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Can a unit that moves onto the table (seer council) still use it's powers that turn as long as they don't turbo-boost? Book says to use the powers at the start of the turn. Just curious as it came up in a game the other day. Thanks!

Well it depends if it is a psychic shooting attack or not. It it is, then you would be able to use it if you would be eligible to fire a weapon. For the other powers I'm not sure, I haven't played Eldar in ages.

Well Fortune was the power that came up.

No.

If you've moved something then it's no longer the start of the turn.

(notes: unlike WFB the turn sequence doesn't have a "start of turn" marked on it. So, you could argue that start of movment phase and start of turn are the same thing. However, once you've moved stuff on it would certainly no longer be at the start of the movement phase but during it.

So, it could be argued that you can do powers for units on the table after rolling for reserves but before bringing them on. However, I think it's safe to assume that start of turn is before the start of the movement phase - it certainly makes this clearer!)

(notes: unlike WFB the turn sequence doesn't have a "start of turn" marked on it. So, you could argue that start of movment phase and start of turn are the same thing. However, once you've moved stuff on it would certainly no longer be at the start of the movement phase but during it.

Though using this "reading" of the rules the game breaks the minute you roll for 2 units to arrive from reserve...

So either:

a) Yes they can use the power.

Or

b) No they can not but if you roll for 2 or more units to arrive from reserve in the same turn you have to abbandon the game pack up your models and go home...

The easiest way to rule the start of the turn is the period in which involuntary actions take place and (appropriate) psychic powers are used as long as you aren't going onto voluntary movement you are still able to cast the power. Arriving from reserve is a complusory movement you have to make when a unit rolls to come on from reserves and has to happen at the start of the turn before other movement. Thus using Scott-66's interpretation 2 units could not enter in the same turn yet they have to enter that turn...(hence game breaks and you have to pack up and go home).

All units in reserve are rolled for at start of movement phase. Then units are brought on, between reserve rolls being made and other movement. The game does not break if you have two to roll for.

There is no interpretation whether units entering from reserve can use a power - after a move has been completed it is no longer the start of the movement phase or the start of the turn.

There is no period defined in the rules for involuntary actions. The first step on the turn sequence chart is 1.Movement Phase. (p9) It may be a useful thing to have but it is not there. This is not WFB.
Further more, reserve rolls would not be in that phase (if it existed) because it is clearly stated that they are made at the start of the movement phase. Also note that compulsory movement does not have to happen before other movement in 40K.

1. Powers - start of turn
2. Reserve rolls - start of movement phase (may be simultaneous with 1?)
3. Moving reserves onto table - in the movement phase (cannot be simultaneous with 1, happens after an action which happens at "start of movement phase" thus movement phase is underway.)
4. Moving normal units - in the movement phase.


ETA, for reference, the 5th ed codexes have powers happening at "start of movement phase" rather than "start of turn".


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Start of Turn and Start of Movement Phase are the same thing, per the chart on p9.

Powers and Rolling for Reserve happen simultaneously.
Moving reserves on happens after rolling for reserves so it must also happen after powers.

Without the existence of this extra phase you've invented it is not possible for powers to happen either after or simultaneous with moving reserves on.

RaW, no you can't

RaI, arguable, but arbitrary

It's been brought up a couple hundred times, please search.

Couple hundred and 1. It was faster to type it then search.

BlueDagger wrote:RaW, no you can't

RaI, arguable, but arbitrary

It's been brought up a couple hundred times, please search.

Links to past threads?

Neconilis wrote:Links to past threads?

You want the video games forum.

Ithankyou.

I don't get it... D:

Also, lrn2search

It's a play on 'Link to the Past', a SNES game.

...Grumble...

Hmm, this is interesting.

I've been playing the psychic powers as they happen i.e doom test before the friendly units fire on the doomed unit or the other unit helping powers as it becomes relevant during the phase. And warlock powers althoguh not tested are done the same i.e embolden prior to testing for squad leadership when relevant etc.

Providing you don't go over the limits of use per turn does it make any difference?

Soup and a roll wrote:It's a play on 'Link to the Past', a SNES game.

...Grumble...

No we get it ... its just a really bad joke. Like "why does Barby not get pregnant?" ... which was only funny when our friend need it explained.

Tri wrote:

Soup and a roll wrote:It's a play on 'Link to the Past', a SNES game.

...Grumble...

No we get it ... its just a really bad joke. Like "why does Barby not get pregnant?" ... which was only funny when our friend need it explained.

You were saying?

And trust me, that's the nicest picture. Some of the pics... Well, they didn't scar me, since it's all scar tissue by now ANYWAY, but you get the point.

Yes it does, primarily because the rules say they are done at the start of your turn, not as and when you use them The biggest differences being if you start your turn in reserve you cant use doo/fortune/guide. Also it would allow you to move and effectivly increase the range of your powers by upto 18" if they were cast after a farseer in a serpent moved.

Vet Sgt - yes, as using it after you have moved means you can have your farseer out of danger for a turn. E.g. move 12" on jetbike, cast powers gives you FAR more felxibility than being forced to cast *before* you move.


Its the reason why Spearhead MCs are allowed to fire after running, but it MUST be *after* running, otherwise they could essentially JSJ ...

Gwar! wrote:

good lord ... worse then the dog that you feed its own doings ... "because Ken comes in another box"

It seems like something that needs to be clarified by the TO or by both players prior to the game beginning.

Cool, so i have to declare what farseer powers i'm using and where/to whom prior to rolling for reserves from now on.

I haven't been playing Eldar for long and have clearly missed the 'do it first' rule.

Warlock powers are switched on all turn though , right? i.e i use embolden for guardians and enhance for a unit like scorpions and as long as they are the same unit the powers always in use?

Tri wrote:

Gwar! wrote:

good lord ... worse then the dog that you feed its own doings ... "because Ken comes in another box"

Modqusitiion on. Focus on the topic or this thread will be closed. thanks.

whitedragon wrote:It seems like something that needs to be clarified by the TO or by both players prior to the game beginning.

No, it doesn't. It sounds like something that is 110% clear and doesn't need to be cleared up.

warlock powers are "on" 100% of the time, they never turn off, and can not be turned off until the warlock is dead.

farseer powers either are a shooting attack that takes place in the shooting phase, or they happen at the beginning of the turn.

a farseer that is not on the board (eg reserves) can not use most of their powers as models not on the table have no actions that i am aware of.

All powers (apart from mind war and eldritch storm) are rolled for before any movement is made. I'm not sure if what I do is going by 100% RaW but I find it most simple to say "This turn eldrad is using doom on that squad *roll test* and fortune on this squad *roll test* and edritch storm *roll dice*" its then clear what is going to be used and if it was successful. You don't loose track ("did I cast 3 powers already or can I guide these guys too?"). If your farseer isnt on the board when you do all this (in reserve) it will be obvious if you have to sort out their powers.

Nor can you Turbo Boost after using any powers, since Turbo Boost means no other voluntary actions.

Gwar! wrote:Nor can you Turbo Boost after using any powers, since Turbo Boost means no other voluntary actions.

Cool. that makes sense as the riders concentrating on going fast!



Thanks guys, that clarifies a couple of things for me

Gwar! wrote:

whitedragon wrote:It seems like something that needs to be clarified by the TO or by both players prior to the game beginning.

No, it doesn't. It sounds like something that is 110% clear and doesn't need to be cleared up.

It is not 110% clear. Eldar psychic powers are cast at the beginning of the turn, and Reserves are rolled at the beginning of the turn. Howevever, one beginning is not before or after or even dependant of the other, so which one can or can't be done first, last, concurrently, consecutively or what? The rules do not say, hence this is a grey area.

Its irrelevant, as models off the table cant perform actions, and models off the board cant be effected by actions of models on the board.

kill dem stunties wrote:Its irrelevant, as models off the table cant perform actions, and models off the board cant be effected by actions of models on the board.

It's very relevant.

If both reserves and psychic powers (at the start of the turn) are consecutive, then they would be able to do both. The rules don't tell us either way which happens first.

Except it does, as it tells you that moving on from reserves happens immediately - you *cannot* perform any other actions that movement phase before moving units on the board.

In addition how are you measuring to unit s when you are off the board? You have no rules that let you do so.