Hey everyone, I figured it would be a good idea to collect all the legitimate questions you find in the new Tau codex together into one thread. so they can be sent to tournament organizers and/or GW for use in making their FAQs.

So if you see legitimate arguments/discussions about rules questions in other threads, then please post the pertinent question (along with any relevant rules information) into this this thread. If a question is based on a loophole that 95% of players and judges are going to agree on the answer, then it isn't worth including on this list.

But most importantly: PLEASE DO NOT ACTUALLY DISCUSS/ARGUE THE RULES IN THIS THREAD. If you think a particular question has an easy answer that was missed by the person adding it into the thread, then posting about it ONCE is fine (and appreciated), but please do not engage in a back and forth discussion about a rule...start another thread on the topic if you need to do that.


Thanks!


I'll get the ball rolling with some of the questions I've seen posted in his forum so far along with some of my own questions:


Army Special Rules
• If the Supporting Fire special rule is being used to fire multiple Tau units at a single charging enemy unit, who chooses which order to resolve the different unit's shooting? Does the Tau player simply choose which valid units to fire (or not fire) one after the other? Or must the Tau player declare all the units he intends to fire overwatch with and then the player whose turn it is (the opposing player), gets to choose which order to resolve them in?
• Is overwatch fire from multiple units at the same enemy charging unit considered to be simultaneous? Or can a markerlight hit from the first unit firing overwatch then be used by the second unit firing overwatch at the same target, etc?


Ranged Weapons
• Can a model that is able to purchase 3 items from the Ranged Weapons chart (such as an XV8 Battlesuit) take 2 of the same weapon without twin-linking them (such as two separate plasma rifles, for example)? If so, can they also potentially use all 3 selections to triple up on a single weapon type, such as taking 1 plasma rifle as well as 1 twin-linked plasma rifle?
• If a firing unit scores a hit with both a networked markerlight & its other weapons on a swooping flying monstrous creature, does this force two grounding tests or just one?


Support Systems
• Can a Drone Controller benefit any type of Drones as the summary suggests, or are Missile Drones exempt from this benefit as the main rules text suggests?
• Does a Target Lock (or even the Split Fire rule) allow a unit that is firing Overwatch to target a 2nd enemy unit besides one that is charging them?
• If a markerlight counter is used to launch a seeker missile at a zooming flyer or swooping monstrous creature, what BS is used to roll to hit (the BS5 specified in the markerlight seeker rules or BS1 for firing snap shots)?
• If the above answer is that the snap shot BS1 takes precedence over the BS5 of a markerlight-launched Seeker Missile, what about if the firing model has the Skyfire special rule (like a Skyray)? In that case (a markerlight counter is used to launch a Seeker off of a Skyray), is the Skyray's own BS used (assuming it is using Skyfire to make this shooting attack)?
• The rules for Multi-trackers specifies that they allow the model to fire an extra weapon in the 'shooting phase'. Does this mean a model with a multi-tracker firing overwatch can only fire a single weapon?


Vehicle Battle Systems
• Does a Disruption Pod give the vehicle Stealth as the summary suggests, or just +1 Cover Save as the main rules text suggests?
• When a vehicle fires overwatch using a Point Defence Targeting Relay, does a markerlight count as being S5 or less?


Drones
• Although the rules are clear that attached Drones have to fire at the same target their vehicle fires at, can/do attached Drones fire at the same time the vehicle they're attached to fires? Or do you always fire them as a separate unit from the firing vehicle?
• If a model with a Drone Controller that has the Skyfire special rule fires at a zooming flyer or swooping monstrous creature, do any drones firing as part of that unit get to fire using the Drone Controller's normal BS, or do they still fire snap shots?
• If a model with a Drone Controller and a Counterfire Defense System is charged, do any Drones in the unit firing overwatch also benefit from the Counterfire Defense System bonus because of the Drone Controller?


HQ
• Aun'va's Paradox of Duality is rolled for when the unit suffers one or more unsaved wounds. If the shooting attack has other effects that trigger off of an unsaved wound, which is resolved first, the Paradox of Duality or the other effects? Or is the current player's choice to decide? And if the Paradox of Duality is allowed to be resolved first, then if it successfully discounts the wound, does whatever effect that was triggered from the unsaved wound then ignored as well?
• Can wounds that ignore cover be discarded by the Paradox of Duality?
• Is an Ethereal's Invocation of Elements range measured 12" to friendly MODELS or UNITS? The main rules text says units, but the summary says models.
• With the Ethereal's Invocation of Elements abilities, do you measure the 12" from the Ethereal at the start of the movement phase when the specific elemental power is declared to see which friendly units are affected, or do you check the 12" range continuously throughout the turn when another model would like to make use of the elemental power? For example, if a Firewarrior unit is within 12" of the Ethereal when he declares the 'Sense of Stone' power, do they still benefit from it until the start of their next turn even if they then move more than 12" away from the Ethereal? Or alternatively, if a unit starts the turn more than 12" away from the Ethereal can it then move back within 12" to benefit from an elemental power? If the latter is the case (that range is continuously checked throughout the turn), when exactly do you check range for the 'Zephyr's Grace' power? Do you check before a unit makes its run move, or after it finishes making its run move?


ELITES
• If a Steath Team contains 4 Stealth Suit models in it, can 1 or 2 of these models upgrade their burst cannon to a fusion blaster?
• Can an Independent Character join a Riptide unit?


FAST ATTACK
• If attached Interceptor Drones use the Interceptor rule to fire in the enemy turn at an enemy unit arriving from reserve, can they only fire snap shots if the Sun Shark they're attached to moved at cruising speed the previous turn? Or does the restriction on passengers only firing snap shots from a vehicle that moved cruising speed only apply to the same player turn the vehicle moved (as written)?
• If an Interceptor Drone detaches from a Sun Shark that moved or is moving cruising speed in the movement phase, are there any negative effects on the Drone's shooting in the subsequent shooting phase?
• Is the Sun Shark supposed to start with 1 Pulse Bomb (if not, how can it ever generate a Pulse Bomb as the Pulse Bomb Generator only works after a bombing run has already been made)?


HEAVY SUPPORT
• The twin-linked smart missile system on a Hammerhead and Sky Ray are the same points cost (free) as the twin-linked Burst Cannon despite being superior in every possible way. Is this a typo?


GENERAL RULEBOOK QUESTIONS
• Does the line of sight restriction for firing an Interceptor weapon in the opponent's turn apply even if the weapon itself doesn't require line of sight to its target?

Supporting Fire:

Can a unit use this ability to fire overwatch multiple times against separate targets if multiple units within 6" are charged? (It doesn't say you can't, and arguably the specific codex rule overrules the generic core rule saying you can't).

Drone Controller:

A unit composed of a crisis suit with a drone controller and skyfire upgrade shoots at a zooming flyer. Which takes precedence: do the drones use the controller's BS (since it can fire at full BS here), or does the "snap shots only" rule reduce the drones to BS 1? (Two simultaneous effects trying to set drone BS).

Riptide:

Can FNP saves be taken against nova charge wounds? RAW yes, but is this intentional?

Stealth Team:

Fusion is "every three models". Does this round up or down (IIRC there was a case recently where it rounds up). IOW, can a unit of four stealth suits take one fusion gun or two?

Sun Shark:

How do the drones work while carried as passengers? Do they count as weapons or embarked passengers? (If they're passengers they can only snap fire until they disembark because the flyer is moving at cruising speed).

Longstrike:

The normal vehicle overwatch system is limited to STR 5 weapons. Does Longstrike's similar ability have this limit, or can he fire with the Hammerhead's main gun too?

Does Longstrike's Hammerhead gain the character rule?

Advanced Targeting System:

The vehicle and infantry versions are slightly different: is the vehicle one also meant to grant precise shots on a 5+ to character vehicles that take it?

Decoy Launchers:

Do you get the save against any weapon that has the interceptor rule, or just weapons that are being fired using the interceptor rule?

Ethereal:

Apparently there's a difference in wording between the full and summary rules, one says any MODEL within 12" gains the benefit, the other says UNITS within 12" gain it. Apparently this is also different depending on the language.

Targeting Array:

GW forgot to add this to the support systems and vehicle upgrade lists:

Targeting array: a model with a targeting array has +1 BS.

(Yes, this is a serious issue. FW rules still have models that can take a targeting array, but now there are no more rules to explain what it does.)

Multitracker:

Again, an unfortunate omission from the vehicle upgrade list:

Multitracker: a vehicle with a multitracker counts as a fast vehicle when determining how many weapons it may fire at full BS.

 Peregrine wrote:
Supporting Fire:

Can a unit use this ability to fire overwatch multiple times against separate targets if multiple units within 6" are charged? (It doesn't say you can't, and arguably the specific codex rule overrules the generic core rule saying you can't).

It very clearly indicates that the unit may only fire overwatch once.

Sun Shark:

How do the drones work while carried as passengers? Do they count as weapons or embarked passengers? (If they're passengers they can only snap fire until they disembark because the flyer is moving at cruising speed).

Pretty clearly covered in the drone rules, also remember that a Zooming Flyer that moves 18 inches is moving at combat speed.

 Peregrine wrote:

Targeting Array:

GW forgot to add this to the support systems and vehicle upgrade lists:

Targeting array: a model with a targeting array has +1 BS.

(Yes, this is a serious issue. FW rules still have models that can take a targeting array, but now there are no more rules to explain what it does.)

Multitracker:

Again, an unfortunate omission from the vehicle upgrade list:

Multitracker: a vehicle with a multitracker counts as a fast vehicle when determining how many weapons it may fire at full BS.

I fully agree. These two issues must be address as it could potentially harm Forge World sales of Tau models. Why would any gamer want spend money on a BS3 Manta or BS3 Tiger Shark AX-1-0?

Another question that needs to be addressed is what becomes of Forge World Broadsides, which normally comes one 40mm base compared to the newer GW Broadside model that comes on a 60mm base?

 SabrX wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:

Targeting Array:

GW forgot to add this to the support systems and vehicle upgrade lists:

Targeting array: a model with a targeting array has +1 BS.

(Yes, this is a serious issue. FW rules still have models that can take a targeting array, but now there are no more rules to explain what it does.)

Multitracker:

Again, an unfortunate omission from the vehicle upgrade list:

Multitracker: a vehicle with a multitracker counts as a fast vehicle when determining how many weapons it may fire at full BS.

I fully agree. These two issues must be address as it could potentially harm Forge World sales of Tau models. Why would any gamer want spend money on a BS3 Manta or BS3 Tiger Shark AX-1-0?

Another question that needs to be addressed is what becomes of Forge World Broadsides, which normally comes one 40mm base compared to the newer GW Broadside model that comes on a 60mm base?

#
As far as I recall somewhere near the front of the rulebook it says you use the base that the model comes with. So 40mm is ok.

 SabrX wrote:

I fully agree. These two issues must be address as it could potentially harm Forge World sales of Tau models. Why would any gamer want spend money on a BS3 Manta or BS3 Tiger Shark AX-1-0?

Another question that needs to be addressed is what becomes of Forge World Broadsides, which normally comes one 40mm base compared to the newer GW Broadside model that comes on a 60mm base?

This happens everytime that GW updates a codex. FW is always pretty aware of these issues and takes care of them the next time they can update the relevant rules, although this is sadly tends to take a while.

So if you want to collate all the FW entries that utilize those upgrades, then that can be useful to pass onto TOs that use Imperial Armor in their events, but when it comes to actually getting GW, for example, to answer that question they're not going to bother as its an issue for FW to deal with at this point.

 Peregrine wrote:
Stealth Team:

Fusion is "every three models". Does this round up or down (IIRC there was a case recently where it rounds up). IOW, can a unit of four stealth suits take one fusion gun or two?

Don't remember the case you "quote" in parenthesis, but imo this is quite clear:
"one in every three models" means full multiples of three then with four stealth you get option for just one fusion gun - if you take two, you are taking one every two models, don't you think?
It should have said "... in every three models or fraction thereof" to let open the 'other' option.

Can you use your firewarrior shas'ui markerlights before anything else fires with the target lock he also gets, meaning you can effectively have a "markerlight" phase before you shoot anything

Kerrathyr wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:
Stealth Team:

Fusion is "every three models". Does this round up or down (IIRC there was a case recently where it rounds up). IOW, can a unit of four stealth suits take one fusion gun or two?

Don't remember the case you "quote" in parenthesis, but imo this is quite clear:
"one in every three models" means full multiples of three then with four stealth you get option for just one fusion gun - if you take two, you are taking one every two models, don't you think?
It should have said "... in every three models or fraction thereof" to let open the 'other' option.

I think he's thinking of the Noise Marine Blast Master thing, where it was 1 for every 10 models. They actually errata'd it to be 1, and one more if you have 10 or more.

HeadRipper wrote:Can you use your firewarrior shas'ui markerlights before anything else fires with the target lock he also gets, meaning you can effectively have a "markerlight" phase before you shoot anything

All models in a unit fire at the same time. He will be firing before other units, but not before other members of his squad.

The wording for the Stealth team fusion blasters is "For every three models in the unit (excluding drones)". That means full three models, not a fraction.

One to add, where RAW at the moment seems clear but I personally feel can't possibly be RAI.
Can Independent Characters join a Riptide, as it is not a unit that always consists of a single model?
Full thread here: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/518912.page#5475835

Can Pinpoint boost the accuracy of subsequent markerlight shots?

I guess this codex is pretty darn well written because it seems as though the vast majority of the questions being submitted are simply:

The rules are crystal clear, but is that REALLY what you mean by those rules?

Honestly, unless its something completely egregious that seems like it *must* be a loophole then it should probably be answered in a FAQ, but most of these things are just...well, the rules!

Do markerlights counters expended benefit other markerlights being shot at that unit? Yep. Rules are crystal clear and the fact that the previous rules went out of their way to deny such a thing makes it even less likely that they just forgot to include it.

Can ICs join a Riptide? Sure why not. Is it any more crazy than Tyranid Primes joining Carnifexes?

Can a model with a target lock and a markerlight fire before the rest of his unit? Nope, why would he? The rules are clear.

Can FNP be taken against Nova Charge wounds? Of course, it is not a save (and not a cheap FNP to purchase, either).

Does Longstrike's support fire ability have the same limitations as a Point Defense Targeting Relay? Why would it, they're different rules!

Does Longstrike give the vehicle the character rule? Why would he...he doesn't even have a profile, he is just an upgrade to the vehicle.

Do Decoy Luanchers get their save against a weapon with the Interceptor rule even when its not being fired in response to the vehicle arriving from reserve? Of course, that's what the rules say...Interceptor is not an on/off thing, it is a special rule that a weapon has that allows it to do special stuff, but no matter what that weapon still has the Interceptor rule.


I mean if you want to give me follow-up as to why you think these rules really are ambiguous, please do so, but from my perspective we seem to be getting too many 'are you really sure?' questions.

As the person who posted a couple of these:

 yakface wrote:
I mean if you want to give me follow-up as to why you think these rules really are ambiguous, please do so, but from my perspective we seem to be getting too many 'are you really sure?' questions.

Yes, some of these are obvious RAW. But you said this isn't just a tournament reference, it will be sent to GW with the intent of persuading them to include answers in the next FAQ. Those questions are IMO the kind of "RAW vs. fluff" where GW likes to change the rule because it wasn't "fluffy", and I'd much rather find out ASAP that Riptides don't get their FNP anymore than have it become established that they do and suddenly get a FAQ out of nowhere that changes it.

For Paradox of Duality wouldn't it be like Feel No Pain? Meaning unless it says otherwise you still suffer the effects?

Volley Fire:
Does Volley Fire also provide an additional shot for Longshot Pulse Rifles?

There's like a 90% chance that it doesn't, but I'd like to be sure.

 Peregrine wrote:
Yes, some of these are obvious RAW. But you said this isn't just a tournament reference, it will be sent to GW with the intent of persuading them to include answers in the next FAQ. Those questions are IMO the kind of "RAW vs. fluff" where GW likes to change the rule because it wasn't "fluffy"

This, basically. A Tyranid Prime joining a Carnifex may be a bit odd, but they are both big creatures nevertheless. So it's perhaps not unimaginable.
On the other hand, I can't see an Ethereal being saved because a Riptide decided to "leap into the bullet's path" for an LoS roll. Nor can I see a Battle Brother ally (Space Marine Captain perhaps?) sitting at the back of the field using it as a bodyguard either.

yakface wrote:Honestly, unless its something completely egregious that seems like it *must* be a loophole then it should probably be answered in a FAQ

...well... yes. Exactly! This is an FAQ collection thread.

And this is why I posted things like the "can Riptides take FNP against nova charge wounds": http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/518991.page . That question, and others like it, will be asked endlessly until GW finally says it explicitly in an FAQ. So the sooner that FAQ is written the better.

What do recon drones do?

XV8 Crisis Bodyguard Team pays 2pts per model for the Bonding Knife Ritual Special rule. No other unit in the codex pays 2per, is that a typo?

 psychadelicmime wrote:
What do recon drones do?

Page 38 of the Codex.

 yakface wrote:



Drones
• Although the rules are clear that attached Drones have to fire at the same target their vehicle fires at, dan/do attached Drones fire at the same time the vehicle they're attached to fires? Or do you always fire them as a separate unit from the firing vehicle? This is especially important for things like markerlight counters expended...in other words, does a markerlight counter expended to increase a vehicle's BS also apply to its attached drones, or do additional markerlight counters have to be expended separately to boost the attached Drones shooting?
•

I think this one should be pulled. It is pretty well answered on pg 33 Tau codex:" Target Acquired [the marklight special rule] abilities used by the Tau vehicle or vehicle squadrons, also apply to any attached drones."

Yak - you are told to treat vehicle attached drones as embarked passengers. As such they are NOT part of thre same unit as the vehicle, so do NOT fire at the same time.

Where actually are the points costs for the weapons used by battlesuits? The reference in the unit entry isn't very specific. Whilst not an actual FAQ question, thought best to ask here rather than make a new thread. Thanks!

 yakface wrote:

I

Can ICs join a Riptide? Sure why not. Is it any more crazy than Tyranid Primes joining Carnifexes?

This one is actually a little strange. The real question is do drones count when considering is a unit always a unit of one. Drones could be ruled both ways based on the other rules. Since an IC with drones is not consider to have a squad so can attach to other squads, and groups of drones are considered squads. If drones don't quad towards squad count then, no an IC can not join a Ripetide. If they do count towards a squad not always being a unit of 1, then yes IC can join the Ripetide


Automatically Appended Next Post:

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Yak - you are told to treat vehicle attached drones as embarked passengers. As such they are NOT part of thre same unit as the vehicle, so do NOT fire at the same time.

Nos, reread the entry. It reads like they do since they must fire at the same target and use the same Target Aquired rule.

Barnowls - no, drones cannot be ruled any other way. they are, RAW, additional members of the unit for al purposes. Rules are clear on this.

I HAVE read the unit entry, thanks for assuming I havent, and doing so while not countering the actual argument. The first line is you treat them as embarked passengers - which are ALWAYS separate units

You are then told *changes* to this rule - which is that they must fire at the same target. This is different to the normal rules.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Barnowls - no, drones cannot be ruled any other way. they are, RAW, additional members of the unit for al purposes. Rules are clear on this.

I HAVE read the unit entry, thanks for assuming I havent, and doing so while not countering the actual argument. The first line is you treat them as embarked passengers - which are ALWAYS separate units

You are then told *changes* to this rule - which is that they must fire at the same target. This is different to the normal rules.

Did not assume you hadn't as I said "reread" not read. New codex easy to miss stuff first reads through.And I did counter the argument, you just don't think it is valid and ignored it.

If they fire at separate time then how can they use the same "Target Aquired" rules? That would point to them firing at the same time as does the requirement to fire at the same target. N

barnowl wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Barnowls - no, drones cannot be ruled any other way. they are, RAW, additional members of the unit for al purposes. Rules are clear on this.

I HAVE read the unit entry, thanks for assuming I havent, and doing so while not countering the actual argument. The first line is you treat them as embarked passengers - which are ALWAYS separate units

You are then told *changes* to this rule - which is that they must fire at the same target. This is different to the normal rules.

Did not assume you hadn't as I said "reread" not read. New codex easy to miss stuff first reads through.And I did counter the argument, you just don't think it is valid and ignored it.

If they fire at separate time then how can they use the same "Target Aquired" rules? That would point to them firing at the same time as does the requirement to fire at the same target. N

They can use the same "Target Acquired" rules because the Drone rules say they can. Nothing in the Drone rules implies they have to fire at the same time. Only at the same target and with all the Markerlight bonuses the vehicle gets. No permission or requirement is given to fire them all at once, so you can't. Although it would probably pay to fire them right after to prevent you forgetting the target and bonuses.

A Pathfinder unit with drones consists of both Infantry, and Jet Pack Infantry. How far does such a unit redeploy when taking advantage of the "Scout" special rule.

NOTE: To save you having to reference the rulebook Yak, the issue is Scout says "If the unit is Infantry, Artillery, a Walker or a Monstrous Creature, each model can redeploy anywhere entirely within 6" of its current position. If it is any other unit type, each model can instead redeploy anywhere entirely within 12" of its current position." which is to say, it determines on a per unit basis, not a per model one.

This really would be a terrible unit, but . . . Could using 4 separate Ethereals (Invoking the Storm of Fire) each attached to an individual Fire warrior squadron; All within 12" of each other each grant the Fire warriors an Additional 4 shots apiece? Could the same be done for a single Fire warrior squad if you were to attach 4 Cadre Fireblades to the same squad?

 EnragedTemplar wrote:
This really would be a terrible unit, but . . . Could using 4 separate Ethereals (Invoking the Storm of Fire) each attached to an individual Fire warrior squadron; All within 12" of each other each grant the Fire warriors an Additional 4 shots apiece? Could the same be done for a single Fire warrior squad if you were to attach 4 Cadre Fireblades to the same squad?

No, the rules for Storm of Fire on page 35 already say that the power can only affect a unit once per turn, no matter how many Etherals are chanting about fire storms.

The Cadre Fireblade one though is a good question because the Volley Fire rule doesn't have the 'may only gain this affect once per turn' wording.

The Hammerhead and Skyray may replace their Gun Drones with either TL BCs, or TL SMS for free.

These two upgrades are identical except the SMS has longer range and Ignores cover, making the BC choice utterly pointless since they both cost the same (free.)

Was this intentional?

Commander Farsight doesn't have the deep strike special rule but he specifically has a warlord trait that utilizes that ability.

Can he and his bodyguard deep strike in?

 CrazyBones wrote:
Commander Farsight doesn't have the deep strike special rule but he specifically has a warlord trait that utilizes that ability.

Can he and his bodyguard deep strike in?

All Infantry(Jet Pack) Models have Deep Strike
Page 47 Jet Pack Units, special rules sub heading.

If a Broadside is equipped with Smart Missiles and a Early Warning Override granting it Interceptor, can it fire at units arriving from reserves that it doesn't have LOS to, or does the LOS restriction on Interceptor still override that?

note: I do think the RAW is they can't make interceptor fire, but I think it's worth looking at since many of the core rules don't take special rules into account well.

 Drunkspleen wrote:
A Pathfinder unit with drones consists of both Infantry, and Jet Pack Infantry. How far does such a unit redeploy when taking advantage of the "Scout" special rule.

NOTE: To save you having to reference the rulebook Yak, the issue is Scout says "If the unit is Infantry, Artillery, a Walker or a Monstrous Creature, each model can redeploy anywhere entirely within 6" of its current position. If it is any other unit type, each model can instead redeploy anywhere entirely within 12" of its current position." which is to say, it determines on a per unit basis, not a per model one.

I'd associate it with rules for mixed movement, where you move at the slowest rate.
So, in this case, you make the "scout move" at infantry 6" distance.

 Kerrathyr wrote:

 Drunkspleen wrote:
A Pathfinder unit with drones consists of both Infantry, and Jet Pack Infantry. How far does such a unit redeploy when taking advantage of the "Scout" special rule.

NOTE: To save you having to reference the rulebook Yak, the issue is Scout says "If the unit is Infantry, Artillery, a Walker or a Monstrous Creature, each model can redeploy anywhere entirely within 6" of its current position. If it is any other unit type, each model can instead redeploy anywhere entirely within 12" of its current position." which is to say, it determines on a per unit basis, not a per model one.

I'd associate it with rules for mixed movement, where you move at the slowest rate.
So, in this case, you make the "scout move" at infantry 6" distance.

The bolded is incorrect.
You can move however you want as long as you keep coherency. The "as fast as the slowest model" was 5th edition.

 Kerrathyr wrote:

 Drunkspleen wrote:
A Pathfinder unit with drones consists of both Infantry, and Jet Pack Infantry. How far does such a unit redeploy when taking advantage of the "Scout" special rule.

NOTE: To save you having to reference the rulebook Yak, the issue is Scout says "If the unit is Infantry, Artillery, a Walker or a Monstrous Creature, each model can redeploy anywhere entirely within 6" of its current position. If it is any other unit type, each model can instead redeploy anywhere entirely within 12" of its current position." which is to say, it determines on a per unit basis, not a per model one.

I'd associate it with rules for mixed movement, where you move at the slowest rate.
So, in this case, you make the "scout move" at infantry 6" distance.

That is only for charging. IMO the Infantry models can redeploy 6", the jetpack models 12". however htey still need to maintain coherency.

 Happyjew wrote:
That is only for charging. IMO the Infantry models can redeploy 6", the jetpack models 12". however htey still need to maintain coherency.

Looks like I messed up movement and charge. Thanks for the correction

 Drunkspleen wrote:
A Pathfinder unit with drones consists of both Infantry, and Jet Pack Infantry. How far does such a unit redeploy when taking advantage of the "Scout" special rule.

NOTE: To save you having to reference the rulebook Yak, the issue is Scout says "If the unit is Infantry, Artillery, a Walker or a Monstrous Creature, each model can redeploy anywhere entirely within 6" of its current position. If it is any other unit type, each model can instead redeploy anywhere entirely within 12" of its current position." which is to say, it determines on a per unit basis, not a per model one.

Actually looking into this issue, I don't think its an issue at all.

'Jet Pack' (and 'Jump') per the rulebook are not a unit type themselves. So drones are still considered infantry and therefore still make a 6" scout move.

I guess a more general question for the main rulebook FAQ would be: Do Jump and/or Jet Pack infantry units that have the Scout ability only get to redeploy 6".

Because I think the answer is actually clear in the rules, but I think a lot of people would read it and still assume that Jet Pack and Jump Infantry are *not* infantry and therefore get to redeploy 12".

That's certainly a valid observation, The transport rules strongly suggested to me that "Infantry" does not inherently include Infantry models with those other unit types attached:

"Only Infantry models can embark upon Transports (this does not include Jump or Jet Pack Infantry)"

I see that as a clarifying statement that those other types do not fall into the basic category of Infantry, but then you could argue that it's not a clarifying statement but an additional rule applied for that specific situation only.

Can they confirm that if Kroot upgrade to sniper rounds they get to choose which profile to use; the normal rifle or the sniper? The note in the summary section suggests this is the case but its not 100% explicit to me.

Hi guys, just some clarifications needed on Tau markerlights.

1- In what order of operations do units with markerlight drones, and markerlights fire their markerlights and weapons?

2- Units cannot benefit from their own markerlights as they are removed/expended before shooting... so how can a unit shoot off a markerlight and have someone make use of it at all?

3. Do markerlights roll to hit at all? obviously not to wound. Having never used one in a game im just trying to rap my newbie head around these rules.

4- Since markerlights are a heavy 1 shot... can markerlight drones that deep strike with a crisis team not fire for that turn? Or do marker lights snap fire?

thanks for any clarifications gents

 CorpseCommander wrote:
Hi guys, just some clarifications needed on Tau markerlights.

1- In what order of operations do units with markerlight drones, and markerlights fire their markerlights and weapons?

2- Units cannot benefit from their own markerlights as they are removed/expended before shooting... so how can a unit shoot off a markerlight and have someone make use of it at all?

3. Do markerlights roll to hit at all? obviously not to wound. Having never used one in a game im just trying to rap my newbie head around these rules.

4- Since markerlights are a heavy 1 shot... can markerlight drones that deep strike with a crisis team not fire for that turn? Or do marker lights snap fire?

thanks for any clarifications gents

This is not the appropriate thread to post these questions. This thread is for legitimate questions that have no answers in the rules so they can be submitted to GW and/or tournaments.

All the questions you posted above are clearly answered in the rules themselves, and besides that, this thread isn't for answering questions, just for collecting questions.

Question:
Can interceptor Drones use supporting fire while still attached to a Sunshark?

Edit: Thought there was no precedence for units in units, nevermind.

Okay, putting this here because I see people arguing this:
Do drones attached to vehicles use thier own BS or the vehicles. The way I read the rules they use thier own, but since this is for GW to end any argument on with a FAQ, Im posting it.

juraigamer wrote:What happens to gun drones disembarking when in a squad of piranha, of say 5.

Do they make 5 2 man gun drone units or 1 10 man unit?

cryhavok wrote:Okay, putting this here because I see people arguing this:
Do drones attached to vehicles use thier own BS or the vehicles. The way I read the rules they use thier own, but since this is for GW to end any argument on with a FAQ, Im posting it.

Both these questions are explicitly answered in the rules...where is there any ambiguity?

Agreed, those two are both explicitly answered on page 33. In particular, look for the sentences containing the key terms "fire points" and then "vehicle squadrons".

Question:
If the Sunshark Bomber evades, are the Interceptor drones restricted to firing only snap shots? In general, do passengers embarked on a zooming flier with fire points fire only snap shots when the flier evades? (RAW, no: fluff, yes)

I made a thread here on You Make Da Call but I will add my question to this one and request mine be shut down, thanks!


A few questions have come to mind with the new Tau supporting fire special rule. I will number them and add more in updates if people are interested in discussion.

1. Do all overwatch shots coming from multiple squads get fired at the same time or separately for each squad participating?
Example: 3 fire warrior squads A, B, and C are standing side by side 5" apart A on the 'left' B in the middle and C on the right. Each squad has 2 marker drones. Squad B in the middle gets targeted for assault, squads A and C elect to assist them with supporting fire.

Possibility A. Squad A shoots first and hits with a marker drone, squad A can not benefit from their marklight hit as it is fired at the same time as their pulse rifles. Then it comes to squad B's turn to fire their overwatch the assaulting squad has a marker token from A's shooting and can use it, if B hits C can then use their Marker.

Possibility B. All Overwatch is fired simultaneously and none of the participating squads can benefit from a markerlight unless it has specific rules allowing it to benefit the squad as it shoots.

2. Can you use a flamers "Wall of Death" effect in conjunction with Supporting Fire? I can imagine this leading to some VERY dumb situations where a flamer could Wall of Death around 42" away.

3. Does supporting fire count as actually firing over watch for the purposes of special rules? I.E. darkstrider's running away, gravity drones, etc.

 Jadenim wrote:
Can they confirm that if Kroot upgrade to sniper rounds they get to choose which profile to use; the normal rifle or the sniper? The note in the summary section suggests this is the case but its not 100% explicit to me.

Considering the codex entry states it's an upgrade, I would think it replaces the pulse rounds. I'm probably wrong but can't think of any upgrades that allow you access to your old equipment.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

From wrote:
I made a thread here on You Make Da Call but I will add my question to this one and request mine be shut down, thanks!


A few questions have come to mind with the new Tau supporting fire special rule. I will number them and add more in updates if people are interested in discussion.

1. Do all overwatch shots coming from multiple squads get fired at the same time or separately for each squad participating?
Example: 3 fire warrior squads A, B, and C are standing side by side 5" apart A on the 'left' B in the middle and C on the right. Each squad has 2 marker drones. Squad B in the middle gets targeted for assault, squads A and C elect to assist them with supporting fire.

Possibility A. Squad A shoots first and hits with a marker drone, squad A can not benefit from their marklight hit as it is fired at the same time as their pulse rifles. Then it comes to squad B's turn to fire their overwatch the assaulting squad has a marker token from A's shooting and can use it, if B hits C can then use their Marker.

Possibility B. All Overwatch is fired simultaneously and none of the participating squads can benefit from a markerlight unless it has specific rules allowing it to benefit the squad as it shoots.

2. Can you use a flamers "Wall of Death" effect in conjunction with Supporting Fire? I can imagine this leading to some VERY dumb situations where a flamer could Wall of Death around 42" away.

3. Does supporting fire count as actually firing over watch for the purposes of special rules? I.E. darkstrider's running away, gravity drones, etc.

3. Oddly enough, I think it works RAW. "When an enemy charges, all friendly models with this special rule in units within 6" of the unit being charged can choose to fire Overwatch." Interesting possibilities there.

EDIT: Sorry, removed to reduce clutter and misinformation.

Trasvi wrote:
I think the answer is A. The markerlight rules specifically state they can be used for overwatch, and units cannot benefit from their own markerlights. (unless they are a vehicle with networked markerlights, in which case they can't overwatch. Unless they have an upgrade, in which case....)

What happens when Longstrike is piloting a Skyray which gets to overwatch, either by supporting fire or by being assaulted?


As for your question 2, I don't have my rulebook on hand, but does overwatch ever say anything about if you need to be in range? Without a range modifier, RAW you can fire even if not in range. The rule was obviously intended for when one unit is assaulted by the enemy, so you will be in range. But add an extra 6 inches or more onto that....

Again people...there are only 2 reasons to post in this thread:

1) If you've looked at the book and are 100% sure there is an ambiguous situation that has no clear resolution per the rules and therefore needs to be included in a list of FAQ questions (or the odd case where the RAW is so illogical that the question will naturally get asked a 1,000 times if it isn't answered).

2) if you see a question posted that you then consult the book and realize there IS a CRYSTAL CLEAR answer to that question to the point where it looks like it was a mistake to even have that question posted in this thread, then you can post here to point that out.


Otherwise, PLEASE DO NOT POST IN THIS THREAD. Please do not ask questions that you haven't had the chance to look thoroughly through the book to research and please do not attempt to 'answer' questions in this thread unless you've done similar thorough research and determined that the question has a completely clear answer in the rules.

Alright. This may be simple, but thought I'd voice it rather than make a separate topic:

The Commander suit can take 4 hard points. Of which consist of Support Systems and Weapons; the bullet under it says you may select items from the Signature System.

Does this imply that Signature Systems are considered hard points, or not? I would assume not, but I have local gamers who say they count as hard points, seeing as how Signature Systems remind me of the Special Issue stuff that didn't take up a hard point last Codex; I believe.

Thanks!

Contrast the Commander and Bodyguard with the Crisis Team Shas'vre and you'll have your answer.

About 80% of the questions asked here have answers in the BRB or the Codex.

Argh, ignore this...I forgot stunned vehicles can snapshot now. Thanks Nos.

(Original post) Ok, new one from another thread...

Can you expend markerlights to fire seeker missiles from a vehicle that is stunned?

It's ambiguous in my eyes as the stunned model is the one firing the missile, but the markerlight rule says the missile is fired in addition to any other weapons you are normally permitted to fire.

"at full BS", when a stunned vehicle can only snapshot, means you can indeed fire. Same way PotMS could fire even if the vehicle was not permitted to fire anything.

To Cleverantics post

Do the signature systems count towards the number of sytems/ weapons a suit can take.
This is something that really needs to get a faq on which way it goes.

We are having it played it does count until an faq says wether or not it does.

There is a precedence set for this ruling on pg. 100 of the codex which states " a Crisis Shas'vre may take up to three items from the ranged weapons, signature systems and/ or support systems list."

Similar to the crisis suit ranged weapon, can a commander take 2 twin-linked weapons of the same type in its 4 ranged weapon hardpoints?

If so, I've found the model I want to be my commander...

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/Tau/TAU-BATTLESUITS-AND-DRONES/XV9-HAZARD-CLOSE-SUPPORT-ARMOUR.html

HeadRipper wrote:
Can you use your firewarrior shas'ui markerlights before anything else fires with the target lock he also gets, meaning you can effectively have a "markerlight" phase before you shoot anything

This is an easy one: NO.

Re-read the rules on the shooting phase. You nominate a unit to shoot, and then do all the shooting from that unit. Once ALL the shooting from that unit is done, you move onto the next unit. The 'ui markerlight shot happens simultaneously with all the other shots from his unit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 BlueRift wrote:
Volley Fire:
Does Volley Fire also provide an additional shot for Longshot Pulse Rifles?

There's like a 90% chance that it doesn't, but I'd like to be sure.

Where are you getting that 90% from?

Volley Fire affects all PULSE weapons.
Is the LongShot pulse rifle a pulse weapon? YES.
Does volley fire give an extra shot to the Long shot pulse rifle? CLEARLY YES.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Jadenim wrote:
Can they confirm that if Kroot upgrade to sniper rounds they get to choose which profile to use; the normal rifle or the sniper? The note in the summary section suggests this is the case but its not 100% explicit to me.

Read it again. How could it be any more explicit?! weapons marked with an * may choose which profile to use when firing.
Of course they can use both. This is why the upgrade is worded as them taking sniper rounds for their rifles, not replacing their kroot rifles with sniper rifles.

 Cheesedoodler wrote:

 BlueRift wrote:
Volley Fire:
Does Volley Fire also provide an additional shot for Longshot Pulse Rifles?

There's like a 90% chance that it doesn't, but I'd like to be sure.

Where are you getting that 90% from?

Volley Fire affects all PULSE weapons.
Is the LongShot pulse rifle a pulse weapon? YES.
Does volley fire give an extra shot to the Long shot pulse rifle? CLEARLY YES.

Here's where reading the rules helps. Volley Fire doesn't affect all Pulse Weapons, it affects only Pulse Rifles and Pulse Carbines. So the answer is clearly No, it doesn't affect Longshot Pulse Rifles, in the same way First Rank Fire, Second Rank Fire! doesn't affect Hotshot Lasguns.

Now the Ethereal's Storm of Fire on the other hand, that does affect all Pulse Weapons, excluding the Pulse bomb. So that will affect Longshot Pulse Rifles.

Chrysis wrote:

 Cheesedoodler wrote:

 BlueRift wrote:
Volley Fire:
Does Volley Fire also provide an additional shot for Longshot Pulse Rifles?

There's like a 90% chance that it doesn't, but I'd like to be sure.

Where are you getting that 90% from?

Volley Fire affects all PULSE weapons.
Is the LongShot pulse rifle a pulse weapon? YES.
Does volley fire give an extra shot to the Long shot pulse rifle? CLEARLY YES.

Here's where reading the rules helps. Volley Fire doesn't affect all Pulse Weapons, it affects only Pulse Rifles and Pulse Carbines. So the answer is clearly No, it doesn't affect Longshot Pulse Rifles, in the same way First Rank Fire, Second Rank Fire! doesn't affect Hotshot Lasguns.

Now the Ethereal's Storm of Fire on the other hand, that does affect all Pulse Weapons, excluding the Pulse bomb. So that will affect Longshot Pulse Rifles.

You've got me there. I was mixing the wording of the two rules.

Q: Does the Stealth Suit Shas'vre's markerlight/target lock upgrade also work on a fusion blaster upgrade?

Since fusion blaster is a "one model may" upgrade, I'd like to load him out with the markerlight/target lock, a fusion blaster and an advanced targeting system to either infiltrate and hit armor or snipe special weapons.

 Space Ghost wrote:
Q: Does the Stealth Suit Shas'vre's markerlight/target lock upgrade also work on a fusion blaster upgrade?

Yes, the only thing that gets replaced in any of that is the burst cannon. There's nothing ambiguous here.

Question regarding Vectored Retro-thrusters (VRT):

Can a unit of more than one model with VRT use the Hit and Run special rules to leave CC?

Per TE Codex:

A model with VRT has both Fleet and Hit and Run Special Rules.

Per 6th Ed Rulebook:

A unit that contains at least one model with this special rule that is locked in combat can choose to leave close combat
at the end of any Assault phase. If the unit wishes to do so, it must take an Initiative test.

Seems to me that by RAW the unit can attempt to leave CC. However, verification of this would be useful, since this equipment used to only apply to Monat (single suit units) in the old codex and you could only purchase one per army.

You asked and answered your own question.

How does a Model with Velocity tracker/Counter fire Defense system and Drone controller work When dealing with drones and Snapshots? Do the Drones fire at Ballistic skill 1 or do they continue to use the Drone controller's ballistic skill which is either unaffected or bs 2?

You can purchase a 2 man bodyguard team to go with your force Commander. Does this now prevent him from being able to join other units as an independent character, such as a drone unit?

hokieseas wrote:
You can purchase a 2 man bodyguard team to go with your force Commander. Does this now prevent him from being able to join other units as an independent character, such as a drone unit?

There is no requirement to have the IC join his bodyguard unit.

Literally every codex since the latter half of 4th edition has been this way.

So yes, if the IC joins his bodyguard he cannot join another unit at the same time (as he has already joined one).

hokieseas wrote:
You can purchase a 2 man bodyguard team to go with your force Commander. Does this now prevent him from being able to join other units as an independent character, such as a drone unit?

Bodyguards are now a completely separate unit to the commander. A bodyguard squad is simply a 1-2 man Crisis team.
You can take the bodyguard squad and a commander, but not join them together, in which case your commander is free to act as any independent character normally would.
If you deploy them with the commander in the bodyguard's unit, he has joined their unit and thus cannot join another unit without first leaving his bodyguards.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Question:
Recon Drones don't explicitly have the supporting fire special rule. Do they inherit it from their Pathfinder unit?

Question:
The Tau Warlord Traits table says 'When generating Warlord Traits, a Commander or Ethereal may either roll on one of the Warlord Traits tables in the Warhammer 40,000 rule book, or roll on the table presented on the right".
Can Cadre Fireblades and Darkstrider take warlord traits from the table in the Tau book?

Trasvi wrote:

Question:
The Tau Warlord Traits table says 'When generating Warlord Traits, a Commander or Ethereal may either roll on one of the Warlord Traits tables in the Warhammer 40,000 rule book, or roll on the table presented on the right".
Can Cadre Fireblades and Darkstrider take warlord traits from the table in the Tau book?

Answered in the FAQ with replace this sentence with "When generating A Tau warlord's trait, you may either roll on the table here or on the Tables in the warhammer 40k rulebook."

Doh.

Ok another one brought up in a tactics thread. I think it is pretty pedantic, but oh well...

The multi-tracker allows you to 'fire an extra weapon each shooting phase.'
Does this ability also apply when Overwatching, or does it only apply to literally your own shooting phase?

Given literally every shooting attack is defined as occuring in the shooting phase, eithe they all work or they dont.

If a model has a twin linked weapon, and is In a unit with a command and control node, does the model get to Reroll to hit twice?

Basic rule is you may never reroll a reroll. So No.

Can seekers fired from Broadsides be fired at a separate target from the one the broadsides are targeting. The rule says they must fire at the same unit as the vehicle. Since you always have to fire at the same target with all weapons, this clause is either worthless or means broadside seekers can shoot another target.

I believe that might be a holdover from last edition: Previously seekers would be 'called in' by any unit against a target which has been marked, and had essentially nothing to do with the vehicle carrying the missile.
Now, it serves to show that you can't pick any random unit with a markerlight hit and launch a seeker at it: it's only from the carrying vehicle (or broadside) and only at the target they're already shooting.
Perhaps a bit redundant, but also useful to people who are used to the old rules.

GW has never made clarifications to older codex rules before. That is why this is so odd. Im inclined to believe that we are to ignore that sentence altogether, but until an FAQ says that, it is confusing

Interesting one popped up in one of my games today; the Ethereal's Storm of Fire power states that it can only be used once per turn, but is this player turn or game turn? I.e can you use it in your shooting phase and then also for over watch in your opponents assault phase? (If it's player turn based)

 Jadenim wrote:
Interesting one popped up in one of my games today; the Ethereal's Storm of Fire power states that it can only be used once per turn, but is this player turn or game turn? I.e can you use it in your shooting phase and then also for over watch in your opponents assault phase? (If it's player turn based)

The codex specifically says the units benefit from this power until the Ethereal's next movement phase, unless he is killed before then, which the power ends immediately. So, it would last all through your opponents following turn after you invoke the power.

 Jadenim wrote:
Interesting one popped up in one of my games today; the Ethereal's Storm of Fire power states that it can only be used once per turn, but is this player turn or game turn? I.e can you use it in your shooting phase and then also for over watch in your opponents assault phase? (If it's player turn based)

Not interesting, given the rulebook defines turn as player turn, unless specified otherwise. The Ethereals rule then specifies the duration.

Please do some basic rules research (just searching turn = player turn? would probably have done it) before posting here

Can MSS force you to use the Onager Gauntlet? If they can, does it reduce the random number of attacks to 1?

Question:
Can drones attached to a vehicle use overwatch and supporting fire? A cursory reading of the relevant rules doesn't seem to show any reason why they could not. However, the Point Defense Targeting Relay explicitly gives attached drones the ability to fire overwatch.
If the vehicle with a PDTR or Longstrike uses overwatch/supporting fire, are the drones forced to use overwatch/supporting fire at the same target? Or are they able to decline to overwatch, and use overwatch/supporting fire on another unit?
A drones attached to a vehicle with Longstrike able to use overwatch/supporting fire multiple times?

Trasvi wrote:
Question:
Can drones attached to a vehicle use overwatch and supporting fire? A cursory reading of the relevant rules doesn't seem to show any reason why they could not. However, the Point Defense Targeting Relay explicitly gives attached drones the ability to fire overwatch.
If the vehicle with a PDTR or Longstrike uses overwatch/supporting fire, are the drones forced to use overwatch/supporting fire at the same target? Or are they able to decline to overwatch, and use overwatch/supporting fire on another unit?
A drones attached to a vehicle with Longstrike able to use overwatch/supporting fire multiple times?

The Tau Codex says:

"This means that while they are attached, they can make shooting attacks as if they were passengers shooting from Fire Points..."

Reading in the Drone rules, all drone have the Supporting Fire special rule.

Reading the BRB under Transport:

"If a Transport vehicle is assaulted, an embarked unit can fire Overwatch at the attackers out of its Fire Points."

It is possible that since Hammerhead and Sky Rays don't have the Transport rule, their Drones can't fire Overwatch without the Point Defense Targeting Relay, though they do have embarked units so I'm not entirely sure.


For your question on shooting the same target or holding overwatch, probably not since it says that the Drone must shoot at the same target as the vehicle. The Devilfish may be able to get away with it with since it is a transport.

Support Fire with the Devilfish and Overwatch against assault with the drones.

Trasvi wrote:
Recon Drones don't explicitly have the supporting fire special rule. Do they inherit it from their Pathfinder unit?

Yea they do it's right above the "Turret Mounting" rule listed for all the special drones on pg.38, ofcourse the recon drone is the only one who actually benefits from it.

 megatrons2nd wrote:
Can MSS force you to use the Onager Gauntlet? If they can, does it reduce the random number of attacks to 1?

Yes and no: printed rules. No reasonable argument can be made otherwise.

 Cheesedoodler wrote:

HeadRipper wrote:
Can you use your firewarrior shas'ui markerlights before anything else fires with the target lock he also gets, meaning you can effectively have a "markerlight" phase before you shoot anything

This is an easy one: NO.

Re-read the rules on the shooting phase. You nominate a unit to shoot, and then do all the shooting from that unit. Once ALL the shooting from that unit is done, you move onto the next unit. The 'ui markerlight shot happens simultaneously with all the other shots from his unit.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 BlueRift wrote:
Volley Fire:
Does Volley Fire also provide an additional shot for Longshot Pulse Rifles?

There's like a 90% chance that it doesn't, but I'd like to be sure.

Where are you getting that 90% from?

Volley Fire affects all PULSE weapons.
Is the LongShot pulse rifle a pulse weapon? YES.
Does volley fire give an extra shot to the Long shot pulse rifle? CLEARLY YES.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Jadenim wrote:
Can they confirm that if Kroot upgrade to sniper rounds they get to choose which profile to use; the normal rifle or the sniper? The note in the summary section suggests this is the case but its not 100% explicit to me.

Read it again. How could it be any more explicit?! weapons marked with an * may choose which profile to use when firing.
Of course they can use both. This is why the upgrade is worded as them taking sniper rounds for their rifles, not replacing their kroot rifles with sniper rifles.

1.) You are correct regarding the Shas'Ui markerlight, it is simultaneous, just at a different target.

2.) You are incorrect. THe VOlley FIre Special rule clearly states Pulse Rifles and Pulse Carbines, not Pulse Weapons

3.) You are correct, the key word is take, not exchange

 HoverBoy wrote:

Trasvi wrote:
Recon Drones don't explicitly have the supporting fire special rule. Do they inherit it from their Pathfinder unit?

Yea they do it's right above the "Turret Mounting" rule listed for all the special drones on pg.38, ofcourse the recon drone is the only one who actually benefits from it.

Lol. There I go looking at the fine print and missing the big huge 'special rules' underneath.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Another Drone question:
If a model equipped with a Drone Controller is forced to snap fire, but drones in the same squad are not, what ballistic skill do the drones use?
As an example: A sniper drone team moves and the marksman elects to fire his markerlight as a snap shot. Do the drones then shoot at BS5 or BS1? RAW I believe it would be BS5, as only the bearer's *shot is resolved at BS1*, rather than the bearer being reduced to BS1, but the question did come up in a game.

They all still use his BS5, it's just that his own markerlight is resolved at BS1 for snapshot.

 HoverBoy wrote:
They all still use his BS5, it's just that his own markerlight is resolved at BS1 for snapshot.

Still needs Clarification, because the Drone controller says Uses the bearer's Ballistic skill ands its pretty much split 50/50 with people says you use his BS, then modify it for the drones or you use his BS after all modifiers take place. now if the FAQ comes out and says "You modify the Ballistic skill before you roll" then yes they would retain BS5 but if it doesnt say anything..... we are stuck with the unclear writing.

Drones are Jet pack infantry, they have relentless so they can shoot the weapons at BS5

Dracoknight wrote:
Drones are Jet pack infantry, they have relentless so they can shoot the weapons at BS5

It still depends on the Ruling for Drone Controller, if its after all modifers they will shoot at BS 1, if its before modifers than they will shoot at BS 5.

Snap shot does not affect the model's actual BS it just affects the shots he makes.
A model making a snapshot isn't reduced to BS1 he resolves the shot at BS1.

 HoverBoy wrote:
Snap shot does not affect the model's actual BS it just affects the shots he makes.
A model making a snapshot isn't reduced to BS1 he resolves the shot at BS1.

This is correct. So the drones use his full BS5

If a Sun Shark hits a Flying Monstrous Creature with it's networked markerlight, does it take it's grounding test before all the other weapons on the Sun Shark fire? Which could then make it snap shots for the Sun Shark to hit as it had to choose to "Skyfire" this turn, and the creature may have failed it's grounded test.

 megatrons2nd wrote:
If a Sun Shark hits a Flying Monstrous Creature with it's networked markerlight, does it take it's grounding test before all the other weapons on the Sun Shark fire? Which could then make it snap shots for the Sun Shark to hit as it had to choose to "Skyfire" this turn, and the creature may have failed it's grounded test.

It takes the grounding test before you fire the rest of the weapons. The Sun Shark will fire at normal BS since it's still firing at a FMC (it doesn't matter if it's swooping or gliding). I'm not sure if the second round of shooting would trigger another grounding test if the first one is passed.

You take a grounding test once per unit that is firing, so there is no allowance for taking it before the rest of the units weapons fire.

There is still one unit firing, there is still only one test.

Yeah, this seems to be a functionally irrelevant question.

The only two things in the codex that have a networked markerlight are vehicles that have skyfire as well (including the drones on the bomber).

So whether the FMC gets grounded by the networked markerlight or not does not matter to them, and the rules seem pretty clear that you're only taking one grounding test per unit's shooting.

So whether you take the test after the networked markerlight or after the rest of the unit's shooting is essentially irrelevant in this case.

Dracoknight wrote:

 HoverBoy wrote:
Snap shot does not affect the model's actual BS it just affects the shots he makes.
A model making a snapshot isn't reduced to BS1 he resolves the shot at BS1.

This is correct. So the drones use his full BS5

I agree that RAW the rules work this way. The question is simply the reverse of one of the ones on the first page: If the drone controller does not fire snap shots in a situation where the drones do (ie, controller has skyfire), what BS do they use? If it is ruled that the drones also get skyfire in that situation, you could argue make sense that they fire BS1 in this one?

RE: FMC and grounding:
If the FMC gets grounded from the markerlight, doesn't that mean that the rest of the weapons on the skyray are now firing skyfire at a ground target, ie needing snapshots?

Trasvi wrote:

RE: FMC and grounding:
If the FMC gets grounded from the markerlight, doesn't that mean that the rest of the weapons on the skyray are now firing skyfire at a ground target, ie needing snapshots?

Nope, check the rules for Skyfire and you'll see.

Skyfire fires normal BS against Skimmers, Flyers & FMCs. It does not matter if the FMC is swooping or gliding.

Trasvi wrote:

Dracoknight wrote:

 HoverBoy wrote:
Snap shot does not affect the model's actual BS it just affects the shots he makes.
A model making a snapshot isn't reduced to BS1 he resolves the shot at BS1.

This is correct. So the drones use his full BS5

I agree that RAW the rules work this way. The question is simply the reverse of one of the ones on the first page: If the drone controller does not fire snap shots in a situation where the drones do (ie, controller has skyfire), what BS do they use?

They still use his BS but with no skyfire of their own they snapshoot.
Same as the other case their BS is still=drone controller use, just the shots are resolved at BS1, i see no RAW way for him to transfer his special rules just his BS and in the more specific case of targetting a unit with hard to hit they kinda loose out.

 HoverBoy wrote:

Trasvi wrote:

Dracoknight wrote:

 HoverBoy wrote:
Snap shot does not affect the model's actual BS it just affects the shots he makes.
A model making a snapshot isn't reduced to BS1 he resolves the shot at BS1.

This is correct. So the drones use his full BS5

I agree that RAW the rules work this way. The question is simply the reverse of one of the ones on the first page: If the drone controller does not fire snap shots in a situation where the drones do (ie, controller has skyfire), what BS do they use?

They still use his BS but with no skyfire of their own they snapshoot.
Same as the other case their BS is still=drone controller use, just the shots are resolved at BS1, i see no RAW way for him to transfer his special rules just his BS and in the more specific case of targetting a unit with hard to hit they kinda loose out.

And agian it comes down to when do we use the Drone controller's BS because it does not defines a set "phase" to transfer it. in the FAQ about using special attacks to modify BS on snap shots it mentions abilities that all happen before you actually roll to attack, where as the drone controller mentions no time (ie before/during/after) when you use the Bearer's ballistic skill, just that you use it instead of the model's own. the drone controller needs GW answer.

I have another question about the Paradox of Duality. It says the wound is discounted as if a cover save has been passed. How does this interact with the Tally of Pestilence rule, and how does this interact with weapons that ignore cover saves?

Marker lights and supporting fire. Are all supporting fire happening simultaneously with overwatch? If not then can marker lights be utilized from the overwatch squad to help supporting squads or vice versa?

 Tomb King wrote:
Marker lights and supporting fire. Are all supporting fire happening simultaneously with overwatch? If not then can marker lights be utilized from the overwatch squad to help supporting squads or vice versa?

Why would there be specific permission for them to affect overwatch, if they can't be used in a manner where it matters.

 Tomb King wrote:
Marker lights and supporting fire. Are all supporting fire happening simultaneously with overwatch? If not then can marker lights be utilized from the overwatch squad to help supporting squads or vice versa?

When an enemy charges, the units that are in Range and have Supporting fire can choose to "Overwatch"

"Resolve Overwatch" is a subphase of the Assault phase and if chosen, is immediately after an enemy declares a charge against one of your units.

Support Fire allows other units to also Overwatch and if they choose to, then it also occurs immediately after an enemy declares a charge against one of your units.

Thus both the unit being Charged and any "Supporting Fire" units that choose to, will fire and resolve Overwatch at the same time.

40k-noob wrote:
Thus both the unit being Charged and any "Supporting Fire" units that choose to, will fire and resolve Overwatch at the same time.

Pg. 27 in the rulebook tells you to resolve each units shots seperately.

overkongen wrote:

40k-noob wrote:
Thus both the unit being Charged and any "Supporting Fire" units that choose to, will fire and resolve Overwatch at the same time.

Pg. 27 in the rulebook tells you to resolve each units shots seperately.

Resolve Separately but at the same time. You can't go from one declared charge to the next declared charge and then go back to that first supporting unit and fire at that first charger.

Also if you are firing at the same time, no marker lights are on the unit as you fire. But I can see a faq going the other way as well.

edit: spelling

Nowhere does it say it's resolved at the same time. Instantly is not the same as simultaneously. It's resolved as a normal shooting attack which follows the shooting sequence listed on page 12.

40k-noob wrote:

Resolve Separately but at the same time. You can't go from one declared charge to the next declared charge and then go back to that first supporting unit and fire at that first charger.

Also if you are firing at the same time, no marker lights are on the unit as you fire. But I can see a faq going the other way as well.

edit: spelling

You know how you know your interpretation is dead-wrong (besides the fact that the rules don't support what you're saying)? Because markerlights specifically say that they can be used to improve overwatch shooting.

 yakface wrote:

40k-noob wrote:

Resolve Separately but at the same time. You can't go from one declared charge to the next declared charge and then go back to that first supporting unit and fire at that first charger.

Also if you are firing at the same time, no marker lights are on the unit as you fire. But I can see a faq going the other way as well.

edit: spelling

You know how you know your interpretation is dead-wrong (besides the fact that the rules don't support what you're saying)? Because markerlights specifically say that they can be used to improve overwatch shooting.

guess I missed that part of the codex. What page would that be on?

40k-noob wrote:

guess I missed that part of the codex. What page would that be on?

The last sentence of the 'pinpoint markerlight' rules.

I have the iOS version of the codex, so I can't give you a printed version page #.

40k-noob wrote:
guess I missed that part of the codex. What page would that be on?

Pg. 68.

Multi tracker - says you can fire an additional weapon in the shooting phase is this an oversight or is it intended that you can only overwatch with 1 weapon per battlesuit?

Pathfinder shas'ui can take a blacksun filter for 1pt, even though blacksun filters on pathfinders are almost useless, however the fire warrior team leader cannot, oversight or intended?

huh.. until reading this thread I never even noticed that the codex states a twin linked burst cannon instead of two burst cannons... great... gotta build some smart missiles now, thats sure to be FAQ'd but until then thats a pain

It will need faq'd though as they technically happen at the same time and I can see people arguing both ways.

Bobug wrote:
Multi tracker - says you can fire an additional weapon in the shooting phase is this an oversight or is it intended that you can only overwatch with 1 weapon per battlesuit?

Pathfinder shas'ui can take a blacksun filter for 1pt, even though blacksun filters on pathfinders are almost useless, however the fire warrior team leader cannot, oversight or intended?

huh.. until reading this thread I never even noticed that the codex states a twin linked burst cannon instead of two burst cannons... great... gotta build some smart missiles now, thats sure to be FAQ'd but until then thats a pain

Not so sure it will get FAQ, I am thinking the TLing of the SMS and BC as to "make-up" for losing the ability to fire as a fast vehicle.

Do the Sniper Drones' longshot pulse rifles count as "pulse rifles" for the purposes of the Fireblade's Volley Fire ability?

Two sniper shots at 48" and 3 at 24" might be enough to convince me to try out sniper drone teams.

Bobug wrote:
Multi tracker - says you can fire an additional weapon in the shooting phase is this an oversight or is it intended that you can only overwatch with 1 weapon per battlesuit?

Already asked and answered - ALL shooting states "in the shooting phase", so either all "in the shooting phase" work or none do

Hom many weapons can a commander with "early warning override" and 3 weapons fire with interceptor?

1, 2, because of multi tracker, or 3, because all 3 weapons have the interceptor special rule?

That one is answered in the rulebook - 2, as interceptor does not allow you to fire more weapons than normally allowed

So is this FAQ question now completely null and void?

BRB FAQ v1.3 wrote:
Q: Can the BS1 of a Snap Shot ever be modified by special rules that modify the BS of a model’s Shooting attack (such as Tau markerlights, Space Marine Signums or Sergeant Telion’s Voice of Experience)? (p13)
A: No.

or is this answer now "yes"

The answer is yes, the Markerlight rules specifically allow it.

In the Broadside unit entry, it mentions that any Broadside or Shas'vre may take one support system from the armory. For Stealth Suits, it mentions that any Stealth Suit may take a support system from the armory, and after the entry to upgrade any Stealth Suit to a Shas'Vre, it mentions the Shas'vre may make up to one selection from the armory again.

-Was this poor editing, or does this mean a Stealth Shas'vre can choose two options from the armory?
-Does the Target Lock from the Target Lock and Markerlight count against the support system allotment?
-Could a Stealth Shas'vre take a Target Lock twice, once from the unit entry and once from the armory?

 MandalorynOranj wrote:
The answer is yes, the Markerlight rules specifically allow it.

If the answer is now "Yes" then that affects more than just Markerlights.

It means that Signum's, Telion and others can make snapshots at better than BS 1

40k-noob wrote:

 MandalorynOranj wrote:
The answer is yes, the Markerlight rules specifically allow it.

If the answer is now "Yes" then that affects more than just Markerlights.

It means that Signum's, Telion and others can make snapshots at better than BS 1

No it doesn't. Markerlights are allowed to do this because they very explicitly are stated to allow Snap Fire at more than BS 1. Since the other similar abilities don't specifically say that they can move Snap Fire above BS 1, they can't.

40k-noob wrote:

 MandalorynOranj wrote:
The answer is yes, the Markerlight rules specifically allow it.

If the answer is now "Yes" then that affects more than just Markerlights.

It means that Signum's, Telion and others can make snapshots at better than BS 1

No, it means only Markerlights can. It says Markerlights, and that's what it means. Those other things already have been ruled upon.

No, if the answer is "Yes" then it is "Yes" to the whole question. Not just one of the examples.

No, it is "No" and, like every single part of 40k there is the implicit "unless something specifies otherwise"

All assault moves are 2D6", apart from bloodletters

No rule can increase BS of a snapshot, apart from rules specifying they override this more general rule

ITs specific vs general, yet again, and they just havent removed the markerlight example as yet.

 MagicJuggler wrote:
In the Broadside unit entry, it mentions that any Broadside or Shas'vre may take one support system from the armory. For Stealth Suits, it mentions that any Stealth Suit may take a support system from the armory, and after the entry to upgrade any Stealth Suit to a Shas'Vre, it mentions the Shas'vre may make up to one selection from the armory again.

-Was this poor editing, or does this mean a Stealth Shas'vre can choose two options from the armory?

Well, if you do read it from top to bottom, I can see how one could read that, but I would say no, they still only get 1 additional armory item.

 MagicJuggler wrote:

-Does the Target Lock from the Target Lock and Markerlight count against the support system allotment?

I would say no because that target lock is part of the marker light.

 MagicJuggler wrote:

-Could a Stealth Shas'vre take a Target Lock twice, once from the unit entry and once from the armory?

I am not sure what benefit this would give you? Or is the thinking the target lock on the marker light would only allow you to fire the marker light at a separate target then the rest of the unit, and you need a second marker light to fire your primary suit weapon at a different target?

Seeing as you can swap a hammerhead/skyrays gun drones for either TL burst cannons or TL SMS for free, is there any reason you would ever choose the burst cannon option? Both SMS and burst cannons both have 4 shots at S5 AP5, but SMS also has 12" extra range, ignores cover and the homing rule. It just seems odd that out of two equally priced options, one is just plain worse than the other...

KingCJz wrote:
Seeing as you can swap a hammerhead/skyrays gun drones for either TL burst cannons or TL SMS for free, is there any reason you would ever choose the burst cannon option? Both SMS and burst cannons both have 4 shots at S5 AP5, but SMS also has 12" extra range, ignores cover and the homing rule. It just seems odd that out of two equally priced options, one is just plain worse than the other...

Well, Tyranids got to pay for a Carnifex upgrade that made it worse against every model in the game bar Wraithlords in the last edition, so it's not unprecedented for GW to screw up the costing in a codex.

RE: Drone Controllers
Similarly to the question with Missile Drones, do Recon Drones and Interceptor Drones also benefit from Drone Controllers if joined by a Shas'o with a controller?
It's a little more of a stretch as they could never be standard wargear for the commander, but the main codex says 'No' while the summary says 'Yes'.

Where are the points for the homing beacon?

 Commander_Farsight wrote:
Where are the points for the homing beacon?

This is answered in the book, also, had you checked, this thread is from 2013...

NECROMANCY!!!!!
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