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In my last thread, I got the bull taken out of me for simply suggesting a xenos race who cooperates with the Imperium on a regular basis. I have found several resources to show why this could be entirely possible, including some background on some dealings within the Blood Angels chapter. This makes secret alliances within SM chapters an entirely reasonable and acceptable possibility.
Here are some links. Please take the time to look at these and read them through carefully before proceeding to answer. Thank you.
http://warhammer40kfanon.wikia.com/wiki/How_to_make_a_Xeno_Species#Notes
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/445444.page
http://www.obsidianportal.com/campaign/boarwh40k/wikis/ordo-xenos
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Xenos#.UApoM7Se7nE
I will keep adding more links to support my thesis as time passes. Please remember this is a forum, and so reply in a civilised manner. Remember: not everyone will see he 40k universe from your point of view, so try to have a flexible mind. The "friend" relationship is, as I now understand, is impossible to be integrated into most races, especially the IoM as a whole. The passive Tau have approached something much like this, and have come up with several legitimate reason to do so. See their codex and 40k related sites for more details.

By fluff, the Imperium has a massive hatred for Xenos, what your posting doesn't back it up in the slightest, as the Imperium have fought with the Eldar before, but due to great desperation in the form of a great enemy such as Chaos or Orks. Xenos mercenaries such as Blood Axe's and Eldar Pirates would only work with radical Ordo Xenos, who are considered traitors and or heretics by their fellow Inquisitors

Your argument fails due to the basis of the Imperium's fluff ideology.


Also, the Black Library isn't the most suggestible basis for any fluff argument, as most of it's books ignore fluff to create a better story, while people like CS.Goto just create really bad stories.

blood reaper wrote:By fluff, the Imperium has a massive hatred for Xenos, what your posting doesn't back it up in the slightest, as the Imperium have fought with the Eldar before, but due to great desperation in the form of a great enemy such as Chaos or Orks. Xenos mercenaries such as Blood Axe's and Eldar Pirates would only work with radical Ordo Xenos, who are considered traitors and or heretics by their fellow Inquisitors

Your argument fails due to the basis of the Imperium's fluff ideology.


Also, the Black Library isn't the most suggestible basis for any fluff argument, as most of it's books ignore fluff to create a better story, while people like CS.Goto just create really bad stories.

Did you even click the links? And this is exactly what I meant by "speaking in a civilised manner". Please read through and re-write your answer in one I would care to read and give a sensible reply to. Thank you.
And I believe on the second link down I provided someone mentioned preferring to have and Eldar girlfriend. That's a bit odd, really. But hey, it's his decision.

Yes, I have done since 2006.

I have, also posting a link from the fanon wiki (I've been a member since 2009) isn't a massive help.

I all respect, your just upset people criticized your poor writing and can't get over it.

blood reaper wrote:Yes, I have done since 2006.

I have, also posting a link from the fanon wiki (I've been a member since 2009) isn't a massive help.

I all respect, your just upset people criticized your poor writing and can't get over it.

Yes, I was quite upset because I was just getting the mick taken out of me for suggesting a race with perfectly legitimate reason as to why the side with the Imperium. I also mentioned in the OP to read through carefully the links I had posted. And thank you. This is more the sort of post I prefer to see on a thread.

It wasn't legit in the slightest, read over those articles and you'll understand why, but again I don't see why I'm trying to save a lost cause, because your obviously not good at taking feed back.

The Imperium, as I have read and understood, have several reasons why they will stay passive (at least) towards certain races of xenos. I think technology and passiveness towards the IoM are the main 2 reasons I have found mentioned.
And as to the Lynx, I have toned them down a bit. realised they were very OP, so I've added some disadvantages to their race. One includes the aforementioned Animatrix Crystals in my first topic, which you of all people should well know is the Lynx Codex. I am making an outline for them and trying to fill inn the gaps where I see flaws. You will probably reply: there are hundreds of flaws. I am looking through the wikis I see and the amount of flaws I see are currently slowly decreasing.


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If you think this is a lost cause, then don't reply. It will make this easier for both of us.

Your race simply seems to be furry Eldar.

Also, a race with great psychic power, would be quite a threat to an Empire that hates psychic power.,

You'd have a fleet with ]I[ on your planets doorstep within days of realizing you're quite the master of psychic power, and Tyranids would be drawn to your like a moth to a light bulb, mass corruption by Chaos.

But you'll ignore this, claim you have some knowledge which you don't and make a poorly designed race.

Medium of Death wrote:I think Xenos Horrificus is really only brought out for things like Tyrannids, Barghesi, Hrud and Slaugth.
So barbaric/violent/mindless as to be impossible to secure cooperation.

Many Xenos species still hate the Imperium for the Great Crusade beat down that was supplied to them, courtesy of the Emperor.

Their are some other minor alien empires mentioned that would probably be good candidates for working with the Imperium, although I'd probably stick to Tau (and their allies) and Eldar for the most part.

I am trying to make the Lynx along these lines. Passive towards the IoM, but will cut deals to ensure their survival. Have you seen the "secret Eldar/Bloo Angels pact" yet? I'm sure it's in one of the links I posted.

In all respects your ignoring what I'm saying.

The Lynx for strong psychic prowess and the ability to attract Daemons would be quickly placed with Xenos Horrificus or on the exterminate list.

Xenos Horrificus is for xenos that are so barbaric/mindless/violent they cannot be co-operated with. Second link, 5th post down. Says there. These links are what I am founding the Lynx on. Using these, the Lynx are perfectly legitimate "business partners", as you could say, with the IoM. Sure, the IoM hate psykers, but the Lynx keep that under control. They do attract Daemons, granted, but they have adapted to be able to take care fo them by themselves with reasonable efficacy.
This basically means the IoM will co-operate with any race as long as they have a very good reason too. Lynx's reason is that they are willing to help the Imperium regain the ground they are rapidly losing. If it's mankind's destiny to rule the Milky Way, then by all means they can do so, but there is nothing that says they can't have a little help with it along the way

The Imperium would never officially side with a Xenos race, what your proposing is again, ridiculous.

blood reaper wrote:The Imperium would never officially side with a Xenos race, what your proposing is again, ridiculous.

I'm not saying they will side with the Lynx, but are more lenient with them. It's not an official alliance, it's more like this: "Ok, we overlook you as long as you allow us to use you for leverage. Agreed?"
The Lynx's reply was along the lines of "Yesyesyesyesyesyes. Just please don't exterminatus us."
If that sounds official, try to give me something here. I'm trying to please. Just fling me a backhanded answer that will help me get round that problem. There are loopholes in 40k I'm exploiting, it's just they're really, really small.
They truce with the Tau and occasionally ask the Eldar for help. I'm trying to get the same principle here. Then I will be able to make the fluff. I'm just discussing these trivial matters with you guys so I can make a decent fluff.

I doubt they'd even do that, for most they'd just ignore them, and if they tried to assist, blow them to kingdom come.

blood reaper wrote:I doubt they'd even do that, for most they'd just ignore them, and if they tried to assist, blow them to kingdom come.

Are you absolutely, definitely positive they would do that?
They allow Eldar to assist them. They just ask for it first.
If you actually want to make a positive contribution, just

fling me a backhanded answer that will help me get round that problem.

Then I'll be much more flexible to work with. I'm the sort of guy who you need to understand how exactly he sees things, then work with that.

The thing is, you can't with your idea, and no, nothing is positive to give.

The Eldar are different, when a Chaos or Ork invasion has brought the Imperium to it's knees, some commanders have been assisted by the Eldar during battle, before disappearing so the Eldar could fufil their own goals, while the Tau aren't always the greater threat.

Your race is made up of uncontrolible psykers, may of which would end up causing a Daemonic incursion or breach in reality, meaning the Imperials missions would be compirsmied.

Your race itself would be torn apart by Chaos.

blood reaper wrote:The thing is, you can't with your idea, and no, nothing is positive to give.

The Eldar are different, when a Chaos or Ork invasion has brought the Imperium to it's knees, some commanders have been assisted by the Eldar during battle, before disappearing so the Eldar could fufil their own goals, while the Tau aren't always the greater threat.

Your race is made up of uncontrolible psykers, may of which would end up causing a Daemonic incursion or breach in reality, meaning the Imperials missions would be compirsmied.

Your race itself would be torn apart by Chaos.

They have developed a resistance to Daemons. It is to do with their 5 day War.
They are potent psykers, but keep it mostly under control. They rely on their power to keep them alive, but it is also the thing that eventually kills them. They will eventually kill themselves from overuse of their power. But back to the point;
It is possible. You are just deliberately setting up destructible roadblock cause you think the idea is bad. Loosen up.
And if you don't have anything positive to say, please don't reply any further.
Anyone else who has something positive to say, please say it. I want to hear something good about the race besides someone just trying to get in my way. The Imperium can and do use them, but are deliberately cautious when around them.

Mynameisalie wrote:
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Xenos#.UApoM7Se7nE

So youre linking to an article and still ignore the content of said article to argue your cause ?

1hadhq wrote:

Mynameisalie wrote:
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Xenos#.UApoM7Se7nE

So youre linking to an article and still ignore the content of said article to argue your cause ?

Look at military alliances, and secret pacts. If they are possible, then this entire thread is actually a waste of time. It just proves I can create some sort of dependence between the IoM and the Lynx.

Mynameisalie wrote:

blood reaper wrote:The thing is, you can't with your idea, and no, nothing is positive to give.

The Eldar are different, when a Chaos or Ork invasion has brought the Imperium to it's knees, some commanders have been assisted by the Eldar during battle, before disappearing so the Eldar could fufil their own goals, while the Tau aren't always the greater threat.

Your race is made up of uncontrolible psykers, may of which would end up causing a Daemonic incursion or breach in reality, meaning the Imperials missions would be compirsmied.

Your race itself would be torn apart by Chaos.

They have developed a resistance to Daemons. It is to do with their 5 day War.
They are potent psykers, but keep it mostly under control. They rely on their power to keep them alive, but it is also the thing that eventually kills them. They will eventually kill themselves from overuse of their power. But back to the point;
It is possible. You are just deliberately setting up destructible roadblock cause you think the idea is bad. Loosen up.

How can you be resistant to Daemons?

Their made from emotion and thought and if they fuel your life force with their own life force, then you'd be bonded with them in some fashion, you'd probably be Chaos Servants in the first place!

the tau have a strong resistance to chaos i believe.

Bloodfrenzy187 wrote:the tau have a strong resistance to chaos i believe.

Because they have a tiny warp signature, and have (to my knowledge) no psykers, this is a race of psykers and the Tau are not.

blood reaper wrote:

Bloodfrenzy187 wrote:the tau have a strong resistance to chaos i believe.

Because they have a tiny warp signature, and have (to my knowledge) no psykers, this is a race of psykers and the Tau are not.

Good point. You win lol.

Mynameisalie wrote:

1hadhq wrote:

Mynameisalie wrote:
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Xenos#.UApoM7Se7nE

So youre linking to an article and still ignore the content of said article to argue your cause ?

Look at military alliances, and secret pacts. If they are possible, then this entire thread is actually a waste of time. It just proves I can create some sort of dependence between the IoM and the Lynx.

It proves you don't see the flaws in your theory of an alliance between xeno psykers and those who control the witch, the xeno and the mutant forcibly by containing or eradicating them.

Want them useful?
> anti psykers
Want them alive and kicking?
> the space orang utans are kept secure from harm...
So having a combo of psyker and xeno is bad. A combo of xeno and psychic blank for example could be useful and some may say the loss of the pariah story of codex oldcrons opens up a hole for your race...to slip in.

Everyone please, click the second link I gave and read through it. Then you'll see where I'm trying to come from. And what do you guys not understand about this principle:
Eldar = xenos psykers
IoM ask for Eldar help on occasions.
Tau = xenos
IoM makes peace treaties with them.
Lynx = xenos psykers willing to help the IoM when they ask for it.
See the pattern here?

Mynameisalie wrote:
And if you don't have anything positive to say, please don't reply any further.
Anyone else who has something positive to say, please say it. I want to hear something good about the race besides someone just trying to get in my way. The Imperium can and do use them, but are deliberately cautious when around them.

so you want people's inut, but only if its to agree with you? Wow, with all due respect, thats a bit small minded of you. So, basically, you're saying you'll listen to people, and take their points on board, but only if they agree with you? Mate, thats not how it works.

Right, now for the use and help of xenos within the Imperium. It boils down to "the enemy of my enemy". Temporary alliances are OK, and frequently mentioned throughout the fluff, but they're never lasting. Also, these tenuous alliances are just that - tenuous. there is fluff of the eldar allying with the imperials to cleanse a world of orks, only to turn their guns on the imperials the second the last greenskin falls.

This is 40k. you know - "there is only war". There are no "nice" aliens. Everyone is a friend where necessary, a tool when possible, and an enemy to be. a psychic race that claims neutrality would be seen by some as being just that. others would see it as an indidious chaos plot to lull the imperium into a sense of false security, and then to strike. better wipe them out now. im reading your thread on the lynx, and just had to mention one ofher thing - trading with the imperials for dark age tech? the imperials would just go in and take it - can you seriously imagine filthy xenos (and psychic filthy xenos at that!) getting their furry hands on tech possibly blessed by the god emperor? the sheer audacity and contempt of such an action would be all that was needed to make folks in power raise a crusadem take what they wanted and consign their worlds to exterminatus.

Regarding the imperium and xenos, thoughts will vary. Some are more open to using aliens to fulfil their goals, or to use them as bulwarks against a short term threat. Others hold the view that an alien exists for each sin mankind has produced, and in order to protect and cleanse their souls, every alien ought to be purged, with no exceptions (3rd ed rulebook). Ultimately, most folks know of aliens as being "bad" because they're not human. they dont know the details. "knowledge is power; guard it well", and all that. but that said, this is 40k. all aliens mentioned either want to kill you, enslave you, eat you, posess you, or something worse. the god emperor had very good reasons for wanting to cleanse the galaxy and let humanity reign supreme. and this last point, ultimately, is pretty much what everyone knows and believes in.

1hadhq wrote:

Mynameisalie wrote:

1hadhq wrote:

Mynameisalie wrote:
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Xenos#.UApoM7Se7nE

So youre linking to an article and still ignore the content of said article to argue your cause ?

Look at military alliances, and secret pacts. If they are possible, then this entire thread is actually a waste of time. It just proves I can create some sort of dependence between the IoM and the Lynx.

It proves you don't see the flaws in your theory of an alliance between xeno psykers and those who control the witch, the xeno and the mutant forcibly by containing or eradicating them.

Want them useful?
> anti psykers
Want them alive and kicking?
> the space orang utans are kept secure from harm...
So having a combo of psyker and xeno is bad. A combo of xeno and psychic blank for example could be useful and some may say the loss of the pariah story of codex oldcrons opens up a hole for your race...to slip in.

Wait, I don't understand that last line. Could you possibly explain for me? It's the psychic blank bit.


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Deadnight wrote:

Mynameisalie wrote:
And if you don't have anything positive to say, please don't reply any further.
Anyone else who has something positive to say, please say it. I want to hear something good about the race besides someone just trying to get in my way. The Imperium can and do use them, but are deliberately cautious when around them.

so you want people's inut, but only if its to agree with you? Wow, with all due respect, thats a bit small minded of you. So, basically, you're saying you'll listen to people, and take their points on board, but only if they agree with you? Mate, thats not how it works.

Right, now for the use and help of xenos within the Imperium. It boils down to "the enemy of my enemy". Temporary alliances are OK, and frequently mentioned throughout the fluff, but they're never lasting. Also, these tenuous alliances are just that - tenuous. there is fluff of the eldar allying with the imperials to cleanse a world of orks, only to turn their guns on the imperials the second the last greenskin falls.

This is 40k. you know - ----->"there is only war" <------. There are no "nice" aliens. Everyone is a friend where necessary, a tool when possible, and an enemy to be. a psychic race that claims neutrality would be seen by some as being just that. others would see it as an indidious chaos plot to lull the imperium into a sense of false security, and then to strike. better wipe them out now. im reading your thread on the lynx, and just had to mention one ofher thing - trading with the imperials for dark age tech? the imperials would just go in and take it - can you seriously imagine filthy xenos (and psychic filthy xenos at that!) getting their furry hands on tech possibly blessed by the god emperor? the sheer audacity and contempt of such an action would be all that was needed to make folks in power raise a crusadem take what they wanted and consign their worlds to exterminatus.

Regarding the imperium and xenos, thoughts will vary. Some are more open to using aliens to fulfil their goals, or to use them as bulwarks against a short term threat. Others hold the view that an alien exists for each sin mankind has produced, and in order to protect and cleanse their souls, every alien ought to be purged, with no exceptions (3rd ed rulebook). Ultimately, most folks know of aliens as being "bad" because they're not human. they dont know the details. "knowledge is power; guard it well", and all that. but that said, this is 40k. all aliens mentioned either want to kill you, enslave you, eat you, posess you, or something worse. the god emperor had very good reasons for wanting to cleanse the galaxy and let humanity reign supreme. and this last point, ultimately, is pretty much what everyone knows and believes in.

I have seen this as an excuse a thousand times. Yes, there still is war, with other races. Lynx remain assertive; the help when asked for, and stay out of things when the IoM doesn't need them. Still, they passively help the IoM in other ways. They found a few interesting Plasma Weaponry blueprints they share with the Magi... They feed the SM some interesting information about opposing races whereabouts... Think of this like a government. The IoM is the government, but the Lynx are like a special division the IoM don't really know much about, just they are there and they seem to want to help. So the IoM are wary of them, but are "grateful" of their presence. And besides, the Lynx are giving back all this tech they find directly to the Imperium like "Oh, we found this btw, you can have it back, it looks like it belongs to you", which I think would put them in high standards for the Magi. Lynx have very high moral standards. They are a proud and honourable race, and only wish to help the IoM achieve it's goal. It's not really a permanent official alliance. It's a backstage series of events which the Lynx are deliberately setting up.
There are several reason why the IoM tend to leave them alone.


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And the Lynx have made it very clear they are trustworthy when they obliterated a Daemon invasion on their home planet, sent them tails turned back to where they came from, then tried to chase them into the Warp and kill every last piece of "Daemon Filth" as they call it, that invaded their planet, spitting curses all the time. The GK can testament to that; they were there. Sent to investigate the Lynx, who weren't best pleased, but said "Hi, why the heck are you here?" all the same.


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I found a picture on the net, this one I would probably associate with a Lynx Priestess.

I'm going to make a bold assumption and guess that you are either a furry, or someone with an overall interest in anthro-types. That is fine.

That said, there is no place for anthro in 40k. Especially not in the IoM. The Imperium of Man, as it were, abhors Xenos. Anyone devout in the imperial cult would kill a xeno on sight, a Xeno psyker even moreso. Your previous post is invalid for several reasons. Grey knights are the most devout (arguably) and would give no quarter to a threatening, non-human, psyker race they encountered. Secondly, they wouldn't be sent to investigate the "Lynx" (which is a painfully furry name that you should fix right away if you want to be taken seriously at all). The GK are the militant arm of the Ordo Malleus. They hunt daemons. So if you stick to the GK presence during said daemon invasion, the invasion would have been caused by Lynx, in which case GK would have eradicated them. Thirdly, "obliterating" a daemon planetary invasion is hilariously Mary-Sue and would be a staggering enough feat to be written by Matt Ward. Not to mention trying to "chase them into the warp". Wait what? No, apologies, but that borders absurd.

Some more fact checks. IoM doesn't ask Eldar for help on occasions; they just sometimes happen to be working to the same end and thus cooperate. Also, your reasoning of this alliance balances on the IoM using logic, which it does not. They exterminatus stuff regularly "just in case".

Suggestions.
If you wish to be taken seriously, Get rid of the furry name and aesthetics. Like I said, nothing wrong with being a furry, but you won't hold much credibility. It'd be like me making a race in 40k and naming it Equestrians. Sure, nothing wrong with Brony fandom, but it's too specific and niche to be taken seriously by a large base.

Also, give up on allying with the IoM or change your race largely. You have to face that the IoM isn't accepting at all. Ally with the Tau. That is completely believable and would explain a smaller race's survival in such times.

Also try to take criticism more seriously and open minded. Does not look good to simply snap at every critique, especially since you asked for it from this community.


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You could also consider writing them as a WHFB race instead. It'd be much more understandable, both in aesthetics and fluff.

TheCaptain wrote:I'm going to make a bold assumption and guess that you are either a furry, or someone with an overall interest in anthro-types. That is fine.

That said, there is no place for anthro in 40k. Especially not in the IoM. The Imperium of Man, as it were, abhors Xenos. Anyone devout in the imperial cult would kill a xeno on sight, a Xeno psyker even moreso. Your previous post is invalid for several reasons. Grey knights are the most devout (arguably) and would give no quarter to a threatening, non-human, psyker race they encountered. Secondly, they wouldn't be sent to investigate the "Lynx" (which is a painfully furry name that you should fix right away if you want to be taken seriously at all). The GK are the militant arm of the Ordo Malleus. They hunt daemons. So if you stick to the GK presence during said daemon invasion, the invasion would have been caused by Lynx, in which case GK would have eradicated them. Thirdly, "obliterating" a daemon planetary invasion is hilariously Mary-Sue and would be a staggering enough feat to be written by Matt Ward. Not to mention trying to "chase them into the warp". Wait what? No, apologies, but that borders absurd.

Some more fact checks. IoM doesn't ask Eldar for help on occasions; they just sometimes happen to be working to the same end and thus cooperate. Also, your reasoning of this alliance balances on the IoM using logic, which it does not. They exterminatus stuff regularly "just in case".

Suggestions.
If you wish to be taken seriously, Get rid of the furry name and aesthetics. Like I said, nothing wrong with being a furry, but you won't hold much credibility. It'd be like me making a race in 40k and naming it Equestrians. Sure, nothing wrong with Brony fandom, but it's too specific and niche to be taken seriously by a large base.

Also, give up on allying with the IoM or change your race largely. You have to face that the IoM isn't accepting at all. Ally with the Tau. That is completely believable and would explain a smaller race's survival in such times.

Also try to take criticism more seriously and open minded. Does not look good to simply snap at every critique, especially since you asked for it from this community.


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You could also consider writing them as a WHFB race instead. It'd be much more understandable, both in aesthetics and fluff.

Not really the anthro type. It's just it was the first real thing that entered my head. That and I really couldn't think of any other physical appearance. I see what you mean, but I didn't mean them to be anime, anthro or manga. Lynx was a name that just, well, stuck. Ok, the daemon invasion is going OTT, I agree, but they didn't cause the daemon invasion in the first place. They don't summon daemons. Lynx find them utterly abhorrent. It's like saying you loved the devil himself. But ok, I see your point. Now that I think about it, could Tzeentch be taking a particular interest in them? Just a thought. I'll explain the GK thing as well. When the Lynx were found to be psykers, the initial reaction was just "find them, investigate them, if possible eradicate and be back before tea-time". GK are the best at doing that, plus they are anti psyker which seemed to fit. I know the GK are merciless, but the Lynx? Threatening towards the Imperium? The opposite is true. They present no threat, they've made that clear. But I thought the discovery of some Dark Age tech could explain the Lynx's Plasma weaponry.
P.S. It's just my luck people are complaining about the fluff. It's the one thing I'm not good at. Army lists? Yes. Kitting out an army? Yes. Fluff? No. Sorry if I sound like I am snapping at you; I'm not trying to. I mean this wholeheartedly.


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I take the same view of the Emperor and the Imperium as these guys do. Don't get me wrong; it's just how I like to see things. Well, not all the guys on that forum...
http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/archive/index.php?t-45897.html

Fair response. Let me explain my threatening-label. It does not necessarily mean hostile, merely possessing enough combat capability to be dangerous.

Also, as much as I can tell that you want it to, GK investigating just doesn't make sense. You want the Ordo Xenos. And even then, it would make more sense for an inquisitorial investigation. If any Ordo sends in their militant arm (which is deathwatch for Ordo Xenos) it's because they're there to F Shizz up.

Also, I didn't mean to suggest they summoned daemons, but anything with a psych signature can be used as a conduit/portal for an invasion. That's why the Ordo Hereticus rounds up every single Psyker they can. I once read a story of a psyker that fell into a lake, got sick, and Nurgle used this instance to stage a full scale planetary invasion, summoning daemons out of the psyker's body/mind.

But yeah, people tend to be fluff sticklers; kindof a part of it if you propose writing something expected to fit into accepted "canon"


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Regarding your appended post, pretty much everything the Emperor intended has been twisted, so regardless of his intentions, The Terran Government does what they think is best.