Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

It isn't completely impossible that GW consider, or even have evidence to support, that the imbalances brought to the game by the current Eldar book have been sufficient to deter people from continuing to play and therefore spend money, and this is a reaction to that.

There's plenty to suggest this isn't, and never would be, the case, but I wouldn't rule it out completely yet, we have seen what are almost certainly reactions to criticism in the face of falling sales, and this could be another one.

 Azreal13 wrote:
It isn't completely impossible that GW consider, or even have evidence to support, that the imbalances brought to the game by the current Eldar book have been sufficient to deter people from continuing to play and therefore spend money, and this is a reaction to that.

There's plenty to suggest this isn't, and never would be, the case, but I wouldn't rule it out completely yet, we have seen what are almost certainly reactions to criticism in the face of falling sales, and this could be another one.

I don't want to be rude but that's a ridiculous assumption. There's literally zero chance of that being true. Not only does GW never react to falling sales like that, but I simply can't see anyone succesfully arguing to anyone that 40K is losing popularity because of the Wave Serpent. As if one unit is what's driving people off. Sure, some people worldwide might have quit because of a marginal reason like that, but likewise I'm sure some people have bought entire Eldar armies or collections simply because of wanting to abuse an overpowered unit. Imbalanced units often drive sales instead of hinder them.

If people are losing interest in 40K it has more to do with a bad or inconsistent rule set, Apocalypse units mixed with skirmish units, the cost of models, ever increasing competition from other forms of entertainment, the recession, etc. A few overpowered units have little to zero to do with it, and units like that have always existed in all of GW's game systems. They never hurt sales before, and even if they did, GW never cared.

Games Workshop have rearranged the tab list order of Warhammer 40k armies in their webshop. Eldar - Harlequins - Dark Eldar now are next to each other, so are the Imperial factions and the Chaos ones. Nothing important but another hint at the continuation of Major Faction -> Sub Faction I guess

http://www.games-workshop.com/en-GB/Warhammer-40-000

Also Codex: Eldar (only available in softcover lately) and the Iyanden Supplement (sold-out) are gone/removed from the GW UK webshop as of today. The mini-codex is still there and the iBook edition. Eldar soon? Quite likely so

Warhams-77 wrote:

 pretre wrote:

Mymearan wrote:
Lords of wargaming have deleted their posts, so there is now no source for these rumors.

Can I get a confirmation on exactly which posts were deleted? I should update the tracker.

Captured by Atia on B&C

These are the original posts from their FB page. I consider these reliable. Do you remove the rumors from the tracker because LoW deleted them, Pretre? It will be interesting to see if these were removed because they are correct

Perfect. I won't remove them, but I wanted to update the tracker that they were deleted.

 pretre wrote:
Perfect. I won't remove them, but I wanted to update the tracker that they were deleted.

Ah good

 Therion wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:
It isn't completely impossible that GW consider, or even have evidence to support, that the imbalances brought to the game by the current Eldar book have been sufficient to deter people from continuing to play and therefore spend money, and this is a reaction to that.

There's plenty to suggest this isn't, and never would be, the case, but I wouldn't rule it out completely yet, we have seen what are almost certainly reactions to criticism in the face of falling sales, and this could be another one.

I don't want to be rude but that's a ridiculous assumption. There's literally zero chance of that being true. Not only does GW never react to falling sales like that, but I simply can't see anyone succesfully arguing to anyone that 40K is losing popularity because of the Wave Serpent. As if one unit is what's driving people off. Sure, some people worldwide might have quit because of a marginal reason like that, but likewise I'm sure some people have bought entire Eldar armies or collections simply because of wanting to abuse an overpowered unit. Imbalanced units often drive sales instead of hinder them.

If people are losing interest in 40K it has more to do with a bad or inconsistent rule set, Apocalypse units mixed with skirmish units, the cost of models, ever increasing competition from other forms of entertainment, the recession, etc. A few overpowered units have little to zero to do with it, and units like that have always existed in all of GW's game systems. They never hurt sales before, and even if they did, GW never cared.

Firstly - there's zero evidence of how GW reacts to falling sales, because it hasn't really happened before, certainly not in the "current age." Additionally, we now have a different personality in the mix, Wells is long gone, Kirby has a revised role, and we've had a new CEO, who, while very much part of the Kirby structure, will still bring a certain approach to things which won't be the same as has gone before.

Secondly I play a lot less 40K now because of Waveserpents, I find the whole army utterly dull to play against, and unfortunately we had several appear after the last book dropped. As a consequence, there has been one less player at my club looking for 40K most weeks, that has meant that someone else has been disappointed if they were looking as for a game, so they have, in turn, moved on to other systems. In the space of three years, my local club has migrated from exclusively GW, almost de facto exclusively 40K, to last week being the first time when not one game of 40K being played and X Wing and Historicals players pretty much equalled the players playing Fantasy.

Is the Waveserpent exclusively responsible for that? No, of course not, but it is one of the most egregious offenders in an already overly strong book, so to dismiss it as "impossible" is a good example of why it is a dumb idea to speak in absolutes on the Internet.

Well, it stands to reason that there isn't a single trigger for a new codex, and that the creative and business opportunities have to intersect.

Perhaps the game designers aren't completely happy with the current Eldar codex; the mini designers have designed some strong new Eldar kits; and the business types are enticed by the sales potential of those kits, the sales potential of a new decurion-style formations, and the opportunity to move more of the range to plastic.

The book should never have made it through play testing as is (yeah, right, play testing!) and while it didn't quite get accused of breaking an edition in the same way as the Mat Ward Daemon Army book does for Fantasy, personally, for me it came close.

A better balanced Eldar book (which is a phrase laden with assumption) would go a long way to reengaging me with the game again, and I can't believe I'm the only one.

Removal of the harlequins from the eldar 'dex seems like a logical thing to do given the recent suppliment - i hope they do the same for militarum tempestus!
I want wraithknights to become a LOW and get a new super-heavy profile for some epic eldar knight vs imperial knight battles!
Then maybe a super-heavy profile for the riptide too?

A man can dream..


*a reassessment of the serpent sheild's range wouldn't go amiss either.

 SirDonlad wrote:
I want wraithknights to become a LOW and get a new super-heavy profile for some epic eldar knight vs imperial knight battles!

I would love that so very much.

Wraithbone Lance?

 pretre wrote:
Wraithbone Lance?

As long as Forge World don't start making Wraithknights with bizarrely elongated legs.

I want a full six Bright Stallion

(You hear me GW designers!)

 SirDonlad wrote:
Removal of the harlequins from the eldar 'dex seems like a logical thing to do given the recent supplement - I hope they do the same for Militarum Tempestus!

Honestly, unless they add the Harlequin options(Skyweaver, Voidweaver, Starweaver, and Solitaire) into Codex: Eldar?
Harlequin are in a bit of a different situation than Tempestus as they actually have units which are new and different in the form of their bikes/transports.

If it were simply the way that they had split Shadowseers/Death Jesters into Elite choices? It wouldn't be hard to continue seeing them as part of C: Eldar. But now I think we might actually see Harlequin cut from Eldar.

 warboss wrote:

 Byte wrote:
Wave Serpent nerf bat swinging? Riptide nerf bat?

$100 book purchase nerf bat within 2-3 from first release?

I don't understand your post.

?

I'd like to see Codex: Eldar Harlequins kept, but made slightly different to the Codex: Harlequins Harlequins. It's a fairly sound business strategy; they already have the new models, why not slightly broaden their appeal by making them their own thing in Codex: Eldar? They'd need their own name, of course, like "Dancers" or "Performers" or something else other than a Troupe of Players, but that's not hard.

 Frozen Ocean wrote:
I'd like to see Codex: Eldar Harlequins kept, but made slightly different to the Codex: Harlequins Harlequins. It's a fairly sound business strategy; they already have the new models, why not slightly broaden their appeal by making them their own thing in Codex: Eldar? They'd need their own name, of course, like "Dancers" or "Performers" or something else other than a Troupe of Players, but that's not hard.

Be extremely odd to just keep them in Codex Eldar when they were taken out of Codex Dark Eldar - also why would GW reduce potential sales of the Harlequins Codex?

I think there is about a 0% chance of Harlequins remaining in the Elder Codex. Also, if they made the Serpent Shield one use only, it would go a long way toward balancing that unit. Regardless, I am not counting on them doing any sort of meaningful balancing. Look at Necrons.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Frozen Ocean wrote:
I'd like to see Codex: Eldar Harlequins kept, but made slightly different to the Codex: Harlequins Harlequins. It's a fairly sound business strategy; they already have the new models, why not slightly broaden their appeal by making them their own thing in Codex: Eldar? They'd need their own name, of course, like "Dancers" or "Performers" or something else other than a Troupe of Players, but that's not hard.

Be extremely odd to just keep them in Codex Eldar when they were taken out of Codex Dark Eldar - also why would GW reduce potential sales of the Harlequins Codex?

Because:

 DarkStarSabre wrote:


Harlequins are still in the current Eldar Codex.

Harlequins were present in the 2nd ed. Eldar Codex as well.

It went - Harlies (2nd), No Harlies (3rd), Harlies (4th/5th), Harlies (6th).

To contrast to Dark Eldar...

No Harlies (3rd), No Harlies (3.5 update), Harlies (5th), No Harlies (7th)

Harlequins were a staple of Eldar but not for Dark Eldar. Similar to Legion of the Damned and Space Marines.

I don't think it would reduce sales of the Harlequin book. It could encourage people to expand, if they had one squad to field with their Eldar, they'd only need a little more before they can access all the other cool stuff from Codex: Harlequins. On the other side, if you already have Harlequins enough for a Harlequin detachment (or whatever it's called), an additional squad to field for their unique benefits, if you happen to be playing them with Codex: Eldar, means buying more models.

I just noticed on BoLS that LoW is reporting codex Craftworld: Eldar coming next along with some models --

“-Lords of War Gaming Yes. After Admech it will be codex Craftworld: Eldar. Plastic jetbikes and Artach.”

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2015/03/whoa-codex-eldar-out-of-left-field.html

Also:

Now we have two camps saying opposite things.

But what they both agree on is look for the Craftworlders to return (in some form) with new minis in April.

Could it be?!?!

Do keep up old chap.

I am starting to get hyped a little about Tzeentch stuff possibily popping up after AdMech, Eldar and DA (?). Exciting.

I don't really care about Elder being nerfed, even though they kick my ass a lot. It makes sense to me that the serpent shield should be shorter range though. I think if Eldar had more aspect rules and kits, we'd see less Serpents sitting back to pewpew. So its a good thing that Eldar gets plastics before, say, Rubric marines. I hope Whispereroftruth is the real deal.

but where does hope get TS?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
So I guess that means no Deathwatch or Genestealer Cults?

It was a nice dream...

Later on in the year my friend, just hold out till then.

 Azreal13 wrote:
Do keep up old chap.

I heard BoLS reported yesterday that there might be some Skitarii miniatures coming out this year.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Azreal13 wrote:
Do keep up old chap.

I heard BoLS reported yesterday that there might be some Skitarii miniatures coming out this year.

But not in Austr...

Oh never mind.

Hm, have we yet seen what happens with a supplement when the mother codex get updated?
It should not be a major issue, but knowing how poorly GW handle balance and fail to anticipate rules interaction, you never know what may pop up with Iyanden.
Perhaps we get a Faq

No, not yet. I think Iyanden was the first hardback supplement iirc.

 Fayric wrote:
Hm, have we yet seen what happens with a supplement when the mother codex get updated?
It should not be a major issue, but knowing how poorly GW handle balance and fail to anticipate rules interaction, you never know what may pop up with Iyanden.
Perhaps we get a Faq

Or GW could just print new $50 books for the babydexes in the subsequent weeks. I mean, seriously, most of the supplements have so little meat in them that giving them a refresh is probably 75% cosmetic.

 Fayric wrote:
Hm, have we yet seen what happens with a supplement when the mother codex get updated?
It should not be a major issue, but knowing how poorly GW handle balance and fail to anticipate rules interaction, you never know what may pop up with Iyanden.
Perhaps we get a Faq

As I mentioned before Codex: Eldar (including the new softcover version they started selling in January) and the Iyanden Supplement have been removed from the UK GW webshop. There is only the Eldar mini-format book left, which is probably selling so bad they hope to find a few customers to purchase them now being the only book left. The current Eldar codex will be replaced with a new 7th edition book soon. Codex and Supplement removed is a strong hint towards the new release. The Supplement seems to be gone forever

GW doing Eldar before Sisters of Battle, before Chaos, before Dark Angels.

>what is wrong with this company