Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Lorgar's_Blessed wrote: But compared to the Astartes, they pale.

Icwutudidthar!

Why would we cram capabilities into a stat range of 3-5 when we could just compare backgrounds? Making stats and then comparing makes no sense.

Oh, and for the records, I have no ill will towards Halo. I like the background and the games. However, Halo and 40k are on such different power levels that comparisons are really pointless.

Precisely. Refer back to previous post stating the Halo fanbois need to realise this please.

ph34r wrote:Why would we cram capabilities into a stat range of 3-5 when we could just compare backgrounds? Making stats and then comparing makes no sense.

Oh, and for the records, I have no ill will towards Halo. I like the background and the games. However, Halo and 40k are on such different power levels that comparisons are really pointless.

If we are just looking at background (which I totally agree is all we need to be looking at) then the spartans definitley lose. How many are left of the Spartan IIs? Less than 10? If that? I don't remember the particulars but IIRC the covenent sort of pwn'd them.

Lorgar's_Blessed wrote:I A Spartan, however, has lost his targetting so he is less accurate, has no physical durability beyond a powerful human, and is simply smaller and weaker.

Uh then why was one spartan(forgot his/her name and what book said spartan was from) able to snipe a banshee pilot when the top was down?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

CrazyThang wrote:

ph34r wrote:Why would we cram capabilities into a stat range of 3-5 when we could just compare backgrounds? Making stats and then comparing makes no sense.

Oh, and for the records, I have no ill will towards Halo. I like the background and the games. However, Halo and 40k are on such different power levels that comparisons are really pointless.

If we are just looking at background (which I totally agree is all we need to be looking at) then the spartans definitley lose. How many are left of the Spartan IIs? Less than 10? If that? I don't remember the particulars but IIRC the covenent sort of pwn'd them.

Yeah but the spartans only died when they were against impossible odds. Even then they would have taken out dozens of covenant.

Munch Munch! wrote:

Lorgar's_Blessed wrote:I A Spartan, however, has lost his targetting so he is less accurate, has no physical durability beyond a powerful human, and is simply smaller and weaker.

Uh then why was one spartan(forgot his/her name and what book said spartan was from) able to snipe a banshee pilot when the top was down?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

CrazyThang wrote:

ph34r wrote:Why would we cram capabilities into a stat range of 3-5 when we could just compare backgrounds? Making stats and then comparing makes no sense.

Oh, and for the records, I have no ill will towards Halo. I like the background and the games. However, Halo and 40k are on such different power levels that comparisons are really pointless.

If we are just looking at background (which I totally agree is all we need to be looking at) then the spartans definitley lose. How many are left of the Spartan IIs? Less than 10? If that? I don't remember the particulars but IIRC the covenent sort of pwn'd them.

Yeah but the spartans only died when they were against impossible odds. Even then they would have taken out dozens of covenant.

The armor aids in aiming quite a bit, even the games say this.

SMs go against impossible odds daily. Look at space hulk boarding parties (and don't give me the "their in terminator armor" excuse, its still easily one of the most dangerous things a marine can do). Granted there are more space marines than there were spartans overall but in single battles not so much.

The "aiming aids" aren't restricted to Mjolnir.

The standard UNSC Marines have the same 'basic' setup, and Mjolnir's setup is a copy of what the ODSTs have.

Just saying, it's not *just* the armor.

I was the 117th vote for space marine. Thats ironic.

Its the strength.
The Space mariens are stronger, the Spartans may be cool and everything but were talking about something in the year 40,000 to a spartan who is from the year 2552.
Ok so there is a big difference.
Humanity has evolved, no matter what people say, but Humanity is pretty advanced.
Plus Space Marines have an extra armor, called the Black Carapace. So the spartans are just out matched in every way.

Go play halo on heroic, or multi player. I consider that to be the 'realistic' toughness of a spartan. Though in the books spartans care comparatively weak. Didnt one of them get fethed up by a single plasma pistol gak, and they basically have to use super tactics. M@stur cheef is super cool if you are a scrub who only plays on easy.

I love halo, I really really really do. But seriously. Thats like comparing the terminator to necron pariahs.

I think if we are going to compare generic marine to generic spartan then the marine comes out on top. And if its master chief then we can put him against say dante or logan. Lets assume chief gets a rocket launcher, with unlimited ammo. A rocket launcher I figure is about equal to a tau missile pod. See how long it takes missile pods to kill any of the marine commanders.

Asherian Command wrote:Its the strength.
The Space mariens are stronger, the Spartans may be cool and everything but were talking about something in the year 40,000 to a spartan who is from the year 2552.
Ok so there is a big difference.
Humanity has evolved, no matter what people say, but Humanity is pretty advanced.
Plus Space Marines have an extra armor, called the Black Carapace. So the spartans are just out matched in every way.

Black Carapace isn't armor.

It's essentially an organ that allows the Astartes a better interfacing with their Power Armour.

Still bulletproof

As bulletproof as your ribcage, maybe.

As bulletproof as THEIR ribcage, which by the way is VERY bulletproof. The Black Carapace does indeed offer a tad bit more extra protection, though no more than a layer of thick clothing.

I thought black carapace was basically flak armor equivalent.

No.

The "Black Carapace" is absolutely nothing other than ossified bone over the ribcage and vital organs.

Ughhh I was to late, you see kids these kinds of threads build up tremendous amounts of nerd rage

But because im posting i mind as well put up my idea.
Space Marine, cause its obviously really about
how bad ass the 2 are. The marine is just pumping with bad assity,
Look at his main weapon, a bolter A BURST ACTION RIFE WITH BULLETS THAT EXPLODE WITHIN YOU
Im sure a spartan looks pretty good to, but this is just to easy.
But in a real fist fight no armor, just skin and boxers, the marine will still win
because unlike the spartan the marine is still huge and a killing machine with out his suit
a spartan with out his armor is just a man with huge tank flipping muscles that's it.

I think a better question might be who would win in a wild west style shootout. A dire avenger or a spartan. Im kinda leaning on the avenger, just because spartan rifles are pathetic by 40k standards.

I have read all the Halo books, and I have to say that if a spartan came across a Space marine his best bet would be to run away and call in a Scorpion.

The Spartans while yes they have fancy armor and have been genetically altered could not match a space marine in any kind of fight. Spartans would basically be in game terms a bit better then storm troopers.

That and the other thing the Spartans weapons wouldn't have a prayer against power amour. That is unless the marine isn't wearing his helmet and is standing completely still.

Well, if you really want to figure it out you can compare different parts of each of them.

Biology:
Spartans have increased reflexes, increased musculature and increased bone growth.
Space Marines have all of these plus extra heart, extra lung (ish), ability to adapted skin, etc, etc, etc.

Armour:
Spartans have an advanced suit which increased strength and provides a large amount of protection as well as the energy shield.
Space Marines have massively thick armour which increases their strength and a huge amount of protection, enough that not even lasguns and bolts will penetrate it, weapons which would normally kill anyone including a Spartan.

Weaponry:
Spartans use slightly more advanced versions of what our army currently uses which pale in comparison to what even the Imperial Guard use.
Space Marines hold giant grenade launchers which they use like assault rifles and would penetrate the energy shield of the Spartans.

They do have a third lung, it's not an ish matter.

Lorgar: You are being fairly hypocritical here.

You have repeatedly attacked those who reckon that a Spartan may have a chance, and have often thrown at the label "halo fanboi". Yet you yourself are practically having an orgasm when describing the awesome pwnage of marine. Even though I feel that a Space Marine would usually come out on top, I have to wince a little at your hyperbole.

Another point, you have often stated that SM can easily lift vehichles. I have to assume your talking about a civilian car or something becuase there is no way in hell that they could lift a Rhino or Chimera. On that same note, while playing Halo, doesn't the Spartan frequently flip over the Warthog and other vehichles? (If you're a crap driver that is)

It seems to me that, despite a slight advantage towards the marine, they are comparable enough in strength.

Speaking of which you can flip the Elephant. That's pretty freaking strong.

OT Munch Munch: Nive Avatar.

Thanks! I think yours is cool too!

*facepalm*

I failed at spelling.

Ah, forget about it!

Halo vehicles are build light and efficient compared to 40k vehicles which are built out of invincible heavytanium. Anything a spartan can flip, a SM can flip. That's just the facts, SM muscle enhancements and power armor is greater than that of a spartan.

Um, where does it say a marine can flip a Rhino?

Maybe with a PF, and Terminators have increased strength with their suit, but a normal marine?

A civilian car? Yes Tank? Thats waaay to strong. I could go on and on the same way about just about any other race.

The point is, the SM would win, but the point here is to simply say that, and I think we all agree that they would. Trust me, Halo fanboys can't possibly be worse than the fanboyism that comes with SM.

The space marine would simple say.

"BY THE EMPEROR'S GRIMDARK ABSURDITY!"

And the spartan would evaporate. As his plot armor is insufficient to stop even a space marine from yelling at him.

The end.