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Why, the colour was named after them of course ! This way, people who wear blue can pretend they're a bit like an Ultramarine despite the fact they can never be as good, and they can feel in communion with their... with our spiritual liege !

Jokes aside, I really like Azure's take on the Necrons.

(There's already at least one lengthy enough DraigoVSMortarion thread.)

Its amazing how many of these I REALLY dont agree with

For some reason 40k has some distinct words like Adeptus Astartes and Adpetus Mechanicus but also some excessively normal ones like Power Armour and Power Weapon. They should come up with something a little more copyrightable like superslicium deathswordus. Ok, bad example but you know what I mean.

KamikazeCanuck wrote:For some reason 40k has some distinct words like Adeptus Astartes and Adpetus Mechanicus but also some excessively normal ones like Power Armour and Power Weapon. They should come up with something a little more copyrightable like superslicium deathswordus. Ok, bad example but you know what I mean.

Well, they do have the different types of armour, such as the maximus pattern...
Besides, what could you call a suit of power armor? Its sort of a staple of sci-fi. Power weapon follows the same logic.

Reading some of those lengthy lists, I can't help thinking some people should just look elsewhere or write their own story. Thanks god there is more to sci-fi than 40k.

The big change I would make involves storyline. I'd keep it consistent, and actually advance it.

The World of Warhammer Fantasy is part of the 40k universe. The slann are actually the last remnants of the race that battled the Necrons hiding out in a remote corner of galaxy.

For chaos, I'd combine it all into one giant book. Renegades, chaos marines, deamons, traitor legions, even bits of chaos fantasy. The Chaos Legions would have different identities and tweeked armylists again. A chaos armylist could bring a mixture of anything chaos. Even summon chaos warriors from fantasy as eternal warriors of chaos fighting for the side of chaos throughtout eternity- whatever.

Eldar would definitely be light on manpower. Following more of a Iyandan build. Units that had manpower would be more expensive but do even more and have better abilities.

Orcs- I would increase their strength as a trade off for lack of power weapons. Orcs thrive on solving a lot of problems with brute force and I think this would follow that trend. Every orc would be +1 strength.higher in codex. I'd give back the clans, and tweek armylists for each clan.

Imperium- I liked the idea that you could grab bits and pieces of each army. So, I'd make one giant book combining all the armies of the Imperium. and you could mix and match the army depending on what leaders you chose: IG, GK, SoB, WH, Space Marines.

The other armies I don't really know a lot about-

Necrons would get back to old fluff.

Tau- wouldnt really change except maybe add some adopted race abilities.

Dark Eldar are ok as space raiders gathering captives to feed the need.

I have to agree with Kanwulen, in that I do not think that Draigo's fluff is that far-fetched. If anything, it's a little cliched. Commander/leader falls in the midst of a battle against a powerful enemy. The heir to power, in a show of anger and revenge, smashes through the opposition to face the slayer, and although the hero manages to wound the villain (and do something to hurt their pride), the villain escapes final retribution. If that makes any sense, the biggest point I think is that Mortarion escaped, which would imply that Draigo was forced away somehow, since he is a Grey Knight and all, and leaving a daemon "alive" is not something they would do voluntarily.

MOAR GRIMDARK and no new crons. Also, kill draigo and tell the traitor primarchs to get off their backsides and do something. Give failbaddon arms and let him do something. Change the smurfs so that light doesn't shine out of their every orifice and add in some more alpha legion shenigans.

i'm a total noob, having just started miniature gaming this past month, hopefully a beginner's first impressions may be found interesting.
1. when I was looking at armies to choose, I immediately decided that I hate imperial guard because of cadians. they need to look way more sci-fi, and less ww2. i mean, krieg look ww2, but they also have a grim, far future vibe.
2. i looked into tau, but 2 things turned me off. first, if I wanted my army to only have a mech feel, then my infantry options are: fire warriors. and that's it. secondly, i wondered why kroot were part of the tau... i like the mech, attack of the clones asthetic, and i like the alien fleshy forest raider asthetic, but not mixed together. wouldn't it be better for kroot to be a different faction?
3. why are girls consigned to a specific faction? ok, eldar have female models, but why is the majority of the game a no girls allowed club? I get it with orks, but female space marines, imperial guard, chaos, tau, why don't I see any?

Armor doesnt conform to body shape,

Marines can't be female due to hormone stuff.

Sumpumpolis wrote:i'm a total noob, having just started miniature gaming this past month, hopefully a beginner's first impressions may be found interesting.
1. when I was looking at armies to choose, I immediately decided that I hate imperial guard because of cadians. they need to look way more sci-fi, and less ww2. i mean, krieg look ww2, but they also have a grim, far future vibe.
2. i looked into tau, but 2 things turned me off. first, if I wanted my army to only have a mech feel, then my infantry options are: fire warriors. and that's it. secondly, i wondered why kroot were part of the tau... i like the mech, attack of the clones asthetic, and i like the alien fleshy forest raider asthetic, but not mixed together. wouldn't it be better for kroot to be a different faction?
3. why are girls consigned to a specific faction? ok, eldar have female models, but why is the majority of the game a no girls allowed club? I get it with orks, but female space marines, imperial guard, chaos, tau, why don't I see any?

40K may be set in the future, but most/ all themes are taken from Gothic/ fantasy things

IIRC, Kroot were in line to have their own faction in 2nd ed. but thy ended up lumping them into the Tau dex. (might just have been a rumor)

Tau females are physically similar to males, nearly identical save the little marks on their forheads, GW doesn't see the profit in making female IG, although half of all Cadians in the fluff are female. As for SM and CSM, it's a gene-seed thing, any female who tries to be converted into a SM suffers an excruciating death.

Bobthehero wrote:Armor doesnt conform to body shape,

Marines can't be female due to hormone stuff.

1/. Wouldn't be hard to change. Just tell the armourer to beat it out really well there and there

Seriously. The IOM is quite capable of making Power Armour to fit women, and seriously buff women aren't built that much differently than men. They aren't quite as bulky as buff men, but their curves tend to get pared away.


2/. And a mysoginistic A-hole developing the process. If you are capable of genewarping a radiation scarred scrawny scavvie into a angelic looking 8 ft supermodel, making it work on a woman shouldn't be that hard. It's more a case of the fluff-writers making Marines a boys only club so tha tthe 14 year old guys they are marketed to won't feel threatened , imo
I think there's a grand total of one line of text saying that it doesn't work, but given the society i doubt they'd even have tried it, as it would be a new idea, which the IOM are violently against.

FOr the record, before the flames start falling, I don't play, nor have i ever played Femmarines (unless you count Sisters ), but i find it hilarious how offended people seem to get by the idea

1. The necrons Never killed all of the Old ones, They fled and disappeared somewhere during the events of the war in heaven.
2. Space wolves were not manipulated by Horus to kill the thousand sons. They were already traitors.
3. Emperor is dead. Golden throne is just a monument.
4. Other than Tyranids, Orks, Necrons, Dark Eldar and the rest of the world would be a bit lighter. While some do kill on sight and its all war and rape and guts and killing. It would be possible to meet a chaos marine or a necron and try to be able to talk to them instead of..Hey wait! Boom....dead!
5. Squats were never killed - I don't like em or even the idea but we need more Xenos codex.
6. GK DONT have psykers. Why should they get a STr 10 AP 1 large blast psykic power AND chimeras for almost nothing when they are Simultaneously the strongest CC army in the game?
They are immune to the warp and psykic energy in every way.....at least in mind.
7.Orks would have TONS more Vehicles and be known as the Xenos Equivalent of I.G in respects of how many different tanks or transports they have. Easily double what there is now and most of the vehicles are unconventional ways of travel!
8. Holy Terra is still a beautiful vibrant planet. NOT a planet with no oceans or plant life that has forsakken and forgotten its past and completely covred in a half a mile thick metal to shield everyone from the old radiation of past war etc etc. Make Holy Terra a beautiful more viberant place. Kinda think a split between japanese and Western super sci fi. Computer keyboards are made of semi solid light suspended in air.

TECHNOLOGY!
Levitating and teleportation platforms are a method of travel and the same goes for stairs.

Walk into an incomprehensible sized room and start walking and when you take a step and squar panel of light appears and you can walk on it and stand. Generated from some Augmentation in your legs and feet so you can basically have instant stairs as you get to a terminal that is your office high where no one else who is "normal" can reach it. Walkers would be more like Gundams in how they can move.
So we don;t have these slow lumbering things that we TODAY can build!

Computers are MUCH smaller! Why is the computer rooms in 40k the same size and appearance as they are in the 1970's? They should be more dynamic looking and more futuery!
Having Holographic semi solid projection images in a room that you can interact with. Kinda think of the computer as a small round cylinder room that is like a holodeck from startrek but the windows and things you interact with is the computer and everything you operate it with. Voice command and touch interface and can even more the windows around the room and do just about anything with them etc.

Warp space Travel would take far less time. Like a day or two or a month at the longest depending on the distance.

Ascalam wrote:
2/. And a mysoginistic A-hole developing the process. If you are capable of genewarping a radiation scarred scrawny scavvie into a angelic looking 8 ft supermodel, making it work on a woman shouldn't be that hard. It's more a case of the fluff-writers making Marines a boys only club so tha tthe 14 year old guys they are marketed to won't feel threatened , imo
I think there's a grand total of one line of text saying that it doesn't work, but given the society i doubt they'd even have tried it, as it would be a new idea, which the IOM are violently against.

I always assumed that no one bothered to develop female Space Marine stuff because the Imperium is made up of sexist, racist jerk faces.

Like i said

Ascalam wrote:

Bobthehero wrote:Armor doesnt conform to body shape,

Marines can't be female due to hormone stuff.

1/. Wouldn't be hard to change. Just tell the armourer to beat it out really well there and there

Seriously. The IOM is quite capable of making Power Armour to fit women, and seriously buff women aren't built that much differently than men. They aren't quite as bulky as buff men, but their curves tend to get pared away.

Power armor, maybe, but mass produced flak/carapace armor? Doubt it.

LoneLictor wrote:

Ascalam wrote:
2/. And a mysoginistic A-hole developing the process. If you are capable of genewarping a radiation scarred scrawny scavvie into a angelic looking 8 ft supermodel, making it work on a woman shouldn't be that hard. It's more a case of the fluff-writers making Marines a boys only club so tha tthe 14 year old guys they are marketed to won't feel threatened , imo
I think there's a grand total of one line of text saying that it doesn't work, but given the society i doubt they'd even have tried it, as it would be a new idea, which the IOM are violently against.

I always assumed that no one bothered to develop female Space Marine stuff because the Imperium is made up of sexist, racist jerk faces.

Or because you guys are ignoring the fact that it causes them a painful death, but y'know thats a stupid reason not to do it

TheAngrySquig wrote:

LoneLictor wrote:

Ascalam wrote:
2/. And a mysoginistic A-hole developing the process. If you are capable of genewarping a radiation scarred scrawny scavvie into a angelic looking 8 ft supermodel, making it work on a woman shouldn't be that hard. It's more a case of the fluff-writers making Marines a boys only club so tha tthe 14 year old guys they are marketed to won't feel threatened , imo
I think there's a grand total of one line of text saying that it doesn't work, but given the society i doubt they'd even have tried it, as it would be a new idea, which the IOM are violently against.

I always assumed that no one bothered to develop female Space Marine stuff because the Imperium is made up of sexist, racist jerk faces.

Or because you guys are ignoring the fact that it causes them a painful death, but y'know thats a stupid reason not to do it

Well, presumably, the Imperium could augment the technology so that it didn't. How hard could it be? Males and females aren't too different. But yeah, I see two reasons they wouldn't.

1. The Mechanicum hates progress and only restores old stuff instead of building new stuff.
2. The Imperium is made up of sexist, racist jerk faces.

Vasarto wrote:4. Other than Tyranids, Orks, Necrons, Dark Eldar and the rest of the world would be a bit lighter. While some do kill on sight and its all war and rape and guts and killing. It would be possible to meet a chaos marine or a necron and try to be able to talk to them instead of..Hey wait! Boom....dead!

8. Holy Terra is still a beautiful vibrant planet. NOT a planet with no oceans or plant life that has forsakken and forgotten its past and completely covred in a half a mile thick metal to shield everyone from the old radiation of past war etc etc. Make Holy Terra a beautiful more viberant place. Kinda think a split between japanese and Western super sci fi. Computer keyboards are made of semi solid light suspended in air.

TECHNOLOGY!
Levitating and teleportation platforms are a method of travel and the same goes for stairs.

Walk into an incomprehensible sized room and start walking and when you take a step and squar panel of light appears and you can walk on it and stand. Generated from some Augmentation in your legs and feet so you can basically have instant stairs as you get to a terminal that is your office high where no one else who is "normal" can reach it. Walkers would be more like Gundams in how they can move.
So we don;t have these slow lumbering things that we TODAY can build!

Computers are MUCH smaller! Why is the computer rooms in 40k the same size and appearance as they are in the 1970's? They should be more dynamic looking and more futuery!
Having Holographic semi solid projection images in a room that you can interact with. Kinda think of the computer as a small round cylinder room that is like a holodeck from startrek but the windows and things you interact with is the computer and everything you operate it with. Voice command and touch interface and can even more the windows around the room and do just about anything with them etc.

Warp space Travel would take far less time. Like a day or two or a month at the longest depending on the distance.

... so make it not 40k anymore? I don't mean this in an obnoxious way, but these things go against more than just little details, they'd change the entire character and spirit of the setting. Everything is unadvanced and lacks elegance on purpose, to reflect the grimdark nature of the universe and the ignorance and fear of the people. Change that, and you've just got another generic sci-fi setting.

Well NO! You can still make it very much grim dark.

A Generic Sci-Fi setting is Politics and Diplomacy and laser battles. What I speak of is simple astetics and advancement of how the technology looks and feels.

Rather than all 1980's computer rooms and giant robots that we today could build. It would actually look and feel like something from in the future.

It would not change what space marines are or how the inquisition deals with zenos or traiors or heratics. Necrons and Tau look just fine. Orks would still for the most part be the same. Tyranids would remain the same.

Its just changing that part where technology and how the our home on Terra is presented is all. Giving a world like this would put a bit less Grim Dark and hopeless nature on our world but put a great deal more emphasis on the aspect of how powerful the human races military, Technological advancement and so forth. The Imperium could be seen as something that is strong and fighting off unimaginable powerful forces of the universe rather than something made of left over ork crap about ready to be wiped off our own planet and from how a lot of the story seems to be progressing so far.

The emperor is probably going to die and Holy Terra is most likely going to fall.

Has anyone suggested lowering the prices of the models ? =p

Bobthehero wrote:

Ascalam wrote:

Bobthehero wrote:Armor doesnt conform to body shape,

Marines can't be female due to hormone stuff.

1/. Wouldn't be hard to change. Just tell the armourer to beat it out really well there and there

Seriously. The IOM is quite capable of making Power Armour to fit women, and seriously buff women aren't built that much differently than men. They aren't quite as bulky as buff men, but their curves tend to get pared away.

Power armor, maybe, but mass produced flak/carapace armor? Doubt it.

You are aware that flak vests exist these days, and that female soldiers and cops wear them ? They are mass produced as well

Carapace- Same thing. Have a mold for a female torso. Not hard to make. Mass produce away.

There are all-female regiments of Guard in the fluff. You think they go into battle in negligees?

(that's more the Repentia's line 4+ armour Everlasts )


Automatically Appended Next Post:

TheAngrySquig wrote:

LoneLictor wrote:

Ascalam wrote:
2/. And a mysoginistic A-hole developing the process. If you are capable of genewarping a radiation scarred scrawny scavvie into a angelic looking 8 ft supermodel, making it work on a woman shouldn't be that hard. It's more a case of the fluff-writers making Marines a boys only club so tha tthe 14 year old guys they are marketed to won't feel threatened , imo
I think there's a grand total of one line of text saying that it doesn't work, but given the society i doubt they'd even have tried it, as it would be a new idea, which the IOM are violently against.

I always assumed that no one bothered to develop female Space Marine stuff because the Imperium is made up of sexist, racist jerk faces.

Or because you guys are ignoring the fact that it causes them a painful death, but y'know thats a stupid reason not to do it

As i pointed out, it takes a whole lot less genetic tinkering to make a genetic mod work for a woman (especially since we are all genetically female before developing to male) than to turn a 5 ft 80 lb glow-in-the dark scavvie into a prettyboy angel-wannabe.

The horrible painful death is because the Big E didn't bother to make the process genetically equal (and becase of the reason i gave for the fluff writers above not wanting to let girls into the clubhouse Genetically it makes zero sense, but that's 40k for you

Vasarto wrote:
8. Holy Terra is still a beautiful vibrant planet. NOT a planet with no oceans or plant life that has forsakken and forgotten its past and completely covred in a half a mile thick metal to shield everyone from the old radiation of past war etc etc. Make Holy Terra a beautiful more viberant place. Kinda think a split between japanese and Western super sci fi. Computer keyboards are made of semi solid light suspended in air.

TECHNOLOGY!
Levitating and teleportation platforms are a method of travel and the same goes for stairs.

Walk into an incomprehensible sized room and start walking and when you take a step and squar panel of light appears and you can walk on it and stand. Generated from some Augmentation in your legs and feet so you can basically have instant stairs as you get to a terminal that is your office high where no one else who is "normal" can reach it. Walkers would be more like Gundams in how they can move.
So we don;t have these slow lumbering things that we TODAY can build!

Computers are MUCH smaller! Why is the computer rooms in 40k the same size and appearance as they are in the 1970's? They should be more dynamic looking and more futuery!
Having Holographic semi solid projection images in a room that you can interact with. Kinda think of the computer as a small round cylinder room that is like a holodeck from startrek but the windows and things you interact with is the computer and everything you operate it with. Voice command and touch interface and can even more the windows around the room and do just about anything with them etc.

Warp space Travel would take far less time. Like a day or two or a month at the longest depending on the distance.

I want to cover these two things. I like that terra is a blackened ruin, it fits the setting, it makes sense. Frankly I am tired of sci-fi games where the earth has been "saved" and made into some kind of pre-mankind paradise.

And on the tech, well there is a few reasons for this. Back in the 80's (when this game was made) large pc's seemed to be the way it would go. Pre- Pentium days no one expected Which is the same reason pc's the size and power we have today so soon. Most games from that era have massive pc's ( Battletech, traveler, even shadowrun to an extent)

Second mankind from what I gathered hit it's apex. The STC's if you ask me can not be rebuilt or remade as they are products of an A.I based system. Humanity hit is peak then tech level became steady. Except must humans did not understand the tech, they told the computer what to do or learned to push a few buttons. Much like today must people can not make our tech- a good number have no clue how it works and could never build it. So over time the tech did it's own thing, humans got lazy. The came the Iron men uprising ( which I think was because A.I's fell to chaos). On top of that you have wrap storm and being cut off and so on. Is it so shocking many folks do not know how things work?

Then you have the IoM's outlook and the deal with the tech-priests. Which hammered home a "Guild" like structure. You did not share your tech know how with just anyone and the tech-priests like you not know. After all that is "Holy knowledge" so you end up with a more classical mindset and not a modern post industrial revolution one. And the people in charge like it that way, they like the worlds of the IoM not having all the knowledge they need.

Ascalam wrote:
You are aware that flak vests exist these days, and that female soldiers and cops wear them ? They are mass produced as well

Carapace- Same thing. Have a mold for a female torso. Not hard to make. Mass produce away.

There are all-female regiments of Guard in the fluff. You think they go into battle in negligees?

(that's more the Repentia's line 4+ armour Everlasts )

They use the same flak vest as their male counterpart, which is mass produced and doesnt grow breast the second a woman wears it.




Now hand them a gasmask do the same with a guy in the same gear, and then tell me which is which.

Bobthehero wrote:

Ascalam wrote:
You are aware that flak vests exist these days, and that female soldiers and cops wear them ? They are mass produced as well

Carapace- Same thing. Have a mold for a female torso. Not hard to make. Mass produce away.

There are all-female regiments of Guard in the fluff. You think they go into battle in negligees?

(that's more the Repentia's line 4+ armour Everlasts )

They use the same flak vest as their male counterpart, which is mass produced and doesnt grow breast the second a woman wears it.

Spoiler:

Now hand them a gasmask do the same with a guy in the same gear, and then tell me which is which.

the pointy ones are girls......

I'm joking.... but that's the way a couple people draw gas masks. Big ones around the face for dudes, and for girls it wraps around the entire head and pointy... Just pointing out the sexism, not joining it

The Emperor didn't bother to make female SMs, because it was a lengthly and difficult process based on his own DNA, and he didn't bother dragging out the process by making it female-compatible in the name of "equality".

Here's a few ideas:

1. BRING BACK MALAL! Malal is true chaos, the embodiement, equal, opposite and remainder of all four of the chaos gods. He is the renegade god that turned against them.
Why? Here's why: with the current chaos gods, you are either a blood thirsty lunatic, a magical guy who has no meaning in life, a humanoid puddle of sick, or an emo that worships a shemale god(dess). Malal is all and none of these. Much more chaossy, and more fun.

2. Grimdark the tau.

3. Eldar aren't clowns.

4. Vanilla marines are grimdark, and can actually be compared to the other marine codexes.

5. The IoM gets semi-annihilated (For the grimdark)

6. The tyranids can feth-off a little. (I've not played a game against them in nearly 6 years, even though I regularly go game-hunting in GW's; clearly they aren't an endless swarm that's everywhere.)

7. The astronomicon isn't failing, but is the only light in humanity's grimdarkness.

8. Abaddon is shown to be successful.

9. Have chaos cultists rules for 40k.

There y'all go!

I think it was a bad move on GW's part putting Cadia so close to the eye of terror. In order for Abbadon to be truly successful, GW would have to figure out how the Cadian IG models will survive.

Have Abaddon attack in another direction. "Oh look, I breached a whole in the IG defense line at Cadia, good I can expand from there."

ie. Instead of going through the defense line and making a right to the Cadian system, make a left and conquer a few territories to the left. Turn these places to Daemon worlds and actuallly INCREASE the size of the Eye of Terror so now Chaos can leave the Eye of Terror without dealing with Cadia.

Galdos wrote:Have Abaddon attack in another direction. "Oh look, I breached a whole in the IG defense line at Cadia, good I can expand from there."

ie. Instead of going through the defense line and making a right to the Cadian system, make a left and conquer a few territories to the left. Turn these places to Daemon worlds and actuallly INCREASE the size of the Eye of Terror so now Chaos can leave the Eye of Terror without dealing with Cadia.

He tried that, more than once.
The only place he got more than a foothold was Cadia, where his forces are stationed, at least partially.