This is what Actual Police Brutality Looks Like.

Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:

No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.

If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

**mattyrm**

starhawks wrote:
It's extremely unfair, and in my experience the only people who are hostile towards police are those who have gotten in trouble with them for doing something illegal and are bitter.

Man that is such nonsense. I told you I'm pretty middle class these days, all my mates are lawyers and engineers, I don't know anyone who has been arrested inside 15 years, and most have never been nicked ever at all, and as I said, most still have some distrust for the bobbies.

I think you need to take it in context, yes we distrust policemen, but you still take them on an individual basis because loads of cops are really good people! Its not like when I say "I generally dislike cops" means I fething hate them all and give them gak in the street! I talk to cops regularly, ask the directions when I'm abroad or ask them the time, there is a big difference between saying you don't trust the police (thanks to so many stories in the press, you would have to be pretty stupid to trust them entirely!) and actually doing anything about it.

I think you are getting your wires crossed if you think the vast majority of people in this thread genuinely hate the police and go out of their way to cause them stress, because that certainly isn't the case.

I am a law abiding citizen with no criminal record, and I always try to do my bit, I wouldn't give a policeman abuse just for being a cop. But as Mel said, can you really blame people for being guarded in this day and age?! If you regularly read the news, then common sense dictates you are wary of both the criminal and the policeman!

**dogma**

starhawks wrote:
So you think it's justified to hate the entire police force and be suspicious and hostile towards every police officer because of incidents like these?

Suspicious, yes. Hostile, no.

**Albatross**

Matty, how do you not have a record? Jesus, now I trust the police even less!

**Frazzled**

Albatross wrote:Matty, how do you not have a record? Jesus, now I trust the police even less!

He does. Google "bigfoot sightings"

**Jihadin**

generally treated as "the enemy."

Seriously Frazz...you would not pefer being handle as an EPW.

**Frazzled**

Jihadin wrote:
generally treated as "the enemy."

Seriously Frazz...you would not pefer being handle as an EPW.

In Pomona, everyone's the enemy.

**Jihadin**

And they have vays of making joo talk

**templarboy**

Melissia wrote:Actually, most of the time it gets little to no attention and the cops get away with a slap on the wrist at most.

Any facts to back this up? I don't know what country you live in but every time a cop does just about anything illegal it is big news in the US. In my department, any accusation, no matter how small, is investigated with some serious zeal. However, as far as the press is concerned "If it bleeds, it leads." Everyone loves to see "The Man" get taken down. It's just like the priestly pedophiles. They make the news because it is salacious. Same with cops. The vast majority are fine people beyond reproach. Same with the priests. If a cop, priest or teacher molests a kid, it is bigger news because there is an expectation of public trust. That is as it should be. I think of myself as kinda like Spider-man. "With great power, comes great responsibility".I am extra careful even in my personal life. My wife was very frustrated with me when my daughter was little because I refused to drive our baby sitter home by myself. All it takes is one false accusation to ruin a career.

**Frazzled**

Jihadin wrote:And they have vays of making joo talk

**spudkins**

I love how this got made into a joke. Made my night

**Lynata**

templarboy wrote:
Melissia wrote:Actually, most of the time it gets little to no attention and the cops get away with a slap on the wrist at most.
Any facts to back this up? I don't know what country you live in but every time a cop does just about anything illegal it is big news in the US.

The more pressing issue might be the massive amount of cover-ups and the networking between judicial and executive branch. Melissia has it right that cops usually get far more lenient punishments - but even more worrying is how hard it is to get them trialed in the first place.

http://www.wyandottedailynews.com/component/content/article/41-top-headlines/3214-dea-road-rage-case-results-in-833250-award-to-kck-resident
http://www.courthousenews.com/2011/08/01/38621.htm
http://articles.cnn.com/2009-02-24/justice/atlanta.police_1_kathryn-johnston-johnston-s-home-raid?_s=PM:CRIME
Those are just a few examples that popped up in a quick google search. Of course, with such a large country, stuff like that is bound to happen - but that doesn't make it any less bad, and not acknowledging a problem won't make it go away.
It's something almost any country has to fight with these days, though, so don't take this is some sort of "national" attack. I could have provided examples from Germany as well, albeit not as shocking ones. Whether this means that German cops are less aggressive or just better at covering stuff up ... who knows.

And I'm sure we still remember that bit about the six cops torturing that homeless guy to death. Guess what happened?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Kelly_Thomas#Aftermath

Respect for police officers will go up again once the public feels that the departments are actively investigating such incidents instead of obstructing justice due to a twisted sense of cameraderie. I realize it must be hard "ratting out" fellow officers, but at the same time I don't think I could stand showing support for the people who do such things, like their department did. I'm not sure if it is possible to retain the (imho) necessary bond between officers whilst at the same time cultivating an environment that shuns and shuts out those who "besmirch the badge" with their behaviour. Perhaps "problematic" departments need to be shut down entirely and the entire force fired, and re-built from the ground up, with fresh officers uncorrupted by the atmosphere that had tainted the old. This, on the other hand, would cost money that just isn't there. Same with psychological programs to help deal with job-induced stress or detect and filter out "bad eggs".

**Kovnik Obama**

Lynata wrote:And I'm sure we still remember that bit about the six cops torturing that homeless guy to death. Guess what happened?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Kelly_Thomas#Aftermath

God this is conflicting, I'm normally against death penalty, but I think I wouldn't care too much if somebody doused these fethers in kerosene and dropped the matches...

**templarboy**

Lynata wrote:
templarboy wrote:
Melissia wrote:Actually, most of the time it gets little to no attention and the cops get away with a slap on the wrist at most.
Any facts to back this up? I don't know what country you live in but every time a cop does just about anything illegal it is big news in the US.
The more pressing issue might be the massive amount of cover-ups and the networking between judicial and executive branch. Melissia has it right that cops usually get far more lenient punishments - but even more worrying is how hard it is to get them trialed in the first place.

http://www.wyandottedailynews.com/component/content/article/41-top-headlines/3214-dea-road-rage-case-results-in-833250-award-to-kck-resident
http://www.courthousenews.com/2011/08/01/38621.htm
http://articles.cnn.com/2009-02-24/justice/atlanta.police_1_kathryn-johnston-johnston-s-home-raid?_s=PM:CRIME
Those are just a few examples that popped up in a quick google search. Of course, with such a large country, stuff like that is bound to happen - but that doesn't make it any less bad, and not acknowledging a problem won't make it go away.
It's something almost any country has to fight with these days, though, so don't take this is some sort of "national" attack. I could have provided examples from Germany as well, albeit not as shocking ones. Whether this means that German cops are less aggressive or just better at covering stuff up ... who knows.

And I'm sure we still remember that bit about the six cops torturing that homeless guy to death. Guess what happened?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Kelly_Thomas#Aftermath

Respect for police officers will go up again once the public feels that the departments are actively investigating such incidents instead of obstructing justice due to a twisted sense of cameraderie. I realize it must be hard "ratting out" fellow officers, but at the same time I don't think I could stand showing support for the people who do such things, like their department did. I'm not sure if it is possible to retain the (imho) necessary bond between officers whilst at the same time cultivating an environment that shuns and shuts out those who "besmirch the badge" with their behaviour. Perhaps "problematic" departments need to be shut down entirely and the entire force fired, and re-built from the ground up, with fresh officers uncorrupted by the atmosphere that had tainted the old. This, on the other hand, would cost money that just isn't there. Same with psychological programs to help deal with job-induced stress or detect and filter out "bad eggs".

I looked at all the links you posted and they don't back up the claim that most incidents are covered up and cops get off with lenient punishment. Looks like there was swift and harsh justice to the cops in at least the Kelly Thomas case. The cops were arrested and charged with murder. Not seeing your point.

Your last paragraph is idealistic and impractical. While you are disbanding entire departments and training up an entire force of rookies with zero experience, who is doing the cop's job? Do you have any idea how long it takes to train a cop? I was in intensive and expensive training for nearly a year. Not counting the college classes I took just to qualify me for the Academy in the first place. For my department, the city spends over $40,000 in training and equipment before a rookie sees a minute of solo street time.

You are from Ireland. There are less than 5 million people there. The USA is 60 times bigger. We are going to have more problems here. These problems are going to look like they are widespread to you. They aren't. Almost all the cops I know, are trustworthy public servants. I have met a few bad ones but I bet you know a few jerks yourself. I have seen most of these bad cops get their butts fired.

**Lynata**

templarboy wrote:Looks like there was swift and harsh justice to the cops in at least the Kelly Thomas case. The cops were arrested and charged with murder. Not seeing your point.

Really?
#1 The department at first issued false statements suggesting that the officers were "defending" themselves
#2 It took 2 friggin' months to arrest two out of six perpetrators, the other four apparently not even getting charged ("swift"?)
#3 The department raised money for their bail and defense

It is rather obvious that the primary reason these cops were put on trial was not because they committed a crime, but because they were filmed doing so. The entire thing blew up like a bomb and mobilized the public, else it would've been swept under a rug because nobody cares about a bum.
I'm really interested in seeing what sentences they will receive - if they are found guilty as charged.

templarboy wrote:Your last paragraph is idealistic and impractical.

That's what I wrote, didn't I? Blame the politicians for cutting the budgets.

templarboy wrote:You are from Ireland.

Actually, I'm from Germany. I just emigrated here about 5 years ago.

templarboy wrote:These problems are going to look like they are widespread to you.

Actually, no. What is looking widespread to me is the departments' unwillingness to clean up their own mess - as I was mentioning earlier, I find this far more distressing than the incidents themselves, because it hints at the existence of even more such incidents where a cover-up has been successful. Almost always when I read of any case of police brutality in the news, it's either that nothing happens or that somebody attempts to deliberately cover it up. Where are the news with headlines like "valiant cop exposes cartel of drug-dealing officers" and so on? For some reason, it's almost always an outside force that, with much effort, attempts to penetrate a thick wall of blatant lies and sudden cases of amnesia.

Maybe your department is different. I can't judge that - and if you'd have read my previous posts in this thread, I have even objected to painting all cops with the same brush. I can however say how it looks for one random citizen when browsing through the news, and that the frequency of such incidents is almost as alarming as the solidarity and support the perpretrators seemingly receive from their colleagues and superiors.

**templarboy**

Ya know what ya'll? I am done. Your ivory tower intellectualism is impossible to defeat without you actually stepping into my shoes and doing the job for yourselves. I can tell you how hard it is to be a police officer til I am blue in face but it doesn't make a difference. You just don't know and you never will. I am going to go back to reading articles about how to magnetize my new Storm Talon and how everyone hopes the new Chaos stuff kicks butt. Oh and just for Melissia-I really hope the WD Sisters codex fares better in 6th ed.

**Kovnik Obama**

templarboy wrote: Your ivory tower intellectualism

So instead of admitting that there's a real issue, that these fethers have really gangbanged a guy for 10 minutes, that this case, while perhaps the worst in contemporary memory, is in no way unique, you accuse us of putting on eye-blinds through intellectualism? Well, I guess you'll never know how hard it is to argue with obstinate cops without stepping into my shoes. I can tell you how hard it is to be a reasonnable human being who hates abuse of power until I am blue, but it won't make a difference. You just don't know and you will never will.

**Jihadin**

Two sides to a coin. There are good cops and ther are bad cops. Some though are saying all cops go with the 2nd type. Templerboy was defending the good cops.

**Lynata**

Jihadin wrote:Two sides to a coin. There are good cops and ther are bad cops. Some though are saying all cops go with the 2nd type. Templerboy was defending the good cops.

Acceptance of the coin having two sides would indeed go a long way.

**Kovnik Obama**

Jihadin wrote:Two sides to a coin. There are good cops and ther are bad cops. Some though are saying all cops go with the 2nd type. Templerboy was defending the good cops.

No. What Templarboy was doing is what is hateful about every kind a fraternity that inflates the ego of it's members for no other reason than justify the power they get, and possibly abuse. He is saying that no matter what, we'll never know how hard it is to be a cop, and that means we have no way of judging what a cop does. Regardless of the fact that cops do not have an exclusivity on hard gak happening to them. Regardless of the fact that some cops might actually have had pretty cool lives. Regardless of the fact that the cops that goes nuts and kick ladies, or gangbang hobos, might simply have been unstable and should never have been given a badge.

To me it's simple. Attitude like his justifies every man who decides to carry a gun on himself for self-defense.

**Melissia**

templarboy wrote:Ya know what ya'll? I am done. Your ivory tower intellectualism

A cute way to try to dismiss everyone else's claims.

But cute does not equate with non-pathetic.

I don't even know if you are a cop, nor do I really care. But the fact remains that you are living in denial of the many, MANY problems that the police forces in the US, and indeed globally, have.

I have nothing against cops. I like good cops, and I know many of them. But that doesn't prevent me from pointing out that there are also a lot of bad cops. The combined effect of criminals who are willing to masquerade as cops and cops who are basically criminals in uniform means that being suspicious of the police force is perfectly reasonable.

That's why many sites recommend, for example, that when a woman is pulled over by a lone cop-- especially in a secluded area or at night-- you call dispatch to confirm the cop's presence. Most good cops will understand it, but some of the less competent ones will get upset. They are to be ignored.

**Frazzled**

templarboy wrote:Ya know what ya'll? I am done. Your ivory tower intellectualism is impossible to defeat without you actually stepping into my shoes and doing the job for yourselves. I can tell you how hard it is to be a police officer til I am blue in face but it doesn't make a difference. You just don't know and you never will. I am going to go back to reading articles about how to magnetize my new Storm Talon and how everyone hopes the new Chaos stuff kicks butt. Oh and just for Melissia-I really hope the WD Sisters codex fares better in 6th ed.

Blah blah blah. My wife was part of the police for years. Blah blah blah.
If you can't be professional, you don't deserve to have the job. That applies to everything, but especially ones where you can legally shoot people.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kovnik Obama wrote:
To me it's simple. Attitude like his justifies every man who decides to carry a gun on himself for self-defense.

Here's the part where you need to get over yourself and stop nonsense. This is where the cop rightfully gets defensive.
You're some kid in Canada, not some Crip rolling in Pomona oppressed by The Man.

**Kovnik Obama**

Frazzled wrote:Here's the part where you need to get over yourself and stop nonsense. This is where the cop rightfully gets defensive.
You're some kid in Canada, not some Crip rolling in Pomona oppressed by The Man.

If you see your security as an issue, and realize cops can become a threat as much as a defense, then you realize you are the only person you can seriously trust with your own defense. Cops can be defensive all they want, until they learn to fight crimes inside the precinct as much as outside, they are just not reliable. I don't see security as a personnal issue myself, since like I said, I've always been perfectly able to avoid potentially threatening situations by simply being polite and too damn cute to get angry at. But I don't exactly go and hang out in the bad parts of town. I don't see how I could have presented myself as 'someone who's being put down by the man'.

If that hobo had survived, would he have been justified in carrying a gun for the rest of his days? Feth yeah. Hell you'd have been justified in pulling a gun on the gangbanging cops if you caught them in the act (although I think everyone can sees why that wouldn't have turned to your advantage).

**templarboy**

I know I said I was done with this argument but I couldn't help sharing this little tidbit. I did a "google" search on "police heroism" and got 4 million hits. I did a "google" search on "police corruption" and got 46 million hits. Like I said "If it bleeds, it leads". The press like sexy stories. Police corruption stories are interesting to most people. Much more interesting than the heroism that happens far more frequently. Try going on a citizen "ride along" with a friendly neighborhood patrolman. You might see something neat.

Also to the poster above that is thinking about carrying a gun to defend himself from the evil corrupt police-think twice. They are wearing ballistic vests. You aren't. They practice. A Lot. They have advanced training. You don't. I don't think the RCMP are a bunch of push-overs that would take kindly to you "defending" yourself from them with a gun. Try being cooperative first. Let it all work it's way out in Court. I would never recommend resisting even what you think is an unlawful arrest. It will go badly. You might win the lawsuit but that broken jaw might take a bit of time to heal. Not saying it's right. Just saying that that is the way of the world.

**Melissia**

2009 in Atlanta, Georgia had a group of SWAT officers charge in to a gay bar without a warrant, beating people confiscating their ID, forcing them to lay down on broken glass, shouting homophobic slurs and threatening to beat them to death, and kicking numerous patrons. The police department claims that they followed protocol despite the fact that no one in the bar was actually suspected of any criminal activity, and illegally searched everyone in the bar.

No officers were punished.

2009, Dolton, Illinois, a mentally disabled student was repeatedly punched in the face for not tucking his shirt in, slammed against a wall, and had to be physically forced off of the teen by student sand teachers.

His only "punishment" was paid administrative leave and quietly being asked to resign afterwards. He avoided the punishment due to him.

2010, Indianapolis, Indiana, a pregnant woman called 911 to help her friend who was having a seizure. She was thrown on the ground, repeatedly kicked, She was arrested, placed i na holding cell, and beaten until she miscarried, and was later admitted in to a hospital for severe cuts and bruises.

No punishment was given to the officer, and the department tried to cover it up. The court case is still on going.

In 2005 shortly after Hurricane Katrina, two incidents: A man was shot and then let bleed to death (The police officers present attacking anyone who tried to help), and then his body was tossed on a car and burned. Two days later, eight unarmed civilians were shot, including a mentally challenged man who was shot in the back. Two were killed, six more injured by gunfire. The officers came up with a cover story, planted a gun on the scene, and lied to the public about what happened.

Until the courts found the department guilty of cover-up, the cops were completely unpunished in both incidents. The police department tried to cover both of them up.

2011, Prince George's County, Maryland, a student was beaten and slammed against the wall repeatedly by cops in riot gear. They lied about what happened claimng the student attacked a police horse, but video evidence proved that it was police that did the assault and that the student did not attack any police.

The department attempted a cover-up, and officers were not charged or suspended until the FBI began conducting an investigation.

2011, San Antonio, Texas. An officer shot and killed a student who ran from him. It was later found out that the police department had a long record of the officer, and knew that he was dangerous and unstable with a history of misconduct, and yet they still decided to put him at a high school and give him a gun.

The lawsuit is ongoing. He faces termination, but no criminal charges.

2006, Fairfax, VIrginia. A man who was supposed to be arrested on gambling charges was shot in through the heart upon opening the door for police. He was known to be unarmed, and showed no signs of resistance.

No charges were filed.

2008, King County, Washington. A fifteen year old girl was brutally beaten by a police officer, who kicked her in the stomach, slammed her head against a wall, tossed her to the floor, hit her twice while she was on the ground ,then lifted her up by her hair and dragged her from the holding area away from the camera.

The city "encouraged" the prosecutor to drop all criminal charges, and the case ended in mistrial despite the clear and undeniable video evidence.

2009, Seattle, Washington. A man who was wrongly mistaken for an assault suspect was brutally slammed against a wall and mishandled after going unconscious. The officer lied about the event claiming he identified himself, when every witness to the case said otherwise. The victim was left brain-damaged and paralyzed from the waist down.

The officer was not punished, nor were any charges filed. Until the courts awarded a ten million dollar punishment in th civil case, no punishment at all was given to anyone.

2007, Washington, District of Columbia. A woman was beaten, tossed across a room at another woman, and had her head slammed in to a metal table giving her permanent brain damage. The police officer who assaulted her later filed false charges against her which directly contradicted the witness statements and video evidence.

The court case is ongoing, but the department has done nothing to punish the officer involved.

I could go on practically forever-- there's thousands of these incidents in the past ten years-- but perhaps, Templarboy, I don't need to? Maybe you notice the pattern here? Police departments have a long history of covering up for their fellow officers. Which really just makes them equally complicit in the crimes of their corrupt so-called brethren. The reason you see more incidents these days is because it's easier to prove them and get past the corruption-- video evidence submitted to the media is hard to ignore.

Or maybe you really are so deluded as to think this kind of thing didn't happen before when it was easier to cover up? These are CRIMINALS. Just because they also happen to be police officers doesn't mean that they don't deserve punishment. In fact, being police who are criminals makes them WORSE than the criminals they're supposed to arrest.

**mattyrm**

Melissia wrote:2009 in Atlanta, Georgia had a group of SWAT officers charge in to a gay bar without a warrant, beating people confiscating their ID, forcing them to lay down on broken glass, shouting homophobic slurs and threatening to beat them to death, and kicking numerous patrons. The police department claims that they followed protocol despite the fact that no one in the bar was actually suspected of any criminal activity, and illegally searched everyone in the bar.

No officers were punished.

2009, Dolton, Illinois, a mentally disabled student was repeatedly punched in the face for not tucking his shirt in, slammed against a wall, and had to be physically forced off of the teen by student sand teachers.

His only "punishment" was paid administrative leave and quietly being asked to resign afterwards. He avoided the punishment due to him.

2010, Indianapolis, Indiana, a pregnant woman called 911 to help her friend who was having a seizure. She was thrown on the ground, repeatedly kicked, She was arrested, placed i na holding cell, and beaten until she miscarried, and was later admitted in to a hospital for severe cuts and bruises.

No punishment was given to the officer, and the department tried to cover it up. The court case is still on going.

In 2005 shortly after Hurricane Katrina, two incidents: A man was shot and then let bleed to death (The police officers present attacking anyone who tried to help), and then his body was tossed on a car and burned. Two days later, eight unarmed civilians were shot, including a mentally challenged man who was shot in the back. Two were killed, six more injured by gunfire. The officers came up with a cover story, planted a gun on the scene, and lied to the public about what happened.

Until the courts found the department guilty of cover-up, the cops were completely unpunished in both incidents. The police department tried to cover both of them up.

2011, Prince George's County, Maryland, a student was beaten and slammed against the wall repeatedly by cops in riot gear. They lied about what happened claimng the student attacked a police horse, but video evidence proved that it was police that did the assault and that the student did not attack any police.

The department attempted a cover-up, and officers were not charged or suspended until the FBI began conducting an investigation.

2011, San Antonio, Texas. An officer shot and killed a student who ran from him. It was later found out that the police department had a long record of the officer, and knew that he was dangerous and unstable with a history of misconduct, and yet they still decided to put him at a high school and give him a gun.

The lawsuit is ongoing. He faces termination, but no criminal charges.

2006, Fairfax, VIrginia. A man who was supposed to be arrested on gambling charges was shot in through the heart upon opening the door for police. He was known to be unarmed, and showed no signs of resistance.

No charges were filed.

2008, King County, Washington. A fifteen year old girl was brutally beaten by a police officer, who kicked her in the stomach, slammed her head against a wall, tossed her to the floor, hit her twice while she was on the ground ,then lifted her up by her hair and dragged her from the holding area away from the camera.

The city "encouraged" the prosecutor to drop all criminal charges, and the case ended in mistrial despite the clear and undeniable video evidence.

2009, Seattle, Washington. A man who was wrongly mistaken for an assault suspect was brutally slammed against a wall and mishandled after going unconscious. The officer lied about the event claiming he identified himself, when every witness to the case said otherwise. The victim was left brain-damaged and paralyzed from the waist down.

The officer was not punished, nor were any charges filed. Until the courts awarded a ten million dollar punishment in th civil case, no punishment at all was given to anyone.

2007, Washington, District of Columbia. A woman was beaten, tossed across a room at another woman, and had her head slammed in to a metal table giving her permanent brain damage. The police officer who assaulted her later filed false charges against her which directly contradicted the witness statements and video evidence.

The court case is ongoing, but the department has done nothing to punish the officer involved.

I could go on practically forever-- there's thousands of these incidents in the past ten years-- but perhaps, Templarboy, I don't need to? Maybe you notice the pattern here? Police departments have a long history of covering up for their fellow officers. Which really just makes them equally complicit in the crimes of their corrupt so-called brethren. The reason you see more incidents these days is because it's easier to prove them and get past the corruption-- video evidence submitted to the media is hard to ignore.

Or maybe you really are so deluded as to think this kind of thing didn't happen before when it was easier to cover up? These are CRIMINALS. Just because they also happen to be police officers doesn't mean that they don't deserve punishment. In fact, being police who are criminals makes them WORSE than the criminals they're supposed to arrest.

I can top all of those stories Mel..

My missus always goes on about how much better the police are over here, and I think they suck too.. but anyway. She was on about how a British bobby got in heaps of trouble for pushing a guy over, and then she told me about this.. and I watched the film.

I honestly cant believe some of the gak the LAPD have pulled.. but that gak takes the cake.

"My son wasnt circumcised?!"

"THROW THE BITCH IN THE NUTHOUSE"

**templarboy**

Again, Melissia beats the same dead horse while failing to address my point of reporting bias. 4 million versus 46 million. Keep quoting the one sided anecdotes. They mean nothing without the full story. Of course you aren't interested in the full story because it doesn't back up your argument.
Sure there are bad cops. I bet there are bad people doing whatever job you do also. Cities "cover up" bad conduct because of extreme liability risk. If you want to reform the system, start with tort reform. In 14 years as a cop, I have never been sued. I am an anomaly. Admit that some of your anecdotes could be a wee bit biased. I admit my bias. If any of your uncited stories are true, I would encourage criminal charges in some of those cases for the bad cops. I never said I didn't. You said I didn't. I have testified in court against a bad cop who knifed a guy in a bar fight. You are actually preaching to the choir here.
I am not deluded. I just want people to recognize the good as well. But then again I am, what did you call me? An arrogant ignorant twit?

**Melissia**

Again, Melissia beats the same dead horse while failing to address my point of reporting bias.

Your point is irrelevant to begin with, because just a single incident can damn an entire police department.

I never denied that most cops are good. Why do you act like I have, aside from wanting to live in denial of the fact that even good cops cover up the crimes of bad ones?

**Mannahnin**

TB, you are having some issues communicating here.

Literally everyone on this thread who you are writing off as ignorant has said they like and support good cops, and that the majority of cops are good people.

Most of us have observed, however, that there is a disturbing and consistent trend, nationally and internationally, for police departments to cover up and minimize the real, documented, and provable misdeeds and crimes of officers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Code_of_Silence
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mollen_Commission
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testilying

None of us are saying that MOST officers are bad. Every one of us has said that most of them are good. But as you are aware, given that we are talking about "with great power comes great responsiblity" here, it only takes a few instances of abuse (and there are many, exhaustively documented ones) to make people wary and cautious. If I can literally kill someone legally, it is an egregious violation of both law and morality for me to abuse/misuse that power. And if we see this happen repeatedly, we are going to be cautious of any cop who seems at all unpleasant. It makes people uncomfortable to be around someone who is hostile and aggressive; pair that with knowledge that if this person chose to kill me, there's a chance that other police would shield him and conceal evidence, and he might get away scot free? That's downright scary.

You seem to agree with this, so I don't know why on earth you're abusing other people here in the thread for saying so.

**Cane**

Good to see that the same bunch of users and threads are still around, it's been a while

Anyway police brutality sucks along with the corruption that goes with it....see The Wire for a TV show on the subject

Even if a police department wanted to punish one of their own, it probably takes a lot of red tape, time, and they have to balance budget and manpower concerns. Dealing with drunk and even sober citizens has also got to be one of the most stressful and life threatening jobs around, and knowing that you're hated and distrusted doesn't help things. Anyway carry on, in no way is that a justification, just throwing stuff out there

**mattyrm**

Mannahnin wrote:TB, you are having some issues communicating here.

Literally everyone on this thread who you are writing off as ignorant has said they like and support good cops, and that the majority of cops are good people.

Most of us have observed, however, that there is a disturbing and consistent trend, nationally and internationally, for police departments to cover up and minimize the real, documented, and provable misdeeds and crimes of officers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Code_of_Silence
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mollen_Commission
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testilying

None of us are saying that MOST officers are bad. Every one of us has said that most of them are good. But as you are aware, given that we are talking about "with great power comes great responsiblity" here, it only takes a few instances of abuse (and there are many, exhaustively documented ones) to make people wary and cautious. If I can literally kill someone legally, it is an egregious violation of both law and morality for me to abuse/misuse that power. And if we see this happen repeatedly, we are going to be cautious of any cop who seems at all unpleasant. It makes people uncomfortable to be around someone who is hostile and aggressive; pair that with knowledge that if this person chose to kill me, there's a chance that other police would shield him and conceal evidence, and he might get away scot free? That's downright scary.

You seem to agree with this, so I don't know why on earth you're abusing other people here in the thread for saying so.

Spot on. I havent really understood TBs point considering everyone has said exactly that! In a nutshell "Most cops are good but some are arseholes so you cant blame people for being wary after all the big cases in the news regarding X Y Z"

Not a soul has said "All cops are scum" because clearly they arent and nobody thinks they are! So I don't really understand why he is arguing with anyone?