct faiths, the differences I see are irrelevant or at least can be reconciled.

4 - God is a heckuva lot smarter than me and it all makes sense to him.

5 - God is really laid back and follows a basic 'don't hurt anyone and it's all good' rule. Course then those who follow an unusually strict religion and enforce it are in trouble for doing what their faith said is praiseworthy and we're back to option 1. Still leaves the vegetarian problem open.

If it's #1 then God is unusually cruel and harsh, especially to all those born before the age of global travel and communications. To say nothing of those born before some of those faiths were created. The Mormons have an interesting fix to that issue...

So unless the Mormons are right I'm kind of pissed.

Edit: nevermind

Not gonna touch this with a 10 ft pole....

InB4Gwar

meh, might as well...

I would think that 3 is the most sensible one. (mabye with a bit of 5 rolled in).
1 is quite plainly arrogant.
2 is fine if that's what you want
3 makes sense.
4 is just a lame excuse to avoid answering the question to be honest.
5 I think it's just like 3, except that we as human beings screwed up.

I'm not a religious person, and I have my reasons for that. I'm also open minded about the subject so if there were to be a God then my choice would be 4, the fact there are so many religions makes me believe that there would have to some underlying message that we are unaware of that all religions share.

I would suggest that it was being good to everyone and not harming one another, but considering we have wars of faith, it kinda blows that idea out the water a little. So yes, my choice is 4.


But thats only a if there were a god, otherwise my choice is 2

I personally go for option 2 - there is no god. Though in a wider context, I would want to imagine that option 5 is correct; with god being rather less uptight than most of those apparently dedicated to his name.

The golden rule in many religions is do unto others as you would have done unto you (after any rules about there is only 1 god and this is his religion, etc). So I am not sure where people are getting all this stuff about it being fine to take out anyone who does not beleive exactly the same as you do.

yeah,
Need a place to go when you die? Pay up.

I think religion was invented by evil men to control the vulnerable and the weak when they need help most.

Panic...

Kid_Kyoto wrote:As a paladin I find myself thinking some deep thoughts lately...

If it's #1 then God is unusually cruel and harsh, especially to all those born before the age of global travel and communications. To say nothing of those born before some of those faiths were created. The Mormons have an interesting fix to that issue...

So unless the Mormons are right I'm kind of pissed.

Since you bring the Mormons into it by name, I'll just say that we don't believe God throws people into a burnibg Hell or condemns them in any way if they don't get a chance to accept him. They'll get the chance after death and even then if they don't they won't be sent to a burning Hell.
It was something I could never really square myself with growing up, the thought of an all loving God creating a race of feeling, thinking creatures and then either throwing them into flames if they were in the least way didn't do what he wanted or sit in a green field somewhere as a pampered pet if they were living like he wanted. We don't really believe in a burning Hell, but an absence of any kind of glory that onlythose who have had a full and undeniable knowledge of God will be subject to. There's not a heck of a lot of people with that kind of knowledge, and in my entire life I've never met one that I know of.

To put it simply we don't believe God plays games of chance with his children.

Seeing as everyone here is into Warhammer, then if there is a ---- insert suitable deity here ----- then we will probably all burn in ---- insert suitable bad place here ---- for consorting with false gos such as Khorne and the Emperor

lol, true, except for Space Marines, pretty much every Chapter regards the Emperor as a great man and not a God IIRC, so I'm safe from ---- insert witty comment ----

hellsguardian316 wrote:lol, true, except for Space Marines, pretty much every Chapter regards the Emperor as a great man and not a God IIRC, so I'm safe from ---- insert witty comment ----

But you aren't safe from the Inquisition!

JEB_Stuart wrote:Not gonna touch this with a 10 ft pole....

Gah! You beat me to it.

I had this same dilema when I was searching for truth before I was saved.

I recomend that you actually do a comparative religion study and find out what the differences are. You will see that all religions are "basically" the same, except one. And then you will be left to ask yourself, why is that one religion different?

GG

You mean Buddhism?

It is one of the few religions with no god figure, and it promotes peace and harmony in all things, including not attempting to convert others against their will.

So there are several differences right there to virtually all other organised religions...

[Note: Not meaning to belittle your faith, or the faith of anyone else... I am just pointing out that from my point of view there is little difference between most religions, nor is there much merit in them]

SilverMK2 wrote:You mean Buddhism?

It is one of the few religions with no god figure, and it promotes peace and harmony in all things, including not attempting to convert others against their will.

So there are several differences right there to virtually all other organised religions...

[Note: Not meaning to belittle your faith, or the faith of anyone else... I am just pointing out that from my point of view there is little difference between most religions, nor is there much merit in them]

I'm not going to get into debating the differences between religions in this thread. If you noticed, I purposely avoided doing that. I am encouraging Kyoto to do that himself.

I can think of other religions that promote peace and harmony. But I can also think of practitioners of those religions that don't. There are many principles taught by a faith that many of their practitioners get wrong or don't bother to practice at all.

GG

generalgrog wrote:I'm not going to get into debating the differences between religions in this thread. If you noticed, I purposely avoided doing that. I am encouraging Kyoto to do that himself.

However, you imply that there is only one religion worth following and that all others are not as good than this single religion. You also imply that it is in some way different to other religions.

Hence my suggestion that it might be Buddhism, since that is perhaps the most unique religion that I can think of. Though I think it is probably a good idea not to start debating the differences between religions too much, as far too much of it is subjective anyway.

I can think of other religions that promote peace and harmony. But I can also think of practitioners of those religions that don't. There are many principles taught by a faith that many of their practitioners get wrong or don't bother to practice at all.

Here I agree with you entirely. Jerks come in all sizes, sexes, colours and faiths, as do heros.

Panic wrote:yeah,
Need a place to go when you die? Pay up.

I think religion was invented by evil men to control the vulnerable and the weak when they need help most.

Panic...

You're right. Jesus and Buddha were evil scumsuckers. How dare they teach those concepts of peace and love your neighbor. Bastards. Clearly they were working for the Man.

yeah,
You assume Jesus and Buddha exist/existed.

In my opinion they didn't, they are fictional characters invented by 'evil scumsuckers'.

Panic...

Panic wrote:You assume Jesus and Buddha exist/existed.

My brother-in-law is a Dr of Ancient History and he seems to think that there is quite a lot of evidence for the existance of Jesus (as a man, regardless of any superpowers he might have had). He is a non-believer as well, so I am more inclined to trust his word than I might otherwise be.

SilverMK2 wrote:

Panic wrote:You assume Jesus and Buddha exist/existed.

My brother-in-law is a Dr of Ancient History and he seems to think that there is quite a lot of evidence for the existance of Jesus (as a man, regardless of any superpowers he might have had). He is a non-believer as well, so I am more inclined to trust his word than I might otherwise be.

Not to mention non-religious records India has that Siddhārtha Gautama actually existed.

Not to mention the four Gospels, Flavius Josephus, Pliny the Younger, Tacitus, Gaius Suetonius Tranquilus, Mara Bar Sarapion. These were authors or authored by contempories or at least within a generation of Jesus. There is no "assuming" that Jesus existed. It is a historical fact.

GG

Know you not... foolish mortal.

yeah,
It's a historical fact... In your opinion.
We have people in this country with all it's record keeping that can't find out who their Great Grandfather was, or where a soldier who died 50 years ago is buried.

Historical facts have all the details of what Jesus got for his birthday, names of people he met, extensively documented discussions he held and accounts of the things he did what he had for his tea a few nights before he died? 2000 years ago....

Or is it more likely that people who make money from these gigs tell you these are facts? Finding truth for themselves and others where there is none?

in my opnion religions leaders offer no more hope of a better life than a email from a Nigerian banker.

Panic...

You're approaching this from a different standard than Grog is. You're questioning the veracity of the accounts of Jesus' life. He's simply saying that the breadth of available accounts indicates that he existed, regardless of the explicit truth of the accounts written.

For what its worth, I agree with him. This isn't some random person who can't discover who his grandparents were. This is a figure that inspired a religion with a 2000 year history. If you're going to question his existence you may as well question the existence of the Roman Emperors of the same period.

yeah,
I don't think we are approaching this from all that different a angle. I'm saying that all the evidence that indicates that Jesus ever lived is propaganda belonging/ originating from a company pushing it's product...

Panic...

No one ever asks about Bob the tailor... WHY!!! Bob the tailor was just as significant to our current interpretation of fabrics... but NOOOOOOO... no one pays attention to Bob... damn whippersnappers.

Panic wrote:yeah,
I don't think we are approaching this from all that different a angle. I'm saying that all the evidence that indicates that Jesus ever lived is propaganda belonging/ originating from a company pushing it's product...

Panic...

Pics or it didn't happen suits this just fine... yes... just fine. Retort with the assumed line of dialogue... wait for it... NOW!!! GO GO GO!!!

Wrexasaur wrote:No one ever asks about Bob the tailor... WHY!!! Bob the tailor was just as significant to our current interpretation of fabrics... but NOOOOOOO... no one pays attention to Bob... damn whippersnappers.

Panic wrote:yeah,
I don't think we are approaching this from all that different a angle. I'm saying that all the evidence that indicates that Jesus ever lived is propaganda belonging/ originating from a company pushing it's product...

Panic...

Pics or it didn't happen suits this just fine... yes... just fine. Retort with the assumed line of dialogue... wait for it... NOW!!! GO GO GO!!!

Despite your similar statements to mine you can't be my long lost brother, I mean I dealt with that situation a long time ago...er wait I said that out loud...nothing to see here...


BOB THE TAILOR, BOB FROM ACCOUNTING-IS THERE A COINCIDENCE?

Panic wrote:yeah,
I don't think we are approaching this from all that different a angle. I'm saying that all the evidence that indicates that Jesus ever lived is propaganda belonging/ originating from a company pushing it's product...

Panic...

That's not the angle you approached this from in your previous post. You can discount the veracity of any report of a person's activities without discounting the veracity of that person's existence.

I'd also be interested to know how you reconcile the existence of third party sources with your conspiracy position.

Frazz wrote:Despite your similar statements to mine you can't be my long lost brother, I mean I dealt with that situation a long time ago...er wait I said that out loud...nothing to see here...

And you thought you would never see these shoes again... WELL YOU THOUGHT WRONG PAL!!!

Dogma wrote:I'd also be interested to know how you reconcile the existence of third party sources with your conspiracy position.

DUH!!! It is waaaaay too obvious to be false.