Soda Pop Miniatures / Ninja Division, (Web store back up, Masterclass resins available again)

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**spiralingcadaver**

As both a freelancer and a consumer, I think the idea of retaliating against freelancers is just absurd. There are pretty much two cases where I think freelancers should be held accountable for something like this:

-They know the company is unethical with their consumers etc., in which case they probably shouldn't be working with them anyways (I don't, as much because I'm protecting myself and don't want to be on the other end either as it is because of any solidarity). But, that also assumes a fair amount of rigor from someone who's probably just trying to pay for rent., since 9/10 freelancers are pretty unknown and it's hardly a glamorous or lucrative business.

-Their failure to deliver directly contributed to the company's failures... but this would be really difficult to tell from the outside, unless some parties are far more transparent than is probably wise.

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

Relic Knight update, full pdf to download for v2.0

note it expires on 7th May so if you want it download it soon

Greetings and happy weekend everyone,

We have been moving projects along, and while we continue the slow process of stoking our engines again, we wanted to give all of you access to a full PDF zip file with everything you need to play a full version of Relic Knights 2.0 right away.

Please follow this link:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1x-uq6PCLOiV0Z0lxm2yRTQoDLZrMtWf1/view?usp=sharing

This link will be open until May 7, 2019 to download.

Download the file and unpack the contents. There you will find the following:
•Relic Knights 2.0 Digest rulebook
•Full set of esper cards for print and play
•Foldable Terrain from the core box to print and assemble
•A FULL set of unit cards featuring ALL the factions and units from the starter set and the main game. The new cards and some new artwork will be hidden in amongst the content
•A FULL set of print and play unit POGS to represent units and miniatures to try out and play with any unit combination and cadre build

Please check it out, we are proud of the work we have done so far. We continue to press on with our efforts to get al backers fulfilled as soon as possible. But want to be able to enjoy some of this content in an easy to consume package until your rewards arrive.

In May, Ninja Division, in efforts to add to our strategy of continuing to pull together resources, and to do a little good in the world, will be offering up some of our older games for a digital campaign on Humble Bundle. We will share more information as we get closer, and look forward to bringing more eyes to this product community as we get closer.

All our very best,

The Ninja Division Team

**HaleysRedComet**

Relic Knights is back, in Pog form.

**Valander**

Why have a download link that expires? That makes no sense unless they've sold the IP to someone else, who thus would want distribution of things stopped. And somehow, I don't see anyone buying the 'hot' property of Relic Knights...

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

a lot of investors might see giving away anything as a bad idea (especially as RK is a paid for rule book)

having a time limit will make it a lot less controversial

**AduroT**

Oh, right, it’s April. That expires in May. I totally read this thread the first time and thought that was a one day duration download link.

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

NOTE: the stuff below isn't directly done by Soda Pop, but since it's licenced from their main property, Super Dungeon Explore i'm posting it here

The Super Dungeon Explore novels from future house publishing and associated limited edition minis are now up for pre-order

while the minis were designed by Soda Pop they're not doing the manufacture (so no need to worry on that account)

$85 for the full set as ebooks, more if you want paperbacks, you have to get the books as well as the minis, but you can get extra sets of the minis (ie 1 set of books, multiple sets of minis)

https://www.futurehousepublishing.com/super-dungeon-series/

**Bossk_Hogg**

Good lord, $85 for 5 ebooks and chibi minis?!

**Monkeysloth**

if that includes shipping it's not too bad a price. $5 a book, $10 a mini and then shipping.

**Col Hammer**

Looks like I'm cured from my SDE addiction... I have no interest of getting those minis...

**LunarSol**

I'm actually way more interested in reading the Midnight Queen book than owning any of the minis. I really liked where that was going, even if the kickstarter spoiled it.... in so many meanings... :(

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

The Ninja Division website is back up and running, and they're in the process of migrating accounts and info across from the old one

https://ninjadivision.com/

All ninja division accounts should be done, use the forgot password option the first time you try and log in

NOT all soda pop accounts are done (yet) so you may get a 'no account found with that email address' when you use the forgot password option, if so just make a new account with the same email address as your old soda pop one and they'll automatically merge them when they bring the old one across

(https://ninjadivision.com/blogs/news/accessing-your-website-account)

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

The masterclass resin minis are back
spoiler as there are a lot of images

Spoiler:

they've also got a sale running to 6th May on some of their other stuff (worth checking elsewhere to compare prices on these as they're not the fire sale prices Miniature Market has had recently) plus some Backspindle Games titles

Note that the suggested payment method is Paypal so you should be protected if nothing shows up, given the financial state of Ninja Division is fragile I'd say you'd want to be certain your protected in this way whatever method you choose

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Greetings Ninjas,

As many of you know, this has been a hard couple of years for Ninja Division. Beset by delays, finance issues, and interruptions to our Kickstarter projects, we are hard-set on combining all of our skills and resources to see these projects through to completion.

While we work to reorganize and secure the outside resources we need to begin the mass production of our Kickstarter projects we have had many backers ask us how they can help.

Already, a number of you have provided valuable insight and service towards accomplishing our reorganization goals, and we thank you tremendously! But, we also need to continue to raise the extra capital necessary to get things moving again, outside our ongoing work to secure investors. We also want to provide you with new and awesome products.

To that end, we are renewing the Masterclass Miniatures line. Further, we are excited to announce that ALL Masterclass sales will exclusively go to fund the following goals:

1. Maintain Stock of Masterclass Miniatures

We will focus on keeping a regular stock of Masterclass Miniatures. Strong selling Masterclass Miniatures will remain “evergreen”. Less popular miniatures will be retired. (Don’t worry, if that happens, we’ll make sure to give you a heads up!).

2. New Monthly Masterclass releases

Our goal is to release at least two Masterclass miniatures per month. Releases will be a mix of regular release and limited edition miniatures.

3. Regular Releases

Regular release miniatures will move into our permanent range and we will maintain stock as outlined above.

Proceeds from regular release Masterclass Miniatures will go towards implementing the reorganization and overhead of Ninja Division, with a priority on continuing constant releases for the Masterclass line. These priorities are: art, sculpting, layout, tooling, manufacturing, packaging and print, shipping, updating/replacing molds, warehousing, and webhosting.

4. Limited Edition

Limited edition miniatures will be available in limited quantities or only during a specific sales window (e.g. 750 quantity, one month only, etc).

100% of the proceeds from Limited Edition Masterclass Miniatures will be locked in the bank and assigned to specific goals to help move us towards Kickstarter fulfillment.

After setting each goal, we will keep you informed of the status of the funds we are raising towards the goal, and then once finished, we will deploy that element of the Kickstarter. We will then assign the next goal.

Our first goal is to clear our outstanding debt with our primary Super Dungeon Masterclass manufacturers so that we can get this engine started.

Super Dungeon x Relic Knights Masterclass Upcoming Releases

We have many exciting Masterclass Miniatures lined up that we had diligently worked on before we had to put on the brakes and begin reorganization. This means we have a deep pool of sculpts and concepts to draw upon to help jump-start this process. We will be starting with Super Dungeon models, but we have great plans for fans of Relic Knights, Rail Raiders, and more!

Our first releases are three exciting Super Dungeon x Relic Knights chibi miniatures. These will both be Limited Edition Leopold Magnus and Bang-Bang will be available this week! Tahariel will be available next month.

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

We are happy to announce a new shipping option for our EU ninjas. Starting today EU customers will be able to select "EU Shipping from UK" as an option during checkout.

When you make your order, the website will calculate your shipping cost to include the actual cost of shipping, plus an allowance for VAT and import fees to ship your package to you from our UK hub. This way, when you make an order you will be able to see all of your costs upfront and be able to make an informed purchase.

Please note that if your post charges additional fees for packages coming from the UK, we cannot account for those costs. However, this new option should allow the vast majority of our EU customers to receive your packages with no surprise expenses.

We will do our best to keep a regular inventory of our most popular items in stock at the UK hub. Each month, Ninja Division will send new inventory to the hub of these items, as well as Limited Edition orders, and any other items needed to fulfill more unique orders that chose the new shipping option.

The hub will then ship EU orders from their fulfillment center in the UK.

We hope that our EU ninjas will find this new option helpful (and cost-saving!). If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to contact us at info@ninjadivision.com.

Now — on to Australia!

good news for now, we'll have to see how Brexit goes to find out whether it remains good for all of the EU

**nkelsch**

More boldface lies... After months of both Future House Publishing and Ninja Division saying they were not in any way involved in the production of FHPs miniatures, ND says it is a lie.

Soda Pop Miniatures wrote:Soda Pop Miniatures
To clear up a few things that are being speculated on -

Future House is managing the the sale and distribution of the miniatures associated with the preorder we are doing. We are under contract, we get a royalty on sales, and we are ensuring that the sculpting quality, and the receiving manufacturer is approved by us to deliver you a product that we would feel comfortable producing ourselves.

Masterclass isnt for everyone - but they are high quality resin miniatures for collectors and painters, and gamers get access to new heroes and monsters with new rules and cards to play super dungeon with. Will it solve all the things? NOPE - will it be part of a bigger plan we are enacting to start bringing in small but consistent revenues to support the growth of the brand and reinforce with you guys that we can be a trusted partner - while we are delayed horridly on the KS, we are in fact moving behind the scenes to pull things together and get this delivered... and as soon as possible. You will be the FIRST ones to know.

If you are making a purchase from the website - you are purchasing physical inventory, it does not sell if it is not there. So, anyone, though welcome to question this, will be happy when their products show up reliably - packed and shipped by me and Deke personally while we work on other lines of business to bring SDE to reality.

This is not a "GIMME MORE MONEY" - we are providing new products and allocated resources from their sale to support our efforts to move this KS forward with our other efforts.

- Ninja John

They had FHP do a pre-order, took the money from the pre-order, made masterclass models and are now selling those retail while we 'wait' for the pre-order.

And the Masterclass will pay off debt from the US-based resin for masterclass. Well, the only possible debt they need to pay off is the Future House publishing models and these new masterclass. Neither of which are Kickstarter products. Right now, all the KS products seem to be Archon produced.

No sign of the WotF masterclass miniatures in all this.

Lies on top of lies. Zero progress or plan...

Oh, and the new masterclass models are now 25$ per 28mm hero. 5$ more than the last round, and 10-15$ more than the same models in 2017.

**Monkeysloth**

If SPM is only involved in the approval process of the FHP stuff then there was no lies. I can't see how anyone would expect SPM to be 100% out of that process outside of just wanting to find a reason to be angry. As long as SPM doesn't get money outside of their royalties and FHP deals with stocking and shipping there's nothing nefarious going on.

**warboss**

As Soda Ninja Pop Division Starfinder kickstarter customers still wait to receive 90-100% of their miniatures, Paizo and Wizkids announced this...

https://wizkids.com/2019/04/24/wizkids-announces-enhanced-licensing-partnership-with-paizo/

The current prepainted minis using the same sculpts that backers are waiting for are/were made by Ninja Division. He paizo rep statement regarding how this affects Ninja Division.

Paizo Employee Sara Marie Customer Service & Community Manager Wednesday, 10:56 am

Folks, Just a heads up, WizKids has issued a press release regarding WizKids Starfinder Battles Miniatures. We understand this may raise some questions regarding the status of the Ninja Division Starfinder Masterclass Miniatures.
Here is where we (still) sit with that. Ninja Division is late on their Kickstarter, but they are working on a means to fulfill their commitments. We are supporting them as best we can, as our goal is to help them fulfill their Kickstarter, but we cannot discuss anything that might be in progress.
Ninja Division retains a license to create unpainted Starfinder miniatures in order to be able to complete their Kickstarter obligations, and none of that changes with this new partnership.
It’s not unusual to have multiple miniatures partners. Paizo has worked with Reaper and WizKids on Pathfinder miniatures for years. We know there may be additional questions that this raises for you, but we do not currently have any additional information to provide.

Thanks, Sara

https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2umu4&page=21?Miniatures-Kickstarter-Ninja-Division#1017

And the response later in the same thread of one of the Paizo executives who during the Starfinder campaign was iirc vocal in his confidence with ND/SP fulfilling their obligations in response to folks bringing up their concerns.

Erik Mona Chief Creative Officer, Publisher Thursday, 06:13 pm | Flag | List | Reply

Folks,

I wanted to drop by to share a conundrum, and to share a bit of my perspective on affairs of the last week.

The conundrum is this: Throughout this process with Ninja Division, but after we realized they were going to have significant difficulties pulling this project across the finish line, there have been numerous behind-the-scenes developments or potential fixes that we have heard about, but that have not come to fruition.

That sort of thing puts us in a difficult place regarding communications. Do we share our sense of hope, only to have it dashed again when something doesn't come through? That's certainly a dilemma that has played into us not being as frequent with updates in the past as we should have been.

I don't want to get people's hopes up, even if I see signs of incremental progress behind the scenes. I hope you all can understand that when we make an announcement regarding this project, we want to be EXTRA CERTAIN that we understand the details and have faith that they are going to occur before sharing them in public.

So I don't have details to convey, and I don't want to give the impression that a solution is in sight or that it looks like the project is back on the road or whatever.

But I DO want to share that, behind the scenes, we have seen a LOT of evidence--especially since the GAMA Trade Show--that Ninja Division is actively working to move the project forward and find solutions for their many difficulties.

I have proof that these guys ARE trying, and some of that is encouraging. I don't want to say more than that, but I do want you guys to know and understand that much at least.

Thanks for your continuing patience, or at least for your continuing attention.

**Monkeysloth**

The comment about miniature Market buying all the stock from Ninja Division was correct. MM just announced they're having a huge ND sale starting tomorrow.

**highlord tamburlaine**

I hope they have the ninja clans for a reasonable price.

I want to use them for Test of Honour!

**Dynas**

What a cluster f*ck. The STarfinder miniatures was the first kickstarter Ive ever backed and now I might be out $200. How is this even legal? Kickstarter is basically a venture capitalist website without any of the financial oversight and regulation.

Ive tried contacting them to no avail. I cant dispute the charge on my CC as its aged out.

Has anyone had any luck getting a refund on the Starfinder kickstarter? If so what steps or contact info did you take?

**warboss**

Dynas wrote:
What a cluster f*ck. The STarfinder miniatures was the first kickstarter Ive ever backed and now I might be out $200. How is this even legal? Kickstarter is basically a venture capitalist website without any of the financial oversight and regulation.

Ive tried contacting them to no avail. I cant dispute the charge on my CC as its aged out.

Has anyone had any luck getting a refund on the Starfinder kickstarter? If so what steps or contact info did you take?

You won't have any luck if you've already tried with your credit card and they refused. Kickstarter doesn't care and will let them do anything they want up to and including forming a "new" company with the exact same people doing the exact same jobs and attempt to crowdfund additional projects while previous ones languish. You can complain to your state attorney general and you'll be lucky if you get ND to copy/paste the response they already gave to an attorney general in response to backer complaints and that's assuming that the AG actually bothers sending out a form letter to investigate it (unlikely). You can take them to small claims court but typically you have to file those cases in the defendant's local area so unless you're in Iowa iirc or somewhere ND travels to regularly on business (like Indiana for gencon) where you can serve them as they're in the area you're out of luck there as well. Five thousand Palladium/Ninja Divsion backers were in the same boat with ND's first project, the Robotech Tactics game, and we were fortunately to get pennies on the dollar (literally 12 cents value on my remaining wave 2 pledge value dollars... I calculated it out) for remaining base pledge wave 2 rewards. You're literally at the mercy of ND and whatever they can/will/feel like doing unless you're willing to throw more good money after bad in suing them. It's the reason I haven't crowdfunded after my first campaign (Robotech) for more than $1.00 just to comment.

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

It's not going to be what you want to hear, and it's not going to be palatable, but your best chance to get anything is to support and promote ND (or at least keep quite about them) in the hope that they can pull themselves back together

If they go bankrupt they owe far more than they can pay back, and people with unsecured debt like KS backers will end up with nothing

at least they are still trying (and believe me it would have been far, far easier for them to have given up and dumped the lot and got jobs doing something else.... or even non management roles in the games industry as employees)

KS is not a store, you can loose out and get nothing (as I've done before, and I suspect I may with ND too), it's not fun, it's frustrating but its how crowdfunding works

**Dynas**

So it sounds like this is a fraudulent company for sure. Perhaps a class action lawsuit is needed. I know I will never back another kickstarter ever again.

A quick search of failed kickstarters lawsuit class action etc...
Reveals this is apparently rally common among games and miniature kickstarters.

Robotech
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/06/feds-take-first-action-against-a-failed-kickstarter-with-112k-judgment/

**warboss**

Yeah... that robotech class action rally cry was doomed from the start and amounted to nothing in the end. As for ND being fraudulent, you'd have to prove that they had the intent to take your money and not give you anything in return. Incompetent and deceitful though are pretty much proven at this point seeing as how they knew they were in dire financial straits and didn't disclose it during the campaign nor sequester the money they raised for the project only specifically for completion of the project. ND/SP didn't get screwed over by another company nor did they suffer some sort of natural disaster or act of god that cost them dearly; they're in a hole completely of their own making based on the limited information we have and backers are paying the price.

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

There's no point in a class action lawsuit if the company has basically no assets, even if you win you can't get blood from a stone

and in more fun news Miniature Market is running an 'up to' 80% off sale of Soda Pop and CMON stuff

if you're after something (and in the USA) it's worth a look, if you're outside the shipping is going to kill any savings, sadly

**warboss**

At least with the fire sale being run by MM, it's unlikely that ND/SP will get any funds from it directly (although large orders might convince MM to restock again from them admittedly). That's not the case with the AVP fire sale by Prodos now that they're not renewing the license; in that case, you're directly rewarding a company that for years hasn't shipped backer rewards that were in stock/available for sale for miniatures that they'd otherwise have to destroy or sell in bulk for pennies in a few weeks/months. At least with AVP, I actually liked the minis but refuse to reward them nonetheless. With ND/SP, I have no interest in their chibi items and my following them was/is purely for Robotech and Starfinder respectively.

**JohnHwangDD**

Dynas wrote:
Perhaps a class action lawsuit is needed.

That would be the very definition of throwing good money after bad.

The typical reason to file class action is to get money; however, it is obvious that SPM/ND is "judgement proof". Assuming that you won, and got through the motions and appeals, SPM/ND aren't sitting on Millions of dollars in cash or other assets that you could have the court freeze and seize to repay backers.

The only reason to take SPM/ND to court is to:
a) get a statement that Consumer Law applies to Kickstarter contracts;
b) force SPM/ND to open their books for forensic accounting; and/or
c) get a bigger "my bad" statement from SPM/ND management

But the chance that you can take SPM/ND to court and recover your cash and other fees is less than zero - there is no money to be gotten there, only "satisfaction".

**skarsol**

Monkeysloth wrote:
The comment about miniature Market buying all the stock from Ninja Division was correct. MM just announced they're having a huge ND sale starting tomorrow.

Flesh Hounds counts as for ~$1.25 each? Don't mind if I do!

**Barzam**

What's really annoying is that I really liked that angel themed faction in Relic Knights (Void I think they were called? ) and chances are good I'll never get them. I really liked that funky mecha they had, too.

**JohnHwangDD**

Barzam wrote:
What's really annoying is that I really liked that angel themed faction in Relic Knights (Void I think they were called? ) and chances are good I'll never get them. I really liked that funky mecha they had, too.

Prismatic, IIRC. I should do something with mine. LOL