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Green Blow Fly wrote:Okay here is what I am keeping in the army

- Marneus, Lysander, Chronus, 6x assault terminators and LRC with multi-melta

What would you suggest for the rest of the points left over to make this a better list?

G

Number 1 thing that people have been telling you here is that if somone can neutralise your 1000+pt single target threat here....you lose. You could have Marneus, lysander and TEN assault terminators, and people arent going to care if they're walking across the board. Imperial guard would even laugh at you while they pelt terminators with lasguns....a walking unit like that is a joke to anyone whose played for at least a couple of years.

LR's ARE tough, but they are NOT tough enough to entrust over 1000 pts to in an 1850 or 1750 list. If you lose your LR, you lose the game. If you deepstrike your terminators anywhere they're going to be a threat, you're simply standing there with an obvious nut to crack, you lose the game. This list isnt competetive in an atmosphere that you need a take all comers list. Any good player has SOMETHING to stop this army with.

You claim to be able to stop a lash list...without a shred of psychic defense. I can stop your entire battle plan with 200 pts that you cannot do squat about.

I teleport an epistolary in terminator armour behind your rhino and he vortexes your LR which is now in open sight. Your game is over. This sort of librarian isnt that far of a stretch to imagine in a tournement atmosphere.

You cannot do this sort of thing against lash lists or Nob bikers, because they either have their points spread out more intelligently (lash lists), or the expensive units are to resiliant to kill with a single shot (Nob Bikers).

1000pts in one spot does NOT work. Thats what people are trying to tell you, but you dont seem to want to listen.

What if I start with the whole army in reserve? Your Librarian comes in first and I punk him out with one meltagun shot.

G

Green Blow Fly wrote:What if I start with the whole army in reserve? Your Librarian comes in first and I punk him out with one meltagun shot.

G

Why? because I'm stupid enough to veil him over there before there's even a target? You DO know that libby's have a power equivalant to the necron veil now right? Teleporting every turn wherever they like. Or didnt you factor that into your little equation when you were putting together your *cough* "Power" *cough cough* list? Along with conversion beamers, Shokk attack gunz, Orbital strikes, basilisks, turbo boosting MM attack bikers(or maybe they just tag along with the libby when he veils and kill you for SURE in one shot), or the plethora of other things that squash land raiders with no problem given half a chance.

Your landraider idea is what makes this list horrible, and since it IS the list....you need to start over.

You can ask anyone I play when I run my landraiders you are not going to be able to get close enough with a deep strike to hit it with vortex or a multi-melta at half range... unless I want you to.

So anyway genius what would you change in the list to improve it, other than the units I have identified as not willing to part with?

I played a SW list back in 3rd edition with one LRC and two rhinos... it did a lot better than you might expect and I took it to quite a few tournaments. Now that the game does not revolve around victory points and the LR is much stronger that to me are two plusses. I know you have it in your head that all you have to do is stop the LRC to win, but that is not the case at all in an objective based game.

G

Green Blow Fly wrote:You can ask anyone I play when I run my landraiders you are not going to be able to get close enough with a deep strike to hit it with vortex or a multi-melta at half range... unless I want you to.
G

What?

It's true.

G

Green Blow Fly wrote:You can ask anyone I play when I run my landraiders you are not going to be able to get close enough with a deep strike to hit it with vortex or a multi-melta at half range... unless I want you to.

One more time loudly for the guys in the nosebleeds....YOU DO NOT NEED MELTA TO KILL/IMMOBILISE A LAND RAIDER!

So anyway genius what would you change in the list to improve it, other than the units I have identified as not willing to part with?

Amazing, you havent heard a word I've said. You know what, nothing, keep the army as it is. Go make up another faux battle report while you're at it.

I played a SW list back in 3rd edition with one LRC and two rhinos... it did a lot better than you might expect and I took it to quite a few tournaments.

G

And I used a single unit of gretchin in the 'Ard Boyz tournements this year, and thats all. I did a lot better than you might expect too...but I still lost. /sarcasm

Quick thread summary for those just joining:

GBF: Dudez, check out my power list. I know it's good because I won a game with it.

Everyone: Um, it sucks. Here's precisely why (...)

GBF: You're all wrong, but I won't provide reasons why. Also, I'm angry and defensive now, rawr.

sourclams wrote:

Green Blow Fly wrote:You can ask anyone I play when I run my landraiders you are not going to be able to get close enough with a deep strike to hit it with vortex or a multi-melta at half range... unless I want you to.
G

What?

Green Blow Fly wrote:It's true.

G

Thats right, didnt you know?

GBF has never lost a landraider to a melta gun, EVER. Dont even bother to bring them against him because it will never kill the landraider. He's that good.

Danny Internets wrote:Quick thread summary for those just joining:

GBF: Dudez, check out my power list. I know it's good because I won a game with it.

Everyone: Um, it sucks. Here's precisely why (...)

GBF: You're all wrong, but I won't provide reasons why. Also, I'm angry and defensive now, rawr.

dbl pwn

I guess every village needs an idiot. Even dakka.

I am not defensive... in fact the hater clan and their juvenile comments are making my day! : )

Anyways anyone reading all the posts will know that what you are saying is not what I am saying. Today we live in a world where it is acceptable to constantly lie on the internet when posting and run routine character assassination on a daily basis. Smart people know what is really going on and those are the ones that matter to me. Shane I do have to say that I am sad to see you are one of those that would do that kind of thing, but then again it does not surprise me.

G

.

.

Character assassination....rriiiigghhhtt!

I guess I'm the only one with anything negative to say about this list.

You're the one posting an extremely off-beat list and getting angry when people tell you its no good....then doggedly defending your position without presenting any facts. Dont post extremist army-lists if you cannot take the criticism. Its not my fault you're this thin skinned. When I posted the last army list that 'I' posted, I didnt feel the need to have to defend myself against anyone that had anything negative to say about it. I listen to what they have to say, decide for myself whether or not its worth listening to, then thank them for their opinion.

Everybody here is telling you that your idea is a poor one, but you are choosing not to hear it. Everyone here is telling you that this isnt a power list, that its not even threatening in a tournement situation except against the smallest fraction of opponents. You seem to find all this as insults and you take it to the next step, everyone else then follows suit and then takes it to the NEXT step, ridiculing you to some extent.

If it makes you feel better thinking that I somehow orchestrated that, so be it. Whatever.

Shane you are more interested in using this as an opportunity to bash me. I have asked you some questions tactical in nature that you have avoided. What you are saying is a broken record. I think if you went up against this list it would put you in a tail spin.

G

Green Blow Fly wrote:Shane you are more interested in using this as an opportunity to bash me. I have asked you some questions tactical in nature that you have avoided. What you are saying is a broken record. I think if you went up against this list it would put you in a tail spin.

G

What questions have you asked ME? I've told you what I think about all this and you just dig your heels in and fire back at whatever I say. (along with whatever anyone else says)

Also, Steve since you have no idea what is actually in the armies that I run right now, since we've never played and dont play at the same store, I do beleive you're talking out of your a$$. You dont have the slightest idea of my playstyle, my armies or what skill level I play at. How could you possibly know what will stop me in a game?

kk to quell all this gak heres what i did, I took all the models I owned and made a proxy battle.

Used your amry list. and then used my list. what happened, you got the first turn and moved forwards.

My turn I dropped a pod of sternys beside your land raider. scatterd 7 inchs away. used the 2 inchs that you get to deploy os I was within half range with 3 meltas. I then procedded to blow up your tank. you get no cover save because their was nothing inbetween and you now have a unit of termies strutting across the board which i eventually wittled down with bolter fire.

oh guess I forgot to post that I dropped the other stern squad beside his rhinos and killed one with plasma guns and the other I immobilized

@ Golga - That is how you played it. I can setup such that your Sternguard cannot possibly get a shot at half range from the drop pod. It is an easy defense to run too.

@ Shane - One my main stances behind this list is that objective based games make the LRC less important. 99% or more of the posters against the list say that its main weakness is early loss of the LRC. Space Marines in general are tough to beat if they can put large squads on top of objectives early in the game. I have won many 5e games with my BA based on this tactic. It is simple and it works.

G

G

Aren't you and Shane both in the WC?

From this, I infer that all WC members are constantly at each others' throat.

Ozymandias, King of Kings

How cna you possibly set up without hemming yourself in with terain or rhinos?

Although I do feel that's a reasonably accurate representation of sternguard vs Superfriends, he built it to counter lash and nob bikers.

Green Blow Fly wrote:
@ Shane - One my main stances behind this list is that objective based games make the LRC less important. 99% or more of the posters against the list say that its main weakness is early loss of the LRC. Space Marines in general are tough to beat if they can put large squads on top of objectives early in the game. I have won many 5e games with my BA based on this tactic. It is simple and it works.

G

G

None of which changes anything anyone here has said. I.E. It still doesnt change the fact that if you stop the LRC and in effect, the terminators....you will lose. The game is still about killing things, something this army wont be doing against anyone with any amount of firepower.

Ozymandias wrote:Aren't you and Shane both in the WC?

From this, I infer that all WC members are constantly at each others' throat.

Ozymandias, King of Kings

I'm not at anyone's throat, I'm simply expressing extreme doubt toward the viability of GBF's list.

He's getting angry, defensive and taking offense at me for doing so.

sourclams wrote:Although I do feel that's a reasonably accurate representation of sternguard vs Superfriends, he built it to counter lash and nob bikers.

Oh I fully agree with that, just giving hi the veiw point that this is not an unbreakable army.

Golga wrote:

sourclams wrote:Although I do feel that's a reasonably accurate representation of sternguard vs Superfriends, he built it to counter lash and nob bikers.

Oh I fully agree with that, just giving hi the veiw point that this is not an unbreakable army.

What you posted basically, again, proves that not only is it not an unbreakable army. It proves that it DEFINATLY isnt suited to tournement play. Lash lists and Nob bikers tend to be at the upper tables....this army wont be.

Shane come on now. You have acted like a jerk often with a lot of your posts... pwned is something I expect to hear when driving by a high school.

In general in regard to avoiding melta alpha strikes... one thing you can do is hold your army in reserve. I have mentioned this several times today. There are also deployments that will shield the LRC. I have found that if an opponent is very eager to take out one enemy unit they may expose their underbelly in doing so.

G

Truth has never being more sweeter.

Was something vaporized?



G