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2021/09/22 19:16:30
Subject: Re:Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
I thought everyone was running spawn! Such a useful and cheap wee unit. Either in groups of 3+ with the strat or as single model units for objectives/screening.
My current list has a 3 man squad with the strat to push up easy game for engage points and to generally get in the enemy's face. Meanwhile a single spawn hangs back with the plagueburst crawler to protect it from deepstrikes, or if there are none, to sit on an objective behind LOS terrain.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/23 10:55:06
2021/09/23 12:43:52
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
ninjafiredragon wrote: I have absolutely began to include at least one spawn in every list. So much objective utility for so little investment
Me too. Unless you have other fast attack units which are mobile that you are willing to throw onto a midboard objective turn 1, otherwise, chaos spawn are the go to for opening move in a DG army. They are super cheap and throwaway and with an advance, they are usually fast enough to get onto a midboard objective turn 1, which is all you need. like in a 5 objective game with both players taking stranglehold, and both players want the middle. Chaos spawn are the perfect trading pieces. Cheap, fast and good.
2021/09/25 15:31:32
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
What are y'all's thoughts on Deathguard in the tournament meta right now? After dhrukari dropped, my hopes went down, and especially after admech, and while I still saw a DG tourney placing pop up here and there, it looked like those were mostly events were those 2 aforementioned boogie men were absent/light.
BUT, with Orks coming into the meta with a bang, both Dhrukari and Admech are a little hurting. Orks have a good matchup into Drukari and a fine one into admech. So, people have been more reluctant to take them to tournaments, reducing their overall meta impact.
What I have noticed be back on the rise in the meta is Space Marines. They deal with Orks well and have mostly good matchups all around.
So enter deathguard. I think we actually generally have a good matchup into space Marines, and into Orks (anyone played enough games vs new Orks to have an idea how we do? So far it's just my guess but I think we have a good matchup into em). So I think the tournament scene might be slightly more friendly to Death guard.
Anyone else have an opinion/thought to share on this?
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2021/09/26 02:41:53
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
I don't really play tournament. But my impression is that shooty lists are now fewer. Terrain has a big impact. The big square blocks of GW terrain reduced the power of shooting lists. So even Admech lists don't spam the kind of shooting they could. Similarly, Drukhari lists these days don't spam dark lances the way they can. So this allows DG lists now to stand a chance even if they run into a Drukhari or Admech matchup. And DG is generally good against the rest of the field.
2021/09/26 22:29:31
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
I can't speak from any of my own experience, but at the London GT this weekend (second largest GT in the world with 600 players) we had 2 DG players in the top 16, I.e. undefeated, and 6 DG when considering the top 50.
Outside of Ad Mech and DE, that's the joint best showing for any single faction, so clearly we still have legs on the tourney scene.
Unfortunately not, all I know is David Thorn came 3rd or 4th with a Terminus Est list, so I'm expecting a flood of poxwalkers. BCP is supposed to have the lists but crashes every time I try and check. I guess I'll just wait for the Goonhammer write up on Wed.
2021/09/27 09:59:57
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
Hey all,
Played some more practice games, planning on the Michigan GT next weekend with pure DG, had practiced with Chaos Knights, Knights/DG and versions of pure DG. I thought I was settled on a Poxmongers list almost exactly like the one Bridger almost won what TTT event recently but have found I really miss mobility and especially mobile close combat threats.
I’m practicing a Mortarions Anvil list using a beat stick Prince, flesh mower drones, terminators and PBCs with some good board coverage with Poxwalkers. I’m built for Spread the Sickness, To the Last, and Stranglehold, probably with To the Last being dropped for whatever special secondary per the mission if it looks spicy.
I like the Blightlords as small 5 mans, they can shoot and fight and offer just a few more wounds than Deathshroud, even though I still am using one squad of them.
We don’t have the missions for the event yet but when I have them in hand, I’ll adjust accordingly .
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2021/09/30 00:14:08
Subject: Re:Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
On the subject on souping in Chaos knights with DG. Have you tried souping in just 4 war dogs in a superheavy detachment ? Seems like the autocannon version wardogs would be extra good at killing Drukhari raiders and still decent against Orc vehicles. And the meltagun melee war dogs would be good against generically everything else. The war dogs are also fast enough such that you can easily move one onto a midpoint objective on turn 1 so the list can skip running chaos spawns if you want to save on points. And 4 war dogs are sufficiently cheap such that you can easily still run pox walkers and 3 units of death shrouds for a core DG list. So like maybe 1 meltagun wardog, 3 autocannon war dogs ? Or 1 meltagun, 2 autocannon and 1 moirex ?
Automatically Appended Next Post: BTW, on another note. A DG Terminus Est list got 3rd at the London GT which had over 500 participants. Mad props to the player David Horn! So Terminus Est is definitely competitive enough and its not a meme list!
Link above to a blog by Euan Bedford who ran a very successful DG Lord of Skulls list that went undefeated 5-0 in the London GT. Who says a single Lord Of Skulls can't be competitive!
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/09/30 00:52:56
2021/11/06 02:37:50
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
Has anyone had any luck with running a Daemon Prince? I have 1 kit to build, but I'm on the fence as to if I want to build it with wings/sword and have it charge up field slinging mortal wounds powers flabked by mower drones, OR have it slog across the board with the spewer and cast buff spells in a blob of Possessed.
Sword is the best weapon, by a long shot. Magnetise him if you can to make it future proof.
Wings is more subjective. In previous editors they were a mandatory upgrade, but the current DG one is more balanced. It really depends on how you want to use him. Although since DP's are full of warp magic, he doesn't need physical wings to fly, so these don't need to be modelled.
2021/11/11 14:22:32
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
So since it looks like they are going to update the meta every 3 months what are the top 3 changes you hope for DG if they put any in? I know we are a baseline codex. I dont want to see buffs only addtional viable builds.
My top 3 changes:
-Plague Marines weapon options all go to 5pts similar to Blight Lords and the models go to 20 points per model. (these guys just are not seeing play and need a small boost these minor tweaks may tip the balance)
-Myphitic Blight Haulers go to 125-130 points per model. (At 140pts they are absurdly over-pointed IMHO). They took a significant nerf from 8th and had a 40% price hike.
-ALL Deadly Pathogens go to 5 to 15pts. (These abilities could make heroes interesting but for some reason they are pointed to ensure no one uses them) They are not nearly as good as the SM equivalents, yet are very high costed. Even at these points they will still likely rarely see play. Honestly, I would like to see the first being free like a warlord trait or relic and paying points for any additonal ones.
-I would also like to see ever unit in our codex (espeically rhinos, defilers, and land raiders) get DR and Inexorible Advance.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/11/11 14:24:45
2021/11/11 22:25:08
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
broxus wrote: So since it looks like they are going to update the meta every 3 months what are the top 3 changes you hope for DG if they put any in? I know we are a baseline codex. I dont want to see buffs only addtional viable builds.
My top 3 changes:
-Plague Marines weapon options all go to 5pts similar to Blight Lords and the models go to 20 points per model. (these guys just are not seeing play and need a small boost these minor tweaks may tip the balance)
-Myphitic Blight Haulers go to 125-130 points per model. (At 140pts they are absurdly over-pointed IMHO). They took a significant nerf from 8th and had a 40% price hike.
-ALL Deadly Pathogens go to 5 to 15pts. (These abilities could make heroes interesting but for some reason they are pointed to ensure no one uses them) They are not nearly as good as the SM equivalents, yet are very high costed. Even at these points they will still likely rarely see play. Honestly, I would like to see the first being free like a warlord trait or relic and paying points for any additonal ones.
-I would also like to see ever unit in our codex (espeically rhinos, defilers, and land raiders) get DR and Inexorible Advance.
Given that the Time of the O̶r̶c̶ Grey Knights is coming, and we have such an abysmal match-up into them (and Thousand Sons) - the Disgustingly Resilient change leaving us helpless against mortal wounds - I'd like to see the Plague Surgeon get a slight shift: Lose the 6+++ general FNP buble in exchange for a 5+++ FNP bubble, but specifically against mortal wounds. It would take a unit that practically cannot ever make its points back into a strong meta choice.
World Eaters: 5780pts
Khorne Daemons: 3450pts
Chaos Knights: 2000pts
Sisters of Battle: 5000pts
Imperial Agents: 410pts
Gloomspite Gitz: 7190pts
Blades of Khorne Daemons: 3810pts
Skaven: 1270pts
Destruction Mercenaries: 470pts
Endless Spells and Incarnates: 1380pts
2021/11/12 04:01:09
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
It would also be nice if our new DR worked on MWs also. This would reduce all MW damage by -1. That would go a long ways towards helping out. Our old DR worked against MW not sure why they changed it.
2021/11/12 06:19:07
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
broxus wrote: It would also be nice if our new DR worked on MWs also. This would reduce all MW damage by -1. That would go a long ways towards helping out. Our old DR worked against MW not sure why they changed it.
you can't have damage reduction on MW because of the way how MW work. They are always applied one by one. So a lot of D1 wounds. And there is to my knowledge no ability without the reduce to minimum 1 part,
4200 1250 500
2021/11/12 14:21:20
Subject: Re:Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
Hopefully we'll see some small points drops for units like the Blight Hauler, Drone with spewers and possessed in the next CA.
But now that GW have shown they can make changes to the actual datasheet mid-codex, my wish list is;
- Add DR to rhinos, preds and land raider. Is TS can share their army wide bonus to vehicles, why not us?
- Bring the plague marine wargear restrictions back to what they were in 8th edition. Being able to take 2 of the same special weapon in 5 man squads (and up to 4 in 10 man squads) might actual given plague marines a purpose, as right now there is little they can do that other units don't do better.
- Scrap all the blightbringer abilities and instead make him something else. I'd recommend a reverse Chaplin, with him knowing a couple of different songs which if successful create a 14" wide de-buff aura. -1A, -1S, -1AP, -2 to charge rolls. Stuff like that.
2021/11/12 14:46:34
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
broxus wrote: It would also be nice if our new DR worked on MWs also. This would reduce all MW damage by -1. That would go a long ways towards helping out. Our old DR worked against MW not sure why they changed it.
you can't have damage reduction on MW because of the way how MW work. They are always applied one by one. So a lot of D1 wounds. And there is to my knowledge no ability without the reduce to minimum 1 part,
You would have to change the DR rule to allow it to work. It would be an easy fix.
2021/11/13 21:33:25
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
broxus wrote: It would also be nice if our new DR worked on MWs also. This would reduce all MW damage by -1. That would go a long ways towards helping out. Our old DR worked against MW not sure why they changed it.
you can't have damage reduction on MW because of the way how MW work. They are always applied one by one. So a lot of D1 wounds. And there is to my knowledge no ability without the reduce to minimum 1 part,
You would have to change the DR rule to allow it to work. It would be an easy fix.
That's not the issue. The issue is that the core rules for how the Mortal Wounds work always applies them one by one, so even multiples of them wouldn't be reduced. For example, smashing a 6 MW Smite out is really 1+1+1+1+1+1 mortals, rendering any blanket reduction rule inefficient.
Then again, you could write DR to include something like "whenever an enemy unit is chosen to attack this unit, until the end of their activation, ignore the first Mortal Wound this unit would suffer". The problem is that it gets weirdly specific fast and will still have edge cases. Just adding "this unit has 5+++ against Mortal Wounds" to DR would be more elegant and go a long way, but still be insufficient in general.
broxus wrote: It would also be nice if our new DR worked on MWs also. This would reduce all MW damage by -1. That would go a long ways towards helping out. Our old DR worked against MW not sure why they changed it.
you can't have damage reduction on MW because of the way how MW work. They are always applied one by one. So a lot of D1 wounds. And there is to my knowledge no ability without the reduce to minimum 1 part,
You would have to change the DR rule to allow it to work. It would be an easy fix.
That's not the issue. The issue is that the core rules for how the Mortal Wounds work always applies them one by one, so even multiples of them wouldn't be reduced. For example, smashing a 6 MW Smite out is really 1+1+1+1+1+1 mortals, rendering any blanket reduction rule inefficient.
Then again, you could write DR to include something like "whenever an enemy unit is chosen to attack this unit, until the end of their activation, ignore the first Mortal Wound this unit would suffer". The problem is that it gets weirdly specific fast and will still have edge cases. Just adding "this unit has 5+++ against Mortal Wounds" to DR would be more elegant and go a long way, but still be insufficient in general.
I’m sure they cam figure out a way to make it work or just allow DG to ignore the core rules for MW. Again not rocket science. The biggest issue is that DG simply not resilient enough to survive the 9th Ed meta. I was hopin when SM got the second would units would all become more defensive. Regretfully, they ruined the defensive gains by making every weapon in new codexes much more deadly bringing the game back to square one. The DG codex and units was designed to survive and outlast 8th edition codexes, not 9th ones.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/11/17 02:15:36
2021/11/17 15:21:54
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
Given how anemic Inexorable Advance is ("Plague Marines can always rapid fire boltguns, and Blightlord Terminators don't suffer -1 to hit with Reaper Autocannons when they move"...) I'd love to see a 5+ vs Mortal Wounds chucked in.
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2021/11/18 09:55:38
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
A 5+++ vs mortals would be far too much on top of what we already have, imo.
l0k1 wrote: Has anyone had any luck with running a Daemon Prince? I have 1 kit to build, but I'm on the fence as to if I want to build it with wings/sword and have it charge up field slinging mortal wounds powers flabked by mower drones, OR have it slog across the board with the spewer and cast buff spells in a blob of Possessed.
I usually run a DP with Warp Insect Hive/RR and it does really well for me. Tried running him without wings a few times and while he's not bad per se, fly + the extra movement feels too useful to me.
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2021/11/25 13:19:36
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
MinMax wrote: Given how anemic Inexorable Advance is ("Plague Marines can always rapid fire boltguns, and Blightlord Terminators don't suffer -1 to hit with Reaper Autocannons when they move"...) I'd love to see a 5+ vs Mortal Wounds chucked in.
Agreed IA is the saddest and worst chapter trait in any codex.
2021/12/01 15:24:44
Subject: Mortarion's sons Death Guard tactica 9th ed
One other thing I would love to see them change is out inability to take 2 lords in the same detachment. It seems silly they gave us some random restriction no one else has. I hate that if I want to take a battalion that I’m forced to take a faster. I would love to take a LoC and LoV in the same detachment.