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40k New Edition Summary - 14th June 17: Lord Duncan paints Primaris in Gravis/non-codex SM focus  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
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Made in us
Tunneling Trygon





NJ

I actually like that they have the cost of all these models with no wargear instead of building the cost of their default wargear into the unit. It allows them to cost things much more appropriately instead of "cost of this weapon minus the cost of the weapons you lose by upgrading to it" which naturally varied wildly from unit to unit


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Loopstah wrote:
Anyone who's seen the nid lists know if spike rifles or stranglewebs are in?


I'm waiting for Nid leaks too...by Friday at the latest I'll know everything

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/30 00:00:05


 
   
Made in us
Ultramarine Master with Gauntlets of Macragge





Upstate, New York

 Crimson wrote:
endlesswaltz123 wrote:
 Crimson wrote:
endlesswaltz123 wrote:
tac marines got combat knifes in the rules.

Since when?


In old codex's they have at least, can't remember if they state it in 7th edition rule book.

No they don't, they never had.


Back in RT every basic marine had a knife or combat accessory. Looks like that was dropped as part of the stock gear in 2nd. But they were issued to the troops at one point.

Ultramarines, 3rd Co. and friends, 12.5K+ Slowly growing 2Kish
Nevelon's Workbench: Ultramarines, Saim-Hann and other assorted oddities
 
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




Looks like the space marine list only has access to the primaris models/units we've already seen, minus the redemptor dread.

I was hoping for some more surprises; maybe a name for the possibly new vehicle from in the background of that picture from the other day, or primaris terminators, or even a primaris chapter master.

There's got to be a "true" primaris list coming down the pipe soon.


Blah, blah, blah, Mister Freeman. 
   
Made in us
Raging Ravener



Flint, MI

I am having a hard time with a STR 6 Carnifex. That would be the lowest it's ever been.

Stalking the void since 1987. 
   
Made in gb
Shrieking Guardian Jetbiker





UK

@cordial

There is the primaris rhino listed and there is something in the lord of war section for 400 points but the picture is cut off, could possibly be the redemptor if it's going to be lord of war level.





 
   
Made in ca
Legendary Master of the Chapter






 JohnU wrote:
 Desubot wrote:
SeanDrake wrote:
gungo wrote:
Considering Frankie was one of the top tau players in the country and playtested the new faction a lot. I'd say they are probably balanced.


Which was offset by reece and co being people who were very obvious about hating tau and wishing they never existed, and now it seems they got their way.

Seriously the pts are only part of the issue a lot of the Tau stuff shows the problem that even the previously lackluster stuff has been nerfed into the ground and that most weapons in general are poorer.

As for the "Buffs" yay a coldstar can fly 40" but wtf is it going to do when it gets there with 8 str 6 -1 rend shots.

"The Storm surge can fire 10 weapons" that includes 4 "Destroyer" missiles that have an impressive 0.772% chance of all hitting, a main gun that requires being almost in charge range to get the most out of.


.772% chance of hitting without markerlight. synergy is taus whole thing.

storm bolters are a little disappointing that its the exact same thing as twin linked bolters. not that its bad or anything 4 shots is 4 shots.


hang on i think i missed the marker light rules.

i know 1 gives you rerolls of 1. did the rest get leaked?


Rest of the ML table is here https://www.facebook.com/GrotOrderly/photos/pcb.1453285424737613/1453283591404463/?type=3&theater

2 is Destroyer/Seeker missiles fire at users BS.
3 is no penalty to moving and shooting heavy weapons or advancing and shooting assault weapons.
4 is no cover bonus
5 is +1 to hit


woof cumulative bonuses but cant get any better than +1 to hit with rerolls of 1

double woof, support systems makes some of the abilities redundant.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
 Scott-S6 wrote:
And yet another thread is hijacked for Unit to ask for the same advice, receive the same answers and make the same excuses.

Oh my god I'm becoming martel.
Send help!

 
   
Made in nz
Hungry Little Ripper




Wellington

 luke1705 wrote:
I actually like that they have the cost of all these models with no wargear instead of building the cost of their default wargear into the unit. It allows them to cost things much more appropriately instead of "cost of this weapon minus the cost of the weapons you lose by upgrading to it" which naturally varied wildly from unit to unit


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Loopstah wrote:
Anyone who's seen the nid lists know if spike rifles or stranglewebs are in?


I'm waiting for Nid leaks too...by Friday at the latest I'll know everything


I'll be keeping an ear out for you come Friday!! Keen as to see what the nids have in store.

\m/ 
   
Made in ch
Fresh-Faced New User




It is interesting to note that the primaris stuff doesn't cost the same in the space marine index and in the primaris codex of the starter box.

I wonder if there won't be a "primaris only" codex that takes the limited choice of troops into account.
   
Made in us
Speed Drybrushing






Chicago, Illinois

Weird that the Chaos leak pictures showed a "Renegade Knight" page, but there wasn't an entry for it anywhere on the points cost page. I suppose there might be another page with LOW entries on it, given some of the Chaos daemon engines and named Greater Daemons available.

Rokugnar Eldar (6500) - Wolves of Excess (2000) - Marines Diagnostica (2200)
tumblr - I paint on Twitch! - Also a Level 2 Magic Judge  
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Connecticut

Elensar777 wrote:
It is interesting to note that the primaris stuff doesn't cost the same in the space marine index and in the primaris codex of the starter box.

I wonder if there won't be a "primaris only" codex that takes the limited choice of troops into account.


Seems to be indicating they'll be getting their own codex soon after release with their vehicles, dreads, and perhaps characters within it.

Blood Angels, Custodes, Tzeentch, Alpha Legion, Astra Militarum, Deathwatch, Thousand Sons, Imperial Knights, Tau, Genestealer Cult.

I have a problem.

Being contrary for the sake of being contrary doesn't make you unique, it makes you annoying.

 Purifier wrote:
Using your rules isn't being a dick.
 
   
Made in us
Lieutenant General





Florence, KY

 Mantle wrote:
@cordial

There is the primaris rhino listed and there is something in the lord of war section for 400 points but the picture is cut off, could possibly be the redemptor if it's going to be lord of war level.

The Rhino Primaris is the existing command variant found on the same datasheet as the Land Raider Excelsior.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/30 00:22:27


'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in gb
Shrieking Guardian Jetbiker





UK

Spoiler:
 Ghaz wrote:
 Mantle wrote:
@cordial

There is the primaris rhino listed and there is something in the lord of war section for 400 points but the picture is cut off, could possibly be the redemptor if it's going to be lord of war level.

The Rhino Primaris is the existing command variant found on the same datasheet as the Land Raider Excelsior.



I keep forgetting about those damned tanks!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/30 00:27:45






 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Steelcity

 luke1705 wrote:
I actually like that they have the cost of all these models with no wargear instead of building the cost of their default wargear into the unit. It allows them to cost things much more appropriately instead of "cost of this weapon minus the cost of the weapons you lose by upgrading to it" which naturally varied wildly from unit to unit


You know that it's totally possible for them to have an internal point list and calculate the points per model without forcing us to do it for models that only have a single option? It's pretty dumb if 4 terminators can only have a powerfist/storm bolter that we have to then equip them with such.

Keeper of the DomBox
Warhammer Armies - Click to see galleries of fully painted armies
32,000, 19,000, Renegades - 10,000 , 7,500,  
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Hyperspace

Tau images were taken down, but luckily your favorite robot has saved screenshots of all of them.



WARNING! PIC HEAVY!
Spoiler:












































































Peregrine - If you like the army buy it, and don't worry about what one random person on the internet thinks.
 
   
Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




Spoiler:
 Mantle wrote:
@cordial

There is the primaris rhino listed and there is something in the lord of war section for 400 points but the picture is cut off, could possibly be the redemptor if it's going to be lord of war level.


Yeah, I figured the Rhino was the one that already exists as a command tank. As for the Lord of War option, I agree it *could* be the Redemptor, I doubt it for a couple of reasons:
1) You can see that its entry starts with "Termi..."
2) It costs a flat number of points. Since we've seen a couple of different weapon loadouts for the Redemptor already, my guess would be it's entry would just be for the chassis and would not include wargear, as per entries for other dreads etc..

I'm guessing the primaris entries in that list are just for models that will be available at release and just a placeholder before the primaris list is expanded (greatly expanded, I hope!) and revamped with its own codex.

Edit: I see Ghaz posted the tank I was thinking of. Thanks

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/05/30 00:42:53


Blah, blah, blah, Mister Freeman. 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





 gigasnail wrote:
matched play carrying over the psychic power rule of 1. so much for being able to have reliable access to catalyst.


Source?

[im]https://imgur.com/kEUzFF0.png[im]

http://insighthammer.com/ 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Magc8Ball wrote:
Weird that the Chaos leak pictures showed a "Renegade Knight" page, but there wasn't an entry for it anywhere on the points cost page. I suppose there might be another page with LOW entries on it, given some of the Chaos daemon engines and named Greater Daemons available.


Note it doesn't have the heretic astartes faction keyword, it's likely in an entirely separate section of the book.
   
Made in us
Whiteshield Conscript Trooper




Is anyone else worried about the standard changes to large blast weapons? My main army has been IG/AM since I started playing in 5th and moving all my large blasts to 1d6 shots is a massive nerf to a significant portion of my force. I'm running 2 minimalist LRBTs right now (Standard Cannon and no sponsons) and having cannons only HIT an average of 1.75 times a round is pretty depressing. Even an ideal scenario of 6 hits only happens every 0.26% of the time, where before hitting 8 models would be an amazing shot for sure, but not unheard of either.

Not to mention I've got a Valkyrie armed with multiple rocket pods, which originally I chose because my circle of friends ran a significant amount of ork boys and kroot. d6 shots from those strictly anti-infantry rockets would be a devastating change.
   
Made in ca
Hauptmann





 Kirasu wrote:
 luke1705 wrote:
I actually like that they have the cost of all these models with no wargear instead of building the cost of their default wargear into the unit. It allows them to cost things much more appropriately instead of "cost of this weapon minus the cost of the weapons you lose by upgrading to it" which naturally varied wildly from unit to unit


You know that it's totally possible for them to have an internal point list and calculate the points per model without forcing us to do it for models that only have a single option? It's pretty dumb if 4 terminators can only have a powerfist/storm bolter that we have to then equip them with such.


Not that dumb if they assume they'll go in later and tweak the cost of any of these components individually.

It reduces the number of places they need to go in and fiddle with the point costs. If the powerfist is too cheap, they change the cost once and call it a day. No need to hunt down a lot of individual places where the cost might occur if it was pre-calculated.

Hell, it also makes it dead easy to change just about everything about units as well. Say they want terminators to start with a default SB+power sword instead of a fist. They go to the entry, change the starting equipment, and then leave the rest alone.

This is the ideal setup for a living ruleset that is meant to be tweaked as we go on. If everything were pre-figured then that would lead to more places to make mistakes and typos as changes were implemented. For a bit of extra complexity on the army build side (and not all that much, all told) they make the product a lot more future proof once changes roll in.

If it wasn't like this, I would question how tied to "yearly updates" they really were.

 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Probably Drunk




Colorado Springs

Daedalus81 wrote:
 gigasnail wrote:
matched play carrying over the psychic power rule of 1. so much for being able to have reliable access to catalyst.


Source?


http://imgur.com/a/gu4pw

Scroll to the very bottom.
   
Made in us
Tunneling Trygon





NJ

 Fluxxxx wrote:
 luke1705 wrote:
I actually like that they have the cost of all these models with no wargear instead of building the cost of their default wargear into the unit. It allows them to cost things much more appropriately instead of "cost of this weapon minus the cost of the weapons you lose by upgrading to it" which naturally varied wildly from unit to unit


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Loopstah wrote:
Anyone who's seen the nid lists know if spike rifles or stranglewebs are in?


I'm waiting for Nid leaks too...by Friday at the latest I'll know everything


I'll be keeping an ear out for you come Friday!! Keen as to see what the nids have in store.


Well to be fair, I'll be "playtesting" on Friday lmao so depending on how late that goes, it might not be until Saturday that you hear things. But don't worry, things will be heard. For I will certainly be playing Nids on Friday
   
Made in at
Storm Trooper with Maglight





 Magc8Ball wrote:
Weird that the Chaos leak pictures showed a "Renegade Knight" page, but there wasn't an entry for it anywhere on the points cost page. I suppose there might be another page with LOW entries on it, given some of the Chaos daemon engines and named Greater Daemons available.

If the cover is anything to go by, they're a separate faction like Imperial Knights are which would explain it.
   
Made in us
Tunneling Trygon





NJ

Slave wrote:
I am having a hard time with a STR 6 Carnifex. That would be the lowest it's ever been.


Remember that this is without any weapons, most of which will likely double its strength (or have a set strength value). And it'll almost assuredly do d6 damage per wound (or better) as per the Trygon
   
Made in us
Mounted Kroot Tracker







I'll keep my comments short about the one thing I have a vested interest in - Kroot.



In summary, Kroot lost the sniper rounds upgrade and a melee attack. They have gained an inch of movement and get back to Strength 4 in melee. Krootox will get to use their Toughness 5 and always advance an additional 6" on top of their 7" movement. Kroot Hounds have a nice 12" movement and reroll failed charges against units that took a wound earlier that turn. The Shaper dishes out Leadership bonuses to units within 6" in the form of using his base Leadership (7 instead of 6 or 5 in the case of the hounds) and if he manages to slay a model in melee then all Kroot units within 6" ignore Morale tests. He also creates a 6" bubble that allows all Kroot units to reroll failed wound rolls of 1.

So, reading all of this, I do like the required synergy between the Shaper and the rest of the units, but do not find it very reliable. Keeping that Shaper within 6" of Kroot units seems difficult. Krootox always Advance 6" and Hounds move 12", and even the Carnivores get a pre-game 7" move that, oddly enough, the Shaper does not get. The Shaper is probably behind the other units after the first turn and can't play catch-up. It's also unlikely he can actually destroy a model in melee so relying on that to prevent all Morale tests at the end of the turn is a fool's game. I'm also pretty disappointed that a Kroot assault is less effective than the shots they take before charging- not what I wanted them to be like on the battlefield.

The Always Advance 6" rule for Krootox is a nice, reliable way to keep them moving up with the Hounds, but seems to be in major conflict with the fact they have 48" rapid fire guns. That's an annoying choice to have to make. Hounds seem really fun, though, as they're going to be screaming across the battlefield at 13-18" each turn and I love their rule for catching a blood scent and getting to reroll failed charges against a wounded unit. At 4 points a pop and a -1 AP (which the Krootox do not get, strangely), they can actually do some early damage. It's just a shame that they're so fast and there doesn't seem to be a way to keep a Shaper near them for any bonuses.

I understand these rules are meant for a T'au army, so the Kroot will probably be hanging back near a gunline and that will allow the Shaper to be useful, but I was thinking ahead to a future Kroot Mercenaries release and am using these rules as a template for how such an army may function.


   
Made in us
Chaplain with Hate to Spare





Sioux Falls, SD

 Ghaz wrote:
 Mantle wrote:
@cordial

There is the primaris rhino listed and there is something in the lord of war section for 400 points but the picture is cut off, could possibly be the redemptor if it's going to be lord of war level.

The Rhino Primaris is the existing command variant found on the same datasheet as the Land Raider Excelsior.

I am curious if the Rhino Primaris and Land Raider Excelsior will be able to be taken separately now. They are listed separately, so it is certainly possible. Which means I might just take the Rhino Primaris alone, rather than both. If I can do that, I might model the Excelsior as just a regular Land Raider.

5250 pts
3850 pts
Deathwatch: 1500 pts
Imperial Knights: 375 pts
30K 2500 pts 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Has the points cost for the Chaos armory been released? Would love to see that so I can get to list building.

Also is the Icon of tzeentch a mortal wound on every unit within 12 on a 6 or just 1 unit?
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Perfected Haemonculi Living Sculpture






changemod wrote:
Two things then:

Flyers count as destroyed when they leave the board, the sun shark still has to move straight after one pivot of 90 degrees max, and it's minimum move has been bumped to 20 inches.

I see a lot less people taking flyers if that's the norm.

Also, what do you think the new standard points level to play at will be, given people will want to use their model collections in similar amounts as before? I'm thinking 3000.


Yea but there are no firing arcs anymore, so a flyer can just circle the board shooting 360 all game.

   
Made in ca
Regular Dakkanaut




 JohnU wrote:
Daedalus81 wrote:
 gigasnail wrote:
matched play carrying over the psychic power rule of 1. so much for being able to have reliable access to catalyst.


Source?


http://imgur.com/a/gu4pw

Scroll to the very bottom.


I was thinking the psychic phase was still going to be good for certain armies until you pointed this out. What a downer.
   
Made in ca
Longtime Dakkanaut





Toronto

I mean... it keeps people from just spamming the same spell over and over again.

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




For psychic powers, not only are you prevented from casting the same (non smite) power twice, you are also limited to three psychic powers on each list so far. With most armies apparently being forced to draw from a single list.
   
 
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