Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

...which is making up rules, 100%

Trace FROM the eyes TO the target. If there is something in the way...like the back of their own head, for example....then you dont have LOS

This means getting down behind your models to see what they can see. Laser pointers arent an issue if they are using them from behind the models.

inquisitorlewis wrote:

helixthief wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

bladedragon03 wrote:If a unit is within the doors reach and there's nothing like a wall or other impassable ter. in the way and they fail their Str. test. Say good bye.

If they have LoS - since that's a requirement set by the doors.

Yes but they will have LOS if there is not a wall or other terrain between the two models.

There is no need to turn models, or anything else.

According to what rule?

LOS rule. page 16 Assult on Black Reach book

nosferatu1001 wrote:

bladedragon03 wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:No, we understood it. What you are failing to understand is that you are making up rules

I'm not making up rules. You have to turn the models to the target and then look for LoS. You can turn the model a full 360 for that purpose. What's made up about that. It's not written but it is a fact.

The monolith is not their target. That is just ONE of the many rules you have made up.

I didn't make anything up. You have to draw LoS from the model to the Target. The target being the door.

Nothing made up there yet another fact you just misread or misunderstood.

Looking for the quote that says they have 360?

Ah, the one that says to trace from their eyes? The one youre ignoring by claiming you can see through the back of your own head?

Stop. Making. Up. Rules

helixthief wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

bladedragon03 wrote:If a unit is within the doors reach and there's nothing like a wall or other impassable ter. in the way and they fail their Str. test. Say good bye.

If they have LoS - since that's a requirement set by the doors.

Yes but they will have LOS if there is not a wall or other terrain between the two models.

There is no need to turn models, or anything else.

So... you're going back to square one?
With no rules to back you up?

Find the rule giving infantry 360 degree LoS and I'll concede the debate to you.

nosferatu1001 wrote:...which is making up rules, 100%

Trace FROM the eyes TO the target. If there is something in the way...like the back of their own head, for example....then you dont have LOS

Why would their own head get in their way?

Do you think a model isnt a member of his own unit?

You can trace from the eyes to the target through your own unit.

I love when people who manipulate rules get mad that somebody else would manipulate a rule(like turning a dreadnought).

Suddenly I remember why I stopped playing.

With that,I am done with this thread.Only an official FAQ will clear this up, and no good will come out of this thread.

helixthief wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:...which is making up rules, 100%

Trace FROM the eyes TO the target. If there is something in the way...like the back of their own head, for example....then you dont have LOS

Why would their own head get in their way?

Do you think a model isnt a member of his own unit?

You can trace from the eyes to the target through your own unit.

Other members of the unit, not yourself. Again, stop making up rules and breaking the tenets of this forum.

rigeld2 wrote:

helixthief wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

bladedragon03 wrote:If a unit is within the doors reach and there's nothing like a wall or other impassable ter. in the way and they fail their Str. test. Say good bye.

If they have LoS - since that's a requirement set by the doors.

Yes but they will have LOS if there is not a wall or other terrain between the two models.

There is no need to turn models, or anything else.

So... you're going back to square one?
With no rules to back you up?

Find the rule giving infantry 360 degree LoS and I'll concede the debate to you.

The rules are the only thing backing me up.

Show me the rule that says they do not and Ill do the same.

BTW you never answered about Nids...some have eyes on the sides, do you think they can only fire broadside? LOL Because when they face their target their eyes are looking left and right so the target is out of LOS right.

What rules? So far you have given none, and I have given the *ACTUAL* rules

OTHER members of your unit do not block LOS. Now, unless you claim your own head is another member of the unit, you are still making gak up

nosferatu1001 wrote:

helixthief wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:...which is making up rules, 100%

Trace FROM the eyes TO the target. If there is something in the way...like the back of their own head, for example....then you dont have LOS

Why would their own head get in their way?

Do you think a model isnt a member of his own unit?

You can trace from the eyes to the target through your own unit.

Other members of the unit, not yourself. Again, stop making up rules and breaking the tenets of this forum.

Well, you cant understand. You are not allowed to just make up rules as you go. Sorry, I tried to teach and explain to you but you think you can just make up any old rule and there is no need to refer to the rules. You also must stop breaking the tenets of this forum, cause I just about had my fill of that.

If you are unsure of the forum rules refer to them.

I've already stated that's it's not in the rule book. But that fact they the models can turn when drawing LoS basically gives them a 360 LoS.

How about I say they have a LoS to whatever is in front of them but because they can turn when drawing LoS this this gives you a 360 rotation untill you line up to your target.

I never made up rules. Just stated unwritten facts.

nosferatu1001 wrote:What rules? So far you have given none, and I have given the *ACTUAL* rules

OTHER members of your unit do not block LOS. Now, unless you claim your own head is another member of the unit, you are still making gak up

So, can nids (with eyes on the side) fire forward?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

bladedragon03 wrote:I've already stated that's it's not in the rule book. But that fact they the models can turn when drawing LoS basically gives them a 360 LoS.

How about I say they have a LoS to whatever is in front of them but because they can turn when drawing LoS this this gives you a 360 rotation untill you line up to your target.

I never made up rules. Just stated unwritten facts.

I dont understand why you think you have to turn the model?

Sigh. The "eyes" debate has already been covered - you know, in the first few pages of this thread.

If youve had your fill, try the mod alert button.

nosferatu1001 wrote:Sigh. The "eyes" debate has already been covered - you know, in the first few pages of this thread.

If youve had your fill, try the mod alert button.

If you are not interesting in learning, why are you on this thread?

helixthief wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:What rules? So far you have given none, and I have given the *ACTUAL* rules

OTHER members of your unit do not block LOS. Now, unless you claim your own head is another member of the unit, you are still making gak up

So, can nids (with eyes on the side) fire forward?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

bladedragon03 wrote:I've already stated that's it's not in the rule book. But that fact they the models can turn when drawing LoS basically gives them a 360 LoS.

How about I say they have a LoS to whatever is in front of them but because they can turn when drawing LoS this this gives you a 360 rotation untill you line up to your target.

I never made up rules. Just stated unwritten facts.

I dont understand why you think you have to turn the model?

I'm just stating this rule because the book says to to draw LoS to make sense to these people that are so hell bent on the rules word for word.

To answer your question. In there words No it couldn't fire straight. But In my words I don't see why not. It can absolutely.

bladedragon03 wrote:

helixthief wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:What rules? So far you have given none, and I have given the *ACTUAL* rules

OTHER members of your unit do not block LOS. Now, unless you claim your own head is another member of the unit, you are still making gak up

So, can nids (with eyes on the side) fire forward?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

bladedragon03 wrote:I've already stated that's it's not in the rule book. But that fact they the models can turn when drawing LoS basically gives them a 360 LoS.

How about I say they have a LoS to whatever is in front of them but because they can turn when drawing LoS this this gives you a 360 rotation untill you line up to your target.

I never made up rules. Just stated unwritten facts.

I dont understand why you think you have to turn the model?

I'm just stating this rule because the book says to to draw LoS to make sense to these people that are so hell bent on the rules word for word.

No that is the problem....they are looking at the rules some where between word for word...and as intented.

That is the problem, if you do both how do you decide where to make the transition.

As intended...Models LOS is 360.

Word for word....Models LOS is 360.

If word for word for part of it, and as intended for the other part. Models can not shoot. (BTW why do they have a shooting phase?)

Helix - because you're spouting incorrect rules, so I'm here to educate you and dissuade others from thinking you are in any way correct.

[quote BRB, page 16]
Line of sight must be traced from the eyes of the firing model to any part of the body of at least one of the models in the target unit...."

nosferatu1001 wrote:Helix - because you're spouting incorrect rules, so I'm here to educate you and dissuade others from thinking you are in any way correct.

So do you think nids with eyes on the side can fire forward?

There is only two answers...

No, and you sound like a fool.

Yes and you disprove your own arguement.

And, again, if youd bothered to check the thread you would have had your asinine question answered. Shocking I know

TheGreatAvatar wrote:[quote BRB, page 16]
Line of sight must be traced from the eyes of the firing model to any part of the body of at least one of the models in the target unit...."

Now, in general, when we play we don't turn the models necessarily to face the targeted unit, we just make the assumption the models turn and fire and what not. And, in the past, this really had little to no affect on the game play. However, the Necron codex uses LOS in a different scenario such the outcome is affected by how the model sees LOS.

The rule quoted above states the LOS is through the model's eyes to the target. If the model isn't in position to see the target then it doesn't have LOS.

So the question then is it a dick move to limit the number of shots due to models not facing the target? When can a model be turned to face its target? Before the unit selects a target? After selecting a target but before rolling dice? After rolling for hits after being corrected by opponent that some of the models are not facing the target?

I would dare say, the hugely vast number of players have played that facing the target isn't necessary when playing w40k since the model can be turned in the Shooting phase to face the target. Further, there is no fire arc restriction for non-vehicles detailed in the rules.

It just states that models can turn to face there target in the shooting phase. It doesn't say when so that means anytime in the shooting phase.

No, it means when they shoot.

You still have no rule that makes you turn them to face the monolith. Shocking that youre lacking rules, truly shocking.

nosferatu1001 wrote:And, again, if youd bothered to check the thread you would have had your asinine question answered. Shocking I know

Or you could answer it, instead of avoiding it.

You are happy to run your mouth about every other thing on this thread, so dont be shy now.

What, you mean correcting you on your made up rules?

Im quite good at that.

nosferatu1001 wrote:No, it means when they shoot.

quote]

Prove it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

nosferatu1001 wrote:What, you mean correcting you on your made up rules?

Im quite good at that.

Right...didnt think so.

If you have nothing more to add, you will not be needed on this thread any longer. You may go.

helixthief, have you ever played against writhguards/wraithlords? They don't even have eyes.So are you going to tell me they can never shoot?