General Kroll wrote: Sounds like a cop out to me. Why not make it clear on the datasheets that they are intended for unbound games?
Its possible that this may be a glimpse ahead to the next edition where "armies of the Imperium" is a catch all faction type that allows you to mix units from the different imperial armies.
Or its a screw up because they were hashed together Friday morning from early FW rules and GW really do intend them to be 30k only models. In which case gimmi a plastic Spartan GW!!
Sounds like a cop out to me. Why not make it clear on the datasheets that they are intended for unbound games?
Maybe GW felt it was obvious enough. It wouldn't be first time what they thought obvious was not so obvious. They seem to live in different universum than us mere mortals
Though refreshing. GW putting up(at least for now) fluff over maximizing sales by not retconning fluff to try to sell more by making them widely usable in 40k.
NewTruthNeomaxim wrote: I think the biggest problem with SoS and Custodes in 40k in this current iteration, even if we are meant to think a unit of them is a formation unto itself, is that for many of us who only play under ITC rules or have local ITC events, the whole "three detachment/formation max" rules is already stretched to its limits.
If a single unit of Sister of Silence eats up one of my three "things" I feel like they just can't work, while I would really, really love them to.
They're perfect ally for my War Convocation. Better than a Culexus. Probably good with Battle Company too, though they have less need for deathstar counter.
I feel like with War Convocation they'll suffer from a lack of transports to borrow, thus going back to the old "Escape Hatch" trick to make them of any use, but you're absolutely right that they will be lovely in a Battle Company. I'll definitely run some with my Iron Hands.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I hadn't see this posted yet, but GW's official response to using these units in 40k...
Apparently they really are only for unbound play. Hmmm...
It does make a lot of sense, given the fact that neither Custodes nor Sisters of Silence are supposed to exist in 40k (well, Custodes technically still exist, but they no longer wear their armour and have not set foot outside of the Imperial Palace for 10.000 years so yeah) I am happy with it, even though I would have loved to use the Custodes in 40k as well.
Edit: Ok, posting before reading is not so smart. Look like they are saying SoS still exist. Interesting. Where could they have gone I wonder? Also, anyone think they are eventually going to expand SoS and/or Custodes into a mini-codex thing like they did with Deathwatch and GSC?
Edit: Ok, posting before reading is not so smart. Look like they are saying SoS still exist. Interesting. Where could they have gone I wonder?
Also, anyone think they are eventually going to expand SoS and/or Custodes into a mini-codex thing like they did with Deathwatch and GSC?
Re: SoS existance
Most of what I hear suggests the SoS are guards on the Black Ships, which would make a great deal of sense, what with their ability to negate and/or dampen the effects of Psykers.
Re: Expanding
Yeah, probably, though they've now painted themselves into a bit of a corner by their response, which states the obvious: that Custodes don't leave Terra, and SoS aren't active on the WH40k battlefield.
If the rumors are true and the story gets progressed somewhat past the current fluff stasis, though, those reasonable fluff restrictions may well be put aside, particularly if they come in a campaign book form ("Even though there aren't a lot of Custodes, this SPECIFIC EVENT brought them onto the battlefield - here's a formation that you can use every time, all the game, when you play the game").
That response is totally just saying, wink, wink, nudge, nudge, black crusade incoming.
My guess is Dorn returns at the head of the custodes rather than the imperial fists. (Fits the rumour about primarchs being in different factions).
Got my box pre-ordered. Mostly I just want the Mk3 armor and the sisters. The Termies are cool but nothing I'm going to go nuts over and the Janitors are bleh to me. Could take or leave them, probably just use them for fun painting or something like the 2 characters.
What I'm really hoping is that when they start selling them individual like they did with the other box that the Sisters will say great and be enough to convince them to do a new line of plastic sisters.
Got a couple of extra sets of Custodes and Sisters. Means I can do a full squad with spears and have enough to make a cool HQ and a banner guy without always needing to take the banner.
Speaking of the banner, I can't be the only one who thinks it is quite overpriced. I mean Fearlessness is great for nearby units, but the Custodes themselves are already Fearless and the guy with the banner gives up his weapon to take it.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Got a couple of extra sets of Custodes and Sisters. Means I can do a full squad with spears and have enough to make a cool HQ and a banner guy without always needing to take the banner.
Speaking of the banner, I can't be the only one who thinks it is quite overpriced. I mean Fearlessness is great for nearby units, but the Custodes themselves are already Fearless and the guy with the banner gives up his weapon to take it.
In 30K morale is huge so it will be a great option there. Plus, based on GW response that seems to be where the models are intended to be used.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Got a couple of extra sets of Custodes and Sisters. Means I can do a full squad with spears and have enough to make a cool HQ and a banner guy without always needing to take the banner.
Speaking of the banner, I can't be the only one who thinks it is quite overpriced. I mean Fearlessness is great for nearby units, but the Custodes themselves are already Fearless and the guy with the banner gives up his weapon to take it.
The guy with the banner gives up his shooting. He still has his Power Knife, and there is no difference between the CC stats for the big spatula sword of doom and the power knife, plus he can still take the storm shield.
cracking open the store copy of the box at my local today was just cruel...
the models are so crisp!!!
Arhiman looks even better in hand, with all the flowing parts, and the relief...
everyone has great detail...
the filigree on the cloaks of the Custodes and Sisters is gorgeous...
Termies are cool, and the weapon options look great...
the tiles look great, and even have "obstructions" for cover...
the statue of the Emperor, with a Magnus statue on the other side is cool, but the crashed Land Speeder is my favorite...
looks like someone was drunk flying lots of opportunity to build fun warp gates, and ruined terrain for the tiles...
a few cake pillars, and some foam core, and you can make 3d versions of the printed terrain...
H.B.M.C. wrote: Got a couple of extra sets of Custodes and Sisters. Means I can do a full squad with spears and have enough to make a cool HQ and a banner guy without always needing to take the banner.
Speaking of the banner, I can't be the only one who thinks it is quite overpriced. I mean Fearlessness is great for nearby units, but the Custodes themselves are already Fearless and the guy with the banner gives up his weapon to take it.
In 30K morale is huge so it will be a great option there. Plus, based on GW response that seems to be where the models are intended to be used.
Except these rules are just for the 40k versions the 30k Rules arent out yet.
Commander Cain wrote: Anyone else's country listing the set as unavailable or is that just poor neglected Canada? Must have sold out before lunchtime today...
It's a format that places arbitrary restrictions on army design that mosrly hinders already subpar armies/codexes while continuing to allow clearly broken armies like Eldar scatpack spam to continue to operate unmolested.
NivlacSupreme wrote: That would be amazing. Dorn and his custodes rolling in a thunderhawk that's only 10 feet in the air beheading people with guardian spears.
Yeah, totes brah, and Dorn should, like, stand on the nosecone of the Thunderhawk ripping out a totes killer guitar solo using the sonic weapon buiilt into the torso of a Noise Marine he just murdered while like missiles go everywhere and the Custodes like totes destroy the whole enemy army! Radical dude!
This, exactly this sort of thing, is what I was afraid of when we first heard rumours of the Primarchs coming back. Ugh. Please Jeebus let FW at least continue to retain some vague sense of respect for the fluff in 30K so I have somewhere to go when GW shart out this Age of the Emperor nonsense.
Chikout wrote: So Geigor was sculpted by @darrenlatham. He is rapidly turning into one of GW's best designers.
yeah, dude. That was the first model I assembled last month and the detail is insane. That claw will be a bit I pick up again for...something. The whole box is great and easy to assemble but those two named characters...
Automatically Appended Next Post:
jah-joshua wrote: cracking open the store copy of the box at my local today was just cruel...
the models are so crisp!!!
Arhiman looks even better in hand, with all the flowing parts, and the relief...
everyone has great detail...
the filigree on the cloaks of the Custodes and Sisters is gorgeous...
Termies are cool, and the weapon options look great...
the tiles look great, and even have "obstructions" for cover...
the statue of the Emperor, with a Magnus statue on the other side is cool, but the crashed Land Speeder is my favorite...
looks like someone was drunk flying lots of opportunity to build fun warp gates, and ruined terrain for the tiles...
a few cake pillars, and some foam core, and you can make 3d versions of the printed terrain...
very impressive box...
cheers
jah
Agreed. The obstruction templates add much but the crashed 15th Legion jetbike is a favorite. Scenario 6 when Russ and Magnus are fighting outside is the best scenario. So much of the book and the game are right and well done.
Unusual Suspect wrote: Yeah, probably, though they've now painted themselves into a bit of a corner by their response, which states the obvious: that Custodes don't leave Terra, and SoS aren't active on the WH40k battlefield.
Not really since GW can change fluff in whatever way they think makes them money. GW has already retconned fluff before. No reason to think they won't in the future.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
tilarium wrote: What I'm really hoping is that when they start selling them individual like they did with the other box that the Sisters will say great and be enough to convince them to do a new line of plastic sisters.
You are too late with that hope. Sisters of plastic in battle are already coming!
Well, I have two copies on preorder to bulk out my Death Guard, I don't even know what I'll do with the imperial stuff & characters.
Good to know the terrain boards are nice, between this, calth and Overkill I'm amassing quite a collection of them, it's just a shame they don't match up.
As for the 40k rules, I'm kinda glad they're unbound only, the sisters alone can shred most units they encounter even if they're not psychic
jah-joshua wrote: cracking open the store copy of the box at my local today was just cruel...
the models are so crisp!!!
Arhiman looks even better in hand, with all the flowing parts, and the relief...
everyone has great detail...
the filigree on the cloaks of the Custodes and Sisters is gorgeous...
Termies are cool, and the weapon options look great...
the tiles look great, and even have "obstructions" for cover...
the statue of the Emperor, with a Magnus statue on the other side is cool, but the crashed Land Speeder is my favorite...
looks like someone was drunk flying lots of opportunity to build fun warp gates, and ruined terrain for the tiles...
a few cake pillars, and some foam core, and you can make 3d versions of the printed terrain...
very impressive box...
cheers
jah
share with us the rules in the booklet! What they have for TS?
i wouldn't know, Vector Strike...
sorry about that...
i don't play, so it didn't even occur to me look at the rules...
i only flipped through the two books in the box to see the pretty pictures...
all of my attention was on the lovely plastic sprues
=Angel= wrote: I can't believe we're not talking about the amazing backdrop terrain they made for the photoshoot. It's perfect- not covered in skulls, looks great but doesn't overpower the minis.
Do reckon that's cast, or clever foam core work?
Buddy I'm thinking on your lines. The scenery is amazing indeed, would love to see a realm of battle tile with that depth of material.
Cool to hear plastic sisters are coming! I've got a bunch of the Raging Hero sisters from their last kickstarter (only half have come in so far) but can't wait to see what GW can do and get them to bump up a sisters army.
Maybe this has been mentioned but there doesn't seem to have been any attempt to put script on the custodes. Down to cost we thInk? Little disappointing.
Had a quick look over this today in the local GW, they haven't got it painted yet or anything and only had a minute or so but very happy I've got this on order, the models look amazing
So what special weapons come with the mkIII? Basically getting BaC and this and want to make 2 20 man tac squads, a vet squad, heavy bolter squad and special weapons squad but i'm not really sure what weapons you get
This is the first GW release in over a year I've been tempted to buy, for sure. Only thing holding me back are the custodes, rather disappointed in them. They look so overwrought (weapons especially) that it just kind of ruins their look to me. Going to check out a display at the LGS though to be sure, hoping an alternate paint job might change my mind. If the actual game included is any good I just might get it.
jah-joshua wrote: cracking open the store copy of the box at my local today was just cruel...
the models are so crisp!!!
Arhiman looks even better in hand, with all the flowing parts, and the relief...
everyone has great detail...
the filigree on the cloaks of the Custodes and Sisters is gorgeous...
Termies are cool, and the weapon options look great...
the tiles look great, and even have "obstructions" for cover...
the statue of the Emperor, with a Magnus statue on the other side is cool, but the crashed Land Speeder is my favorite...
looks like someone was drunk flying lots of opportunity to build fun warp gates, and ruined terrain for the tiles...
a few cake pillars, and some foam core, and you can make 3d versions of the printed terrain...
The more I contemplate the more I want this set, I do have a question though. Seeing as how I don't play 40k and don't plan on jumping into something so daunting anytime soon, and am only really interested in playing the game included in the box...is there a specific way your supposed to build the models in terms of weapons etc so the teams are balanced? I'm assuming i'll get into this game pretty well as I enjoyed silver tower and DW overkill, I tend to prefer boardgames over the more convoluted 40k rules.
Thargrim wrote: The more I contemplate the more I want this set, I do have a question though. Seeing as how I don't play 40k and don't plan on jumping into something so daunting anytime soon, and am only really interested in playing the game included in the box...is there a specific way your supposed to build the models in terms of weapons etc so the teams are balanced? I'm assuming i'll get into this game pretty well as I enjoyed silver tower and DW overkill, I tend to prefer boardgames over the more convoluted 40k rules.
According to Board Game Geek, you have options on what to build. They did this with Betrayal @ Calth, too.
There is, I'm sure, an optimal load out that you can do for both games.
What I wound up doing was choosing the option that gave me maximum variety.
That is I have a flame thrower guy, a melta gun, a missile launcher and a heavy bolter.
One sergeant has a plasma pistol and a lightning claw, another has a bolter and a power sword, etc.
I'm in agreement with you on current mass gaming from GW.
I play AoS because I like the rules but 40k is kind a messy right now.
These board games have been great in letting me buy-in without having to go 'all-in'.
dosiere wrote: This is the first GW release in over a year I've been tempted to buy, for sure. Only thing holding me back are the custodes, rather disappointed in them. They look so overwrought (weapons especially) that it just kind of ruins their look to me. Going to check out a display at the LGS though to be sure, hoping an alternate paint job might change my mind. If the actual game included is any good I just might get it.
They look awesome and the game is extremely fun, especially if you like the HH narrative and the novels surrounding this battle. The designers have a video on Warhammer TV. We put out our review Friday night. It's well done. Hope you get to try it and see the Custodes in some alt paint jobs or at least in person.
I took a couple of screen shots from an unboxing video. I was not impressed with the custodes initially but they look much better here. The true metallic gold looks amazing in person but it does not photograph well.
Of everything in the set I still feel the Custodes are the least impressive. Their weapons, the Sentinel Blade especially, just look so clunky. The design of the kit seems to encourage unnatural looking poses as well.
Thraxas Of Turai wrote: Of everything in the set I still feel the Custodes are the least impressive. Their weapons, the Sentinel Blade especially, just look so clunky. The design of the kit seems to encourage unnatural looking poses as well.
Thraxas Of Turai wrote: Of everything in the set I still feel the Custodes are the least impressive. Their weapons, the Sentinel Blade especially, just look so clunky. The design of the kit seems to encourage unnatural looking poses as well.
you may change your mind when you have them in hand...
the details are beautiful!!!
such fine lines...
the guardian spears are the best looking weapons, in my opinion...
they are the ones that kept drawing my eye on the sprues...
Thraxas Of Turai wrote: Of everything in the set I still feel the Custodes are the least impressive. Their weapons, the Sentinel Blade especially, just look so clunky. The design of the kit seems to encourage unnatural looking poses as well.
Rules wise or model wise?
Rules wise I think they are great. So tanky..
No invulns or FNP, unfortunately, without sacrificing their really good melee weapon. They'll tank regular fire just fine, but a little plasma (Or other AP2 at range) will obliterate them.
Thraxas Of Turai wrote: Of everything in the set I still feel the Custodes are the least impressive. Their weapons, the Sentinel Blade especially, just look so clunky. The design of the kit seems to encourage unnatural looking poses as well.
Rules wise or model wise?
Rules wise I think they are great. So tanky..
No invulns or FNP, unfortunately, without sacrificing their really good melee weapon. They'll tank regular fire just fine, but a little plasma (Or other AP2 at range) will obliterate them.
Well S5 AP3 is still pretty good with inv plus you don't need inv for every model in the squad. Couple stormshields and takes about 11 plasma shot by BS4 to take out one.
Thunderfrog wrote: The fact that the Sisters and Custodes can only be played Unbound makes my excitement dampen.
I'm sure they have a plan to fix that, it's just a stopgap until they release them in a real book.
The Facebook team answered a question about this last week. Basically, they want people to be able to use the models in 40k, but neither organization (Sisters or Custodes) are active on a galactic scale in the 41st Millennium, thus Unbound only.
Chikout wrote: I took a couple of screen shots from an unboxing video. I was not impressed with the custodes initially but they look much better here. The true metallic gold looks amazing in person but it does not photograph well.
Do you want to see any angles? I can snap a pic for you. Or if your store has one that works too.
Thraxas Of Turai wrote: Of everything in the set I still feel the Custodes are the least impressive. Their weapons, the Sentinel Blade especially, just look so clunky. The design of the kit seems to encourage unnatural looking poses as well.
Rules wise or model wise?
Rules wise I think they are great. So tanky..
No invulns or FNP, unfortunately, without sacrificing their really good melee weapon. They'll tank regular fire just fine, but a little plasma (Or other AP2 at range) will obliterate them.
T5 - Two wound with a 2+/3++ and Eternal Warrior? They're harder to crack than Wulfen.
Statistically, you need high volume Str 7 at BS4 to handle them. Also, 60pts for a Blood Angels priest solves the FNP problem. At that point, you can't afford the high volume S10 to remove that nuisance. This is a hard unit. About the only thing that ties them up will be Knights, whom they can't hurt. and they can't block a stomp.
Thunderfrog wrote: The fact that the Sisters and Custodes can only be played Unbound makes my excitement dampen.
I'm sure they have a plan to fix that, it's just a stopgap until they release them in a real book.
The Facebook team answered a question about this last week. Basically, they want people to be able to use the models in 40k, but neither organization (Sisters or Custodes) are active on a galactic scale in the 41st Millennium, thus Unbound only.
And let's be honest, there have to be some things you can't do in Battle Forged armies or else the distinction is meaningless.
Thunderfrog wrote: The fact that the Sisters and Custodes can only be played Unbound makes my excitement dampen.
I'm sure they have a plan to fix that, it's just a stopgap until they release them in a real book.
The Facebook team answered a question about this last week. Basically, they want people to be able to use the models in 40k, but neither organization (Sisters or Custodes) are active on a galactic scale in the 41st Millennium, thus Unbound only.
And let's be honest, there have to be some things you can't do in Battle Forged armies or else the distinction is meaningless.
The handling of this is the first praise I've ever had concerning 'unbound' (a concept I normally find laughable).
It's great that GW don't retcon a big chunk of the fluff to shoehorn in these models into being vastly more represented than they should be.
These are models that represent forces who has seen the field of battle rarely if ever in almost ten thousand years. If you want to play a 'what-if' scenario or something, there's stats for them, but they don't need to be shoe-horned in as any kind of regular fighting force. It shows some restraint from GW's part and a respect for the setting. Kudos.
lord_blackfang wrote: And let's be honest, there have to be some things you can't do in Battle Forged armies or else the distinction is meaningless.
The handling of this is the first praise I've ever had concerning 'unbound' (a concept I normally find laughable).
The Sisters and Custodes might well be the nose of the Unbound camel, just as IKTs were the nose for Superheavies. GW is making stuff that people are going to want to play, and tweaking the rules so that they force players outside of their previous no-Superheavy / all-Battleforged comfort zones.
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote: element games just posted this picture... half of their burning of prospero order (all preorders are covered in it, just in case you were worried)
looks like it's rather popular even compared to Calth
One of those babies is all mine! I hope that fires not too hot near all that scupper plastic!! Nice goblet he has though for some fireside drinking!
Nope no 30k SoS rules, and the Custodes banner bearer is missing as well.
Not sure if I should hold off on putting them together until Inferno is released or not. A squad of spears and a sword and board squad for the Custodes as well as a sword squad for the SoS should be a "safe" build I guess. Although there's always the chance that FW will surprise us with some alternate non gold and red color schemes on the Custodes.
The Sisters rules for 30k will be in the next White Dwarf (released November 25), also a preview of Inferno and the preorder of Blood Bowl. Blanchitsu is also going to make a return. All confirmed by the November WD which I read a few minutes ago.
Zywus wrote: These are models that represent forces who has seen the field of battle rarely if ever in almost ten thousand years. If you want to play a 'what-if' scenario or something, there's stats for them, but they don't need to be shoe-horned in as any kind of regular fighting force. It shows some restraint from GW's part and a respect for the setting. Kudos.
It does seem odd that the line is drawn here though - the description of the Sisters of Silence accompanying their rules makes it clear that they see the field with some degree of regularity.
Yet they're apparently so rare that they can't be in a Battleforged army, but Death Company Tycho - who literally only existed for a couple of in-universe hours - isn't...
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote: element games just posted this picture... half of their burning of prospero order (all preorders are covered in it, just in case you were worried)
Spoiler:
looks like it's rather popular even compared to Calth
You know off course, that those boxes are empty and those 13 games are all they got
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:element games just posted this picture... half of their burning of prospero order (all preorders are covered in it, just in case you were worried)
looks like it's rather popular even compared to Calth
Is that $98 000 just in those boxes? Guessing what 4 in a box. My guess it's really over $100 000 at $180 per box unless they are giving major discounts, but man that is a lot of boxes but a lot of money. And it's only 1/2? Close to a 1/2 million in there. Wow, Just wow.
Thraxas Of Turai wrote: Of everything in the set I still feel the Custodes are the least impressive. Their weapons, the Sentinel Blade especially, just look so clunky. The design of the kit seems to encourage unnatural looking poses as well.
Rules wise or model wise?
Rules wise I think they are great. So tanky..
No invulns or FNP, unfortunately, without sacrificing their really good melee weapon. They'll tank regular fire just fine, but a little plasma (Or other AP2 at range) will obliterate them.
T5 - Two wound with a 2+/3++ and Eternal Warrior? They're harder to crack than Wulfen.
Statistically, you need high volume Str 7 at BS4 to handle them. Also, 60pts for a Blood Angels priest solves the FNP problem. At that point, you can't afford the high volume S10 to remove that nuisance. This is a hard unit. About the only thing that ties them up will be Knights, whom they can't hurt. and they can't block a stomp.
With the shields and a 60 point priest, you are looking at a unit that is in the ballpark of 400 points. Not quite equal to a thunder-hammer/storm-shield-wielding squad of wulfen that are 250 points, and have all the ridiculous rules attached to them. Sure, the Custodes can shoot an assault 2 bolter where the wulfen can only CC, but is that really worth another 150 points of unit that can't kill anything over AV11? With no krak grenades even, they will struggle to kill a rhino in CC. Meanwhile Wulfen hit at S10 AP2 and are almost as durable, furthermore swinging again upon their deaths in CC.
Are they going to be a tough unit? Sure. But don't compare them to something as broken as the Wulfen, because they are not near as bad. At least the point cost is fair for the unit you get.
(I tried to resist typing this comment but it overpowered me, lol! I love how the breast plated armor of the SoS hasn't yet received a single remark after 34 pages on this thread, yet when we used the same design for the breast plated Shieldmaiden torsos we didn't manage to dodge a single hour before the first comments popped up... *sigh*)
Shieldwolf Miniatures wrote: (I tried to resist typing this comment but it overpowered me, lol! I love how the breast plated armor of the SoS hasn't yet received a single remark after 34 pages on this thread, yet when we used the same design for the breast plated Shieldmaiden torsos we didn't manage to dodge a single hour before the first comments popped up... *sigh*)
Well...
1) Sisters of Battle breastplates have been discussed extensively for years already, and 2) Your shieldmaidens bring to mind, and attracted interest from people who wanted, historical vikings (who did not use boob plate) as opposed to these science-fantasy grimdark superhumans. Obviously people will care more when they want more realistic depictions of things with historical counterparts.
Shieldwolf Miniatures wrote: (I tried to resist typing this comment but it overpowered me, lol! I love how the breast plated armor of the SoS hasn't yet received a single remark after 34 pages on this thread, yet when we used the same design for the breast plated Shieldmaiden torsos we didn't manage to dodge a single hour before the first comments popped up... *sigh*)
It seems you have not read this thread very carefully then.
Shieldwolf Miniatures wrote: (I tried to resist typing this comment but it overpowered me, lol! I love how the breast plated armor of the SoS hasn't yet received a single remark after 34 pages on this thread, yet when we used the same design for the breast plated Shieldmaiden torsos we didn't manage to dodge a single hour before the first comments popped up... *sigh*)
It seems you have not read this thread very carefully then.
Thebiggesthat wrote: I'm not sure how many more mod warnings about this subject you all need...
Apparently I missed some parts.
@Mods Please feel free to delete my post, while I go cruising to see what escaped me.
Shieldwolf Miniatures wrote: (I tried to resist typing this comment but it overpowered me, lol! I love how the breast plated armor of the SoS hasn't yet received a single remark after 34 pages on this thread, yet when we used the same design for the breast plated Shieldmaiden torsos we didn't manage to dodge a single hour before the first comments popped up... *sigh*)
Not quite true. Instead of talking about it here, their is a 14 page thread about the subject that it now locked in the Dakka General Discussion.
1) Sisters of Battle breastplates have been discussed extensively for years already, and
2) Your shieldmaidens bring to mind, and attracted interest from people who wanted, historical vikings (who did not use boob plate) as opposed to these science-fantasy grimdark superhumans. Obviously people will care more when they want more realistic depictions of things with historical counterparts.
Kinda reminds me of the original Warzone Kickstarter and the confusion that happened with the Etoiles Mortants. Their was this bizarre disconnect were we were showen art work of them with out boob plates, and then the original renders had boob plates with exposed mid-rifts and everyone was super confused. The models that came after closer to the artwork are actually some of my favourite female models in wargameing now.
I like the sisters of silence models alot, and tempted on doing loyalists in 30k now just to use them. It's a boob plate, but it's not crazy fan service levels of boob plates that pop up on some minis TBH so I forgive it more.
I think GW know they haven't exactly done a great service to how female warriors have been portrayed through their models in years gone by. The fiction does them great justice but it hadn't translated into the models very well.
The new models I think show a good bit of thought and a cracking representation of a female warrior band that steers clear of over the top stereotypes. They are much more in line with the dark eldar fearsome females than previous renditions.
I think the whole debate about how to portray females has delayed the release of sisters for some time, but it appears to be time well spent. I call this one a win for GW.
Alpharius wrote: That is a lot, but if we're going by your numbers, is $200K really that close to $500K?
I think not!
But yes, either way, that's a lot of product.
OOOPS Don't know what I was thinking off. lol. I think it was about 200 000 I think I meant 1/4 of million but now, don't recall what I was thinking off. It's a lot of coin no matter what.
I think it's important to remember that the imperium also really likes to do sculpted abs and pecs on some of the nicer armor pieces. So there is kind of a in-universe thing going on with it. Regardless, models are freaking gorgeous.
Shieldwolf Miniatures wrote: (I tried to resist typing this comment but it overpowered me, lol! I love how the breast plated armor of the SoS hasn't yet received a single remark after 34 pages on this thread, yet when we used the same design for the breast plated Shieldmaiden torsos we didn't manage to dodge a single hour before the first comments popped up... *sigh*)
There were remarks. Then an entire thread was created in off topic as a sort of colostomy bag for boob plate discussion. Then it got locked.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Am I the only one slightly disappointed that the Custodes' helms look so different from the artwork? They look more like fantasy High Elf Silver Helms now. Does anyone know why they were changed? Trademark issues or mold-tooling issues?
BobtheInquisitor wrote: Am I the only one slightly disappointed that the Custodes' helms look so different from the artwork? They look more like fantasy High Elf Silver Helms now. Does anyone know why they were changed? Trademark issues or mold-tooling issues?
Probably because all of the Custodes conversions were using HE heads as the basis for the helmet conversions, so it carried over?
Damn those Custodians look good! Will need to be picking up some golds at the weekend me thinks.
I am interested to see what GW do with the Thousand Sons as ForgeWorld seem to have them with a glossy metallic red (something I have also used) where as the boxed set looks more like a matt colour.
I put a copy back at my local game/comic store. Apparently GW wanted him to take 15 copies but he settled on 5 as he didnt want to be stuck with loads. He called them back yesterday as he already has 10 pre orders so he is now getting 15.
We did find it odd as the Games Workshop store in town is only getting 4 copies in and a lot of the people going into the comic store had come in after being turned down by GW......is this GW looking after the little guy?
Daston wrote: Damn those Custodians look good! Will need to be picking up some golds at the weekend me thinks.
I am interested to see what GW do with the Thousand Sons as ForgeWorld seem to have them with a glossy metallic red (something I have also used) where as the boxed set looks more like a matt colour.
I put a copy back at my local game/comic store. Apparently GW wanted him to take 15 copies but he settled on 5 as he didnt want to be stuck with loads. He called them back yesterday as he already has 10 pre orders so he is now getting 15.
We did find it odd as the Games Workshop store in town is only getting 4 copies in and a lot of the people going into the comic store had come in after being turned down by GW......is this GW looking after the little guy?
Its strange but I've heard (mind you just from regular GW Employees) that they aren't looking to push the local stores out as much these days. Something about wanting a community that plays or some such.
My issue with the Custodes is definitely with the miniatures. The rules seem fine enough, basically a bit above what Terminators should be. On the miniatures themselves the proportions seem a bit off, the arms a tad too long, the shoulders too low in relation to the head. They are by no means terrible, and plenty here seem to like them, but I just feel they are not as good as they could be. I think I may kit bash them with Stormcasts to see what I can come up with.
Daston wrote: Damn those Custodians look good! Will need to be picking up some golds at the weekend me thinks.
I am interested to see what GW do with the Thousand Sons as ForgeWorld seem to have them with a glossy metallic red (something I have also used) where as the boxed set looks more like a matt colour.
I put a copy back at my local game/comic store. Apparently GW wanted him to take 15 copies but he settled on 5 as he didnt want to be stuck with loads. He called them back yesterday as he already has 10 pre orders so he is now getting 15.
We did find it odd as the Games Workshop store in town is only getting 4 copies in and a lot of the people going into the comic store had come in after being turned down by GW......is this GW looking after the little guy?
Were those 4 copies preorders or the regular stock?
Cause the two are different at GW shops. If I go in on a release day, whatever they have on the shelf is their regular stock.
If I preordered and then went in on release day, my copy is completely separate from the 4 or whatnot the shop has as their stock.
I can't wait to get my hands on all that sweet sweet MKIII armor to turn into more Death Guard. Probably sell off the Sisters and Custodes. Keeping Arhiman though.
Thousand Sons and Space Wolves tutorials are also already up, but are private for now.
I'm beginning to hate these videos. I already buy the expensive GW miniatures and they also expect me to buy 20 different paints to paint them with. I will never be good at painting because I just can't afford to be
Thousand Sons and Space Wolves tutorials are also already up, but are private for now.
I'm beginning to hate these videos. I already buy the expensive GW miniatures and they also expect me to buy 20 different paints to paint them with. I will never be good at painting because I just can't afford to be
You can mix paints to create the colors you need. And you can buy cheaper paints as well. Don`t have money - learn how to mix, it saves a lot, trust me
It`s weird, that you`re beginning to hate these vids- they tell you how to paint your minis in the most efficient, easy way, like on the backcover (for free as well)
It does say on the box, that minis come unassmbled and unpainted.
You can even paint miniatures in monochrome, that`d be cool. (no sarcasm). You only need 2 paints then. Money is no handicap, if you want to become good at painting.
Colors impossible to mix: white, black, yellow, red, blue, metallics. Everything else in your paint box is optional.
Thousand Sons and Space Wolves tutorials are also already up, but are private for now.
I'm beginning to hate these videos. I already buy the expensive GW miniatures and they also expect me to buy 20 different paints to paint them with. I will never be good at painting because I just can't afford to be
Yea I don't get this either. If anything id like more videos. Plus unless your lathering on, GW paint has a fairly good life span. I enjoy getting to see how they are painted and even after painting 10 years, I learn new stuff from these vids.
Thousand Sons and Space Wolves tutorials are also already up, but are private for now.
I'm beginning to hate these videos. I already buy the expensive GW miniatures and they also expect me to buy 20 different paints to paint them with. I will never be good at painting because I just can't afford to be
Buy paints of other brands.
They're cheaper, equally good or better and generally come in superior pots so that half the bottle don't dry up before you use it.
Thousand Sons and Space Wolves tutorials are also already up, but are private for now.
I'm beginning to hate these videos. I already buy the expensive GW miniatures and they also expect me to buy 20 different paints to paint them with. I will never be good at painting because I just can't afford to be
You can mix paints to create the colors you need. And you can buy cheaper paints as well. Don`t have money - learn how to mix, it saves a lot, trust me
It`s weird, that you`re beginning to hate these vids- they tell you how to paint your minis in the most efficient, easy way, like on the backcover (for free as well)
It does say on the box, that minis come unassmbled and unpainted.
You can even paint miniatures in monochrome, that`d be cool. (no sarcasm). You only need 2 paints then. Money is no handicap, if you want to become good at painting.
Colors impossible to mix: white, black, yellow, red, blue, metallics. Everything else in your paint box is optional.
I think the point he is trying to make is there just seems so much paint being use that you really don't need them. So another GW trying to get you to buy more for no reason. No disrespect to Duncan or the painters in the How to books that are sold, they are not 'Eavy Metal quality so using so much paint for a "normal" paint job just seems too much. Less paint could have been used in a lot of times.
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: I don't understand why people are complaining about having to paint their models...
Why not just play a computer game if you hate the painting? Isn't the painting a huge part of this hobby? Or is that just me?
I wasn't going to comment on what i was sure to be a troll post, but if you are not going to paint the models why play? I understand that paint gets expensive, but the stuff lasts so long... didn't make sense, so I assumed it was a troll.
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: I don't understand why people are complaining about having to paint their models...
Why not just play a computer game if you hate the painting? Isn't the painting a huge part of this hobby? Or is that just me?
I wasn't going to comment on what i was sure to be a troll post, but if you are not going to paint the models why play? I understand that paint gets expensive, but the stuff lasts so long... didn't make sense, so I assumed it was a troll.
I enjoy the painting, it's just ridiculous how many variants of the same color there are. Over the last year I have acquired 7 reds.
I always think of that list as a colour guide. You can make any red including shades and glazes with two paints (a dark one and a bright one) and some medium. The long list of paints he uses is an easy short hand for the mix I want to make.
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: I don't understand why people are complaining about having to paint their models...
Why not just play a computer game if you hate the painting? Isn't the painting a huge part of this hobby? Or is that just me?
I wasn't going to comment on what i was sure to be a troll post, but if you are not going to paint the models why play? I understand that paint gets expensive, but the stuff lasts so long... didn't make sense, so I assumed it was a troll.
I enjoy the painting, it's just ridiculous how many variants of the same color there are. Over the last year I have acquired 7 reds.
I'm sorry to break it to you, but in this scenario you are the problem, and it's entirely possible everything you're doing is wrong.
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: I don't understand why people are complaining about having to paint their models...
Why not just play a computer game if you hate the painting? Isn't the painting a huge part of this hobby? Or is that just me?
I wasn't going to comment on what i was sure to be a troll post, but if you are not going to paint the models why play? I understand that paint gets expensive, but the stuff lasts so long... didn't make sense, so I assumed it was a troll.
I enjoy the painting, it's just ridiculous how many variants of the same color there are. Over the last year I have acquired 7 reds.
I'm sorry to break it to you, but in this scenario you are the problem, and it's entirely possible everything you're doing is wrong.
Nanana play nice
if someone doesn't paint their mini's it is their prerogative (or uses 6 types of red on one mini )
Some people are board gamers by hart and see them just as play pieces.
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: I don't understand why people are complaining about having to paint their models...
Why not just play a computer game if you hate the painting? Isn't the painting a huge part of this hobby? Or is that just me?
I wasn't going to comment on what i was sure to be a troll post, but if you are not going to paint the models why play? I understand that paint gets expensive, but the stuff lasts so long... didn't make sense, so I assumed it was a troll.
I enjoy the painting, it's just ridiculous how many variants of the same color there are. Over the last year I have acquired 7 reds.
I'm sorry to break it to you, but in this scenario you are the problem, and it's entirely possible everything you're doing is wrong.
Nanana play nice
if someone doesn't paint their mini's it is their prerogative (or uses 6 types of red on one mini )
Some people are board gamers by hart and see them just as play pieces.
Ok, but why complain about them making painting videos or selling paint? Why complain about not being able to afford to paint? Which is a crock, by the way. I used to paint exclusively with craft paints that cost less than a buck each and it came out passable. You don't have to be rich to paint, you just have to be willing to put time and effort in.
If it were simply a matter of not wanting to paint because they care more about playing the game than painting the models, that's one thing. But complaining about these resources being made available for those of us who do like to paint just seems... strange? Pointless? Sour grapes?
I constantly say that I wish Duncan had been around when I started this hobby. His videos have really set the baseline for this generation of gamers and hobbyists, because he makes it so simple. Even after painting for most of my life, I found new tips and techniques in his videos. Not everybody needs to watch his videos, but for those of us who got something out of them, we found them very valuable. Better yet, it's free. Why complain about getting free tips or tutorials? If you don't like them, don't watch them. Easy.
I'd argue that their painting videos is one of the better decisions made. It made this hobby more accessible by showing some people that it isn't as crazy-hard to pull off a good paint scheme as they all thought it was.
I think the point he is trying to make is there just seems so much paint being use that you really don't need them. So another GW trying to get you to buy more for no reason. No disrespect to Duncan or the painters in the How to books that are sold, they are not 'Eavy Metal quality so using so much paint for a "normal" paint job just seems too much. Less paint could have been used in a lot of times.
People complaining that professional painting guides use too many colours is the most ridiculous thing I've read on this forum in quite some time. If you want to "save money" on painting that badly, buy a $3 spray can and a cheap can of wood stain and be done with it.
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: I don't understand why people are complaining about having to paint their models...
Why not just play a computer game if you hate the painting? Isn't the painting a huge part of this hobby? Or is that just me?
I wasn't going to comment on what i was sure to be a troll post, but if you are not going to paint the models why play? I understand that paint gets expensive, but the stuff lasts so long... didn't make sense, so I assumed it was a troll.
I think the original poster of that sentiment is ...a younger poster. I checked out his small gallery and "not being able to afford enough colours" isn't his issue, though I'm sure he could improve easily with a few tips.. Davor on the other hand is just busy shaking his fist in the air at ebil geedubs because Davor.
They'll probably be "un-private videoed" in the next few days, I imagine.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
AllSeeingSkink wrote: How about we get off this tangent. Maybe start (yet another) thread on painting vs not painting models.
So where are aussies buying this from? You guys just eating the terrible Australian pricing or do you have somewhere you can import it?
Importing it. I'm not going to say where from on the forum, though I will say there are lots of sources.
Am I the only one slightly disappointed that the Custodes' helms look so different from the artwork? They look more like fantasy High Elf Silver Helms now.
I found that a little off-putting, as well. Not because it's different to the artwork, exactly, but simply because the rather blatant recycling of High Elf symbols on these guys make them look more like good conversions than production models.
They're pretty, but it's just not quite what I expected.
I've got about 8 reds in use but I like Blood Angels and Word Bearers and am FAR too lazy to mix up big batches of colours for painting armies. Plus I really like buying stuff. I'm DEFINITELY part of the problem.
Bull0 wrote: I've got about 8 reds in use but I like Blood Angels and Word Bearers and am FAR too lazy to mix up big batches of colours for painting armies. Plus I really like buying stuff. I'm DEFINITELY part of the problem.
Bull0 wrote: I've got about 8 reds in use but I like Blood Angels and Word Bearers and am FAR too lazy to mix up big batches of colours for painting armies. Plus I really like buying stuff. I'm DEFINITELY part of the problem.
I'll be trying to mix it up by painting my 40k world eaters in just dulled out and highly bloodied heresy colors. I like my head-canon of how some never actually took the time to repaint their armour. It just got that color after all the bloodshed.
Thraxas Of Turai wrote: My issue with the Custodes is definitely with the miniatures. The rules seem fine enough, basically a bit above what Terminators should be. On the miniatures themselves the proportions seem a bit off, the arms a tad too long, the shoulders too low in relation to the head. They are by no means terrible, and plenty here seem to like them, but I just feel they are not as good as they could be. I think I may kit bash them with Stormcasts to see what I can come up with.
Exactly my thoughts and exactly what I'll be doing. My main issue is with their legs so gunna look for some decent SCE legs I can repose and sculpt robes onto.
I think the point he is trying to make is there just seems so much paint being use that you really don't need them. So another GW trying to get you to buy more for no reason. No disrespect to Duncan or the painters in the How to books that are sold, they are not 'Eavy Metal quality so using so much paint for a "normal" paint job just seems too much. Less paint could have been used in a lot of times.
People complaining that professional painting guides use too many colours is the most ridiculous thing I've read on this forum in quite some time. If you want to "save money" on painting that badly, buy a $3 spray can and a cheap can of wood stain and be done with it.
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: I don't understand why people are complaining about having to paint their models...
Why not just play a computer game if you hate the painting? Isn't the painting a huge part of this hobby? Or is that just me?
I wasn't going to comment on what i was sure to be a troll post, but if you are not going to paint the models why play? I understand that paint gets expensive, but the stuff lasts so long... didn't make sense, so I assumed it was a troll.
I think the original poster of that sentiment is ...a younger poster. I checked out his small gallery and "not being able to afford enough colours" isn't his issue, though I'm sure he could improve easily with a few tips.. Davor on the other hand is just busy shaking his fist in the air at ebil geedubs because Davor.
They'll probably be "un-private videoed" in the next few days, I imagine.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
AllSeeingSkink wrote: How about we get off this tangent. Maybe start (yet another) thread on painting vs not painting models.
So where are aussies buying this from? You guys just eating the terrible Australian pricing or do you have somewhere you can import it?
Importing it. I'm not going to say where from on the forum, though I will say there are lots of sources.
I regret ever saying anything but just so you know I have got better since then. Even I admit those were the crappiest things I've ever seen
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: I don't understand why people are complaining about having to paint their models...
Why not just play a computer game if you hate the painting? Isn't the painting a huge part of this hobby? Or is that just me?
They aren't complaining about the painting, they are complaining about the issue of the change in HOW they paint the particular models.
They have evolved the painting tutorials into an overly complicated goal, rather then a fun "Hey you can do this too!" paint guide that is engaging, and interesting.
The new tutorials, paint styles, paints themselves, etc. have pretty much become money sinks. It will devolve, but to keep it in perspective, go back and look at the old paint scheme for a basic Vanilla Space marine, and look at the fresh new car smell GW tutorials.
Ultramarines, for example, were Ultramarine blue, blood red, Mitheral Silver, Golden yellow, Skull white, and Chaos Black. A regular guy can put together a model in a few minutes, a squad in a half an hour or so. Then you base coat it with a primer, then go to work on the base colors of your marines, depending.
(I am just pointing to a basic paint job, with no particular extras, or the three color technique that a kid or preteen would aspire to.)
You would crank out the six to ten figures base color, add in the red weapons, add in the details, pertaining. That would be the pouches, joints, weapon purity seals, etc..
Not going into a whole painting tutorial, but in explanation of the technique- They have evolved to an even more complicated point that in fact drives people away from painting, rather then just giving you a quick base point to target "Here is how to paint a space marine".
I can now point to a Ultramarine tutorial, posted by Warhammer TV.
Color pallet had evolved to no less then 18 different paints. ( 18 different paints, 4.00 USD each- local) Chaos Black Spray-paint. ( GW Website- 13.5 GBP)
You need a cup, water brushes, but we can put this to already on-hand, and then you have the new models themselves... I'm not going to go into those in this post, but to keep it together and wrap up the point - As a new player painter the worst thing in the world to do is to make you drink from the firehose.
A new player should be encouraged to WANT to paint, not to go chase them with a chainsaw, and put them to the torture of- You need to buy "EVERYTHING NOW!!!" to play the game. combine that with the ... "Rules/ gameplay" and you have just opened up a can of the kid that bought 300.00, and throws it away, or puts it back up on EBay for 50.00.
This issue" is more destructive, then inclusive, and does not give a new player a welcome, it gives them intimidation. That is the issue.
I think the tutorials have evolved with painting standards, and the range is designed to make achieving good results easier. There's nothing stopping a newcomer or kid from keeping it simple, and as others have said there's no need to buy loads of paints.
There's a lot of threads out there discussion the relative merits and demerits of those who do or do not think painting is or is not a core tenet of warhammer.
Bull0 wrote: I think the tutorials have evolved with painting standards, and the range is designed to make achieving good results easier. There's nothing stopping a newcomer or kid from keeping it simple, and as others have said there's no need to buy loads of paints.
This topic is kind of ridiculous tbh. Let it die.
And then you comment on it....
On topic, Are there going to be additional figure sets for the factions in this boxed game?
Bull0 wrote: I think the tutorials have evolved with painting standards, and the range is designed to make achieving good results easier. There's nothing stopping a newcomer or kid from keeping it simple, and as others have said there's no need to buy loads of paints.
This topic is kind of ridiculous tbh. Let it die.
And then you comment on it....
what a funny guy.
Should have known I couldn't add my thoughts AND simultaneously say I think we should move on without inviting a hilarious comedian to take a not-at-all obvious shot.
What do you guys think about the SoS40k rules? Not just based on the stats. I'm thinking more along the lines of how their rules will fit into a strategy or playstyle.
Anybody planning any lists with them in it? House rules to keep them out of unbound?
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: I don't understand why people are complaining about having to paint their models...
Why not just play a computer game if you hate the painting? Isn't the painting a huge part of this hobby? Or is that just me?
Oh, I don't know, socialization, customization, fluff, a different game every time. I prefer miniature games to computer games for a variety of reasons and painting is REALLY low on the list. I have never been very artistic and for the most part, find painting to be a chore, but i truly enjoy mini games....I apologize if that hurts your sensibilities.
GW is obviously trying to make money. It`s buisness.
But this time they actualy are trying to do it by appealing to customers by making painting guides of "medium" difficulty.
It does involve more paints (more money for GW), but it certainly is helpfull. A couple of years ago, when GW just started making "How to", they were more expensive(the magazines and downloadables) and actual paintjobs were very basic. Now they`re doing videos for free.
To the new comers, who want to learn, how to paint upto a tabletop srandard, so the result is akin to what GW show - like on the website/mag. that`s a good thing.
If you are good at art, you can skip a lot of paints and mix them yourselves. Or learn how to do that. That is more difficult and chalenging, than just following "these steps in the video", so it might scare away newcomers or people, who are not too keen on painting anyway.
If you want to use just basic few colors WITHOUT mixing them together, you`ll get just a passable tabletop mini, like Grot_6 described in his "good ol` days" example. "just make sure the paint is consitant on all areas and don`t go over other details" type of deal.
Gw are now doing painting videoguides FOR FREE. No right to complain, really. + they are asking people, what tip they want to see. Those *rseholes, amiright?
Sorry for offtopic. It`s just some people are still following "Gw is evil no matter what they do" fad.
Back to the actual thing..
I was very serious about getting the box, but I decided against it in the end - gotta finish my other projects first. + I`m planning on investing a lot into stylised GeneCult!
But I might be tempted yet again
What really intrests me are the rules for the game! Anyone had a chance to read the rulebook/saw them on the internet? I wonder, if they are any good!
Requizen wrote: Emperor forbid they teach people how to paint something more than a few basic colors. No one needs a tutorial for basic 3 color minimum.
This.
A thousand times, this.
I've been painting for 30-odd years at this point, and I'm far from a beginner. A basic 3-colour tutorial will teach me nothing and not inspire me in the slightest. Watching Duncan's videos, I can pick up new ideas, see how simpler techniques that I have already "mastered" but used differently can speed up other parts of models, and so on. I already have hundreds and hundreds of paints, so I don't need to buy anything, and I have enough brains and independence to mentally substitute colours from their recommended palette. When there's something new, I can pick that up as well if I deem it interesting or potentially useful to me.
And there's certainly nothing wrong with having 7 red paints. I've got a lot more than 7 shades of red, from different companies and that do different things. Of course, there's nothing wrong with having only one red if that's all you feel that you need. Of course you can mix whatever you like as well, and that's a thing that has its place, but so does consistency when you're painting multiple uniform armies and don't want them all to be the same shade of red, or blue, or purple, or whatever.
I really like these tutorials. Honestly, the fact they don't assume I have any clue what I am doing is pretty refreshing. If I was a brand new hobbyist, these things would be perfect. And really, these are good anyway. The technique on the Space Wolves one gave me an idea for my Imperial Fists Legion. I am going to basecoat in Averlund Sunset and then do an all-over layer of Yriel Yellow. It should make the color more clear.
I definitely want to see the thousand sons painting vid (i'm assuming tomorrow), I'm debating on the metallic red or matte red. On one hand having almost the entire model be metallic is off putting... the way FW does it looks cool. I know I can pull off the matte red just fine. I generally don't airbrush so if I did metallics i'd likely mix a tiny bit of leadbelcher into a red base color. but I just want to capture the colors on FW art, particularly the land raider scheme that was shown off a while ago...which just looks glorious.
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: On topic: How many people are buying it for starting a 30k army? How many folks are combining it with Betrayal at Calth for that end?
I am. I will be combining it with several of the Betrayal at Calth miniatures to make anew Imperial Fists army. I will be using the Mk III Marines alongside some Shapeways Boarding Shields to make my Breacher Squads.
I purchased both Calth and this with the intention of starting a Thousand Sons 30k army. Just waiting to see what Forgeworld releases as far as special unit, terminators, and dreadnaught. Plus the rules obviously.
As far as paint, the description of the red in the Ahriman book is how I plan to do mine. It's described as red so dark that it looks black in shadows. Or something along those lines.
I picked up BaC for a 30k army. I'm not sure if the BoP models will add to the 30k army (Emperor's Children) or will get painted up as my Thousand Sons / Space Wolves reneloyalgade 40k chapter. Probably depends a lot on if I decide that I really want to play the BoP game. If I play the board game, most likely they'll go TS/SW. Otherwise I'll do a mix.
I'm honestly interested, I was thinking earlier today that this may be a good entry into the new rules/ new base boxed set. Would like to see some squad boxes, because quite frankly, I don't want to just buy another boxed game, that's going to sit on the shelf, because there is not much you can do with it.
Was also wondering if we are going to see some OG civilians/ militiamen. Base humans armed with weaponry.
SirDonlad wrote: Managed to expediate ownership of a BoP box today - pleased to discover that the three heavy bolters in the box are identical to the ones in BaC.
Awesome. I was going to ask about that and the Plasmaguns(which I hope are also identical to the BaC ones). I need four Heavy Bolters and five Plasmaguns for my setup. I will still need two more Missile Launchers, but I will have to get those from my brother. This is great news for me!
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: On topic: How many people are buying it for starting a 30k army? How many folks are combining it with Betrayal at Calth for that end?
The thought has crossed my mind. I'm getting Calth and Prospero in the same order, so that's 2 Heroes, 10 Terminators, 60 Marines and Contemptor. I'm very near to getting loads of World Eater pads for them.
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: On topic: How many people are buying it for starting a 30k army? How many folks are combining it with Betrayal at Calth for that end?
The thought has crossed my mind. I'm getting Calth and Prospero in the same order, so that's 2 Heroes, 10 Terminators, 60 Marines and Contemptor. I'm very near to getting loads of World Eater pads for them.
I would make the case that you could get a fair number of Hero options between the two boxes, thanks to the "Praetor" from B@C and the Cataphractii hero as well. Granted, they are not named characters, but with a little bit of customization and flair you can make them into your own heroes...
The plasmaguns and meltaguns are not the same as those from BaC - they have two bonding studs on the backhand of the trigger/handle gauntlet and the plasmagun has a redesigned foregrip.
The BaC plasma foregrip is smooth and has a 'drop down' section on the uppper edges (where the tips of the marines fingers are) - the BoP one has slots in it like on the meltagun.
I like how the SoS flamers are really svelte compared to every flamer ever designed by GW, they look like you could actually carry one if it was made of metal!
SirDonlad wrote: The plasmaguns and meltaguns are not the same as those from BaC - they have two bonding studs on the backhand of the trigger/handle gauntlet and the plasmagun has a redesigned foregrip.
The BaC plasma foregrip is smooth and has a 'drop down' section on the uppper edges (where the tips of the marines fingers are) - the BoP one has slots in it like on the meltagun.
I like how the SoS flamers are really svelte compared to every flamer ever designed by GW, they look like you could actually carry one if it was made of metal!
Damn. Though I suppose I could give the Sergeant of my Mk IV Tactical Support Squad the BoP Plasmagun. That way it he looks a little special. At least the Heavy Bolters are the same so I can use them with my two Mk IV Veteran Tactical Squads.
I haven't commited to what I want to do for Special Weapons on my Breacher Squads. On one hand, I think using Gravguns as stand-ins for Graviton Guns would be good, but I don't overly like Graviton Guns.
Nvs wrote: I purchased both Calth and this with the intention of starting a Thousand Sons 30k army. Just waiting to see what Forgeworld releases as far as special unit, terminators, and dreadnaught. Plus the rules obviously.
As far as paint, the description of the red in the Ahriman book is how I plan to do mine. It's described as red so dark that it looks black in shadows. Or something along those lines.
So who's red is darker: Thousand Sons or Word Bearers?
Assuming equal coverage of the red ink wash, the gold base should be a little darker and a little warmer; the silver base should be a little brighter and a little cooler.
Vorian wrote: I disagree, the videos are really pretty simple to follow and give you something that looks good.
Long may they continue
Agreed. I'm tabletop quality at best after 15+ years painting but my painting has improved more the last year or so with these cool videos.
I really like the one for the wolves linked above.
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FoxPhoenix135 wrote: On topic: How many people are buying it for starting a 30k army? How many folks are combining it with Betrayal at Calth for that end?
I like this mark armor better than any other I've seen. But I'm buying it for the boardgame (although I have B@C and could combine them if the new 40k is any good).
Just ordered both Prospero and BaC, my TSons army is about to get a whole lot larger!
I am pretty excited to see what people do with the new set. There are too few Thousand Sons armies out there and I love to see other people's takes on the force. It's also secretly nice to know that I have a 5 year head start on anyone making a similar army
Now all I have to do is decide what to do with another 70+ marines. Fortunately the only rule I need abide to is the rule of cool...
Edit: Ah heck, probably should have gotten some paint to go with them/1
Nvs wrote: I purchased both Calth and this with the intention of starting a Thousand Sons 30k army. Just waiting to see what Forgeworld releases as far as special unit, terminators, and dreadnaught. Plus the rules obviously.
As far as paint, the description of the red in the Ahriman book is how I plan to do mine. It's described as red so dark that it looks black in shadows. Or something along those lines.
Between Calth and Prospero, I think the MKIII marines will be split between Iron Warriors and Death Guard, while the MKIV will be mixed between Thousand Sons, Ultras (and I guess) enough Word Bearers and Space Wolves to play a "proper" game of Prospero - assuming the boardgame part is actually any good. I just feel like the Wolves and Thousand Sons will both work better for me in MKIV than MKIII.
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: On topic: How many people are buying it for starting a 30k army? How many folks are combining it with Betrayal at Calth for that end?
Mine is going to be split three ways; SoS, Custodes and one squad of Wolves built for the actual game (which is what I did for Calth); the other side for both games will be built from my nascent CSM army, using a mix of Mk III, Mk IV and normal CSM and the remainder will go to make some special weapons squads for my Ultramarines, so I can use them in 30k if I want. I've been using Mk IV for ranged squads (plasma, missiles, etc.), going to use the Mk III for melta and flamer squads.
I really want a box for December since I'm taking the Christmas week off from work. For me, all those 30 marines and terminators will be for Iron Warriors!
Yeah I'm probably going to take ten or so and turn them into special weapon squads for my UM, and out the other twenty into a box with twenty mark 4, some mark 8 from Deathwatch, and some Mark 7 modern marines and make me a battle company list.
I'm going to swap some parts out between this and Calth, to make a 20 man tactical squad and ten man veteran squad of MKIV Emperors Children, and the same in MKIII for Deathguard.
Each will get one termie squad too. The EC will have the dread as it fits better with MKIV I reckon.
Then I can play both games with opposed (non cannon) Heresy armies.
It also gives me a reasonable start if I want to fall down the HH rabbit hole.
Regarding future SoS releases Kraut Scientist has dug out an older artwork with some good hints at what FW could produce for the range. I especially like these dogs. With how close most models in BoP already are I think there is a good chance FW will continue to stay true to these concepts
I know I shouldn't care so much, but I'm having a heck of a time deciding on whether or not I should start a 30k Thousand Sons force or if I should just paint them like regular 40K Thousand Sons because of the lack of clear cut direction on when they changed their colors and emblem. It really bugs me. I can't really afford to buy two separate armies right now, so I have to prioritize one or the other...
I use my Sons of Horus models as Black Legion units with veterans of the long war-upgrades in 40k games and will continue to do so with TS. With BaC and BoP (and lots of Rhinos, LR, artillery like Rapiers and other 40k models plus some resin FW characters) the amount is already enough for the occassional 30k game. I think you should decide what game you want to give priority, 30k or 40k and then choose the colour scheme. You could also send Forgeworld or the White Dwarf team an email or ask about it on Facebook, they have been pretty good at answering stuff like this lately
I still have B@C sitting in its box. I was going to do Salamanders because MkIV helmets lend themselves to a dragon look. But now I really want to do Thousand Sons with BoP. But I didn't really want to do two new armies, just one. Of course I have mounds of other plastic to paint first. So it's all really a theoretical dilemma.
Funny enough, I picked up 2 Calth sets and all the pads, heads,etc to make Thousand Sons. Then I bought 2 of BoP. Besides Ahzek, the set will be made into the core of Imperial Fist army as id like to use the SoS and Custodes.
As for armor color as a base for Thousand Sons, all opinion on what you like. Silver Base/Gold base. I did mine in silver with the clear red airbrushed and love it.
I also read the rules for playing the board game. Basic but seems fun enough I want to give it a go. Also their rules writing seems to be getting better and better with added good examples on how stuff works. A big plus to see them putting effort into their board games again and making them with good quality. The quick reference sheets are a big plus.
Gonna use 21 of the Mk3 and the Cataphractii from BaC to finally get my Death Guard going. Tartaros and Custodes will be going with the Mk4 from BaC to my Imperial Fists. The remaining 9 Mk3, SoS and characters will go to my wife's projects.
Myself and a few buddies split this box three ways, they have been looking for something to paint and do some skirmish games with so I let them know this was coming out and we ordered it a few days ago. Super pumped about those mk3, bought some of the BoC stuff to go along with this set.
Definitely going to buy a box for my Dark Angels. My plan are to put most of my BoC minis into veteran squads, to represent the elite of the Legion getting the better armor. The leftovers and the Prospero box will be used for Legion tacticals or despoilers. Hopefully we see a Dreadwing ROW that helps it make sense in my head cannon.
Ya know, extra souped up Mk III armor for Dreadwing tacticals heading into dire/Zone Mortalis situations.
The whole deal with SoS only being in unbound armies has really killed it.
I had offered to buy about 20 of em from people but now, well, I'm in a bind. I don't know if I need them if I can't play them at most organised events.
godswildcard wrote: I know I shouldn't care so much, but I'm having a heck of a time deciding on whether or not I should start a 30k Thousand Sons force or if I should just paint them like regular 40K Thousand Sons because of the lack of clear cut direction on when they changed their colors and emblem. It really bugs me. I can't really afford to buy two separate armies right now, so I have to prioritize one or the other...
I'm considering a couple of squads in each of the two schemes. 40kDA have three concurrent schemes (green, black, bone), Sons of Horus have at least two, as do Word Bearers. I'll also supplement both sets of TS with some GW, FW and 3rd party bits and consider the force "good enough" to play in various eras.
godswildcard wrote: I know I shouldn't care so much, but I'm having a heck of a time deciding on whether or not I should start a 30k Thousand Sons force or if I should just paint them like regular 40K Thousand Sons because of the lack of clear cut direction on when they changed their colors and emblem. It really bugs me. I can't really afford to buy two separate armies right now, so I have to prioritize one or the other...
I'm considering a couple of squads in each of the two schemes. 40kDA have three concurrent schemes (green, black, bone), Sons of Horus have at least two, as do Word Bearers. I'll also supplement both sets of TS with some GW, FW and 3rd party bits and consider the force "good enough" to play in various eras.
With T-sons, it seems easier than most to explain away why they may have these pristine sets of armor from the old days...
"They got sent into the warp and haven't been seen until now."
The whole deal with SoS only being in unbound armies has really killed it.
I had offered to buy about 20 of em from people but now, well, I'm in a bind. I don't know if I need them if I can't play them at most organised events.
If you like the models, then get them. Not every game is a tournament - Unbound is not an issue if you talk to your opponent beforehand, especially for something as tame as a few units of Sisters.
And on top of that, I would expect Sisters and Custodes to get ways to be used in the not too distant future. It happened for all the models in Betrayal at Calth, it happened for Deathwatch/Genestealers, etc. The box like just came out, have patience.
godswildcard wrote: I know I shouldn't care so much, but I'm having a heck of a time deciding on whether or not I should start a 30k Thousand Sons force or if I should just paint them like regular 40K Thousand Sons because of the lack of clear cut direction on when they changed their colors and emblem. It really bugs me. I can't really afford to buy two separate armies right now, so I have to prioritize one or the other...
They didn't change their armor color until after prospero fell and they were transported into the warp/their newly readied demon world with Magnus. One may also assume perhaps they didn't change their armor color until struck by the rubric of ahriman a little while later (32nd millennium?) If you want to keep things accurate i'd do 30k sons in red, and post heresy TS blue. I trust what forge-world shows in their books more than what is read in the black library books, which are fairly hit/miss and you have an authors interpretation and there are many authors of those books. The heresy thousands sons scheme should be expanded on more with the release of inferno/book 7 soon enough. I particularly want to see more FW scheme layouts, I remember when the emperor's children ones were unveiled with the release of betrayal and they looked amazing with the gleaming metallic purple.
Anyone have any good ideas for making the bases for this set look like the game board/tiles? I was thinking using plastic card cut into square tiles and painted to match the board. That's probably the cheapest way to go instead of getting more costly themed resin bases.
Nah Man Pichu wrote: Definitely going to buy a box for my Dark Angels. My plan are to put most of my BoC minis into veteran squads, to represent the elite of the Legion getting the better armor. The leftovers and the Prospero box will be used for Legion tacticals or despoilers. Hopefully we see a Dreadwing ROW that helps it make sense in my head cannon.
Ya know, extra souped up Mk III armor for Dreadwing tacticals heading into dire/Zone Mortalis situations.
This is what I did. I now have 40 tac but built a 5 man legion tac support squad w/meltagun (1 extra from BaC) and a sgt w/plasma/pfist. All the bolt pistols and chainswords used for great use. Command squad as well. Finally expanded my DG beyond tac, breachers and terminators, and armor. Assault marines jetpack/torsos sadly can't get around but the other stuff is flexible. Much luck with your Dark Angels!
godswildcard wrote: I know I shouldn't care so much, but I'm having a heck of a time deciding on whether or not I should start a 30k Thousand Sons force or if I should just paint them like regular 40K Thousand Sons because of the lack of clear cut direction on when they changed their colors and emblem. It really bugs me. I can't really afford to buy two separate armies right now, so I have to prioritize one or the other...
They didn't change their armor color until after prospero fell and they were transported into the warp/their newly readied demon world with Magnus. One may also assume perhaps they didn't change their armor color until struck by the rubric of ahriman a little while later (32nd millennium?).
The TS definitely used their original red color scheme until after the fall of prospero. Although at least in the older fluff I think they were already rubric marines at the siege of Terra. They might have changed colours already then.
The whole deal with SoS only being in unbound armies has really killed it.
I had offered to buy about 20 of em from people but now, well, I'm in a bind. I don't know if I need them if I can't play them at most organised events.
If you like the models, then get them. Not every game is a tournament - Unbound is not an issue if you talk to your opponent beforehand, especially for something as tame as a few units of Sisters.
And on top of that, I would expect Sisters and Custodes to get ways to be used in the not too distant future. It happened for all the models in Betrayal at Calth, it happened for Deathwatch/Genestealers, etc. The box like just came out, have patience.
That's probably good advice, except the bit about tournaments. (which is still good advice, but not for me specifically...)
My group and I almost exclusively play tournaments. As dads with kids only getting one day out a week, tournaments are a great way to squeeze lots of games in a short amount of time.
I tried to resist it. I swear, I did, I just wanted the blasted thing for my week off in December, but my local drug dealer just knows how to push my buttons. Gods, this box is so freakin' sexy, the sprues, the board tiles, YUMMY.
Now, to gather the Iron Warrior shoulder pads. Well played GW, well played <3
Seen the sprues live today. I'm really impressed with the game boards - they look amazing and are pretty useable for other RPG games.
Everything else is just, well, marines
FoxPhoenix135 wrote: On topic: How many people are buying it for starting a 30k army? How many folks are combining it with Betrayal at Calth for that end?
I finally broke down and ordered BaC and BoP.
Not interested in the boardgames.
The Marines will be used to start a dual purpose Dark Angels 30k/ Consecrators 40k army if, Emperor forbid, I don't like the look of plastic Sisters.
Not sure what I will do with Wolf face and Ahri' . Might convert and paint up for mates as Xmas presents.
godswildcard wrote: I know I shouldn't care so much, but I'm having a heck of a time deciding on whether or not I should start a 30k Thousand Sons force or if I should just paint them like regular 40K Thousand Sons because of the lack of clear cut direction on when they changed their colors and emblem. It really bugs me. I can't really afford to buy two separate armies right now, so I have to prioritize one or the other...
In the same boat... and have pretty much decided to go with blue for both 30K and 40K Thousand Sons, regardless of emblems.
I thought only Arhiman's rubric marines were blue and the ones loyal to Magnus were still red.
I need to read some more Thousand sons background, I guess.
godardc wrote: I thought only Arhiman's rubric marines were blue and the ones loyal to Magnus were still red.
I need to read some more Thousand sons background, I guess.
Hmm, not too sure. However after prospero the thousand sons were fewer in number. And i'd think after all these years the remaining thousand sons with physical forms would have warped beyond recognition. Is there an explanation as to why ahriman and the higher ups aren't affected? Regardless I always had the impression all remaining regular marines were turned into rubric ones aside from ahrimans cabal.
godardc wrote: I thought only Arhiman's rubric marines were blue and the ones loyal to Magnus were still red.
I need to read some more Thousand sons background, I guess.
Hmm, not too sure. However after prospero the thousand sons were fewer in number. And i'd think after all these years the remaining thousand sons with physical forms would have warped beyond recognition. Is there an explanation as to why ahriman and the higher ups aren't affected? Regardless I always had the impression all remaining regular marines were turned into rubric ones aside from ahrimans cabal.
When Ahriman cast his rubric, any ksons that had no psychic abilities became rubric Marines, the rest were restored to no mutations, protected from mutation and became powerful sorcerers that could control the rubric Marines.
privateer4hire wrote: As someone who only has passing 30k knowledge, what would come after Calth and Prospero as far as well-known HH battles/potential boxed games?
The Iron Cage, with Iron Warriors and Imperial Fists.
The Battle at Phall however... sweet, sweet void-based combat.
Another event that could work is the Thramas Crusade (DA vs Night Lords).
Most of the other events that come to my mind featured multiple legions against each other or feature UM/WB/SW again (Shadow Crusade, Battle of the Furious Abyss, 2nd Battle of Propero), though I suppose if GW wanted to they could do a Drop Site Massacre or Istvaan III themed box with each unit being of a different legion.
godswildcard wrote: I know I shouldn't care so much, but I'm having a heck of a time deciding on whether or not I should start a 30k Thousand Sons force or if I should just paint them like regular 40K Thousand Sons because of the lack of clear cut direction on when they changed their colors and emblem. It really bugs me. I can't really afford to buy two separate armies right now, so I have to prioritize one or the other...
I thought they changed their colors after the battle of Prospero, when Magnus embraced Tzeentch. They certainly had blue and gold armor by the Battle of the Fang, a thousand years later.
Depending on how the T-Sons plastics look, I'll either make Tzeentchian Thousand Sons or Dornian Heresy-inspired Loyal Sons (The Loyal Thousand?). Either way, I'm going to have to raid my Tomb Kings box.
"My Sons, we shall embrace Tzeentch and wage war on the false Emperor! BUT FIRST we must painstakingly repaint every last scrap of armour and equipment BLUE!"
"Wait, what?"
"GET ON WITH IT! Nobody fights til everybody is painted."
"Jeez, calm yourself, keep your scarab on. This is gonna take like a thousand years. Imhotep, pass the Nuln Oil when you're done..."
At one time, the actual Rubric, as it was cast, was described in terms that one may have inferred to change the colors of the TS, with blue and gold lightning striking the marines on the planet of sorcerers, but current fluff from the Ahriman books has them still in red until Ahriman takes control of Amon's warband, when he uses the sorcerous link that he, as the prime caster of the Rubric, has with all of the Thousand Sons, to burn away their red colors with magical fire and recolor their armor blue.
What's not fully known, as far as I am aware, is whether the Magnus loyalists and Rubric Marines on the planet of Sorcerers were affected by that, or if Ahriman was just recoloring his new warband and didn't extend that spell past them.
Blue TS at the Battle of the Fang implies that he did recolor all of the legion, but let's face it, GW and retcon go together like Oreos and milk, so maybe there's some portion of TS out there still in red, whether it's those on the Planet of Sorcerers with Magnus or not.
shade1313 wrote: At one time, the actual Rubric, as it was cast, was described in terms that one may have inferred to change the colors of the TS, with blue and gold lightning striking the marines on the planet of sorcerers, but current fluff from the Ahriman books has them still in red until Ahriman takes control of Amon's warband, when he uses the sorcerous link that he, as the prime caster of the Rubric, has with all of the Thousand Sons, to burn away their red colors with magical fire and recolor their armor blue.
What's not fully known, as far as I am aware, is whether the Magnus loyalists and Rubric Marines on the planet of Sorcerers were affected by that, or if Ahriman was just recoloring his new warband and didn't extend that spell past them.
Blue TS at the Battle of the Fang implies that he did recolor all of the legion, but let's face it, GW and retcon go together like Oreos and milk, so maybe there's some portion of TS out there still in red, whether it's those on the Planet of Sorcerers with Magnus or not.
I like this. He waved his magical wand and changed their armor because COLORS.
I always thought that was funny, like imagining Angron after he rejoined the World Eaters deciding what colors he wanted his warrior's armor to be. Grimdark genetically modified super soldiers deciding color schemes.
Loopstah wrote: Looks like they have added detachments to the Custodes and SoS rules pdf.
Now useable outside of unbound.
So they have! Nice.
Pretty decent formation benefits too.
Good catch! I had to let my group know, because we had a poll going around about whether we were going to let them be taken as a separate attachment in an upcoming tournament but this effectively settles the issue.
That must be a record - less than two days between someone praising GW for puting the integrity of the IP above short-termist sales tactics, and GW reverting to type
That must be a record - GW responding to overwhelming feedback within two days giving people exactly what they wanted, and Yodhrin finding a way to complain about it anyway!
In any case, I'm now looking longingly at several squads of these guys and girls - if only it weren't Christmas soon...
Yodhrin wrote: That must be a record - less than two days between someone praising GW for puting the integrity of the IP above short-termist sales tactics, and GW reverting to type
Requizen wrote: On one hand, I'm sad and a little upset they backpedaled just due to public outcry. Lorewise, you shouldn't see these models on the table in 40k.
It's not a case of them "backpedaling" about their inclusion. The models were still going to be getting 40k rules either way, the only thing is now that it won't be just Unbound...
Which I'm kind of irked about but hey...those Sisters of Silence are looking mighty fine to make an appearance in my Guard.
Also? We don't actually know for sure that there are lore reasons anymore. The Sisters of Silence made an appearance in "The Beast Arises" towards the end, and while not 40k proper...this was the first confirmation we had that they definitely survived the Heresy.
The Battle at Phall however... sweet, sweet void-based combat.
Another event that could work is the Thramas Crusade (DA vs Night Lords).
Most of the other events that come to my mind featured multiple legions against each other or feature UM/WB/SW again (Shadow Crusade, Battle of the Furious Abyss, 2nd Battle of Propero), though I suppose if GW wanted to they could do a Drop Site Massacre or Istvaan III themed box with each unit being of a different legion.
The last MK is II though. So they'd most likely base it around the legions that would be likely to still be using that set, or look good in it. By that measure, the remaining loyalists which would qualify are Iron Hands, Raven Guard, Salamanders & Imperial Fists, and their counterparts would be Iron Warriors, Death Guard or World Eaters.
The question is, what other kits would be made into plastic at the same time? We've had the two generic marks of termie armour and the contemptor. Since they'd be keeping it small (I doubt we'll suddenly see superheavies in plastic), the logical choices would be the Scimitar Jetbikes, the Javelin speeders, the Outrider bikes, a jetpack unit of some kind, a breacher unit of some kind, or a rapier battery. I'd be inclined to bet on the Rapier, because there's a lot of variants they could squeeze onto one sprue, and it'll double up with the Solar Auxilia.
The Battle at Phall however... sweet, sweet void-based combat.
Another event that could work is the Thramas Crusade (DA vs Night Lords).
Most of the other events that come to my mind featured multiple legions against each other or feature UM/WB/SW again (Shadow Crusade, Battle of the Furious Abyss, 2nd Battle of Propero), though I suppose if GW wanted to they could do a Drop Site Massacre or Istvaan III themed box with each unit being of a different legion.
The last MK is II though. So they'd most likely base it around the legions that would be likely to still be using that set, or look good in it. By that measure, the remaining loyalists which would qualify are Iron Hands, Raven Guard, Salamanders & Imperial Fists, and their counterparts would be Iron Warriors, Death Guard or World Eaters.
Going by what FW has released for the Loyalists the Dark Angels and the White Scars use Mk II the most still and the Iron Warriors and the World Eaters uses Mk II for the Traitors.
And White Scars. MKII is also very heavily used by them (if only because they were too busy/too far out to get resupplied with MKIV, and MKIII didn't really suit their lightning fast attack style).
Prospero 2: Electric Boogaloo with WS vs DG? Yeah I know that won't happen...
Matt.Kingsley wrote: And White Scars. MKII is also very heavily used by them (if only because they were too busy/too far out to get resupplied with MKIV, and MKIII didn't really suit their lightning fast attack style).
Prospero 2: Electric Boogaloo with WS vs DG? Yeah I know that won't happen...
Good point actually.
I could totally see a MK II equipped White Scars squad with two backup units of Outriders and a Javelin against two squads of MK II equipped Iron Warriors/Death Guard backed by a few rapier batteries. Give each side a named plastic hero and you're in business!
The Battle at Phall however... sweet, sweet void-based combat.
Another event that could work is the Thramas Crusade (DA vs Night Lords).
Most of the other events that come to my mind featured multiple legions against each other or feature UM/WB/SW again (Shadow Crusade, Battle of the Furious Abyss, 2nd Battle of Propero), though I suppose if GW wanted to they could do a Drop Site Massacre or Istvaan III themed box with each unit being of a different legion.
The last MK is II though. So they'd most likely base it around the legions that would be likely to still be using that set, or look good in it. By that measure, the remaining loyalists which would qualify are Iron Hands, Raven Guard, Salamanders & Imperial Fists, and their counterparts would be Iron Warriors, Death Guard or World Eaters.
While all Legions had plenty of MkII still around at the outbreak of the Horus Heresy, we can get some idea of which Legions are most associated with which armor marks by Forgeworld's legion-specific torsos. White Scars, Dark Angels, World Eaters, Iron Warriors are all based off MkII. MkIII are Death Guard, Salamanders, Iron Hands, Imperial Fists, and Space Wolves. Raven Guard are MkVI, and everyone else has MkIV torsos (yes, even 1K Sons). So if you're assuming they're coming out with another box next year, and that it'll have MkII armor, look to famous encounters with at least 1 of White Scars, Dark Angels, World Eaters, and/or Iron Warriors. Phall would be really nice, or they could go with an encounter that was part of the Thramas Crusade. They could also return to the Shadow Crusade. I'm not all that sure what the White Scars were up to before Terra, but I'm sure a game could be made around them, too. If I had to bet, since the first one had Ultramarines and the second had Space Wolves (both have a major codex in 40K), would be Dark Angels fighting Night Lords. But that's a little self-serving since I have a I Legion army
I've watched some videos on the rules and some gameplay examples and it was very deflating (specifically the flipping cards for the psychic phase portion). The variant dice is a neat little twist, but I am kind of wondering if I need to know more about what the cards actually do. Maybe therein lies the actually "game".
Erren wrote: . So if you're assuming they're coming out with another box next year, and that it'll have MkII armor, look to famous encounters with at least 1 of White Scars, Dark Angels, World Eaters, and/or Iron Warriors.
Probably Zepath or Catallus then. Or Prospero 2: Electric Boogaloo, as previously stated.
The Battle at Phall however... sweet, sweet void-based combat.
Another event that could work is the Thramas Crusade (DA vs Night Lords).
Most of the other events that come to my mind featured multiple legions against each other or feature UM/WB/SW again (Shadow Crusade, Battle of the Furious Abyss, 2nd Battle of Propero), though I suppose if GW wanted to they could do a Drop Site Massacre or Istvaan III themed box with each unit being of a different legion.
The last MK is II though. So they'd most likely base it around the legions that would be likely to still be using that set, or look good in it. By that measure, the remaining loyalists which would qualify are Iron Hands, Raven Guard, Salamanders & Imperial Fists, and their counterparts would be Iron Warriors, Death Guard or World Eaters.
The question is, what other kits would be made into plastic at the same time? We've had the two generic marks of termie armour and the contemptor. Since they'd be keeping it small (I doubt we'll suddenly see superheavies in plastic), the logical choices would be the Scimitar Jetbikes, the Javelin speeders, the Outrider bikes, a jetpack unit of some kind, a breacher unit of some kind, or a rapier battery. I'd be inclined to bet on the Rapier, because there's a lot of variants they could squeeze onto one sprue, and it'll double up with the Solar Auxilia.
I hadn't thought of the jetbikes, but I'm not sure they want to open that can of worms in 40k. While BoP does break the mold a little bit more by including a Plasma Blaster and a Volkite Charger, I would doubt the jetbikes. But perhaps a Deimos Predator/Rhino kit in place of the Contemptor or SoS/Custodes combo, and a Rapier in place of the Termies? Perhaps with a Techmarine as one of the characters, so that the 40k buyer could use the Techmarine and Rapier (with quad mortar) in place of a TM and Thunderfire Cannon? Or they could really surprise us and drop the flying sofa style Landspeeder on us, which could go to either 30k or 40k, as a substitute for either the Contemptor or termies.
Speculation is fun, but to be honest, I have a feeling that Mk II is the least selling late-crusade/early-heresy armor mark, and I'm skeptical of a third set at this point. But, in the event that they do go to capitalize on the popularity of both of these boxes with another iteration, I'd be very happy about it.
I am happy the Sisters and Custodes got formations. I might look into fielding one or the other now. Probably going to make my SoS all Nuns-with-Guns since they can't get a Transport to make the swords worth it.
I really doubt we will need another armor Mk. GW might make another game using the existing models just with a different combination and some special characters.
are formations unique? ie can i take the same formation more than once (eg if i wanted to run 5 squads of sisters, could i take 2 null-maiden task forces with 3 squads in one and 2 in the other)?
Did I dream it, or did the Custodes go from having a 5+ invulnerable save standard in the original PDF file to only having it if you have 3+ squads on the field in the formation?
I'm pretty sure it said they had a 5++ on the original appendix / armoury page.
tomorrow cannot come soon enough!!!
i wanna crack open my box of goodies
i really hope that we get a set, one day, with plastic MKV...
the plastic MKIV and MKIII are so crisp!!!
so much better than the majority of the resin pieces i've worked on...
i've always wanted to paint up some Space Sharks in MKV
Requizen wrote: On one hand, I'm sad and a little upset they backpedaled just due to public outcry.
What's far, far, far more likely is that they released the original rules not realising that they could only be included in Unbound lists.
If we are being honest 99.9% of gamers don't follow fluff.
Taudar? Lame.
Marine armies with unfluffy compositions, wrong markings, inaccurate paint schemes and load outs, etc.? The norm
Etc., etc.
The only time most gamers pay ANY attention to the fluff is when they want to use it As a weapon to try to ridicule or invalidate someone els's army selection:/ choices.
Glass houses...
Automatically Appended Next Post:
bubber wrote: are formations unique? ie can i take the same formation more than once (eg if i wanted to run 5 squads of sisters, could i take 2 null-maiden task forces with 3 squads in one and 2 in the other)?
If you play by the rules themselves You can take as many formations as you want in your army, and can duplicate them
Unless a formation has a stated restriction/limit.
If you play using various tournament formats like ITC (house rules essentially), you have to abide by their arbitrary restrictions Concerning number of sources in an army, etc.
So it seems like in the fluff description of the Custodes formation they just opened the door to allowing Custodes in 40K...
"They have no mercy for those who would seek to do the throne of Terra harm."
To me that implies that if they get an Alpha-level threat notice of some evil baddie that could POTENTIALLY threaten Terra in the future then they could get their deployment papers.
Just my two cents though. I honestly don't know enough about them. I'll let the real knowledge keepers discuss...
Color me impressed, I might be looking into this one. It is amazing to see the figures that they have, I thought that the Ultramarines were neat, then to see the look of those heavy weapons... I really like the look of the old school marines, they will really look great alongside some of the newer models in mix-matched armor. (Not to mention the batch of bits that you get alongside the, for additional chaos marine additions.)
Don't know about the game set, itself, but the figures look great.
I could see a detachment of Custodes alongside an inquisition retinue, BTW...
godswildcard wrote: So it seems like in the fluff description of the Custodes formation they just opened the door to allowing Custodes in 40K...
"They have no mercy for those who would seek to do the throne of Terra harm."
To me that implies that if they get an Alpha-level threat notice of some evil baddie that could POTENTIALLY threaten Terra in the future then they could get their deployment papers.
Just my two cents though. I honestly don't know enough about them. I'll let the real knowledge keepers discuss...
I would not be surprised if the current 40K fluff progression sees Terra with the custodes and SoS in play...
To be fair, the battles we play on the table are the exception, not the rule, for combat in the universe. Unless your local meta is 95% guards and orks. How many fights can a named chapter master be in? He’s just one guy in a vast universe.
It makes just about as much sense for a small unit of SoS/custodes to be sent on a critical, secret, mission then it does for abbadon to fight the farsight enclaves.
GW did Sisters and Custodes rules which were Unbound on the basis they're not common in 40K, and a few people expressed positive sentiments that they were putting the IP above the chance to score a few extra sales. Then they decided actually, they want those extra sales and put out "proper" 40K rules.
Mymearan wrote: That must be a record - GW responding to overwhelming feedback within two days giving people exactly what they wanted, and Yodhrin finding a way to complain about it anyway!
Ah yes, I forgot you speak for all gamers everywhere, and so anything you personally like is also supported by "overwhelming" numbers.
Nevelon wrote: To be fair, the battles we play on the table are the exception, not the rule, for combat in the universe. Unless your local meta is 95% guards and orks. How many fights can a named chapter master be in? He’s just one guy in a vast universe.
It makes just about as much sense for a small unit of SoS/custodes to be sent on a critical, secret, mission then it does for abbadon to fight the farsight enclaves.
Yeah, see, that excuse works for a special scenario, or an event game, not the provision of rules that let you use something anytime, anywhere. Or else you have yourself a Star Trek Online situation.
Can you conceive of a story that would see a Constitution-class ship, a Wells timeship, a Ferengi cruiser, and the Defiant to all be flying together on a mission? Sure, why not, wierd one-offs like that can be fun. As wierd one-offs, once in a while. Warping in to Earth orbit and seeing that and much, much more much, much wierder stuff, every day, all the time though defeats the entire point of making a Star Trek game, because it doesn't look or feel like Star Trek any more. In seeking to satisfy every little fan demand, to let everyone play the version of Star Trek they want all at the same time, the result is that nobody gets to play Star Trek at all because the integrity of the IP is just gone.
Is this Custodes nonsense on that scale? No, but an extreme example seems to be the only way to get some people to grasp the concept - the limits are as much a part of the IP as everything else, and they do matter.
Is this Custodes nonsense on that scale? No, but an extreme example seems to be the only way to get some people to grasp the concept - the limits are as much a part of the IP as everything else, and they do matter.
You know what really matters? Having fun. Nothing stopped 'bobby' from converting his sigmarines into custodes and playing a whole force of them before. What has changed? Now they have models and official rules, suddenly you expect GW to be held to a standard that wasn't there from the beginning? That kind of sentiment is flawed on the basis that an entire judgement has been created on a set of conceptual limitations that no one has ever stated or enforced.
Shut up and play with your toy soldiers.
Yodhrin wrote: GW did Sisters and Custodes rules which were Unbound on the basis they're not common in 40K...
Yeah, this is one of those [citation needed] situations Yod. It's either that or I get out old man Occam's trusty cut-throat.
Yodhrin wrote: ... and a few people expressed positive sentiments that they were putting the IP above the chance to score a few extra sales. Then they decided actually, they want those extra sales and put out "proper" 40K rules.
Never attribute to malice that which can be attributed to incompetence.
Or, to put it another way, given GW's history with rules writing it is far more likely that when they put out the originao 40KSoS and Custodes rules they did not realise that the way they had presented them made them Unbound only. Again, that big blade of old man Occam's really comes in handy here.
The thing with Sisters of Silence is that we don't actually know what happened to them. We don't know if they were wiped out or something. The only thing we know about what happened to them is that we don't know what happened to them.
Let's consider this: it's thr metaphorical ten minutes to midnight in 40k. And the Imperium is , according to some peoples logic, telling it's force of elite super marines and ultra secret anti psykers"no you guys just stay guarding Terra"..... Yes this move benefits GW.
That's because they listened to their customers who want to use their product and acted.
I've got to say it: GW is doing some great stuff these days.
The sheer variety and quantity of good models in this box made me get two - one to split with friends and the other I'm not even sure of yet. This is AFTER I've already quit 40K and been selling off all things GW in my home.
Yodhrin wrote: GW did Sisters and Custodes rules which were Unbound on the basis they're not common in 40K, and a few people expressed positive sentiments that they were putting the IP above the chance to score a few extra sales. Then they decided actually, they want those extra sales and put out "proper" 40K rules.
If 'not common' equated to Unbound armies, then unique models - and particularly special characters - shouldn't be allowed in Battleforged armies either.
Having formations for Sisters and Custodes does nothing to make them more or less common - you can have a Battleforged formation of either which includes fewer models than a single Unbound squad does.
GW did Sisters and Custodes rules which were Unbound on the basis they're not common in 40K, and a few people expressed positive sentiments that they were putting the IP above the chance to score a few extra sales. Then they decided actually, they want those extra sales and put out "proper" 40K rules.
Mymearan wrote: That must be a record - GW responding to overwhelming feedback within two days giving people exactly what they wanted, and Yodhrin finding a way to complain about it anyway!
Ah yes, I forgot you speak for all gamers everywhere, and so anything you personally like is also supported by "overwhelming" numbers.
Nevelon wrote: To be fair, the battles we play on the table are the exception, not the rule, for combat in the universe. Unless your local meta is 95% guards and orks. How many fights can a named chapter master be in? He’s just one guy in a vast universe.
It makes just about as much sense for a small unit of SoS/custodes to be sent on a critical, secret, mission then it does for abbadon to fight the farsight enclaves.
Yeah, see, that excuse works for a special scenario, or an event game, not the provision of rules that let you use something anytime, anywhere. Or else you have yourself a Star Trek Online situation.
Can you conceive of a story that would see a Constitution-class ship, a Wells timeship, a Ferengi cruiser, and the Defiant to all be flying together on a mission? Sure, why not, wierd one-offs like that can be fun. As wierd one-offs, once in a while. Warping in to Earth orbit and seeing that and much, much more much, much wierder stuff, every day, all the time though defeats the entire point of making a Star Trek game, because it doesn't look or feel like Star Trek any more. In seeking to satisfy every little fan demand, to let everyone play the version of Star Trek they want all at the same time, the result is that nobody gets to play Star Trek at all because the integrity of the IP is just gone.
Is this Custodes nonsense on that scale? No, but an extreme example seems to be the only way to get some people to grasp the concept - the limits are as much a part of the IP as everything else, and they do matter.
I can see where your coming from but I gotta say I don't really like the idea that the game must conform to the fluff. The relationship between fluff and gameplay should be symbiotic, everything that goes on in the background should be done with an eye to how it's represented on the table; the Genestealer cult is a perfect example of this(intentional or not) The army is CRAZY fluffy but is actually pretty darn powerful because the fluff LET them be powerful by emphasizing the fact that they specialize in ambush scenarios and that there's a whole boatload of these dudes running around. The fluff gives them viable, flexible tactics for the table, perfect!
That said, if something is done sloppily and one ends up leading the other, I'd much rather have gameplay be the emphasis and the fluff see changes. A 2 sentence, 'oh yeah they just screw around all over now' explanation is all it takes to justify something existing in the fluff and then I can have fun with it on the table. 'Oh yeah, contemptors are around.' Boom, awesome new thing rolling around. Try to force the table to react to the fluff and you end up with Tyranids eating themselves in instinctive behavoir or orks killing their own units every time they fail leadership.
casvalremdeikun wrote: The thing with Sisters of Silence is that we don't actually know what happened to them. We don't know if they were wiped out or something. The only thing we know about what happened to them is that we don't know what happened to them.
According to the War of the Beast books they had fallen into decline and only one known Sect of them was going.
They only helped when they knew Vulcan was involved. Even then they basically thought the Imperium was fundamentally different from what they were originally fought for and basically didn't care if it fell.
They only helped because of Vulcan. They were mistrusted too as they still had a flying Rhino. I'm guessing by M32 technology had begun to become stagnated.
casvalremdeikun wrote: The thing with Sisters of Silence is that we don't actually know what happened to them. We don't know if they were wiped out or something. The only thing we know about what happened to them is that we don't know what happened to them.
According to the War of the Beast books they had fallen into decline and only one known Sect of them was going.
They only helped when they knew Vulcan was involved. Even then they basically thought the Imperium was fundamentally different from what they were originally fought for and basically didn't care if it fell.
They only helped because of Vulcan. They were mistrusted too as they still had a flying Rhino. I'm guessing by M32 technology had begun to become stagnated.
S.Y.
And yet, after that point we still have no idea what became of them. Sure, only one sect is left at that point, but perhaps they continued to exist in small numbers, serving the Imperium when needed, then disappearing again.
casvalremdeikun wrote: The thing with Sisters of Silence is that we don't actually know what happened to them. We don't know if they were wiped out or something. The only thing we know about what happened to them is that we don't know what happened to them.
According to the War of the Beast books they had fallen into decline and only one known Sect of them was going.
They only helped when they knew Vulcan was involved. Even then they basically thought the Imperium was fundamentally different from what they were originally fought for and basically didn't care if it fell.
They only helped because of Vulcan. They were mistrusted too as they still had a flying Rhino. I'm guessing by M32 technology had begun to become stagnated.
S.Y.
And yet, after that point we still have no idea what became of them. Sure, only one sect is left at that point, but perhaps they continued to exist in small numbers, serving the Imperium when needed, then disappearing again.
casvalremdeikun wrote: The thing with Sisters of Silence is that we don't actually know what happened to them. We don't know if they were wiped out or something. The only thing we know about what happened to them is that we don't know what happened to them.
According to the War of the Beast books they had fallen into decline and only one known Sect of them was going.
They only helped when they knew Vulcan was involved. Even then they basically thought the Imperium was fundamentally different from what they were originally fought for and basically didn't care if it fell.
They only helped because of Vulcan. They were mistrusted too as they still had a flying Rhino. I'm guessing by M32 technology had begun to become stagnated.
S.Y.
And yet, after that point we still have no idea what became of them. Sure, only one sect is left at that point, but perhaps they continued to exist in small numbers, serving the Imperium when needed, then disappearing again.
I thought they served on board the Black Ships.
Maybe they do, maybe they don't. Nothing is really confirmed on that. It seems like a logical place for them, though.
casvalremdeikun wrote: The thing with Sisters of Silence is that we don't actually know what happened to them. We don't know if they were wiped out or something. The only thing we know about what happened to them is that we don't know what happened to them.
According to the War of the Beast books they had fallen into decline and only one known Sect of them was going.
They only helped when they knew Vulcan was involved. Even then they basically thought the Imperium was fundamentally different from what they were originally fought for and basically didn't care if it fell.
They only helped because of Vulcan. They were mistrusted too as they still had a flying Rhino. I'm guessing by M32 technology had begun to become stagnated.
S.Y.
And yet, after that point we still have no idea what became of them. Sure, only one sect is left at that point, but perhaps they continued to exist in small numbers, serving the Imperium when needed, then disappearing again.
I'm not denying that they may continue to exist. Perhaps they are seconded to the Astra Telepathica as their bodyguards?
They would have to ideologically change though. I'm not sure they would get a free pass on not considering him to be a God. It's not as if they are Marines after all, neither are they under the protection of the Mechanicum.
I'm not sure I'd like to see them as anything more than enigmatic warriors who just appear as you say and vanish back into the holes of history.
However, if they are a larger fighting force in 42nd millennium and keep their original philosophy why haven't they been killed by the inquisition or the Ecclesiarchy ?, it's not as if generic Humans get a pass on being Heretics even if they are blanks
Custodes running around in 40k is great! I hope they move the story forward and bring back the primarchs! And the 2 lost legions! And the Emperor reborn!
And maybe we can finally get some female space marines too!
Abadabadoobaddon wrote: Custodes running around in 40k is great! I hope they move the story forward and bring back the primarchs! And the 2 lost legions! And the Emperor reborn!
And maybe we can finally get some female space marines too!
Please No.
Unless you are trying to say Sisters are female SM which they are not.
Every game of 40k is a hypothetical "what-if" undertaking.
People do realize and admit that the vast majority of gamers and games break the fluff on multiple levels and that the average gamer at best knows his own fluff to some degree and perhaps his opponent's army fluff to a lesser degree no?
When people stop building armies based on cheese combos, changing heir chapter rules every other game but using the same paint scheme and every other game isn't Marine on marine I'll start nerdraging about somebody wanting to put their SOS/Custodes on the table.
We are all guilty.
God forbid people enjoy and use the toys they bought with their own money...
GW did Sisters and Custodes rules which were Unbound on the basis they're not common in 40K, and a few people expressed positive sentiments that they were putting the IP above the chance to score a few extra sales. Then they decided actually, they want those extra sales and put out "proper" 40K rules.
Mymearan wrote: That must be a record - GW responding to overwhelming feedback within two days giving people exactly what they wanted, and Yodhrin finding a way to complain about it anyway!
Ah yes, I forgot you speak for all gamers everywhere, and so anything you personally like is also supported by "overwhelming" numbers.
Nevelon wrote: To be fair, the battles we play on the table are the exception, not the rule, for combat in the universe. Unless your local meta is 95% guards and orks. How many fights can a named chapter master be in? He’s just one guy in a vast universe.
It makes just about as much sense for a small unit of SoS/custodes to be sent on a critical, secret, mission then it does for abbadon to fight the farsight enclaves.
Yeah, see, that excuse works for a special scenario, or an event game, not the provision of rules that let you use something anytime, anywhere. Or else you have yourself a Star Trek Online situation.
Can you conceive of a story that would see a Constitution-class ship, a Wells timeship, a Ferengi cruiser, and the Defiant to all be flying together on a mission? Sure, why not, wierd one-offs like that can be fun. As wierd one-offs, once in a while. Warping in to Earth orbit and seeing that and much, much more much, much wierder stuff, every day, all the time though defeats the entire point of making a Star Trek game, because it doesn't look or feel like Star Trek any more. In seeking to satisfy every little fan demand, to let everyone play the version of Star Trek they want all at the same time, the result is that nobody gets to play Star Trek at all because the integrity of the IP is just gone.
Is this Custodes nonsense on that scale? No, but an extreme example seems to be the only way to get some people to grasp the concept - the limits are as much a part of the IP as everything else, and they do matter.
All 40k games are hypothetical "one-offs". Games don't have an continuity or linear connection to each other unless you are playing a campaign, and that is a different beast entirely from standard game play and has no bearing.
I only actually play once in a blue moon, so having Custodes turn up in games does nothing to break my immersion. Seems like a really weird thing to complain about.
Abadabadoobaddon wrote: Custodes running around in 40k is great! I hope they move the story forward and bring back the primarchs! And the 2 lost legions! And the Emperor reborn!
And maybe we can finally get some female space marines too!
Bring back the Primarchs: hell to the Yeah, the first one is soon The Red Cyclops is gonna kick some ass!
2 lost legions: ain't gonna happen, those ones were removed so you can make your own mysterious past chapters.
Emperor reborn: You have no idea how much I would love to see the Starchild plot-line show up.
One of the things that appeals to me about 40k is how there isn't really much of a 'canon' but rather an intertwined series of unreliable and clearly biased perspectives. This purposeful vagueness lets the individual project their own interpretation of the world without the slavish obedience to the sacred canon. Before Prospero, I heard at least 5 different theories as to what happened happened to the custodes and SoS, and I wouldn't have it any other way. So yes, it's true that the custodes are few in number and restricted to the Golden Throne, and also true that they're not...
I'm not going to jump into any discussion about the SoS, the Custodes or the intricacies of the set like the one that is going on in this thread right now. I did however get the opportunity to crack open the box after my brother brought it back from a prelease event last night at my LGS.
GW's made a cracking set here; everything looks like it fits together well, the gameboard looks very nice (and is pretty solid) and there's plenty of extra bits across all the models to add to your bitz box. And of course, the Custodians and the Sisters of Silence steal the show, at least for me - the level and attention to detail on those models in particular is fantastic.
Well worth the £95 asking price, before you even include the fact that it's a boxed game.
Apologies if it's been covered before, but are there any 30k rules for Sisters of Silence out yet or just 40k rules? I can only find the 40k rules. Want to know how to kit them out...
Found a bit of a clue in the assembly instructions - the different loadouts are listed as "vigilator", "witchseeker" and "prosecutor" - so I guess the 30k rules will be monobuild squads a la the 30k custodes rules. Screw it, swords it is.
NivlacSupreme wrote: What annoys me is that the custodes only have 5 poses and 10 variants with a few extra heads. So you can't have 5 normal dudes with guardian spears.
NivlacSupreme wrote: What annoys me is that the custodes only have 5 poses and 10 variants with a few extra heads. So you can't have 5 normal dudes with guardian spears.
NivlacSupreme wrote: What annoys me is that the custodes only have 5 poses and 10 variants with a few extra heads. So you can't have 5 normal dudes with guardian spears.
Wrong. I count 5 Guardian Spears on the sprue that's in front of me right now, as well as 5 Sentinel Baldes, 5 Storm Shields and 5 Power Knives.
The Custodians' legs are also separate to their torsos and heads. A multipose kit just like any other.
Don't know what I was thinking off. 
play nice
