Valkyrie wrote: I'm struggling to understand where everyone got the idea that the Silent King will be released. I've seen the vid and I'm getting the vibes of something big, but my gut feeling is that it'll just be the proper announcement and overview of the new Szeras model, perhaps another infantry kit, possible even Pariahs, but not the Silent King.
Really? It's a video about the Silent King and him returning and you are wondering where people get the idea that he will be released?
More in that, in my opinion, the Silent King is never explicitly mentioned. They use the term "king", but that could refer to any of the Necron dynasties, not necessarily the Silent King. That, and with the fact that this seems so completely out of the blue, I'm sceptical that they'd drop something like this so suddenly.
The rulers of Dynasties are called Phaerons, not Kings. So no, it would not really refer to any dynasty. Not to mention, there is no individual dynasty that gave the people immortality, the Silent King did.
The opening clip even has him sitting with his two advisors to form the Triarch.
You don't even need to have a deep understand of Necron lore to know this clip is clearly about the Silent King. At this point I have to think you are being intentionally obtuse about it.
Well guess you're mistaken. I'm not being intentionally obtuse, my knowledge of Necron fluff is limited and I was just a bit skeptical.
It's fair to be completely skeptical of what kind of release this will entail. No one really knows, and while I'd be pretty shocked if we did not get a model for the Silent King is is possible. The event and release could encompass many things or little things.
However, the individual in the trailer is very clearly the Silent King, to the point where the only thing they could add to make it more obvious is to call him by that or his real name. So saying things like you struggle to understand where people are getting the Idea that people are thinking the Silent King will be released is going to raise some eyebrows.
TBH, it would just be cool if they did generic models for marines and did a established but less well known chapter as the paint scheme, like the death spectres or something.
TBH, it would just be cool if they did generic models for marines and did a established but less well known chapter as the paint scheme, like the death spectres or something.
Basically the King who united the Necron Dynasties under one banner. He awoke and instead of uniting them all again he headed off on a barge with some escorts into the deep black of infinite space outside of the Galaxy. Apparently he saw something there that scared him and send him reeling back to the Galaxy with the overall objective of uniting the awakening Necron Dynasties into a single fighting force instead of competing Dynastic groups.
It's generally believed that what he saw was more Tyranids and perhaps something even more sinister and deadly than they've thrown at the Galaxy thus far. Thus making him fearful enough to need to return and unite his people to stand against them.
Valkyrie wrote: I'm struggling to understand where everyone got the idea that the Silent King will be released. I've seen the vid and I'm getting the vibes of something big, but my gut feeling is that it'll just be the proper announcement and overview of the new Szeras model, perhaps another infantry kit, possible even Pariahs, but not the Silent King.
Really? It's a video about the Silent King and him returning and you are wondering where people get the idea that he will be released?
More in that, in my opinion, the Silent King is never explicitly mentioned. They use the term "king", but that could refer to any of the Necron dynasties, not necessarily the Silent King. That, and with the fact that this seems so completely out of the blue, I'm sceptical that they'd drop something like this so suddenly.
The rulers of Dynasties are called Phaerons, not Kings. So no, it would not really refer to any dynasty. Not to mention, there is no individual dynasty that gave the people immortality, the Silent King did.
The opening clip even has him sitting with his two advisors to form the Triarch.
You don't even need to have a deep understand of Necron lore to know this clip is clearly about the Silent King. At this point I have to think you are being intentionally obtuse about it.
Well hold on now. King > Lion King > Lionel Johnson. Also all the hieroglyphs were carved on rock. Lionel Johnson is on the Dark Angel's ship, which is the ROCK.
It was really about Lionel Johnson returning just confirmed it.
Valkyrie wrote: I'm struggling to understand where everyone got the idea that the Silent King will be released. I've seen the vid and I'm getting the vibes of something big, but my gut feeling is that it'll just be the proper announcement and overview of the new Szeras model, perhaps another infantry kit, possible even Pariahs, but not the Silent King.
Really? It's a video about the Silent King and him returning and you are wondering where people get the idea that he will be released?
More in that, in my opinion, the Silent King is never explicitly mentioned. They use the term "king", but that could refer to any of the Necron dynasties, not necessarily the Silent King. That, and with the fact that this seems so completely out of the blue, I'm sceptical that they'd drop something like this so suddenly.
The rulers of Dynasties are called Phaerons, not Kings. So no, it would not really refer to any dynasty. Not to mention, there is no individual dynasty that gave the people immortality, the Silent King did.
The opening clip even has him sitting with his two advisors to form the Triarch.
You don't even need to have a deep understand of Necron lore to know this clip is clearly about the Silent King. At this point I have to think you are being intentionally obtuse about it.
Well hold on now. King > Lion King > Lionel Johnson. Also all the hieroglyphs were carved on rock. Lionel Johnson is on the Dark Angel's ship, which is the ROCK.
It was really about Lionel Johnson returning just confirmed it.
I mean... I've seen people use more twisted l;ogic.
Basically the King who united the Necron Dynasties under one banner. He awoke and instead of uniting them all again he headed off on a barge with some escorts into the deep black of infinite space outside of the Galaxy. Apparently he saw something there that scared him and send him reeling back to the Galaxy with the overall objective of uniting the awakening Necron Dynasties into a single fighting force instead of competing Dynastic groups.
It's generally believed that what he saw was more Tyranids and perhaps something even more sinister and deadly than they've thrown at the Galaxy thus far. Thus making him fearful enough to need to return and unite his people to stand against them.
He saw some zoats and decided he wants none of that..
Basically the King who united the Necron Dynasties under one banner. He awoke and instead of uniting them all again he headed off on a barge with some escorts into the deep black of infinite space outside of the Galaxy. Apparently he saw something there that scared him and send him reeling back to the Galaxy with the overall objective of uniting the awakening Necron Dynasties into a single fighting force instead of competing Dynastic groups.
It's generally believed that what he saw was more Tyranids and perhaps something even more sinister and deadly than they've thrown at the Galaxy thus far. Thus making him fearful enough to need to return and unite his people to stand against them.
Valkyrie wrote: I'm struggling to understand where everyone got the idea that the Silent King will be released. I've seen the vid and I'm getting the vibes of something big, but my gut feeling is that it'll just be the proper announcement and overview of the new Szeras model, perhaps another infantry kit, possible even Pariahs, but not the Silent King.
Really? It's a video about the Silent King and him returning and you are wondering where people get the idea that he will be released?
More in that, in my opinion, the Silent King is never explicitly mentioned. They use the term "king", but that could refer to any of the Necron dynasties, not necessarily the Silent King. That, and with the fact that this seems so completely out of the blue, I'm sceptical that they'd drop something like this so suddenly.
The rulers of Dynasties are called Phaerons, not Kings. So no, it would not really refer to any dynasty. Not to mention, there is no individual dynasty that gave the people immortality, the Silent King did.
The opening clip even has him sitting with his two advisors to form the Triarch.
You don't even need to have a deep understand of Necron lore to know this clip is clearly about the Silent King. At this point I have to think you are being intentionally obtuse about it.
Well hold on now. King > Lion King > Lionel Johnson. Also all the hieroglyphs were carved on rock. Lionel Johnson is on the Dark Angel's ship, which is the ROCK.
It was really about Lionel Johnson returning just confirmed it.
I mean... I've seen people use more twisted l;ogic.
Like those arguing this will be a reveal of 9th? Or those pushing for the consolidation of army books? Or those that thought blowing up an established game world rather than fixing bad corporate practises was a good idea?
Valkyrie wrote: I'm struggling to understand where everyone got the idea that the Silent King will be released. I've seen the vid and I'm getting the vibes of something big, but my gut feeling is that it'll just be the proper announcement and overview of the new Szeras model, perhaps another infantry kit, possible even Pariahs, but not the Silent King.
Really? It's a video about the Silent King and him returning and you are wondering where people get the idea that he will be released?
More in that, in my opinion, the Silent King is never explicitly mentioned. They use the term "king", but that could refer to any of the Necron dynasties, not necessarily the Silent King. That, and with the fact that this seems so completely out of the blue, I'm sceptical that they'd drop something like this so suddenly.
The rulers of Dynasties are called Phaerons, not Kings. So no, it would not really refer to any dynasty. Not to mention, there is no individual dynasty that gave the people immortality, the Silent King did.
The opening clip even has him sitting with his two advisors to form the Triarch.
You don't even need to have a deep understand of Necron lore to know this clip is clearly about the Silent King. At this point I have to think you are being intentionally obtuse about it.
Well hold on now. King > Lion King > Lionel Johnson. Also all the hieroglyphs were carved on rock. Lionel Johnson is on the Dark Angel's ship, which is the ROCK.
It was really about Lionel Johnson returning just confirmed it.
I mean... I've seen people use more twisted l;ogic.
Like those arguing this will be a reveal of 9th? Or those pushing for the consolidation of army books? Or those that thought blowing up an established game world rather than fixing bad corporate practises was a good idea?
A reveal of 9th is hardly crazy when you consider the rulebook has 3 years of tweaks, erratas and faqs to roll into it. Even if they reprint the rulebook with no other changes than including all the FAQ's it'd be enough of a change to call it a revised/new edition.
Basically the King who united the Necron Dynasties under one banner. He awoke and instead of uniting them all again he headed off on a barge with some escorts into the deep black of infinite space outside of the Galaxy. Apparently he saw something there that scared him and send him reeling back to the Galaxy with the overall objective of uniting the awakening Necron Dynasties into a single fighting force instead of competing Dynastic groups.
It's generally believed that what he saw was more Tyranids and perhaps something even more sinister and deadly than they've thrown at the Galaxy thus far. Thus making him fearful enough to need to return and unite his people to stand against them.
Not quite, needs a bit of clarification.
The Silent King is a Necrontyr rank, the leader of their civilisation alongside two others, who collectively formed The Triarch.
The one returning is the last Silent King. The one who struck/authorised the bargain with the C’Tan, that lead to biotransference. During that period, every single Necrontyr was forcibly converted, to provide a fully militarised race with which to fight The Old Ones. And it worked, the Old Ones lost the war.
Part of the deal, alongside nobles getting better bodies and more seamless transference, was a control programme. With that, The Silent King held absolute power. No Necron could disobey him.
War won, he saw what had become of his people - what he had done. That’s when they struck against the C’Tan, shattering them into fragments (it’s unclear if they definitely got all of them though).
With that final task done, he destroyed his control programme/protocol, and headed off into the intergalactic void as penance for having so utterly failed his people. Millions of years later, he encountered something out there, and saw its threat. So he headed back home.
I can’t recall if it’s explicitly the Tyranid race he saw, or if it’s just heavily implied. Either way, whatever it is has galactic extinction potential. Sure, Necrons would probably survive it, but with absolutely no hope of ever reversing bio-transference. Hence his return.
Valkyrie wrote: I'm struggling to understand where everyone got the idea that the Silent King will be released. I've seen the vid and I'm getting the vibes of something big, but my gut feeling is that it'll just be the proper announcement and overview of the new Szeras model, perhaps another infantry kit, possible even Pariahs, but not the Silent King.
Really? It's a video about the Silent King and him returning and you are wondering where people get the idea that he will be released?
More in that, in my opinion, the Silent King is never explicitly mentioned. They use the term "king", but that could refer to any of the Necron dynasties, not necessarily the Silent King. That, and with the fact that this seems so completely out of the blue, I'm sceptical that they'd drop something like this so suddenly.
The rulers of Dynasties are called Phaerons, not Kings. So no, it would not really refer to any dynasty. Not to mention, there is no individual dynasty that gave the people immortality, the Silent King did.
The opening clip even has him sitting with his two advisors to form the Triarch.
You don't even need to have a deep understand of Necron lore to know this clip is clearly about the Silent King. At this point I have to think you are being intentionally obtuse about it.
Well hold on now. King > Lion King > Lionel Johnson. Also all the hieroglyphs were carved on rock. Lionel Johnson is on the Dark Angel's ship, which is the ROCK.
It was really about Lionel Johnson returning just confirmed it.
I mean... I've seen people use more twisted l;ogic.
Like those arguing this will be a reveal of 9th? Or those pushing for the consolidation of army books? Or those that thought blowing up an established game world rather than fixing bad corporate practises was a good idea?
A reveal of 9th is hardly crazy when you consider the rulebook has 3 years of tweaks, erratas and faqs to roll into it. Even if they reprint the rulebook with no other changes than including all the FAQ's it'd be enough of a change to call it a revised/new edition.
Well, it would certainly qualify more as a "new" edition than csm II.
Could you imagine somthing so terrifying that the Tyranids and Necrons fear it?! If they ever imply in the fluff that “somthing” out there could cause the Tyranids to feel cornered enough in this galaxy to ally with the other races against it I may just lose it! In a good way or bad I’m still not sure! It too over the top to contemplate until more if ever is revealed. Ok conspiracy rant done
Basically the King who united the Necron Dynasties under one banner. He awoke and instead of uniting them all again he headed off on a barge with some escorts into the deep black of infinite space outside of the Galaxy. Apparently he saw something there that scared him and send him reeling back to the Galaxy with the overall objective of uniting the awakening Necron Dynasties into a single fighting force instead of competing Dynastic groups.
It's generally believed that what he saw was more Tyranids and perhaps something even more sinister and deadly than they've thrown at the Galaxy thus far. Thus making him fearful enough to need to return and unite his people to stand against them.
Not quite, needs a bit of clarification.
The Silent King is a Necrontyr rank, the leader of their civilisation alongside two others, who collectively formed The Triarch.
The one returning is the last Silent King. The one who struck/authorised the bargain with the C’Tan, that lead to biotransference. During that period, every single Necrontyr was forcibly converted, to provide a fully militarised race with which to fight The Old Ones. And it worked, the Old Ones lost the war.
Part of the deal, alongside nobles getting better bodies and more seamless transference, was a control programme. With that, The Silent King held absolute power. No Necron could disobey him.
War won, he saw what had become of his people - what he had done. That’s when they struck against the C’Tan, shattering them into fragments (it’s unclear if they definitely got all of them though).
With that final task done, he destroyed his control programme/protocol, and headed off into the intergalactic void as penance for having so utterly failed his people. Millions of years later, he encountered something out there, and saw its threat. So he headed back home.
I can’t recall if it’s explicitly the Tyranid race he saw, or if it’s just heavily implied. Either way, whatever it is has galactic extinction potential. Sure, Necrons would probably survive it, but with absolutely no hope of ever reversing bio-transference. Hence his return.
Thank you for posting this, I've seen so many people rambling about the Silent King without actually never having read anything about Necron lore.
John D Law wrote: Could you imagine somthing so terrifying that the Tyranids and Necrons fear it?! If they ever imply in the fluff that “somthing” out there could cause the Tyranids to feel cornered enough in this galaxy to ally with the other races against it I may just lose it! In a good way or bad I’m still not sure! It too over the top to contemplate until more if ever is revealed. Ok conspiracy rant done
A new Matt Ward penned 9th edition Grey Knight and Blood Angels codex sanctioned by Kirby
I like the idea that the current tyranid fleets are really just advanced scouts softening up the galaxy ready for the full hive fleets. Maybe Szarek saw the full might of the tyranid hive fleets and has come back to unite the necron Dynasties against it. Would be a cool reason to create a bunch of new tyranid units too!
If we indeed get the Silent King it will just be a more pompous overlord or one on a special barge.No, I want pariahs - the old human cyborg hybrids that we had pre 5th. I could use lychguard but it's not the same... C'mon pariahs!
Yeah, GW is great at screwing up rules of new big models, see ghaz. I second that the silent king, if he gets a new model, will be a big disappointment. Just like szeras, judging from what has been shown.
p5freak wrote: Yeah, GW is great at screwing up rules of new big models, see ghaz. I second that the silent king, if he gets a new model, will be a big disappointment. Just like szeras, judging from what has been shown.
Show your work. Why do you think Szeras is going to be disappointing?
Basically the King who united the Necron Dynasties under one banner. He awoke and instead of uniting them all again he headed off on a barge with some escorts into the deep black of infinite space outside of the Galaxy. Apparently he saw something there that scared him and send him reeling back to the Galaxy with the overall objective of uniting the awakening Necron Dynasties into a single fighting force instead of competing Dynastic groups.
It's generally believed that what he saw was more Tyranids and perhaps something even more sinister and deadly than they've thrown at the Galaxy thus far. Thus making him fearful enough to need to return and unite his people to stand against them.
Not quite, needs a bit of clarification.
The Silent King is a Necrontyr rank, the leader of their civilisation alongside two others, who collectively formed The Triarch.
The one returning is the last Silent King. The one who struck/authorised the bargain with the C’Tan, that lead to biotransference. During that period, every single Necrontyr was forcibly converted, to provide a fully militarised race with which to fight The Old Ones. And it worked, the Old Ones lost the war.
Part of the deal, alongside nobles getting better bodies and more seamless transference, was a control programme. With that, The Silent King held absolute power. No Necron could disobey him.
War won, he saw what had become of his people - what he had done. That’s when they struck against the C’Tan, shattering them into fragments (it’s unclear if they definitely got all of them though).
With that final task done, he destroyed his control programme/protocol, and headed off into the intergalactic void as penance for having so utterly failed his people. Millions of years later, he encountered something out there, and saw its threat. So he headed back home.
I can’t recall if it’s explicitly the Tyranid race he saw, or if it’s just heavily implied. Either way, whatever it is has galactic extinction potential. Sure, Necrons would probably survive it, but with absolutely no hope of ever reversing bio-transference. Hence his return.
Thank you for posting this, I've seen so many people rambling about the Silent King without actually never having read anything about Necron lore.
Seconded. Brilliantly concise summary.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Necronmaniac05 wrote: I like the idea that the current tyranid fleets are really just advanced scouts softening up the galaxy ready for the full hive fleets. Maybe Szarek saw the full might of the tyranid hive fleets and has come back to unite the necron Dynasties against it. Would be a cool reason to create a bunch of new tyranid units too!
What currently stops you from playing a game with removed or limited command points and "Freebies"? Certainly seems like stuff like detachment-wide rules, stratagems and whatnot would be perfectly easy to play without. The game does not need them to function.
This is like me saying that I wish GW would design the game to allow me to play ITC missions. I can currently play ITC missions. Many do. Why do I need GW to tell me I can? GW currently tells people they can play Open Play, and next to nobody chooses to. I would hazard to bet that ITC, while not endorsed by GW officially, is less popular than GW-endorsed Open Play.
My point is that GW already owns the ideas necessary for a rules system that affords multiple ways to play at different levels of realism and organization, I want to say sort of GURPS style.
What stops me? Nothing - but it would be great if I could say "Hey <person I have not met before, or members of gaming group Alpha Bravo, or ...>, for our <pick-up game, league games, tourney, etc> can we use the advanced rules on terrain and cover from pages N, M, and O. And, I like to use the force org charts described on pages PQ and RS? What do you think?"
Easier than "Hey <whoever>, GW rules are stoopid <insert picture of Baneblade poking a corner from behind a rock and shooting all guns as if with clear line of sight>. Let's do this <baneblade cannot see to shoot, but can be targetted, and when shot at we should use a damage allocation table as in earlier editions to see if the front track is hit; if the Baneblade is hit, then front track that is visible is hit if the roll on damage allocation table indicates that tracks are damaged, or... >. Whatcha think?"
The so-called theory "Tyranids are running away from something far worse" doesn't exist.
The Horus Heresy novel "Pharos" explicitly states at the end of the book that Tyranids were attracted to the Milky Way when loyalists destroyed an ancient xeno-artifact to prevent the Night Lords from conquering it.
This xeno-artifact (also confirmed in a recent novel to be a Necron construct) known as the Pharos was some kind of weird reversed Astronomicon (the Astronomicon is a lighthouse while the Pharos was more like a lantern). The Necron were using it to harnass psychic energy to aid in navigation.
When it was overloaded by the loyalists and destroyed, the Pharos produced for a very very brief time a gigantic amount of psychic energy.
This psychic energy went beyond the Milky Way, in the void, where "great behemoths of the deep were lurking". The Tyranids noticed it and identified the Milky Way as a source of preys and then shifted their course.
This is the end of the Pharos novel :
Spoiler:
Far beyond the fringes of the galaxy there was naught but endless black. Past the last few stray stars plying their lonely track through the cold night, past the dead worlds and the fragments of galactic collisions billions of years gone, past the probes sent out by extinct races recorded in no history…
past all that and beyond, there was a night sea studded with the diamond islands of distant, lonely galaxies.
Though incomprehensibly vast, this sea was not empty. Great behemoths of the deep lurked there.
Into the eternal blackness, a flash of quantum energy shone out at many times the speed of light; a brief flare, milliseconds in duration, projecting from an unremarkable spiral of stars.
It was not missed.
In the darkness, something of limitless hunger stirred in a slumber that had lasted for aeons. A million frozen and unblinking eyes saw the flash, tripping cascades of stimuli.
Their purpose served, the eyes died. The entity processed the message the eyes provided without ever truly awakening.
Automatically, instinctively, its gargantuan, dreaming mind analysed the signal, comparing it against all parameters for the one thing it sought.
Prey.
Slowly, glacially, the Great Devourer shifted its course.
JSG wrote: Remember the BT ships in the first PA trailer and the BT in the background of the last one? Maybe they are finally gonna get some attention again.
Yeah, it all sounds more and more Black Templar-ish to me. There are not many chapters who believe in the God-Emperor as a divinity.
Seems that every teaser image is very faith in the emp related, which kinda steers away a bit from marines...
Marines inflict suffering, armour is their armour not faith.
I'm wondering if there is gonna be some crazy imperial extreme religious divide like ynnari. If you think about it all this citrix maledictum stuff kicked off more or less when Bob showed back up again with all his reason and logic, must be an undercurrent of zealots about to kick off in the imperium... would be cool.
edit: Now i flesh it out more in my head its too grim dark for they way GW is taking the 40k fluff.
Don't they all sort of link to the forces in Pariah? Inquisition, Sisters and Necrons? Maybe Pariah is the precursor to the new starter [sisters vs Necrons?] and the next phase of 40k ..Plus wasn't the conclusion of Blackstone Fortress supposed to have implications for 40k?
Im suspicious of the teaser quote that said they are "raised to believe that the God-Emperor watches over us all".
Sounds bitter, and a true believer would probably not see it as something they are just raised to believe.
Might be the friday quote end it with something like "but we now know it is all lies".
However, I admit Im just trying desperatly to cling to the hope of Traitor Guard
I always liked the "Tyranids are running from something worse" theory. I like it even more because they've never ever explained it, whether they be running or just the vanguards or a truly enormous galaxy-spanning (or bigger) fleet, or whatever. The origins of the 'Nids should forever be secret. What I'm trying to say is that I hope Cawl didn't create them by accident.
Selfcontrol wrote: The Horus Heresy novel "Pharos" explicitly states at the end of the book that Tyranids were attracted to the Milky Way when loyalists destroyed an ancient xeno-artifact to prevent the Night Lords from conquering it.
And is easily one of the dumbest "revelations" from the HH novels. BL couldn't have picked a better way to shrink the universe further.
Right up there with the tragedy of Fulgrim being all "Psyke! I'm totally evil and I conquered the daemon which stole my body and locked me inside his former daemon sword. I don't feel bad about lopping of Ferrus' head at all! Let's go kill the Emperor!".
They really needed a plan for those books... one that didn't involve dozens and dozens and dozens of titles.
To me it just reads as Black Templars being in the new starter box, along with Not!EndlessSpells with a divine theme, particularly when manifestations that could coincidentally work as models were described in Faith & Fury's fluff.
p5freak wrote: Yeah, GW is great at screwing up rules of new big models, see ghaz. I second that the silent king, if he gets a new model, will be a big disappointment. Just like szeras, judging from what has been shown.
Show your work. Why do you think Szeras is going to be disappointing?
Don't they all sort of link to the forces in Pariah? Inquisition, Sisters and Necrons? Maybe Pariah is the precursor to the new starter [sisters vs Necrons?] and the next phase of 40k ..Plus wasn't the conclusion of Blackstone Fortress supposed to have implications for 40k?
Could be something to this.
Sisters - Even in the face of death we shall not submit. Suffering is our prayer. Faith is our armour
Black Templars - We must not falter, We are his sword, We are his wrath
INQ - We are raised to believe the god-emperor watches over us, so we are charged to cleanse the mutant, the heretic, the alien (from the last reveal we know there is a new INQ model)
Necrons - In the darkness between the starts the weak and the faithless find no deliverance... - least one that makes sense
John D Law wrote: Could you imagine somthing so terrifying that the Tyranids and Necrons fear it?! If they ever imply in the fluff that “somthing” out there could cause the Tyranids to feel cornered enough in this galaxy to ally with the other races against it I may just lose it! In a good way or bad I’m still not sure! It too over the top to contemplate until more if ever is revealed. Ok conspiracy rant done
My Little Pony faction confirmed.
Tho, at this point, I might prefer it to plus sized Black Templars.
Well starter sets always have marines so if this is related to starter sets it lends to possibility of black templars being the marines of 9th ed box set(like in 3rd ed). They are one of the few chapters who would treat emperor as god.
Of course it could be non-starter set related quote as well.
I'm beginning to think this may be another battlebox rather than a starter set. Depending on the size of the Silent King model (assuming there is one) it could easily be something similar to Prophecy of the Wolf. Possibly vs. Primaris Black Templars.
tneva82 wrote: Well starter sets always have marines so if this is related to starter sets it lends to possibility of black templars being the marines of 9th ed box set(like in 3rd ed). They are one of the few chapters who would treat emperor as god.
Of course it could be non-starter set related quote as well.
Just wanna note how obnoxious it is to me that a bunch of coolboy edgy atheists have spontaneously created a situation where they don't want their marines to be religious because religion bad, so like 95% of space marines are monastic orders of explicitly brainwashed super-soldiers who live in a technobarbaric theocracy... but they don't believe the emperor is a GOD you guize theyre totes cool science based atheist skeptics!
.....
....ignore the fact that gods are REAL in this universe and also that sisters of battle exist, a faction that worships the emperor as a god and the emperor gives their units holy protection occasionally and summons reincarnated winged saints with flaming swords to answer their prayers in battle.
So because of these cool atheist bros marines are just stupid and believing things in spite of evidence, except they're doing it in the opposite way that religious extremists in our world do. They're skeptical extremists!
What? Space Marines have never treated the emperor as a God... I mean... thats what all the fuss with Word Bearers in the horus heresy was about. Space Marine chapters are all about their own cultures, thats what their Chaplains are for.
Valkyrie wrote: I'm struggling to understand where everyone got the idea that the Silent King will be released. I've seen the vid and I'm getting the vibes of something big, but my gut feeling is that it'll just be the proper announcement and overview of the new Szeras model, perhaps another infantry kit, possible even Pariahs, but not the Silent King.
Really? It's a video about the Silent King and him returning and you are wondering where people get the idea that he will be released?
More in that, in my opinion, the Silent King is never explicitly mentioned. They use the term "king", but that could refer to any of the Necron dynasties, not necessarily the Silent King. That, and with the fact that this seems so completely out of the blue, I'm sceptical that they'd drop something like this so suddenly.
The rulers of Dynasties are called Phaerons, not Kings. So no, it would not really refer to any dynasty. Not to mention, there is no individual dynasty that gave the people immortality, the Silent King did.
The opening clip even has him sitting with his two advisors to form the Triarch.
You don't even need to have a deep understand of Necron lore to know this clip is clearly about the Silent King. At this point I have to think you are being intentionally obtuse about it.
Well hold on now. King > Lion King > Lionel Johnson. Also all the hieroglyphs were carved on rock. Lionel Johnson is on the Dark Angel's ship, which is the ROCK.
It was really about Lionel Johnson returning just confirmed it.
I mean... I've seen people use more twisted l;ogic.
Surely you remember the people here not accepting what's in front of them and thinking the rumor was Lionel returning, though I forget what the particular result was.
p5freak wrote: Yeah, GW is great at screwing up rules of new big models, see ghaz. I second that the silent king, if he gets a new model, will be a big disappointment. Just like szeras, judging from what has been shown.
Show your work. Why do you think Szeras is going to be disappointing?
I said judging from the preview, they have shown szeras empyric overcharger ability, which will most certainly never go off. Maybe in 1/100 games. But thats just one ability, maybe i will be pleasantly surprised by his other rules, or stats. Also, because of xenos, especially necrons, their HQ choices are mostly overpriced taxes, with little use.
So the blurbs so far do indeed feel like they are the contents of Pariah, which is the closing act of PA. This could possibly mean that the blurb tomorrow gives a clue for what is the next chapter in 40K, which would be revealed on Saturday. It's a possibility that the end of PA is the big set-up for this next chapter. There may be a battle box for Pariah with what has been mentioned, but I doubt that is the big reveal. I assume that will mostly be for the direction of 40K for next 2-3 years. New edition? Possibly, new campaign series? Also possible. Obviously the Silent King returning is a big deal, but how much that will influence the next saga I'm not sure.
We have seen that blurry image of marine bikes/speeders, and the only way you'd see both Ultras and BAs in one place would be a rulebook or campaign book, otherwise it would be just one or the other.
I think a new edition or reboot is likely soon just because of the sheer bloat of 8th currently. Some consolidation is necessary.
Just wanna note how obnoxious it is to me that a bunch of coolboy edgy atheists have spontaneously created a situation where they don't want their marines to be religious because religion bad, so like 95% of space marines are monastic orders of explicitly brainwashed super-soldiers who live in a technobarbaric theocracy... but they don't believe the emperor is a GOD you guize theyre totes cool science based atheist skeptics!
.....
....ignore the fact that gods are REAL in this universe and also that sisters of battle exist, a faction that worships the emperor as a god and the emperor gives their units holy protection occasionally and summons reincarnated winged saints with flaming swords to answer their prayers in battle.
So because of these cool atheist bros marines are just stupid and believing things in spite of evidence, except they're doing it in the opposite way that religious extremists in our world do. They're skeptical extremists!
Just wanna note how obnoxious it is to me that a bunch of coolboy edgy atheists have spontaneously created a situation where they don't want their marines to be religious because religion bad, so like 95% of space marines are monastic orders of explicitly brainwashed super-soldiers who live in a technobarbaric theocracy... but they don't believe the emperor is a GOD you guize theyre totes cool science based atheist skeptics!
.....
....ignore the fact that gods are REAL in this universe and also that sisters of battle exist, a faction that worships the emperor as a god and the emperor gives their units holy protection occasionally and summons reincarnated winged saints with flaming swords to answer their prayers in battle.
So because of these cool atheist bros marines are just stupid and believing things in spite of evidence, except they're doing it in the opposite way that religious extremists in our world do. They're skeptical extremists!
Latro_ wrote: Seems that every teaser image is very faith in the emp related, which kinda steers away a bit from marines...
Marines inflict suffering, armour is their armour not faith.
I'm wondering if there is gonna be some crazy imperial extreme religious divide like ynnari. If you think about it all this citrix maledictum stuff kicked off more or less when Bob showed back up again with all his reason and logic, must be an undercurrent of zealots about to kick off in the imperium... would be cool.
edit: Now i flesh it out more in my head its too grim dark for they way GW is taking the 40k fluff.
and all but the last one has already been put in motion......so a new civil war is the next Chapter?
Love the Tyranid art at the start..had my hopes up for a nano second .. Nice that we are seen as a major threat.
I suggest a little of all of them coming the Imperiums way- More Nids arriving, Chaos rising, Psychic rebellion, Necron rising, the trouble with Orks and a civil war..
maybe ..
I'd love to see them evolve the Nids with new bio weapons and creatures as other elements of the Hive Fleet arrive..they could even just refresh kits by adding upgrade frames of biomorphs and weapons..
But I don't see Nids on the way for a while at least..
Voss wrote: Ah. Are we amping up on the clock being two minutes to midnight again?
Problem with that is the stakes were already raised, and sitting on that state for too long starts to feel artificial.
But companies (including GW already) actually following through on 'midnight' tends to go badly. Very, very badly.
The flaw with settings turned into story. Which is why 40k would work best as setting like it was meant to be
No, it was a flaw with the setting as it was originally written. Both WFB and 40k sat at the edge of 'everything is ruined forever,' just like World of Darkness sat at 'End Times o'clock' (Gehenna & etc)
There just isn't room for infinite, endless battles where night mysteriously doesn't fall. You either need to give factions something real to fight for or you accept that the 'setting' is completely irrelevant to the game.
But picking up an 'end times' threat after the galaxy is shattered by the chaos sphincter and saying 'but this time for realsies' falls really flat.
bullyboy wrote:A fracture within the Imperium would be a good place to go though, justify all those Imperium on Imperium battles.
Something they could and should have done with Roboute, and something they still could with <Next Primarch>.
Voss wrote: Ah. Are we amping up on the clock being two minutes to midnight again?
Problem with that is the stakes were already raised, and sitting on that state for too long starts to feel artificial.
But companies (including GW already) actually following through on 'midnight' tends to go badly. Very, very badly.
The flaw with settings turned into story. Which is why 40k would work best as setting like it was meant to be
No, it was a flaw with the setting as it was originally written. Both WFB and 40k sat at the edge of 'everything is ruined forever,' just like World of Darkness sat at 'End Times o'clock' (Gehenna & etc)
There just isn't room for infinite, endless battles where night mysteriously doesn't fall. You either need to give factions something real to fight for or you accept that the 'setting' is completely irrelevant to the game.
But picking up an 'end times' threat after the galaxy is shattered by the chaos sphincter and saying 'but this time for realsies' falls really flat.
bullyboy wrote:A fracture within the Imperium would be a good place to go though, justify all those Imperium on Imperium battles.
Something they could and should have done with Roboute, and something they still could with <Next Primarch>.
Honestly all they need to do to remove the everything is ruined forever threat is downplay the absurd implications the universe will die if the emperor dies and play up the rise and fall of empires schtick already shown by the old ones, necrons, eldar, humans and tau. With that tone in mind, it would still matter deeply to humanity if terra fell, but the setting as a whole would keep trucking on like nothing happened with humanity moving on to an eldar style scattered remnants phase as the tau get to take their turn on the wheel of empires.
Voss wrote: Ah. Are we amping up on the clock being two minutes to midnight again?
Problem with that is the stakes were already raised, and sitting on that state for too long starts to feel artificial.
But companies (including GW already) actually following through on 'midnight' tends to go badly. Very, very badly.
The flaw with settings turned into story. Which is why 40k would work best as setting like it was meant to be
No, it was a flaw with the setting as it was originally written. Both WFB and 40k sat at the edge of 'everything is ruined forever,' just like World of Darkness sat at 'End Times o'clock' (Gehenna & etc)
There just isn't room for infinite, endless battles where night mysteriously doesn't fall. You either need to give factions something real to fight for or you accept that the 'setting' is completely irrelevant to the game.
But picking up an 'end times' threat after the galaxy is shattered by the chaos sphincter and saying 'but this time for realsies' falls really flat.
bullyboy wrote:A fracture within the Imperium would be a good place to go though, justify all those Imperium on Imperium battles.
Something they could and should have done with Roboute, and something they still could with <Next Primarch>.
Yeah the problem with End Times for me was I expected it to shatter the setting and reset it in a different form -not blow it up. The could quite easily shatter the 40k setting -a split in the Imperium with other rising threats would work. It could work really well and allow space for the factions to figure more strongly [and actually the presence of an Ork Empire, a large Tyranid infestation [remember they built something on a world ] , Tau ascendency and the return of the Necrons would keep Chaos and each other from snuffing out the broken Imperium .. They need to do something with the other factions because they are getting to state were most of them are complete ranges.
Voss wrote: No, it was a flaw with the setting as it was originally written. Both WFB and 40k sat at the edge of 'everything is ruined forever,' just like World of Darkness sat at 'End Times o'clock' (Gehenna & etc)
There just isn't room for infinite, endless battles where night mysteriously doesn't fall. You either need to give factions something real to fight for or you accept that the 'setting' is completely irrelevant to the game.
But picking up an 'end times' threat after the galaxy is shattered by the chaos sphincter and saying 'but this time for realsies' falls really flat.
There's ten thousand years of history between the Heresy and 'present day', with a backstory perfectly suited to explain not only why momentous events could occur and then be forgotten about (with at least one already in-universe- The Harrowing), but how new products could be introduced without raising questions about where they ended up in M41.
GW used to recognize this, in that they had rules for characters like Lord Solar Macharius who canonically was dead hundreds of years before the 'present day'. With a setting built on deep time and ancient history, the fact that the 'now' is at two minutes to midnight is only a problem for events pushing the timeline forward, rather than exploring the past.
Galas wrote: What? Space Marines have never treated the emperor as a God... I mean... thats what all the fuss with Word Bearers in the horus heresy was about. Space Marine chapters are all about their own cultures, thats what their Chaplains are for.
Well except for the Marines that do believe the Emperor is a god.
What is this malady they are talking about that's linked to the necrons? I'm drawing a blank.
I'm not complaining, its a good concept and brings some of the menace back (the Psychic Awakening story they released wasn't bad too.), I just don't know what they could be referring to.
I want the original history of Black Templar’s being more than 1000 to come true and them and the rest of the Imperial Fists off shoots join to punch big blue in his face just in time for Dorn to return.
Only some factions have the previous 10,000 years to play with, so diving into the past doesn't work. The Tau, Tyranids, Necrons only became active as whole factions relatively recently.
I suspect all of those threats mentioned by GW will come to pass in some form to some degree. But I think one way to keep from being stuck at an artificial one minute to midnight scenario forever is to have those threats start to interfere with each other and you can get local dynamic fluctuations in the fortunes of all the factions. The Necrons' pylons dampen the worse of the psychic awakening and the warp rifts, while at the same time the warp rifts prevent the total becalming of the warp and the end of warp travel. The Tyranids smash into the Orks and the two hordes stalemate each other (with local fluctuations of this fleet winning here, that Waagh winning there). Abaddon tries to head towards Terra but gets bogged down to a crawl towards Terra as he runs into Orks, Necrons, Tyranids, while his forces get harried by Ynnari and other Imperial factions.
Imperial fracturing is a good idea to break up the whole Imperium behemoth and to give a sense that things really are dark. A monolithic Imperium with the seemingly ever present option of smothering the threat in sheer weight of bodies doesn't give the impression that things are slipping. I just hope they don't make the fracturing a simple Guilliman/reformist "good" and reactionary "bad" (or vice versa). Both reformists (like the Inquisition Recongregator faction) and the reactionaries (Amalthean faction) can genuinely want what is best for the Imperium but they disagree about how to go about it, and all without Chaos having to be involved to mark one side as the "bad" side. In some parts of the galaxy, maybe urgent reform is needed, but in others maybe urgent reform at the wrong time might be worse.
I can also see splinters such as sectors splitting off while still professing loyalty to the Imperium by using the rationale of "we'll stabilize our local area first". They might even genuinely mean it and not be power grabbing secessionists. Of course they could also be lying and maybe lying even to themselves.
Voss wrote: Ah. Are we amping up on the clock being two minutes to midnight again?
Problem with that is the stakes were already raised, and sitting on that state for too long starts to feel artificial.
But companies (including GW already) actually following through on 'midnight' tends to go badly. Very, very badly.
The flaw with settings turned into story. Which is why 40k would work best as setting like it was meant to be
No, it was a flaw with the setting as it was originally written. Both WFB and 40k sat at the edge of 'everything is ruined forever,' just like World of Darkness sat at 'End Times o'clock' (Gehenna & etc)
There just isn't room for infinite, endless battles where night mysteriously doesn't fall. You either need to give factions something real to fight for or you accept that the 'setting' is completely irrelevant to the game.
But picking up an 'end times' threat after the galaxy is shattered by the chaos sphincter and saying 'but this time for realsies' falls really flat.
bullyboy wrote:A fracture within the Imperium would be a good place to go though, justify all those Imperium on Imperium battles.
Something they could and should have done with Roboute, and something they still could with <Next Primarch>.
Im a Dark Angel player so maybe I am biased, but The Lion would be perfect for this. Sees Gully playing Emperor, again, and isn't happy.
Voss wrote: Ah. Are we amping up on the clock being two minutes to midnight again?
Problem with that is the stakes were already raised, and sitting on that state for too long starts to feel artificial.
But companies (including GW already) actually following through on 'midnight' tends to go badly. Very, very badly.
The flaw with settings turned into story. Which is why 40k would work best as setting like it was meant to be
No, it was a flaw with the setting as it was originally written. Both WFB and 40k sat at the edge of 'everything is ruined forever,' just like World of Darkness sat at 'End Times o'clock' (Gehenna & etc)
There just isn't room for infinite, endless battles where night mysteriously doesn't fall. You either need to give factions something real to fight for or you accept that the 'setting' is completely irrelevant to the game.
But picking up an 'end times' threat after the galaxy is shattered by the chaos sphincter and saying 'but this time for realsies' falls really flat.
bullyboy wrote:A fracture within the Imperium would be a good place to go though, justify all those Imperium on Imperium battles.
Something they could and should have done with Roboute, and something they still could with <Next Primarch>.
Im a Dark Angel player so maybe I am biased, but The Lion would be perfect for this. Sees Gully playing Emperor, again, and isn't happy.
yes because repeating a resolved heresy era plot point is such a great idea!
Just wanna note how obnoxious it is to me that a bunch of coolboy edgy atheists have spontaneously created a situation where they don't want their marines to be religious
.....
....ignore the fact that gods are REAL in this universe and also that sisters of battle exist, a faction that worships the emperor as a god and the emperor gives their units holy protection...
So because of these cool atheist bros marines are just stupid and believing things in spite of evidence, except they're doing it in the opposite way that religious extremists in our world do. They're skeptical extremists!
Indeed! Glad to see another sees this. It's annoyed me since the Last Church HH novel and later "canon". Before that even ultramarines often worshiped the Emperor in much of the much more mysterious and less defined fluff.
I just choose to ignore this weird contradictory atheist zealous warrior monk with chaplains theme. It certainly makes the BT a chapter that makes a lot more sense in the setting fluff-wise though.
Indeed! Glad to see another sees this. It's annoyed me since the Last Church HH novel and later "canon". Before that even ultramarines often worshiped the Emperor in much of the much more mysterious and less defined fluff.
I just choose to ignore this weird contradictory atheist zealous warrior monk with chaplains theme. It certainly makes the BT a chapter that makes a lot more sense in the setting fluff-wise though.
From as far back as 2nd edition, when Marine lore started to be codified from the original brain-altered convicts to the current super-powered warrior monks, Marines haven't been religious. The fact that they viewed the Emperor as powerful but not actually a god was one of the things that made them stand out from, and often butt heads with the rest of the Imperial machine.
Chaplains, despite their name, were never a sign of religious zealotry. Their original purpose in Marine Legions was merely to keep an eye on the Librarians.
And now, Chaplains are basically the spiritual guides of the chapter, the ones that keep their traditions and the lessons of their Primarch, not real life chaplains that give prayers for the emperor, etc... (With the exception of some chapters like black templars, of course)
This is not any kind of recent retcon. It is how the lore has been written since is inception. Space Marines aren't less zealous just for not thinking the Emperor is a God.
I like that there are some religious Chapters out there that genuinely see the Emperor as a god. It's just not the norm, and there's nothing wrong with that.
spaceelf wrote: Look, we all know what is in the darkness of space...Squats.
This is clearly the Squats Vs. Tyranid starter set that everyone has been waiting for since 2nd ed.
Didn't GW buy the Squat tradmark or something recently and produced a couple of FW models of squats? Jesus, if they bring squats back, I'll be in heaven!
spaceelf wrote: Look, we all know what is in the darkness of space...Squats.
This is clearly the Squats Vs. Tyranid starter set that everyone has been waiting for since 2nd ed.
Didn't GW buy the Squat tradmark or something recently and produced a couple of FW models of squats? Jesus, if they bring squats back, I'll be in heaven!
Chaplains, despite their name, were never a sign of religious zealotry. Their original purpose in Marine Legions was merely to keep an eye on the Librarians.
Voss wrote: No, it was a flaw with the setting as it was originally written. Both WFB and 40k sat at the edge of 'everything is ruined forever,' just like World of Darkness sat at 'End Times o'clock' (Gehenna & etc)
There just isn't room for infinite, endless battles where night mysteriously doesn't fall. You either need to give factions something real to fight for or you accept that the 'setting' is completely irrelevant to the game.
But picking up an 'end times' threat after the galaxy is shattered by the chaos sphincter and saying 'but this time for realsies' falls really flat.
There's ten thousand years of history between the Heresy and 'present day', with a backstory perfectly suited to explain not only why momentous events could occur and then be forgotten about (with at least one already in-universe- The Harrowing), but how new products could be introduced without raising questions about where they ended up in M41.
GW used to recognize this, in that they had rules for characters like Lord Solar Macharius who canonically was dead hundreds of years before the 'present day'. With a setting built on deep time and ancient history, the fact that the 'now' is at two minutes to midnight is only a problem for events pushing the timeline forward, rather than exploring the past.
Exactly this, and with all that space and time GW themselves could have put out campaign books for a hundred years without ever stepping on the same ground twice. And the "present day" not being ideal for GW to tell an ongoing storyline with was a feature, not a bug - it was supposed to be a setup for us to tell our own stories, for us to determine the future of the setting based on our own games.
Sadly there's a loud minority who both want Official(tm) story content and only care about "what happens next" with the "main plot", and the other minority who preferred GW to do "historicals" and leave the ongoing plots to us(the large majority in the middle genuinely don't seem to give a gak which form the campaigns from GW take, they just want campaigns from GW and new models) allowed ourselves to be sidelined by not being as persistently obnoxious about our preference. Plus the makeup of the Studio has changed, with people who want to "shake things up" for a variety of reasons now being the norm there.
Chaplains, despite their name, were never a sign of religious zealotry. Their original purpose in Marine Legions was merely to keep an eye on the Librarians.
Where's this fluff from?
in detail from the Horus Heresy books, but it was already there in the older Codex books, that Chaplains were copied over from the WB to make sure that all Marines walk the line of the imperial way (which includes of not having active psykers during the HH)
spaceelf wrote: Look, we all know what is in the darkness of space...Squats.
This is clearly the Squats Vs. Tyranid starter set that everyone has been waiting for since 2nd ed.
Didn't GW buy the Squat tradmark or something recently and produced a couple of FW models of squats? Jesus, if they bring squats back, I'll be in heaven!
Just don't.
I'm triggered and having flashbacks to the fun I had with Toughness 8 Ancestor Lords casting Force Dome on speeding Eldar jetbikes.
Galas wrote: What? Space Marines have never treated the emperor as a God... I mean... thats what all the fuss with Word Bearers in the horus heresy was about. Space Marine chapters are all about their own cultures, thats what their Chaplains are for.
Well except for the Marines that do believe the Emperor is a god.
I thought it was commonly accepted they saw him as a divine father, if not a god then close enough.
Think of it...Squats the size of the older marines. Those who don’t want to use Primaris marines just have to use Clan and Hearthguard rules instead. And add runes everywhere.
tneva82 wrote: Last time I checked squats aren't 7 feet tall.
last time I checked the size of the models had nothing to do with scale or the original template
getting Squats or Imperial Guard at the same model size as Primaris is not unlikley (not more than getting Squats or new Guard models at all)
DivineVisitor wrote: Curveball! We're getting a Plastic Avatar of Khaine that rivals the new plastic Greater Daemons in size and with different weapon options!
...and then i woke up...
Does it have the ability to not be throttled by Space Marine heroes.
That GW article may be setting up for 9th edition, which may have some very big advancement to the lore. I remember a rumour back when 8th came out that the design studio wanted to really shake things up... but seeing the initial reaction to what happened when the WFB world was destroyed, they choose to do small changes. 8th could have just been the start of the storyline advancing in small steps.
9th could really shake things up. Either way from a lore point of view it is getting hard to imagine the IoM can hold out for much longer.
I doubt GW would leap straight into Squats tbh, but I could see them doing a Squat unit or a few characters the next time they visit the Guard to test the ground.
I would expect that if we see new factions they might be something like what's been done with AOS, which are factions that are a bit light for a "full army" but can be souped up or expanded if they prove popular. So more Tau auxillaries/expanded Kroot, Chaos Guard, Dark Mechanicus, aforementioned Squat auxiliaries for Guard, maybe even Eldar Corsairs/Exodites.
I don't expect a bigger fluff shakeup than 8th tbh. We might have another Primarch show up with some conflict with Guilliman, but that won't be to the level of outright civil war. It's actually really hard to write around the fact that the Imperium requires the Astronomican to keep functioning or human civilisation collapses.
The Phazer wrote: I doubt GW would leap straight into Squats tbh, but I could see them doing a Squat unit or a few characters the next time they visit the Guard to test the ground.
I would expect that if we see new factions they might be something like what's been done with AOS, which are factions that are a bit light for a "full army" but can be souped up or expanded if they prove popular. So more Tau auxillaries/expanded Kroot, Chaos Guard, Dark Mechanicus, aforementioned Squat auxiliaries for Guard, maybe even Eldar Corsairs/Exodites.
I don't expect a bigger fluff shakeup than 8th tbh. We might have another Primarch show up with some conflict with Guilliman, but that won't be to the level of outright civil war. It's actually really hard to write around the fact that the Imperium requires the Astronomican to keep functioning or human civilisation collapses.
That’s one rumour currently going around: during 9th ed the main armies to receive new stuff will be ones that do not exist yet, like GSC until a few years ago. Those rumoured to arrive are Eldar Exodites, the Lost and the Damned, Dark Mechanicus, Renegade Guard.
Who knows if it’s baseless speculation or not...
Ok, maybe we get 9th edition, maybe we don't. But we know we're getting new forge world books, so will gw preview them tomorrow? And if so, what will they change? (If anything)
DivineVisitor wrote: Curveball! We're getting a Plastic Avatar of Khaine that rivals the new plastic Greater Daemons in size and with different weapon options!
...and then i woke up...
Does it have the ability to not be throttled by Space Marine heroes.
"Brother Sergeant Guillinor, Ive read in your battle honors report that you've vanquished that crude effigy, the Avatar of Khaine in single combat?"
"Aye, Senior Captain. I had extinguished it with the superior power of my Centurian Armor Warsuit, punishing it with Emperor Blessed hurricane bolter shells in righteous honor, and then smashing it clean through the face with my siege hammer drills, embasing myself in its hot magma blood, unharmed."
"Well... we'd normally give a bonus point to throttling in the neck with bare hands, but... Oh... well... a Kill is a Kill, I guess. You checked off all 3 boxes. Congratulations Soldier, you're a Captain now!"
Chaplains, despite their name, were never a sign of religious zealotry. Their original purpose in Marine Legions was merely to keep an eye on the Librarians.
Where's this fluff from?
in detail from the Horus Heresy books, but it was already there in the older Codex books, that Chaplains were copied over from the WB to make sure that all Marines walk the line of the imperial way (which includes of not having active psykers during the HH)
So their purpose as a watch over the Librarius was just added in the HH series then.
It would be cool if the Silent king showed up and made the same deep impact on 9th edition as Ynnari did on 8th edition with a whooping 3 related models and full white dwarf update of the rules and everything.
Fayric wrote: It would be cool if the Silent king showed up and made the same deep impact on 9th edition as Ynnari did on 8th edition with a whooping 3 related models and full white dwarf update of the rules and everything.
I think GW like the fan base have forgot about Ynnari.
Fayric wrote: It would be cool if the Silent king showed up and made the same deep impact on 9th edition as Ynnari did on 8th edition with a whooping 3 related models and full white dwarf update of the rules and everything.
I think GW like the fan base have forgot about Ynnari.
That's because they tried to turn them into their own army, which they should not have been.
The problem with Ynnari is that its a fluffy concept to pull together two armies into a 3rd army. Like Primaris it smacks of a CEO level choice to increase the army range without actually increasing anything (just like how Primaris are clearly the next Mark models of space marines, but instead of replacing they were released alongside to double the marine range somewhat).
Ynnari simply hits a wall because the best and most fluffy things you want to put into those lists from Craftworld are - drum roll - all those finecast aspect warrior troops. Ynnari would have been great after having a massive update to the Craftworld to give them exciting new models; some update to DArk Eldar too and then let you combine the two. Doing Ynnari before simply made it a mess because you've got existing fans who don't really want a 3rd wheel on the eldar army list and they aren't really picking up Ynnari as a duel army because they are still waiting on the update to their core army first.
It's a neat concept, but just released at the wrong time. Update Craftworld core; update Dark Eldar finecast and then release your merger army.
There's a new quote up ’in battle he offers us redemption' now I may be biased but that sounds like Khorne! Or I might just be wishful thinking. Daemon angron.
That's because they tried to turn them into their own army, which they should not have been.
Ehhh...they tried to turn them into an Inquisition styled faction, not "their own army".
They REALLY failed at that then. If they had a generic HQ and stuff that could be slotted in with little issue like current Inquisition it'd be fine. If they conferred some generic benefits to work with all Eldar armies like Inquisition do with Imperium, it would be fine. Instead you give up a bunch of good stuff for a bad benefit overall and get stuck with only named Characters.
That's because they tried to turn them into their own army, which they should not have been.
Ehhh...they tried to turn them into an Inquisition styled faction, not "their own army".
They REALLY failed at that then. If they had a generic HQ and stuff that could be slotted in with little issue like current Inquisition it'd be fine. If they conferred some generic benefits to work with all Eldar armies like Inquisition do with Imperium, it would be fine. Instead you give up a bunch of good stuff for a bad benefit overall and get stuck with only named Characters.
The only difference they had, realistically, is that they turned the army into what everyone says they want the Inquisition to do when taken in Guard("make it so they get the inquisition keyword!!1!!").
Mr Morden wrote: A supplement with a few special rules would work fine for Legion of the Damned. Buts thats trueof ALL Marine Chapters
Well to be fair they have always had a giant slew of rules you can't really consolidate for. They ignore cover, have a 3++, AND Deep Strike (and I'm pretty sure they still have to arrive that way). I've been all for getting rid of bloat but they're a tough nut to crack.
Kanluwen wrote: Man, if Legion of the Damned gets a Codex after they removed Skitarii and Scions with their own...I'll cry into my bacon and waffles tomorrow morning.
Skitarii do have their own codex, regardless of your continued bizzare trolling on the matter.
That their small number of auxiliary units happens to include the HQ section because they’ve yet to get around to giving an alpha primus rules outside of 30k is a strange anomaly, but doesn’t change that the tabletop faction is *overwhelmingly* tech guard.
Kanluwen wrote: Man, if Legion of the Damned gets a Codex after they removed Skitarii and Scions with their own...I'll cry into my bacon and waffles tomorrow morning.
Skitarii do have their own codex, regardless of your continued bizzare trolling on the matter.
They do not have their own Codex. They feature in a Codex. They had their own Codex, hence my statement of "after they removed" those two from their own.
That their small number of auxiliary units happens to include the HQ section because they’ve yet to get around to giving an alpha primus rules outside of 30k is a strange anomaly, but doesn’t change that the tabletop faction is *overwhelmingly* tech guard.
"Small number of auxiliary units" is apparently code for: -Three different Techpriest variants(Dominus, Enginseer, Manipulus) plus two characters(Cawl and Daedolosus) -Two different Electropriest units -Two different Kataphron units -Kastelan Robots -Datasmiths -Knights and Armigers
Huh. Why, it almost sounds like they rolled three books into one! If people can constantly whine about GW prices or anything, I can damn well bring up in my thread the fact that Skitarii lost their own Codex to get rolled into a combined book that could just as easily have been two separate ones or a more complete one with a simple frigging job that ensured Skitarii remained a viable solo army. Because they were a viable solo army, unlike the dumpsterfire that was Cult Mechanicus
Mr Morden wrote: A supplement with a few special rules would work fine for Legion of the Damned. Buts thats trueof ALL Marine Chapters
Well to be fair they have always had a giant slew of rules you can't really consolidate for. They ignore cover, have a 3++, AND Deep Strike (and I'm pretty sure they still have to arrive that way). I've been all for getting rid of bloat but they're a tough nut to crack.
They a single entry in the Index and they certianly have less unique units than say Harlequins (who are still missing some of theirs) and would in fact be perfect for a WD dex.
Having their Chapter tactics be Flaming Projectiles (Ignore Cover) Aid Unlooked For (Deep Strike) and Unyeilding Spectres (Amour is invulnerable) worked there
Kanluwen wrote: Man, if Legion of the Damned gets a Codex after they removed Skitarii and Scions with their own...I'll cry into my bacon and waffles tomorrow morning.
Skitarii do have their own codex, regardless of your continued bizzare trolling on the matter.
They do not have their own Codex. They feature in a Codex. They had their own Codex, hence my statement of "after they removed" those two from their own.
That their small number of auxiliary units happens to include the HQ section because they’ve yet to get around to giving an alpha primus rules outside of 30k is a strange anomaly, but doesn’t change that the tabletop faction is *overwhelmingly* tech guard.
"Small number of auxiliary units" is apparently code for:
-Three different Techpriest variants(Dominus, Enginseer, Manipulus) plus two characters(Cawl and Daedolosus)
-Two different Electropriest units
-Two different Kataphron units
-Kastelan Robots
-Datasmiths
-Knights and Armigers
Huh. Why, it almost sounds like they rolled three books into one!
If people can constantly whine about GW prices or anything, I can damn well bring up in my thread the fact that Skitarii lost their own Codex to get rolled into a combined book that could just as easily have been two separate ones or a more complete one with a simple frigging job that ensured Skitarii remained a viable solo army. Because they were a viable solo army, unlike the dumpsterfire that was Cult Mechanicus
So to clarify, you're upset your faction got rolled in with another who is thematically very similar from the same organisation. You gained options, you can still run your army the way you could before (hint, skitarii needed a bespoke force org to even field models) more or less and you're complaining you don't get to buy 2-3 books for the same units?
Kanluwen wrote: Man, if Legion of the Damned gets a Codex after they removed Skitarii and Scions with their own...I'll cry into my bacon and waffles tomorrow morning.
Skitarii do have their own codex, regardless of your continued bizzare trolling on the matter.
They do not have their own Codex. They feature in a Codex. They had their own Codex, hence my statement of "after they removed" those two from their own.
That their small number of auxiliary units happens to include the HQ section because they’ve yet to get around to giving an alpha primus rules outside of 30k is a strange anomaly, but doesn’t change that the tabletop faction is *overwhelmingly* tech guard.
"Small number of auxiliary units" is apparently code for:
-Three different Techpriest variants(Dominus, Enginseer, Manipulus) plus two characters(Cawl and Daedolosus)
-Two different Electropriest units
-Two different Kataphron units
-Kastelan Robots
-Datasmiths
-Knights and Armigers
Huh. Why, it almost sounds like they rolled three books into one!
If people can constantly whine about GW prices or anything, I can damn well bring up in my thread the fact that Skitarii lost their own Codex to get rolled into a combined book that could just as easily have been two separate ones or a more complete one with a simple frigging job that ensured Skitarii remained a viable solo army. Because they were a viable solo army, unlike the dumpsterfire that was Cult Mechanicus
Gee, it’s almost like cult mechanicus was a small supplement following up the initial release or something.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Dudeface wrote: So to clarify, you're upset your faction got rolled in with another who is thematically very similar from the same organisation. You gained options, you can still run your army the way you could before (hint, skitarii needed a bespoke force org to even field models) more or less and you're complaining you don't get to buy 2-3 books for the same units?
He’s been at this for a while, essentially instead of just asking for one or two skitarii specific characters like the rest of admech players, he wants the filthy taint of tech priests out of his pure unsullied skitarii book.
So to clarify, you're upset your faction got rolled in with another who is thematically very similar from the same organisation.
Yeah...no. That's the view that someone who was unfamiliar with the two factions would go for.
I'm "upset" that my faction lost all of its flavor in response to the whining from Cult Mechanicus players who insisted that "iT nEeDs To Be CoMbInEd!!!1!" because their Canticles "didn't work otherwise". So to summarize: I don't get Doctrina Imperatives on my Skitarii outside of Stratagems, I don't get squadroned Onagers, I don't get grenades on my Ruststalkers, I don't get my advance move. And to top it off? I got a whole new set of nonsense in the form of that watered down crap that is Canticles foisted upon me
You gained options, you can still run your army the way you could before (hint, skitarii needed a bespoke force org to even field models) more or less and you're complaining you don't get to buy 2-3 books for the same units?
I cannot run my army the way I could before. I gained no "options" until the introduction of the Skorpius and the forthcoming Engine War stuff. I could ally in Cult if I wanted them(spoiler: I didn't), and the 'bespoke force org' that they had was no different than Harlequins had last edition...yet Harlequins got HQ choices added.
Gee, it’s almost like cult mechanicus was a small supplement following up the initial release or something.
Gee, it's almost like Cult Mechanicus was designed around being an elite army and people insisted they had to play it as a horde...and for whatever stupid reason, GW caved and let them have their way.
Electropriests should have been a Troops choice, not Kataphrons.
Dudeface wrote: So to clarify, you're upset your faction got rolled in with another who is thematically very similar from the same organisation. You gained options, you can still run your army the way you could before (hint, skitarii needed a bespoke force org to even field models) more or less and you're complaining you don't get to buy 2-3 books for the same units?
He’s been at this for a while, essentially instead of just asking for one or two skitarii specific characters like the rest of admech players, he wants the filthy taint of tech priests out of his pure unsullied skitarii book.
lol, no? I've said that we need a Skitarii HQ choice before we need more stupid Techpriests added. I've said that we need Doctrina Imperatives returned to Skitarii because this Canticles stuff is garbage.
If you choose to view it that way, that's on you. But you're wrong.
I cannot run my army the way I could before. I gained no "options" until the introduction of the Skorpius and the forthcoming Engine War stuff. I could ally in Cult if I wanted them(spoiler: I didn't), and the 'bespoke force org' that they had was no different than Harlequins had last edition...yet Harlequins got HQ choices added..
you are aware that you army only was created just because not all boxes fitted the release model by that time and GW split them into 2 factions instead of changing the way they released stuff?
this was just a temporary solution until the next Codex release
your army was a placeholder right from the start and while I can understand it, this is how GW works, deal with it or play something else (as you can expect another change happening with 9th)
"your army" is only there for one edition/life cycle of the Codex books and replaced by something different with the next version of the book. If you expected those things (as how your army works and plays) to stay, you play the wrong game
So, just talking with some people from our group, and one pointed out the obvious: All those quotes they spoiled only really match one faction perfectly - the Sisters of Silence, which are supposed to join the custodes in their PA.
Jidmah wrote: So, just talking with some people from our group, and one pointed out the obvious: All those quotes they spoiled only really match one faction perfectly - the Sisters of Silence, which are supposed to join the custodes in their PA.
Which is "War of the Spider", not "Pariah".
Also they match any non-Marine Imperial faction fairly well.
Jidmah wrote: So, just talking with some people from our group, and one pointed out the obvious: All those quotes they spoiled only really match one faction perfectly - the Sisters of Silence, which are supposed to join the custodes in their PA.
that makes sense we know sisters are getting slotted into custodes.
that said the silent king's return has been all but said already, that's IMHO the big news and we should expect no more and no less.
Jidmah wrote: So, just talking with some people from our group, and one pointed out the obvious: All those quotes they spoiled only really match one faction perfectly - the Sisters of Silence, which are supposed to join the custodes in their PA.
You know, that's a really good call. I mean, if we didn't already know it was Space Slann. SPACE SLANN!
Jidmah wrote: So, just talking with some people from our group, and one pointed out the obvious: All those quotes they spoiled only really match one faction perfectly - the Sisters of Silence, which are supposed to join the custodes in their PA.
that makes sense we know sisters are getting slotted into custodes.
that said the silent king's return has been all but said already, that's IMHO the big news and we should expect no more and no less.
Get ready everyone, your wallets are not prepared ! As in spending, they offer you salvation. The real question will be, how over the top will all the new offerings cost ?
Give those feelers out there folks. I'm going to say the prices will be legendary, strong enough to send ripples of joy through the masses.
Jidmah wrote: So, just talking with some people from our group, and one pointed out the obvious: All those quotes they spoiled only really match one faction perfectly - the Sisters of Silence, which are supposed to join the custodes in their PA.
that makes sense we know sisters are getting slotted into custodes.
that said the silent king's return has been all but said already, that's IMHO the big news and we should expect no more and no less.
anything beyond that one reveal? is a bonus
Do they - Are the Sisters of Silence religious?
... it's honestly been left kinda unclear TBH. as we've only seen them apper in two novels.
Jidmah wrote: So, just talking with some people from our group, and one pointed out the obvious: All those quotes they spoiled only really match one faction perfectly - the Sisters of Silence, which are supposed to join the custodes in their PA.
that makes sense we know sisters are getting slotted into custodes.
that said the silent king's return has been all but said already, that's IMHO the big news and we should expect no more and no less.
anything beyond that one reveal? is a bonus
Do they - Are the Sisters of Silence religious?
Everything I have read of their lore says they are not and its implied that the have a deep hate for the Eclesiarcy, it's implied that they were involved in the SoS being cast out.
Also on the Religious side there is implied that Guilliman sees the ecclesiarcy and has the does no one remember Lorgar and the mess this god worshipping caused last time, but then goes F*** it I don't have time to fix this idiocy I have choas to fight.
At this point any split in the imperium is likely to be religious vrs secular, but given SoB have just been released turning to that civil war would be a risk for GW.
Kanluwen wrote: More likely than not, it's a formal announcement of a bunch of novels along with whatever else is happening.
Just like when 8th launched then? Dark Imperium 2.0?
that's hardly the only time GW has released novels. more often then not big special events have tie in novels. (it's shocking come to think of it there was no Vigilus novel)
Also on the Religious side there is implied that Guilliman sees the ecclesiarcy and has the does no one remember Lorgar and the mess this god worshipping caused last time, but then goes F*** it I don't have time to fix this idiocy I have choas to fight.
At this point any split in the imperium is likely to be religious vrs secular, but given SoB have just been released turning to that civil war would be a risk for GW.
Ughhgh I hate Guilliman and the edgelord-atheist stuff since mid ABG's HH books. Its a bit too cringe-worthy and cliche for me, but I suppose that's the dominant taste among the fanbase. I preferred the strong ambiguity (as opposed to the current weak theory) as to whether the Emperor's divinity was a straight lie or hidden per his plans, with even examples of Ultramarines calling him God-Emperor, etc.
I do think we will see a civil war or a cold-war style uneasy truce between Guilliman and another faction.
Kanluwen wrote: More likely than not, it's a formal announcement of a bunch of novels along with whatever else is happening.
Just like when 8th launched then? Dark Imperium 2.0?
that's hardly the only time GW has released novels. more often then not big special events have tie in novels. (it's shocking come to think of it there was no Vigilus novel)
True. My point was that new BL content could point to this being a new edition or possibly a new campaign series. Guess we'll know soon.
Kanluwen wrote: More likely than not, it's a formal announcement of a bunch of novels along with whatever else is happening.
Just like when 8th launched then? Dark Imperium 2.0?
that's hardly the only time GW has released novels. more often then not big special events have tie in novels. (it's shocking come to think of it there was no Vigilus novel)
Yeah, it's not like there was all the free stories they posted!
That's the route they have been going rather than "tie in novels" of late. Vigilus had it and Psychic Awakening had it, and on the Age of Sigmar side? Malign Portents had it and Forbidden Power had it.
It's rather worth mentioning that it is a Thing of late for GW to have novels dropping alongside starter sets.
Kanluwen wrote: If people can constantly whine about GW prices or anything, I can damn well bring up in my thread the fact that Skitarii lost their own Codex to get rolled into a combined book that could just as easily have been two separate ones or a more complete one with a simple frigging job that ensured Skitarii remained a viable solo army. Because they were a viable solo army, unlike the dumpsterfire that was Cult Mechanicus
GW price increase affect everyone. Your hang-up with AdMech only affects you.
Kanluwen wrote: If people can constantly whine about GW prices or anything, I can damn well bring up in my thread the fact that Skitarii lost their own Codex to get rolled into a combined book that could just as easily have been two separate ones or a more complete one with a simple frigging job that ensured Skitarii remained a viable solo army. Because they were a viable solo army, unlike the dumpsterfire that was Cult Mechanicus
GW price increase affect everyone. Your hang-up with AdMech only affects you.
To be fair, everything he said about Skitarii was right. They were better by themselves than Cult. Cult players were the ones that were annoyed that they were two separate codices, even though they were completely two different armies compared to "oh look they're Marines but totally different!!!1!". And, while the move to put them in the same codex was probably correct, they weren't able to be pure Skitarii which immediately invalidated an army and you had to go buy an overpriced character (both in points and money).
Was it though? The idea that the two be separate is daft, and they were meant to be one thing right from the start. They're the Adeptus Mechanicus. It'd be like taking Scouts and Terminators out of Marine forces and making them separate. The two are not two. They are one. The only reason two books were made was because of GW's asinine secrecy, not because of any logical reasons.
Was it though? The idea that the two be separate is daft, and they were meant to be one thing right from the start. They're the Adeptus Mechanicus. It'd be like taking Scouts and Terminators out of Marine forces and making them separate. The two are not two. They are one. The only reason two books were made was because of GW's asinine secrecy, not because of any logical reasons.
Nothing about the move makes sense regarding secrecy though as much as they want to say it, though.
remember this was at the height of the post CH era where putting out a codex and saying "these new models will be out in 6 months"could result in another chapter house beating them to the punch
I'll reserve final judgement on a new edition for now, but my guess is this will amount to little more than a metashift, and likely will otherwise fundamentally retain most of the same problems we have now with vastly overdeveloped levels of killing power and systemic issues with gobs of afterthought tacked-on layered special rules spread over multiple books since they're keeping everything from 8E compatible. Looking at the Grey Knights on my painting table, the basic Troops of the army have no fewer than 9 distinct special rules (ATSKNF, Bolter Discipline, Combat Squads, Crux Terminatus, Daemon Hunters, Masters of the Warp, Rites of Banishment, Shock Assault, and Teleport Strike) that have to be collected from 3 different sources (GK Codex, Chapter Approved, and Psychic Awakening) several of which GW could get rid of if they could bring themselves to just Errata the statline of the units. If they do this right, my hope is that such will no longer be necessary, but I'm not going to hold my breath. We'll see how it shakes out.
I already know the rules will still be IGOUGO and we will retain the same issues that the game always ends up having because apparently nobody in their writing department notices this.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: I already know the rules will still be IGOUGO and we will retain the same issues that the game always ends up having because apparently nobody in their writing department notices this.
I love IGOUGO and I hope they'll never switch to AA. There's plenty of other games for that.
Slayer-Fan123 wrote: I already know the rules will still be IGOUGO and we will retain the same issues that the game always ends up having because apparently nobody in their writing department notices this.
I love IGOUGO and I hope they'll never switch to AA. There's plenty of other games for that.
Because me playing for an hour while the opponent does nothing as I simply clear half their army is a much better way to do things, absolutely. It's not interactive, less realistic, and much easier to abuse. The only defense people make is "that's how it's always been" and that's a piss poor defense at this point.
The problem is not which version of IGoUGoGW uses (alternating player turns, alternating phases, alternating units), or what interaction mechanic is used (reactions interrupt actions, alternating unit activation etc)
the problem is that they always want to mix things up for more social interaction, ending up with the worst of all worlds
if they would stick to one version (like alternating phases with one type of reaction system) and no future rules would change that, it won't be a big problem
Well not really surprising text if true. Of course it being so unsurprising makes it very easy to fake. New logo is bit harder to fake but hardly unsurmountable. There's also 1 non-gw like phrase there though not earthshattering
Eldarain wrote: I hope that's fake just for how dreadful that symbol is. They're daft, but that daft?
It's similar to the Kill Team one. The current 40K logo is too iconic for me, changing it would be a low blow. Not that the supposedly new one is awful, I'm just too attached to the current one.
If this is true that everything remains compatible pretty much nothing will change. IGOUGO and D6 are the main problems. Players need to alternate between each other in one turn, and D10/D12 dice are needed.
p5freak wrote: If this is true that everything remains compatible pretty much nothing will change. IGOUGO and D6 are the main problems. Players need to alternate between each other in one turn, and D10/D12 dice are needed.
Even D8 would be a significant improvement over D6.
BrianDavion wrote: Maybe but "seismic shifts" in 40k are rare and anyone expecting 9th edition to be anymore then a cleanup was kidding themselves
Yeah. Good luck keeping codexes etc compatible with even aa let alone new dices and codexes staying compatible in 9th is about as certain as anything can be
If there is a new edition...anyone expecting seismic changes is in for a rude awakening. We've just entered "3rd Edition" the sequel.
As with their typical design processes, the next edition or two (or...five) will be tied to the same basic stat line/codices, etc. This essentially prevents major changes to most meaningful things. Remember, 7th edition used the same spine that 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th used. While there was a little room to move and adjust things, the codices will remain the codices - for quite some time.
Sadly I think this is going to be a huge issue moving forward unless they have discovered some sneaky way to get out from behind BS 2+, etc. They painted themselves into a serious corner by going to fixed values instead of the old WS/BS system which allowed much more room (weirdly they didn't use much of that that space in previous editions of the game).
Using old codices will also mean a lot of retro-reference material if they want to make substantial changes (points costs, abilities, etc.). It will not be a clean new edition, but rather a patchjob.
I think this thread in general has failed at keeping the expectaitions at reasonable levels .
I want nothing less than Necron titans and at least one more Primarch in the pot (and why not Russ, as good as anyone, right. we need to build up even more annoyance for the Lion to wake up to)
Aeneades wrote: From the FAQ it sounds like they won’t be announcing the contents of the new starter set today which is a shame.
Well, no, but you can easily read between the lines and tell it will involve necrons at least.
Exactly. When 8th arrived, the edition was presented over months (from March at Adepticon up until the launch in early June) but the starter set was unveiled only a couple of days before the preorders started.
The primaris themselves have been unveiled only 3 weeks before Dark Imperium.
Aeneades wrote: From the FAQ it sounds like they won’t be announcing the contents of the new starter set today which is a shame.
Sounds like we'll see some Necron stuff from that box without them explicitly spelling out which models are from the starter set. Then later on we'll get a preview of the full contents with a focus on the (likely Marines) half
I'd be intreasting if they went with a Sicarius made primaris in the box and they continued the narrative that was being developed with the char from Damnos.
this'll be like 8th edition where the core rules are free but you realisticly need a codex and the core rule book if you're playing at the kind of level most of us are playing at.
this'll be like 8th edition where the core rules are free but you realisticly need a codex and the core rule book if you're playing at the kind of level most of us are playing at.
Yeah, almost certainly. I've lost count of the number of times I've seen new players show up with the "complete" free rules, then be somewhat annoyed and disappointed to find they're missing a huge chunk of what they need to actually play the game the way everyone else plays it. Maybe this time GW will do it right and include everything in the free rules, but I doubt it.
tneva82 wrote: Well we know it won't contain matched play rules. Or the new narrative system
We do?
I think just adding the deployment maps and the detachment rules to the battle primer would be plenty to turn it from "useless" to "all the rules you need".
this'll be like 8th edition where the core rules are free but you realisticly need a codex and the core rule book if you're playing at the kind of level most of us are playing at.
this'll be like 8th edition where the core rules are free but you realisticly need a codex and the core rule book if you're playing at the kind of level most of us are playing at.
You don't really need the brbtbh
Didn't the 8th Ed BRB have detachments, scenarios and deployment rules? I'm pretty sure they were missing in the free rules.
tneva82 wrote: Well we know it won't contain matched play rules. Or the new narrative system
We do?
I think just adding the deployment maps and the detachment rules to the battle primer would be plenty to turn it from "useless" to "all the rules you need".
Yes. The Basic Rules Primer for the new edition will be
available to download for free, just as with the current
edition. For the new rules in full, you’ll want to get a copy
of the new Warhammer 40,000 Rulebook, which includes
updates for matched play and the new Crusade system for
narrative play.
BrianDavion wrote: I'd be intreasting if they went with a Sicarius made primaris in the box and they continued the narrative that was being developed with the char from Damnos.
And do what?
'And then the Ultramarines went back to Damnos AGAIN, and dunked on the Necrons even harder! But this time Sicariariaus had TWO vortex grenades!'
BrianDavion wrote: I'd be intreasting if they went with a Sicarius made primaris in the box and they continued the narrative that was being developed with the char from Damnos.
And do what?
'And then the Ultramarines went back to Damnos AGAIN, and dunked on the Necrons even harder! But this time Sicariariaus had TWO vortex grenades!'
If you read the various novella's done to tie in, Sicarius was, personally impacted by his first real defeat at Damnos. Prior to iot he'd been a bit arrogant, basicly beginning to belive his own press, it'd be intreasting to see how he'd respond to leading primaris Marines agaisnt the necrons. sure not an amazing story, but if GW insists on "ULTRAMARINES VS NECRONS" it's proably the best narrative we're going to get.
BrianDavion wrote: I'd be intreasting if they went with a Sicarius made primaris in the box and they continued the narrative that was being developed with the char from Damnos.
And do what?
'And then the Ultramarines went back to Damnos AGAIN, and dunked on the Necrons even harder! But this time Sicariariaus had TWO vortex grenades!'
Well that fits to saturday cartoon style the moving storyline results in. Nobody can die so it's just repeats and draw after draw
Similar style yes but 8th ed one didn't claim codexes stay same, dark imperium boxed set goes away, nobody had mentioned vigilus and pa books. No surprise. Why write all from scratch when you can just modify old one?
this'll be like 8th edition where the core rules are free but you realisticly need a codex and the core rule book if you're playing at the kind of level most of us are playing at.
Yeah, almost certainly. I've lost count of the number of times I've seen new players show up with the "complete" free rules, then be somewhat annoyed and disappointed to find they're missing a huge chunk of what they need to actually play the game the way everyone else plays it. Maybe this time GW will do it right and include everything in the free rules, but I doubt it.
They’ve done it with AoS, barring points values and Batallions. So a bit puzzling if they don’t follow suit with 40k.
One the main advantages of the free AoS rules is ease of reference when shopping. Whether I’m buying direct or not, it’s just a quick visit to GW’s site to have a squizz. This is particularly useful when considering a new army, as with a few clicks you can get a feel of what sort of combos you fancy.
And allegiance abilities etc. You don't get far with just free core rules in aos either and trying to play without battletome is execrise in futility. Free bonuses too good to pass
As to why not in 40k. It's their cash cow. More money to be bought.
BrianDavion wrote: I'd be intreasting if they went with a Sicarius made primaris in the box and they continued the narrative that was being developed with the char from Damnos.
And do what?
'And then the Ultramarines went back to Damnos AGAIN, and dunked on the Necrons even harder! But this time Sicariariaus had TWO vortex grenades!'
If you read the various novella's done to tie in, Sicarius was, personally impacted by his first real defeat at Damnos. Prior to iot he'd been a bit arrogant, basicly beginning to belive his own press, it'd be intreasting to see how he'd respond to leading primaris Marines agaisnt the necrons. sure not an amazing story, but if GW insists on "ULTRAMARINES VS NECRONS" it's proably the best narrative we're going to get.
If you read the 6th ed. Warzome: Damnos supplement, you'd know that Sicarius and half the Ultramarines Chapter went back to Damnos 50 years after the loss of the world and reclaimed it already.
Calgar literally manhandles a gauss pylon and uses it to shoot down a tesseract vault, and then Sicarius nukes a C'tan with a vortex grenade, while a Deathwatch strike team destroys The Undying One in his tomb.
Rinkydink wrote: I just want them to get rid of the command re-roll strat.
For me, that would be huge. My orks could care less about the emp.
I'm happy with the strat but I'd like to see reroll auras toned down and slowly vanish. Even if it was just an affect for 1 unit rather than everything in range.
I hope they switch to D10/12 and/or use the apocalypse loss removal system, which removes casualties at the end of the turn, which would nullify the first turn advantage.
Indeedy. Definitely one the best things about Apocalypse. Taking extensive early casualties is still going to be a problem later in the game, but nowhere near as outright disastrous as now.
Also helps prevent or at least reduce resentment at paying good money for a unit which is repeatedly smashed to bits in the first turn, game in, game out,
And hey, unit wound counters of some description are another tool you can sell folks.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Indeedy. Definitely one the best things about Apocalypse. Taking extensive early casualties is still going to be a problem later in the game, but nowhere near as outright disastrous as now.
Also helps prevent or at least reduce resentment at paying good money for a unit which is repeatedly smashed to bits in the first turn, game in, game out,
And hey, unit wound counters of some description are another tool you can sell folks.
If it went that way hopefully los blocking terrain goes reduced though or alpha strike to win becomes beta strike to win and gives incentive to not move from dz or get blown.
tneva82 wrote: Would flip balance toward going second certainly. Hides most army, 1st going can't shoot much and without it removing return fire gets shot back
Which is why KT-like activation system (adding alternating across all phases, including movement) would be boss.
tneva82 wrote: Would flip balance toward going second certainly. Hides most army, 1st going can't shoot much and without it removing return fire gets shot back
Which is why KT-like activation system (adding alternating across all phases, including movement) would be boss.
Looks good for Necrons- I hope they give us a teaser of some new models for some of the factions. I'm mostly interested in the fluff development and new models - really hoping they revamp some Nids/ evolve them forward..
WTF is that! [in a good way] Looks really impressive for Necrons..the towering figures look excellent..
Looks good for Necrons- I hope they give us a teaser of some new models for some of the factions. I'm mostly interested in the fluff development and new models - really hoping they revamp some Nids/ evolve them forward like they seem to have done for Necrons..
tneva82 wrote: Would flip balance toward going second certainly. Hides most army, 1st going can't shoot much and without it removing return fire gets shot back
Which is why KT-like activation system (adding alternating across all phases, including movement) would be boss.
It would slow down the game imho
I hear this argument a lot, but it all comes down to the time sinks. And the biggest time sinks are decision making and rolling+rerolling buckets of dice. Decision making is already being addressed at events with chess clocks, and rolling... well, it will most probably stay with us no matter the activation model. In the very worst-case scenario events, where time-frame matters, will cut points - to 1750 or something. Things we can get from alternate activation are far superior IMO - actual play and counter-play, instead of winning at list-building stage or executing turn-wide combos, for instance.
If I'm mad for the price increases but also love everything GW makes, what makes that of me? A white knight? An idiot? An addict? Hypocrite? I mean at least i never buy at GW retail prices...
The stuff mentioned, Codexes and 
