Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Most people have those single sheet rules summaries so that they don't need to carry the rulebook with them all the time. Codex is slightly different because most people are only intimately familiar with their own.

Wish I could memorise what I had for breakfast this morning never mind a cowin' codex!

I'm eighty three you know...

Memorizing rules for the sake of speeding up a game is fine, but I would always carry at least a photocopied page of the rules, in case any disputes do arise. Summarization does not bold well for those who are hellbent on playing RAW.

I can see those rules for pickup games just fine, they seem bizarre if people are coming in with plans to play against each other (IE, why can't two friends share a rulebook dice and templates?).

Seems fine to me. The sharing template thing is a bit meh....

Eh At least they didn't require fully painted armies

Avatar 720 wrote:

"I memorize my codex, releiving me of carrying a 6 oz book into my store" Really? You have committed that much to memory? Or are you simply trying to play the Devil's advocate for a futile cause?

Assuming you're replying to me here (since i'm the only one who's brought it up as a possibilty so far), may I ask you where I said i'd memorised it in order to save weight? All you've done is mis-quoted me to try and prove a point.

What I did bring up (and what you keep failing to understand) is the possbility of it being done. I studied drama for over 5 years, and had to memorise a lot of stuff in short amounts of time; naturally, this became second nature, and I started doing it with other things.

My point that I have been trying to make: What if a group of people who play each other (this was the bolded part that you ignored) did just that, memorised their codices because they'd played that army for a long time/played against it for a long time?

Next time, if you want to quote me, please do it with my actual words, otherwise try and paraphrase and avoid adding in bits that were not originally there.

Yes, your point is that you (as many others, myself included) can/have memorized their codex/codices to the letter.

HIS point is, even if everyone has the rules memorized, why not just bring your codex just in case (and/or to at least shut people up about having it around) ? Especially when that (and rulebook/dice/templates) are all pretty small things compared to what most people probably store their models in.

^ If it's between friends that know and trust each other though it shouldn't matter.

I think it's a bit mountain-out-of-molehills here... I actually think there are not too disimilar rules posted in our local GW, and it's not really a big deal.

I always have my rules (both main and army book), dice/templates, and models with me when playing. I don't think I've ever proxied over 10% of an army, that lets you try out a new unit. In short, I'd already be meeting these rules for friendly games, as are most people I play with...

For fantasy, the main rulebook has a small paperback copy, which is the one almost everyone brings with them. The huge tome is too much to carry... but I can't imagine going to game without bringing the rulebook, questions just come up too often not to have it on hand to check.

Kanluwen wrote:Or it could simply be the OP just has a pretty crummy looking army and the "please have the most current models" is a little less harsh than "Your stuff looks like it was assembled and painted by a blind man painting with a brush in his nose".

Pot calling the kettle black much?

I direct the Jury's attention to Kanluwen's gallery: http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/user/722-Kanluwen.html

Kanluwen wrote:

Manchu wrote:

MeanGreenStompa wrote:GW has been fairly open about the shops being about recruitment and induction into the hobby, the sales from those shops is a fairly good secondary bonus to them after they've got new folks coming in and seeing the hobby first hand.

This is hard to square with the closing of so many stores.

You know, I can kind of understand why they'd close so many stores.

Having a large amount of stores in the same vicinity(like they tended to do at times) results in an overcrowding of 'official' GW shops. They really just need one in a central location, then they direct you to the FLGSes for gaming, etc.

A la STARBUCKS... had 6 stores in downtown Sydney... all but 2 closed due to cannibalising eachother's sales...

AvatarForm wrote:Pot calling the kettle black much?

I direct the Jury's attention to Kanluwen's gallery: http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/user/722-Kanluwen.html

This jury members sees nothing egregious in his gallery. Golden Demon winning, maybe not, a better camera would help, but certainly nothing in there thats offensive.

The verdict is guilty of poor attempt at trolling on your part.

Have a splendid day sir.

Honestly I don't see what's wrong with just bringing your Codex, Rulebook, and Dice.

I find it annoying as when my opponent is always asking to see MY Rulebook and borrowing MY Ruler and MY Dice because they only chose to stick 5 in their back pocket of all places.

I don't see why they seem to think they have to restrict you on all those things especially Proxying, but I do feel out of common curtousy you should bring your own things in. Even if it's just a scanned printed off copy of the Army List section if you hate carrying around your codex (I'm not sure why you would be though )

I'm opening a new game store in west London in April. All are welcome. The concept of the shop is an extension of the best ideas from the old style GW.

There will be eight tables which can be configured to different popular sizes from 4x4 to 6x8 feet.

The terrain has been hand built and it's modular -- I've got some pics I'll post later.

We have most of the 40K armies done to tournament standard with at least 3,000 points of options. We're still short on Necrons and some of the non-Vanilla SMs, but we'll get most of the SMs done before opening. This is to allow players a wide choice of troops. In case you don't want to write a list, there are recommended pre-written lists so you can pick up and play.

There are at least two copies of every codex, plus dice, templates, rulebooks and all other game necessaries. You don't need to bring anything.

The best thing is, we even provide players to run each army. While your proxy player plays a game for you at the shop, you can play another game at home.

We're planning campaign weekends, when the action will carry on for two or three days (on Bank Holidays). Your proxy player will even attend the after game drinking and dining sessions on your behalf. Your proxy player can play the entire campaign while you go on holiday, saving you the trouble of having anything to do with 40K.

I don't believe any other wargame shop offers such good facilities.

For those not from Brisbane.

I've heard the last few weeks the new manager at the store in question has shut down prize support for tourneys and allowing non GW workers to run events at the battle bunker.

I assume he was the GW guy (there was one from the store anyway) handing out fliers for the new WHFB O&G range (10 savage orcs for $48US, yes US dollars as the Australian dollar is at parity with the US dollar, remember it is $28US for USAlanders .... but I can buy it for $21 direct from the UK)

A GW store has just closed in the town.

Things are not going well in 'ole Brisbane towne...

Auxellion wrote:Seems fine to me. The sharing template thing is a bit meh....

Eh At least they didn't require fully painted armies

Which would make more sense as fully painted armies present a generally better and more exciting image of the hobby to people entering the shop. That would surely be more useful than requiring every pair of players bring two rulebooks.

It could just be that they're fed up of people coming into the shop to play and grabbing books off the shelves to check rules. Because that's how you damage stock and make it unsellable; it's people thumbing through them looking for rules that ruins them.

All the GW shops here have a sticker on the copy that you're allowed to look through (i.e. if you intend on buying it and want to glance at it first).

Sounds like a bummer, Gonads... and Treesong, the problem with requiring fully painted armies (not that they're doing that here) for friendly play is that people who want to try out their armies / learn the rules / etc cannot do it there. So that business goes elsewhere... imho that's a great requirement for tournaments, not so much for friendly gaming.

As far as Kanluwen's comment about how it's better to have a single GW in a central location- around Baltimore there's a ring of GWs (presumably more here since the HQ/Bunker used to be here). So that statement doesn't appear to be their strategy here at all. I highly doubt they would close stores to make room for more FLGS's... as nice as it is to have more of them around.

RiTides wrote:
As far as Kanluwen's comment about how it's better to have a single GW in a central location- around Baltimore there's a ring of GWs (presumably more here since the HQ/Bunker used to be here). So that statement doesn't appear to be their strategy here at all. I highly doubt they would close stores to make room for more FLGS's... as nice as it is to have more of them around.

There's a key part of the context missing from your analysis of my statement.

I said: "I can kind of understand why they'd close so many stores" before I made the statement about overcrowding.

That's dealing, specifically, with the amount of GW shops we've seen closing here in the US. Many of them are ones were situated within five minutes of the others.

Do they necessarily "close stores to make room for more FLGS's"? No, but they do start hinting towards you wanting to 'check out this cool place...' at a certain point.

AvatarForm wrote:Pot calling the kettle black much?

I direct the Jury's attention to Kanluwen's gallery: http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/user/722-Kanluwen.html

I'd direct them towards your gallery...but it's empty.

Inquisitor Rex and his henchmen need to be photographed again, I'll grant you that. The camera I took the photos with was pushing 5+ years old, had no macro function, no tripod, etc. I bought a new camera and that's what the Hydra and Tarantula have been photographed with so far.

The Cadian test model clearly couldn't have been just that...a test.
The Terminator Sergeant in that gallery was stripped ages ago because I felt the quality wasn't high enough on the painting.

Do you really want me to go on and make you look more ridiculous, or are you going to play nice?

Did I miss something?
namely a WIP of the Stryker

Which way did he go?

RiTides wrote:...

, the problem with requiring fully painted armies (not that they're doing that here) for friendly play is that people who want to try out their armies / learn the rules / etc cannot do it there. So that business goes elsewhere... imho that's a great requirement for tournaments, not so much for friendly gaming.

...

I suppose it depends if GW want to present their shop as a venue for playing, or as a outlet for sales and hobby advice. I don't see why it can't be both, as long as people are sensible, but obviously the sales and marketing aspect must come first.

Perhaps the issue is that some customers come to see the shop as their club rather than as a business. Ideally GW want you to come in, buy stuff, and go away. If you come and play in the shop they want you to present the best look to the hobby -- painted armies -- and require the minimum of support from themselves (free rules, and so on).

Well I dont have a GW in my town or in my district or even in my country so I dont think they have gone that far

Seriously these seem like legit demands and rules for their gamers in their stores... personally the "your not welcome if " announcement seems not the way to go... I mean things could be handled on a private conversation with the " offending" players... but with the one man stores I guess thats asking to much... one man stores will in theory become less and less humanized and i think these kind of limitations/rules anouncements will pop up more and more.

Well I dont have a GW in my town or in my district or even in my country so I dont think they have gone that far

That sounds less like going too far and more like not coming close!

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:

Well I dont have a GW in my town or in my district or even in my country so I dont think they have gone that far

That sounds less like going too far and more like not coming close!

It definitely seems very hit or miss at times.

We had one GW shop within the entirety of North Carolina at a point in time. It was in Charlotte, which isn't a very good placement if they're trying to 'draw in kids/college students'--because Charlotte is more of a "working professionals" city than "raise a family here" city.

That shop closed down like a year after it opened.

Kanluwen wrote:

It definitely seems very hit or miss at times.

If my memory serves me correctly back in '06, GW purchased a program and data from a company that looks at the areas of wealth that are established via by zip code so that they have a critera (not the main one) on where to place their stores. This does not necessarly means that the store is placed in a wealth hub, it could be placed near a wealth hub at a reasonable distance, or if other criteria on placement supersedes the wealth hub aspect.

Other possible criteria are:

How far is it to a fast food places, restaurants, supermarkets, magnet stores such as Target here in the US that draws people to an area where the Game store could possibly be located.

Then it is up to the local population that are willing to get into this hobby and the employees in that store which keeps the store open.

Failure of a store is when the company does not do their homework on placement and follow through IMHO

Kilkrazy wrote:I'm opening a new game store in west London in April. All are welcome. The concept of the shop is an extension of the best ideas from the old style GW.
I don't believe any other wargame shop offers such good facilities.

Sounds awesome! Do you accept proxy money?

When I was a lad gw workers were quite cool guys, now I don't go into gw for fear of having some balding, overweight 30 year old virgin trying to force me to buy a b aneblade or something.

I realise i'm sounding a bit out of order, but seriously, I went their with my gf recently and there was an actual intake of breath and a race as to who could converse first with a real female.

Scott-S6 wrote:

Kilkrazy wrote:I'm opening a new game store in west London in April. All are welcome. The concept of the shop is an extension of the best ideas from the old style GW.
I don't believe any other wargame shop offers such good facilities.

Sounds awesome! Do you accept proxy money?

Absolutely!

I'll send a proxy for whatever you buy.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

AvatarForm wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Or it could simply be the OP just has a pretty crummy looking army and the "please have the most current models" is a little less harsh than "Your stuff looks like it was assembled and painted by a blind man painting with a brush in his nose".

Pot calling the kettle black much?

I direct the Jury's attention to Kanluwen's gallery: http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/user/722-Kanluwen.html

Kanluwen's models look fine.

AvatarForm wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

Manchu wrote:

MeanGreenStompa wrote:GW has been fairly open about the shops being about recruitment and induction into the hobby, the sales from those shops is a fairly good secondary bonus to them after they've got new folks coming in and seeing the hobby first hand.

This is hard to square with the closing of so many stores.

You know, I can kind of understand why they'd close so many stores.

Having a large amount of stores in the same vicinity(like they tended to do at times) results in an overcrowding of 'official' GW shops. They really just need one in a central location, then they direct you to the FLGSes for gaming, etc.

A la STARBUCKS... had 6 stores in downtown Sydney... all but 2 closed due to cannibalising eachother's sales...

That is a deliberate strategy. Starbucks open multiple stores in a small area in order to force local coffee shops and rival chains out of business. Then they close enough stores to let the remainder become profitable.

I don't know if GW follow the same principle.

Hurrdurr2000 wrote:I'm sorry if I was unclear, and I'm not even sure this will make a difference but;

Each PLAYER must have their own Rulebook, markers, templates and dice - otherwise you are politely asked to pack up the models you have with you and leave the gaming area.

Or have I been just too comfortable with the lax rules up until now?

Hurr.

So everyone must have a full set of stuff, even if gaming in a group? So if you have 4 people you need to have 4 rulebooks and 4 sets of templates? That sounds pretty dumb.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kanluwen wrote:

Chibi Bodge-Battle wrote:

Well I dont have a GW in my town or in my district or even in my country so I dont think they have gone that far

That sounds less like going too far and more like not coming close!

It definitely seems very hit or miss at times.

We had one GW shop within the entirety of North Carolina at a point in time. It was in Charlotte, which isn't a very good placement if they're trying to 'draw in kids/college students'--because Charlotte is more of a "working professionals" city than "raise a family here" city.

That shop closed down like a year after it opened.

We dont have a single one in the state of Florida, not one. You would think a place like Orlando or Tampa would get one. Not that Im complaining, Im at the point where even internet discounts arent getting me interested in GW stuff, never mind paying full retail for it. Though I must admit if there was one within reasonable distance Id visit it once, just to say i did.

I have 2 GWs within about 15 minutes, and I tend to drive 30+ minutes (and occassionally 2 hours on the weekend) to go to the independent stores in the area instead.

So, no real attachment to me about GW stores... I just think saying they're closing them to direct you to other FLGS's is just silly. Perhaps if you meant they close them to direct you to the other GWs, that would make more sense (a la the Starbucks discussion above).

RiTides wrote:I have 2 GWs within about 15 minutes, and I tend to drive 30+ minutes (and occassionally 2 hours on the weekend) to go to the independent stores in the area instead.

So, no real attachment to me about GW stores... I just think saying they're closing them to direct you to other FLGS's is just silly. Perhaps if you meant they close them to direct you to the other GWs, that would make more sense (a la the Starbucks discussion above).

Once again: You're misunderstanding. I'm not saying "they close them and direct you to shop at the FLGSes".

GW's policy, as it stands now, is they are directing veterans towards FLGSes.

The official GW shops are essentially "recruiting stations" where players are introduced and kept for an amount of time...then boom, they start getting directed towards the FLGSes.

I think its a local role we don't have that. or gw Australia.
I don't proxy allot. and if I forgot something i just use the shop version. including dice books templates and even models.
only thing we aren't aloud is to eat and drink in the shop. But than again we have a really nice local shop manager. and no red gak yet shop has only been there for like maby a half year.

Kanluwen wrote:

RiTides wrote:I have 2 GWs within about 15 minutes, and I tend to drive 30+ minutes (and occassionally 2 hours on the weekend) to go to the independent stores in the area instead.

So, no real attachment to me about GW stores... I just think saying they're closing them to direct you to other FLGS's is just silly. Perhaps if you meant they close them to direct you to the other GWs, that would make more sense (a la the Starbucks discussion above).

Once again: You're misunderstanding. I'm not saying "they close them and direct you to shop at the FLGSes".

GW's policy, as it stands now, is they are directing veterans towards FLGSes.

The official GW shops are essentially "recruiting stations" where players are introduced and kept for an amount of time...then boom, they start getting directed towards the FLGSes.

and this is strange. our local shop is always 50% veterans but than again its the veterans how teats the new comers. but than again we only have 3 gw's in our country and one has to do every thing with the French 2 with the dutch.( live in a country with more than one mother tong )
to go on the memo rising your rule book en codex. its the same for me i still bring them for when T am not a 100% sure of a rule but half the time they stay in my back pack. ( tournament role's state that you have to know your rule's bye hart books are only used to set el arguments)
and me and my girl friend use the same rule book dice and template's (oke I own 5-6 sets of templates 3 rule books ( black reach version big one an collectors edition and a butch of dice)
and my local club is 10€ a year for the use of tables and terrain thats how they keep there terrain in good state the space the get for free from a local computer en magic bar. and even then you are aloud to take non members with you only one person needs a member ship card to get the terrain. my local gw manager has gone there to play war machine with I fined a finny thing.

This is what has always puzzled me. The US game playing scene seems to revolve around playing in shops.

The UK scene is much more about clubs at parish halls, community centres and people's houses.

The main Aussie scene is like this as well.
The minority of clubs are based in stores, GW or otherwise.

My own club used to be hosted in the local Police &Citizens Youth Club (we found a cheaper venue across the road) with access to beer.
My previous clubs were usually run in hired scout halls or other community group locations.