Why I dislike Tau!

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**Asherian Command**

I dislike the Tau alot.... Hence why I have at least 20 dead tau warriors in my warrior. As My friend plays them and every time I play that one squad. He is brushed with anger. And I destroy, leaving nothing behind but his dead devilfishes.
Anyway the Tau are a young but agnorant race as The AI one day will betray them as it did humanity and every other race that has ever made AI. (necrons do not count as an AI)

AI's have a habit of turning on their creators, especially when they become self aware. Hence why so many of the Imperium banned it because the Iron Men caused the Dark Age of Humanity, Hence their hate for all Technology, I would be too if it almost annihilated your entire species.

**KamikazeCanuck**

IvanTih wrote:
SanguinaryGuard wrote:Tau is gay because their plasmas dont overheat. The Imperium needs that gak

Plasma weapons generally overheat only on higher settings,lower settings are usually used.

if by "usually" you mean "never".

**xXSir MontyXx**

The Tau IMO are just naive, ive said it before I know and Im saying it again. NAIVE. They think they can come of their rock and clean up the galaxy without knowing anything about what theyre cleaning up? Seriously, trying to make an alliance with ork's when what you want to do is "for the greater good". My god even a blind man could see this universe is beyond repair! The only way that there will be no fightning is if there are no more intelligent beings. Not even one, cuz then theres civil war. There is no "greater good". In a quote we all know; "In the grim darkness of the far future there is only war". If the Tau continue their goody good little quest on galactic flowers and teddy bears they will be the first to die out.

**Ledabot**

Ok. thats just sad. GW should have at least tryed not to look bad

**Retribution**

xXSir MontyXx wrote:
about the production. You could say that IoM has Economies of scale on there side. that is, as more is produced, the cheeper it is do produce more. they dont have production anyware on the same scale. Tau i think went for the, lets serply or small number of troops with good guns as aposed to lets supply our large numbr of troops with no so good weapons.

Its good that the Tau can do this though, good for them. As far as winning a full scale war with another race except MAYBE Eldar, I will always have to side with the opponent of the Tau for pure logic.

Would make sense...you know...if you ignore all the fluff of them...winning

**JDM**

Mordoskul wrote:You make a good point. In six thousand years (humans took 10k to reach our current level of tech) how do a bunch of backwards savages rise to the top of the tech tree?

Because the Tau are not held back by religon, unlilke humans. As true as this is, history wise, it is also true in the 40kverse. That is the reson it looks all dark and gothic. People are going to flip, but I think the UNSC, ONI, Navicom,etc, etc, etc, are more advanced than the Imperium of MAN. Not SM. In one BL book it made refrence to computers and Tech Heritcle, where as computers and the internet have a strong presence in the Halo Series. The Cole Proticale data file is downloaded via the internet, so yeah.
The Tau are moved by their unfaltering faith in the idea of the Greater Good, which is what pushes them forward.

So Yeah.........,

**xXSir MontyXx**

Would make sense...you know...if you ignore all the fluff of them...winning

from wat, their codex?

even if you got that info from somewhere else im not talking skirmishes, im talking full crusade scale invasion, something along those lines. Not the leftovers of a hive fleet or isolated world, even if im blatantly wrong they are still inaive on multiple occasions

**Retribution**

xXSir MontyXx wrote:
Would make sense...you know...if you ignore all the fluff of them...winning

from wat, their codex?

even if you got that info from somewhere else im not talking skirmishes, im talking full crusade scale invasion, something along those lines. Not the leftovers of a hive fleet or isolated world, even if im blatantly wrong they are still inaive on multiple occasions

So what if it is; a codex is the first source for fluff, no?

Taros Campaign, a complete victory
Damocles Crusade, which i would consider it a Tau victory given their ability to stall a full-on imperial crusade for so long they just gave up
Shadowsun wiping out an entire splinter fleet without losing a single ship (pretty mary-sue, but it's official)

Granted, Tau battle fluff is veryyy lite, but what're we gonna do until they update the 'dex?

**xXSir MontyXx**

So what if it is; a codex is the first source for fluff, no?

Taros Campaign, a complete victory
Damocles Crusade, which i would consider it a Tau victory given their ability to stall a full-on imperial crusade for so long they just gave up
Shadowsun wiping out an entire splinter fleet without losing a single ship (pretty mary-sue, but it's official)

Granted, Tau battle fluff is veryyy lite, but what're we gonna do until they update the 'dex?

because codex's highlight only good points for their army, ur not gonna go buy a twenty dollar book to have it say, "oh well the Tau are cool I guess but if other races got tired of them they wouldnt stand a chance."

come on man, my nid codex told of nothing but flawless victory until the end, so if I went only by my codex the tyranid only lost one battle to lose the entire hive fleet? no. It doesnt tell of all the hive fleets still being hunted down and killed. or the sure losses they are suffering to the orks. There are victories but lots of loss to. I dont ave the new 'nid dex but im sure it only has good points for 'nids in it.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Not to mention they have almost zero defensive know-how. If the tyranid were to come into their empire FULL FORCE not just splinter fleets, they would be very hard pressed to repel them. They get attacked they dismantle their tech and leave to attack later. Problem is that when they leave a world for 'nid theres nothing to come back to. They would have to beat them in space and I dont think the Tau have the numbers to halt a full hive fleet, even with their naval prowess.

**Ledabot**

On the chart showing the space that the tau empire controls shows that the area is about 12 light years radius. the tau must have some very dencely populated worlds. they would need meny fire warrors to take out a hive fleet. They must have some very good ways of reproducing colonests so that the worlds "fill up" quickly.

**Kilkrazy**

xXSir MontyXx wrote:
Back back back, back back!

Sry was that to far? My bad, still learning the ropes

Sry wont happen again, except the other one I have on this thread after that one, I apologize for that to.

I was just being an alien for a moment. Nothing to worry about.

**xXSir MontyXx**

haha awesome thanks

**Ledabot**

We come in pease. please do not run away.

**Sgt_Scruffy**

So it seems the Tau haters here hate tau because the imperium or tyranids haven't wiped them out yet. Yet there are a multitude of minor races that have not been wiped out.

Why? Because it would be boring. If the only stipulation for races that should be allowed to exist is that they must fit some arbitrary scale of power, then I move that all races except Necrons, Orks, and Tyranids be removed from the game as they are the strongest.

The Tau exist because the Imperium doesn't have the resources to fully commit to destroying them. At last count we have major wars happening all over the imperium including, but no means limited to:

War for Armageddon
13th Black Crusade
Waagh whatever on Ryza
Leviathan containment operations
Kraken Splinter Fleets
Hive Fleet Jormungandr
Numerous Ork Waaghs in progress
M'kanda(sp?) the Reborn bearing down on Baal

Not to mention the literally thousands of other campaigns being waged across the Imperium. Attacking a concentrated grouping of worlds held by a highly professional and competent army that is dug in, fortified, and rapidly subverting Imperial Citizens to fight for them is not an easy matter.

Taros: 6-8 IG regiments, 2 full Space Marine companies, demi-scout titan legion backed up by a fairly substantial fleet. Result: defeat.

Damocles Gulf: Titan Legion, several regiments of Brimlock Dragoons, Scythes of the Emperor. Result: stalemate and eventual retreat.

Third Shere of Expansion: take several dozen worlds (IIRC) followed by quite substantial counter-attack. Some worlds retaken, others not.

Hive Fleet Gorgon (Tyranid Fluff, not Tau): Not a splinter fleet but a hive fleet in it's own right. Killed by the Tau. Yes, the IG were there but the outcome was not in doubt by that point.

Everyone can say what they want about the Imperium outnumbering the Tau a million to one. It's true. Doesn't matter. Imperium has bigger fish to fry and in the meantime, the Tau will take advantage.

Damocles Gulf Crusade: 742.M41 Tau first encounter titan class weapons. Tau fleet mauled by Imperial Crusade Fleet. Considered a disaster by the Air Caste

Taros Campaign: 998.M41 Tau begin fielding anti-titan aircraft in the AX 1-0 Tiger Shark. Naval fleet gives a better account of itself but is still ultimately defeated by the combined Space Marine/Imperial Navy fleet.

that's two and a half centuries of research and development yet both the Tigershark and the new classes of Tau warships are both noted as being "test beds" or "experimental" units. 250 years of concentrated research doesn't seem very Mary Sue to me - not when the Tau Empire lack the stagnation and beauracracy of the IoM.

**xXSir MontyXx**

So it seems the Tau haters here hate tau because the imperium or tyranids haven't wiped them out yet. Yet there are a multitude of minor races that have not been wiped out.

Why? Because it would be boring. If the only stipulation for races that should be allowed to exist is that they must fit some arbitrary scale of power, then I move that all races except Necrons, Orks, and Tyranids be removed from the game as they are the strongest.

The Tau exist because the Imperium doesn't have the resources to fully commit to destroying them. At last count we have major wars happening all over the imperium including, but no means limited to:

War for Armageddon
13th Black Crusade
Waagh whatever on Ryza
Leviathan containment operations
Kraken Splinter Fleets
Hive Fleet Jormungandr
Numerous Ork Waaghs in progress
M'kanda(sp?) the Reborn bearing down on Baal

Not to mention the literally thousands of other campaigns being waged across the Imperium. Attacking a concentrated grouping of worlds held by a highly professional and competent army that is dug in, fortified, and rapidly subverting Imperial Citizens to fight for them is not an easy matter.

Taros: 6-8 IG regiments, 2 full Space Marine companies, demi-scout titan legion backed up by a fairly substantial fleet. Result: defeat.

Damocles Gulf: Titan Legion, several regiments of Brimlock Dragoons, Scythes of the Emperor. Result: stalemate and eventual retreat.

Third Shere of Expansion: take several dozen worlds (IIRC) followed by quite substantial counter-attack. Some worlds retaken, others not.

Hive Fleet Gorgon (Tyranid Fluff, not Tau): Not a splinter fleet but a hive fleet in it's own right. Killed by the Tau. Yes, the IG were there but the outcome was not in doubt by that point.

Everyone can say what they want about the Imperium outnumbering the Tau a million to one. It's true. Doesn't matter. Imperium has bigger fish to fry and in the meantime, the Tau will take advantage.

Damocles Gulf Crusade: 742.M41 Tau first encounter titan class weapons. Tau fleet mauled by Imperial Crusade Fleet. Considered a disaster by the Air Caste

Taros Campaign: 998.M41 Tau begin fielding anti-titan aircraft in the AX 1-0 Tiger Shark. Naval fleet gives a better account of itself but is still ultimately defeated by the combined Space Marine/Imperial Navy fleet.

that's two and a half centuries of research and development yet both the Tigershark and the new classes of Tau warships are both noted as being "test beds" or "experimental" units. 250 years of concentrated research doesn't seem very Mary Sue to me - not when the Tau Empire lack the stagnation and beauracracy of the IoM.

haha no my friend, I dislike Tau because they are naive, If I hated all races not wiped out by the IoM or Tyranid I would be a shallow minded idiot. What would be the point???

no, I dislike the Tau for the simple fact that they come into the picture thinking they are the sould good race in the universe. (Self quote ahead)

Automatically Appended Next Post:

The Tau IMO are just naive, ive said it before I know and Im saying it again. NAIVE. They think they can come of their rock and clean up the galaxy without knowing anything about what theyre cleaning up? Seriously, trying to make an alliance with ork's when what you want to do is "for the greater good". My god even a blind man could see this universe is beyond repair! The only way that there will be no fightning is if there are no more intelligent beings. Not even one, cuz then theres civil war. There is no "greater good". In a quote we all know; "In the grim darkness of the far future there is only war". If the Tau continue their goody good little quest on galactic flowers and teddy bears they will be the first to die out.

**asimo77**

I think their naivety is their most endearing and appealing aspect. As a friend once described: they are the "I'm twelve years old and what is this" meme of the 40k universe. If that kid had a railgun strapped to his head.

Plus all that makes for great stories, like Necron Party 2: Electric Boogaloo.

**Kroothawk**

Grey Templar wrote:sorry, but the stuff i said is in the fluff.
naturally the T'au codex won't say anything bad about them.

Then give exact quotes, but your second sentences is a good sign that you can't give a credible source that negates Codex and expressed designers' will.

BTW the sterilization nonsense comes from a non-GW PC game and the speculation by an Imperial narrator, why men and women not living together might not get children (ask Mom and Dad about it

). It is the third likeliest explanation even by him, taking place in a parallel 40k universe that definitely doesn't happen in the official 40k background, as the PC game structure had to present versions for every race winning. And even this non-GW alternative 40k universe speculated PC version was very far from the "when a planet is conquored they immediatly Sterilize all disenting individuals so only those who are loyal to the T'au empire can reproduce", that you presented as fact.

I am in the process of reading Courage and Honour (up to now a really bad novel), written by a man who let's an Eldar Avatar be choked to death while it doesn't even breath (in Fulgrim), just to show how UEBER Space marines are.

**nosferatu1001**

Ivan - nothing you posted alters that a) your assertion that IoM has "superior plasma tech" is plain *wrong*, or that b) the IoM is slowly regressing.

Your low, medium, high numbers have no basis. You also assume zero losses since heresy....unlikely, given how many were destroyed in the heresy itself.

Face it: the IoM IS REGRESSING. It has no choice otherwise - when you have rigid, religious control over technology, and have to repress your ciitizens in the way they do, no true innovation can take place.

AS to the Machine Spirit = AI - not at all. MS is an element of the Emperor, in machine form. Or its the void dragon. It's also bits and pieces of everyone who has connected via MIU, with the more you connect / longer you connect the more is stored / uploaded / integrated. It doesnt appear to be "true" AI, even in the biggest machines - see the souldrinkers old mechanicus explorator fleet - the MS in there really doesnt sound like an AI, not cmopared to say Minds (IM Banks, Culture novels) anyway.

**Retribution**

xXSir MontyXx wrote:
So what if it is; a codex is the first source for fluff, no?

Taros Campaign, a complete victory
Damocles Crusade, which i would consider it a Tau victory given their ability to stall a full-on imperial crusade for so long they just gave up
Shadowsun wiping out an entire splinter fleet without losing a single ship (pretty mary-sue, but it's official)

Granted, Tau battle fluff is veryyy lite, but what're we gonna do until they update the 'dex?

because codex's highlight only good points for their army, ur not gonna go buy a twenty dollar book to have it say, "oh well the Tau are cool I guess but if other races got tired of them they wouldnt stand a chance."

come on man, my nid codex told of nothing but flawless victory until the end, so if I went only by my codex the tyranid only lost one battle to lose the entire hive fleet? no. It doesnt tell of all the hive fleets still being hunted down and killed. or the sure losses they are suffering to the orks. There are victories but lots of loss to. I dont ave the new 'nid dex but im sure it only has good points for 'nids in it.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Not to mention they have almost zero defensive know-how. If the tyranid were to come into their empire FULL FORCE not just splinter fleets, they would be very hard pressed to repel them. They get attacked they dismantle their tech and leave to attack later. Problem is that when they leave a world for 'nid theres nothing to come back to. They would have to beat them in space and I dont think the Tau have the numbers to halt a full hive fleet, even with their naval prowess.

So you're logic says...let's just disregard fluff...right?

And if the 'Nids attacked ANYONE in full force they would be "hard pressed" to repel it; you're argument is ignorance

**Asherian Command**

OK who here hates small races? No one
One race that I really like are the shapeshifters.

**punkow**

Are you ok

Absolutely no!!!
Have you ever seen someone grown up in the Imperium sane??

**IvanTih**

GalacticDefender wrote:@xxSir
Excuse me,IOM has better plasma weaponry,better broadsides on ships(besides Tau suck in BFG) and they also have railguns.The biggest Tau fanboy is Andy Hoare who wrote fluff for Deathwatch RPG and those pile of shi* Rogue Trader novels(Tau wan* isn't his only sin,he also makes combat ranges extremly short and which are hundreds of kilometres while every other source tells us tens of thousand kilometres or more,he also ignores the fact that Imperium has railguns).

No, the Tau have better Broadsides!

**Frazzled**

IvanTih wrote:My small rant.

You know what is "so utterly ridiculous as to not merely strain credibility, but throw it to the ground, stomp on it, and then put it through the shredder for good measure"? That a civilization can go from cavemen to matching the elder species of 40k in a mere six thousand years. Here's a hint, it took humans tens of millenia to reach this point.

The Tau could have pulled it off if they displayed levels of competence that would make the Moties look like a bunch of slowed children, but their technology has stagnated for centuries, too.

THAT is why I despise the Tau. Their very existence is an affront to logic and common sense.

I also hate Tau fanboys that state that Tau are more advanced than Imperium which they are not.

6000 years is roughly 3500 BC to 2500 AD. Frankly, they're a bit slow, compared to those bipedal monkey boys.

BFG: Tau ships are noted as being substantially less advanced than Imperium ships. Their best ships are just now getting to cruiser strength.
40K: Definitely not more advanced, just advanced.
Compare them to mech IG
-better plasma tech (plasma cannons)
-better long range antitank (vanquisher superior, Tau Tank inferior)
-better short range special weapons (melta guns) and crew served weapons.
-better tanks (punisher)
-better aircraft/landers (Valkyrie superior, Tau craft inferior)

Compare them to the Chicks with Sticks which are arguably more in line with technologically advanced troops.
-Exorcists - so choice
-Melta weaponry
-standard bolter equivalent to Tau small arms.
-better troop armor and BS due to technology.

**agnosto**

Frazzled wrote:-better aircraft/landers (Valkyrie superior, Tau craft inferior)

Not going to argue on the tech stuff; different doesn't always mean better. Railguns are hands-down the most efficient, ranged tank killers in the game. Combine a railgun with a cheap wargear that turns your tank into a fires as fast vehicle with a built-in 4+ invulnerable....yeah IG tanks are not as nice. Anecdotally, I've offed 3 IG tanks in 1 turn with a squad of broadsides and a hammerhead.

Now, the aircraft. Have you not seen a Manta? Here, take a look:

We're talking about something that kills titans and carries an entire army in the cargo hold. Yeah, you can have your thunderhawk.

**Mr Nobody**

Aircraft are also more logically sound than titans, a flying target is better than a walking taget.

**IvanTih**

Yeah they need a small space ship to kill a Titan really shows us how powerful are their ships(in a negative way).

**agnosto**

IvanTih wrote:Yeah they need a small space ship to kill a Titan really shows us how powerful are their ships(in a negative way).

Actually it's just a difference in combat tactics. The entire combat philosophy of the Tau (fluff and army composition-wise) is the whole "stick and 'git" philosophy; don't maintain a battlefield presence when you can cause the damage and leave before your enemy is able to retaliate.

**Mr Nobody**

The tau have giant ships, instead of giant robots.

**Frazzled**

****Not going to argue on the tech stuff; different doesn't always mean better. Railguns are hands-down the most efficient, ranged tank killers in the game.
No way Jose. Vanq: Str 8 2d6. railgun Str 10. how is that better?

***Combine a railgun with a cheap wargear that turns your tank into a fires as fast vehicle with a built-in 4+ invulnerable....yeah IG tanks are not as nice. Anecdotally, I've offed 3 IG tanks in 1 turn with a squad of broadsides and a hammerhead.
Cover save is a function of V5.
Armor 14 with similar cover save most times.
And yea I've run through a whole wing of crisis suits with a pissed off obliterator, not sure what your point was.

***Now, the aircraft. Have you not seen a Manta? Here, take a look:

Manta is a super heavy/BFG craft. I'll see your manta and raise you a Warlord Titan, or BFG bomber (note I like Tau super heavies).
In other news my eldar remind me to note: Mantas drool, Revenant Titan rules.

****We're talking about something that kills titans and carries an entire army in the cargo hold. Yeah, you can have your thunderhawk.
They're pretty equivalent actually. Again my eldar remind me that none of these vehicles are fit to carry a good bourdeaux. If you're going to fly in style you have to fly Air Vampire.

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer-40000/ELDAR-VAMPIRE-RAIDER.html

**IvanTih**

From what I rememer IoM also has space fighters(some are 200m or even more long) which are quite frankly good anti-titan force.