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Were there even GKs during the Rouge trader era?

and it is generally accepted that much of the rouge trader era fluff is no longer cannon.

egor71 wrote:*old git mode on*

Aren't there supose to be 666 GK, only in TA

*old git mode off*

I'm pretty sure you're confusing that with their chapter designation - they were the 666th chapter of space marines.

No, you're right, I forgot about the old rules for Jump Pack Grey Knights in 2nd Ed.

H.B.M.C. wrote:Canon in 40K is flexible and arbitrary.

If GW wants to add Jump Pack Grey Knights to the fluff, guess what, they'll ret-con them in and then they'll always have been there. If they want Jetbike GK's - same deal, they were always there. And then we have internal inconsistency between GK Jetbikes and Master of the Deathwing's Last Jetbike in the Imperium.

Teehee.

actually, I'd like to see grey knights using teleporter packs instead of jump packs, would make them unique. Allow them to use their teleporters in the movement phase... give the teleport a 24" range, assault on arrival from teleport, and ONLY allow them to teleport to within 6" of grey knight carrying a teleport homer. Of course, this would mean they would never scatter....

would allow GK teleport units to back up and support their brothers from longer ranges in hand to hand.

Were there Jump Pack Grey Knights in 2ed? I thought during that time all Grey Knights were Terminators and they didn't lower themselves to Power Armor until the Daemon Hunters Codex.

Grey Templar wrote:Were there even GKs during the Rouge trader era?

and it is generally accepted that much of the rouge trader era fluff is no longer cannon.

Yes, introduced in the first Realms of Chaos book.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Aduro wrote:Were there Jump Pack Grey Knights in 2ed? I thought during that time all Grey Knights were Terminators and they didn't lower themselves to Power Armor until the Daemon Hunters Codex.

GK's were just another name for Marines in RT.

Grey Templar wrote:Were there even GKs during the Rouge trader era?

Yes, and they were effectively Codex, as most GK weren't psykers, and they wore Corvus armor like everybody else.
____

Aduro wrote:Were there Jump Pack Grey Knights in 2ed?

I thought during that time all Grey Knights were Terminators and they didn't lower themselves to Power Armor until the Daemon Hunters Codex.

under 2E Heroes of Imperium? No JP GKs

under 2E Heroes of Imperium? pretty much

DeathGod wrote:

egor71 wrote:*old git mode on*

Aren't there supose to be 666 GK, only in TA

*old git mode off*

I'm pretty sure you're confusing that with their chapter designation - they were the 666th chapter of space marines.

Yep, there are about 3000 Grey Knights. It sounds like a lot in comparison to normal Index Astartes chapters, but remember that the Grey Knights are spread across the entire Galaxy, as opposed to normal chapters, which have their numbers confined to a single sector.

H.B.M.C. wrote: And then we have internal inconsistency between GK Jetbikes and Master of the Deathwing's Last Jetbike in the Imperium.

Not really... The DA codex only says that the Master's Jetbike is thought to be the last one. And given the GK's penchant for secrecy... no problems there.

insaniak wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote: And then we have internal inconsistency between GK Jetbikes and Master of the Deathwing's Last Jetbike in the Imperium.

Not really... The DA codex only says that the Master's Jetbike is thought to be the last one. And given the GK's penchant for secrecy... no problems there.

Actually, it would probably look like this

"Sir, we've just uncovered an intact STC unit."
"Great! What does it do?"
"It produces shiny, new plastic mode... errr, I mean, Imperial Mk 2 pattern jetbikes, Sir!"

http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=62769

appologies if re-post but seen new white dwarf today in local GW and in the news section it states that the Daemonhunters and Witch Hunters codexs are going to be available in full in PDF format on the main GW site
not new codex but the old ones - so does this mean august as release time seems unlikely?

Hmm.. if this is true, and it sounds plausible enough .. and is an odd thing to make up as it will very quickly be disproven if it's not the case..then I would say it does make an August release for Grey Knights look unlikely no ?

Fafnir wrote:Yep, there are about 3000 Grey Knights. It sounds like a lot in comparison to normal Index Astartes chapters, but remember that the Grey Knights are spread across the entire Galaxy, as opposed to normal chapters, which have their numbers confined to a single sector.

The figure I hear most seems to be around 6000... or is that Black Templar? Or both, perhaps. I can never find concrete answers for either...


As for the whole "pdf online, inquisition probably next" I certainly hope so. Also here's hoping that Inquisition keeps some options, at least a few types of acolyte and inducted guard units.

Although perhaps this is a bit unfair, I'm hoping the Inquisition gets all their options stuffed into this codex so that they are completely absent in my Sisters codex

Yes.

those of us who play "Pure" grey knights and sisters don't like the Inquisitors hanging around our codex.


the only reason i will take an inquisitor is if i want an assassin. and that doesn't happen very often and it is almost never worth it.

reds8n wrote:http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=62769

appologies if re-post but seen new white dwarf today in local GW and in the news section it states that the Daemonhunters and Witch Hunters codexs are going to be available in full in PDF format on the main GW site
not new codex but the old ones - so does this mean august as release time seems unlikely?

Hmm.. if this is true, and it sounds plausible enough .. and is an odd thing to make up as it will very quickly be disproven if it's not the case..then I would say it does make an August release for Grey Knights look unlikely no ?

Alright, that's enough to convince me that GK/=I= aren't going to beat the Dark Eldar. Good news is I know what to save up my Xmas money for.

reds8n wrote:http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=62769

appologies if re-post but seen new white dwarf today in local GW and in the news section it states that the Daemonhunters and Witch Hunters codexs are going to be available in full in PDF format on the main GW site
not new codex but the old ones - so does this mean august as release time seems unlikely?

Hmm.. if this is true, and it sounds plausible enough .. and is an odd thing to make up as it will very quickly be disproven if it's not the case..then I would say it does make an August release for Grey Knights look unlikely no ?

Oh I would laugh so hard if all GKs got was a PDF and some new models...

Heh, Jump Packs or Teleporters...I think Games Workshop could pull off teleporting like the Eldar Warp Spiders for Grey Knights. Show up anywhere within 24" and then tada! You've just been assaulted by a unit that just arrived. Kind of like Gate of Infinity without the pain of sitting out in the open upon arrival.

Nobody is forced to play an Inquisitor in a WH army, personally I like a good Inquisitor retinue to add flavor and diversity to my army (and the assassins).
But COdex discussion should not focus on how to reduce options for WH, but to enhance them.

This is all nice and well, but Space Marines will probably come out this year and GK will be added as an elite option like the Legion of the Damned...which were a damn waste considering they could have easliy made a nice codex for them...even if it was an online one.

Father Gabe wrote:This is all nice and well, but Space Marines will probably come out this year and GK will be added as an elite option like the Legion of the Damned...which were a damn waste considering they could have easliy made a nice codex for them...even if it was an online one.

And winner of the least likely outcome is.... Father Gabe! Yay, give him a prize.

It is highly unlikely that they will redo Codex: SM this year just to put GK in it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Archonate wrote:Oh I would laugh so hard if all GKs got was a PDF and some new models...

I'm okay with this actually... As long as it is an updated PDF for WH/DH with aligned points values for vehicles and a couple updates.

Sure I'd love a whole new codex, but a stopgap codex a la BA with a later completely OTT codex is fine too.

Grey Templar wrote:the only reason i will take an inquisitor is if i want an assassin. and that doesn't happen very often and it is almost never worth it.

CaptKaruthors wrote:GK codex looks to be shaping up great. I can't wait to see what they do with assassins and their power level. Right now they are chumps compared to all the unique characters in the game. Assassins should have little problems taking out character targets. That's their whole reason for existing....LOL.

I wouldn't use an Assassin for a tournament, but...

-an Eversor can kill 5 necrons or 6 marines (and thier special weapon) to make his point costs count which is easily done with infiltration/outflank (well, depending on where the cover is set up)
-a Vindicare assassins Hellfire round can easily protect your expensive commander from a sergent with a powerfist and I believe a units worth can be weighed on not only what it kills but what it protects (plus his ability to ignore targeting restrictions allows him to fire into melee!)
-a Celexus assassin was designed to take out Psykers, and boy can he do it, Psykers such as Hive Tyrants
-and of course the Callidus assassin can move an enemy unit out in the open which is awesome if you planned to move something important into the firing arc of something really shooty. or my favorite, use an IG Psyker Battle Squads 'Weaken Resolve' ability (while protected in a Chimera) so I can sumarily hit them with the Neural Shredder which means I can wound 2+, instant death and AP 1 any squad in the game (I personally don't use Instant Death though)

but like I said, I woundn't use them in a tourney, but love to against the regulars

Ixquic wrote:Like I said in the other thread I really hope that Inquisitors are either eternal warrior or not independent characters. They should not have higher than toughness 3, but at the same time a single imperial guard squad with a powerfist sarge will just pick them out and murder them and a 4+ or 5+ invul isn't going to help much.

technically they're not Independant Characters till thier retinue is destroyed. yeah, they're not as powerful but I've taken out more than a fare chunk from the enemy with an Inquisitor, like my Inquisitor Lords (110 points) first trophy kill (made in his first deployment) of the Parasite of Mortrex (160 points STR 6) even after my whole squad was downed

Lotet wrote:technically they're not Independant Characters till thier retinue is destroyed. yeah, they're not as powerful but I've taken out more than a fare chunk from the enemy with an Inquisitor, like my Inquisitor Lords (110 points) first trophy kill (made in his first deployment) of the Parasite of Mortrex (160 points STR 6) even after my whole squad was downed

I was actually quite pleased with my Inquisitor. At 'AB I ran a OH Inq with 2xWar with PG, 2xSage, Bolter-Stake,CCW, Divine Pro and Hood.

I shot up a bunch of stuff (although the Stake didn't work out, oh well) and he held against all sorts of things that he shouldn't have. With 3 wounds, auto-pass morale and WS5, people constantly underestimated him and he tarpitted them. Heck, I underestimated him. I thought he'd die to the first stiff breeze.

Edit: Going back, I would probably trade the Divine Pro for Hammerhand and a Crusader hench. Would have been awesome to have high Str (even no PW) and an Invul/PW in the squad.

pretre wrote:I was actually quite pleased with my Inquisitor. At 'AB I ran a OH Inq with 2xWar with PG, 2xSage, Bolter-Stake,CCW, Divine Pro and Hood.

I shot up a bunch of stuff (although the Stake didn't work out, oh well) and he held against all sorts of things that he shouldn't have. With 3 wounds, auto-pass morale and WS5, people constantly underestimated him and he tarpitted them. Heck, I underestimated him. I thought he'd die to the first stiff breeze.

Edit: Going back, I would probably trade the Divine Pro for Hammerhand and a Crusader hench. Would have been awesome to have high Str (even no PW) and an Invul/PW in the squad.

that reminds me of my DH Inquisitor (the garden variety, not the Lord) who was decked out for some serious splashing. an incinerator and holocaust saw off a full squad of termagaunts. because you know how with the new rules a fearless unit suffers from being over run when beaten and all those gaunts were so nice to huddle around my Inquisitor for the upcoming Holocaust, well, it worked out better than I could have hoped with the Inquisitor suffering no damage with his Sv 2+

I eagerly await to see how much of this is true, daemon hunters was my 2nd army and I'd like to bring them up again.

Kroothawk wrote:Nobody is forced to play an Inquisitor in a WH army, personally I like a good Inquisitor retinue to add flavor and diversity to my army (and the assassins).
But COdex discussion should not focus on how to reduce options for WH, but to enhance them.

Yes. Enhance them by focusing on Sisters, expanding the Sisters to the point of being equal in size on their own to the level of a fifth edition codex. WITHOUT counting any Inquisitorial units.

Screw the Inquisition, I just want to play Sisters like back in second edition.

The funny thing is, with a little imagination the Inqusitior/Henchman dynamic could be the next evolution of the current 'Special Characters make army variants' doctrine.

A 'normal' GK or SOBarmy is, well, a GK or SoB army. Commander is a Grand master/Canoness type as we can see in the current books.

Or, the army could be built around an Inquisitor. The base Inquisitor gets powers, is good in combat, etc. The minions may have some combat ability and some light special powers, but they primarily unlock other options.

Want Guard Allies? take a Commisar Henchman who allows Guard Squads as troop choices or something.

Want Sisters? The Sister Famulous (Or whatever it was) from the old 3rd edition SoB list returns, now as the liason between the Inquisition and the SoB.

Want Grey Knights? A similar GK type.

Same for other things. This would probably work best if GW was doing big books and was combining everything, or at least a separate 'Codex: Inquisition' but it could probably be done in the existing books. Some other interesting Henchman ideas might work for Inquisition-focused lists by adding to the 'religious nutter' aspects or boosting the Stormtroopers:

"Master of the Fleets": Allows orbital strikes.
"Adeptus Mechanicus Liason" Allows for penitent engines and mechanising Stormtroopers. Maybe even Stormtroopers on bikes or in flyers.

And the non-unlocking ones:
Melee Fighter
Ranged Fighter
Penitent Psyker (Anti-psyker defense)
Healer

Melissia wrote:

Kroothawk wrote:Nobody is forced to play an Inquisitor in a WH army, personally I like a good Inquisitor retinue to add flavor and diversity to my army (and the assassins).
But COdex discussion should not focus on how to reduce options for WH, but to enhance them.

Yes. Enhance them by focusing on Sisters, expanding the Sisters to the point of being equal in size on their own to the level of a fifth edition codex. WITHOUT counting any Inquisitorial units.

Screw the Inquisition, I just want to play Sisters like back in second edition.

Sisters back in 2nd had Ecclesiarchy and Frateris.

As I said in the fluff thread, you cannot make a Sisters only codex without doing one of two things.
1) Boring Sisters. (i.e. 9 units total not counting Ded Trans)
2) MarinesLite or FemMarines. Standard Sisters plus ScoutSisters, TermSisters, VanguardSisters, SternguardSisters, etc.

Sisters are very niche in the fluff. I could be wrong though. Maybe someone has an idea for additional units that fit the theme of Sisters, are not just SM ripoffs and do not include Ecclesiarchy or Inquisition.

Prove me wrong GW. Otherwise, give me Ordo Hereticus, Ecclesiarchy and Sisters together.

pretre wrote:Sisters back in 2nd had Ecclesiarchy and Frateris.

And your point is? Oh wait you don't have one, as the Frateris Militia aren't part of the Inquisition.

As I said in the fluff thread, you cannot make a Sisters only codex without doing one of two things.

I do believe you are hilariously wrong.

Melissia wrote:

pretre wrote:Sisters back in 2nd had Ecclesiarchy and Frateris.

And your point is? Oh wait you don't have one, as the Frateris Militia aren't part of the Inquisition.

As I said in the fluff thread, you cannot make a Sisters only codex without doing one of two things.

I do believe you are hilariously wrong.

FM aren't Inq, but their not pure Sisters.

Your fandex isn't pure Sisters either.

So your point?

Pretre just cause some people can't think of a way to do it doesn't mean other people (or GW) can't.