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you take everything as separate points


dogs outside bark, and if someone shoots my dogs outside, I'm pretty sure the gunshot would get the cops called by every neighbor.

so I would be awake, and grab my gun, load it and start stalking in inside of my home. I have 2 doors, so not hard to cover them. Since doors are deadbolted they would have to come in a window, making my job even easier.


given all this, the crook would just leave, home invasion isn't worth dying over. I also live with 3 other guys, so we have a small assault force here.

DIDM wrote:first off the dogs would have scared them off as soon as they got in the yard, that is what they are there for. Then the house dog would go nuts waking everyone up. We don't have real guns, but we do have frozen paintballs, and if you have ever gotten hit with one of them at close range you understand that it can hurt worse than a real bullet. We also have a bat at every door, but the dogs do their job, and we hopefully will never have do deal with a home invasion.

Sadly dogs only keep some of them away, it's really easy to take care of a dog if your robbing some place that's one of my biggest concerns is someone kills my dogs while I'm out of the house to rob the house, I don't care so much for the stuff but their like my kids.

Sckitzo wrote:The best advice I have is if you do injure or kill someone breaking into your home, don't tell the cops , be polite and respectful, just state that your really shaken up and would prefer to talk to a lawyer first.

Officer, you were there after the victim was shot, what did the defendant say to you?
"He said he was really shaken up."
In your experience, do people who are "really shaken up" exhibit rational behavior when handling firearms?
"No."
If the defendant wasn't rational, would you say that the defendant acted out of a rational fear that his life was threatened?
"No."
Thank you officer, I have no further questions.

The proper response when dealing with police is "I do not consent to a search, I'm not answering any questions, I want a lawyer."

biccat wrote:

Sckitzo wrote:The best advice I have is if you do injure or kill someone breaking into your home, don't tell the cops , be polite and respectful, just state that your really shaken up and would prefer to talk to a lawyer first.

Officer, you were there after the victim was shot, what did the defendant say to you?
"He said he was really shaken up."
In your experience, do people who are "really shaken up" exhibit rational behavior when handling firearms?
"No."
If the defendant wasn't rational, would you say that the defendant acted out of a rational fear that his life was threatened?
"No."
Thank you officer, I have no further questions.

The proper response when dealing with police is "I do not consent to a search, I'm not answering any questions, I want a lawyer."

Massad Ayoob wrote:
1. Call 911
2. Officer this person attacked me, I will sign the complaint,
3. Officer here is the evidence (knife, gun, ball bat, whatever).
4. Officer these are the witnesses.
5. Officer you will have my full cooperation in 24 hrs after I see my attorney.

This is also why I have a card with the Texas Law Shield phone number and states on the back of it that I have invoked my 4th, 5th, and 6th amendment rights.

Sckitzo wrote:

DIDM wrote:first off the dogs would have scared them off as soon as they got in the yard, that is what they are there for. Then the house dog would go nuts waking everyone up. We don't have real guns, but we do have frozen paintballs, and if you have ever gotten hit with one of them at close range you understand that it can hurt worse than a real bullet. We also have a bat at every door, but the dogs do their job, and we hopefully will never have do deal with a home invasion.

Sadly dogs only keep some of them away, it's really easy to take care of a dog if your robbing some place that's one of my biggest concerns is someone kills my dogs while I'm out of the house to rob the house, I don't care so much for the stuff but their like my kids.

luckily I live in a city where I am 99.9% sure I will never have a home invasion. But the thread was what is my plan for one, and that is mine. I have 2 large dogs that live in my yard, and a heeler that lives inside. They may not kill the intruder, but they will at least alert me to someone coming. My dog inside thinks he is huge and the only guard dog in the house. He knows the minute anyone is in the yard, friend or foe, and he goes nuts till he sees who it is.

and sadly enough, all I would have to do is call 911 and a cop would be here in seconds, and they would shoot the intruder, with a real gun.


I live in a medical state, so patients are protected by the police. homes with cards attached are potential targets for thieves, and the cops have our backs. Being a white male in my 30's is about as safe as you can get in the city of Portland.

but seriously, have you ever had a frozen paintball shot at you? when you are shot with a real gun shock sets in and you feel nothing for a while, but frozen paint in a hard ball is just god awful. I would also aim for crucial areas, neck, lungs and crotch.

crotch?

you are evil.

when you are shot with a real gun shock sets in and you feel nothing for a while

With a real firearm and a competent shot you can replace the word "While" with "Ever" ...generally speaking.

It's different firing at a moving, hostile target while disoriented than a target at a firing range.

In self defense... best choice is center of mass, three rounds rapid. No trick shots. Put some rounds in his chest until he stops moving.

I agree with M.

I'd probably get sued for excessive use of force. All of the training I've been through teaches two to the chest, one to the head.

Nocturn wrote:I'd probably get sued for excessive use of force. All of the training I've been through teaches two to the chest, one to the head.

Waste of Bullets. One to the chest, one to the head.

/armchairsurvivalistpseudobs

DIDM wrote:you take everything as separate points


dogs outside bark, and if someone shoots my dogs outside, I'm pretty sure the gunshot would get the cops called by every neighbor.

so I would be awake, and grab my gun, load it and start stalking in inside of my home. I have 2 doors, so not hard to cover them. Since doors are deadbolted they would have to come in a window, making my job even easier.


given all this, the crook would just leave, home invasion isn't worth dying over. I also live with 3 other guys, so we have a small assault force here.

Just because a door is deadbolted, doesn't mean it's invincible. They can still be kicked in, it's just harder.

You're also making the assumption that the person invading your home is rational.
What if he's poor and is forced to steal for a living?
What if he's a meth/crack head, too high to care?
What if he has some sort of grudge against you and only wants to hurt you?

Expect the worst and hope for the best.

Right. I'm gonna treat anyone who invades my home as a potential serial rapist, which means it's a kill or be killed situation for me...

Just pray they arnt hopped up on meth or something. Im tellin ya, those mother fethers are HARD to put down. Years ago, I worked at a local Target. And this guy started bolting for the doors, and 3 security guards came from no where and tackled the guy. Now this fella could only of been 110pounds and thats being generous, 2 guards were average size/build, the 3rd looked like a blocker in football. They struggled to hold him down big time, he was actually getting away. So myself and my buddy Ben, we are about the same size/build jumped over to help them. I had his legs, and Ben was smashing the dudes face into the ground, and it still took all 5 of us to subdue him and get him cuffed.

It was just insane, and Ive heard police stories where theyve had to open fire on drugged out crooks and it took many rounds to phase them

I've got about three knives in my room, and one of which is sharp enough to shave with (bad idea).
You really don't want to feth with me. I have a banana tree in my back yard, and there's a machete in my garage that I use to cut down the bunches.

I have a samurai sword on display but it's easy to miss if your not looking for it. but that doesn't matter when your dropping furniture onto your bugler.

KingCracker wrote:Just pray they arnt hopped up on meth or something. Im tellin ya, those mother fethers are HARD to put down. Years ago, I worked at a local Target. And this guy started bolting for the doors, and 3 security guards came from no where and tackled the guy. Now this fella could only of been 110pounds and thats being generous, 2 guards were average size/build, the 3rd looked like a blocker in football. They struggled to hold him down big time, he was actually getting away. So myself and my buddy Ben, we are about the same size/build jumped over to help them. I had his legs, and Ben was smashing the dudes face into the ground, and it still took all 5 of us to subdue him and get him cuffed.

It was just insane, and Ive heard police stories where theyve had to open fire on drugged out crooks and it took many rounds to phase them

id always heard that but assumed that sorta thing was urban myth good thing meth hasnt really hit ireland yet, all the waens are all jumped up on super glue or vodka and orange juice

I have rigged all of the floors in my house on a hinge, they are activated by a secret button. When I press the button, they drop, sending everything not nailed down(people and zombies) into an incinerator in my basement. This takes care of burglars, and house guests.

No evidence.....

assultmarine wrote:

KingCracker wrote:Just pray they arnt hopped up on meth or something. Im tellin ya, those mother fethers are HARD to put down. Years ago, I worked at a local Target. And this guy started bolting for the doors, and 3 security guards came from no where and tackled the guy. Now this fella could only of been 110pounds and thats being generous, 2 guards were average size/build, the 3rd looked like a blocker in football. They struggled to hold him down big time, he was actually getting away. So myself and my buddy Ben, we are about the same size/build jumped over to help them. I had his legs, and Ben was smashing the dudes face into the ground, and it still took all 5 of us to subdue him and get him cuffed.

It was just insane, and Ive heard police stories where theyve had to open fire on drugged out crooks and it took many rounds to phase them

id always heard that but assumed that sorta thing was urban myth good thing meth hasnt really hit ireland yet, all the waens are all jumped up on super glue or vodka and orange juice

No myth lol, they are like super humans when all hopped up. Its friggin crazy. If you were to take on yourself, 1 of you was normal, and the other all juiced up, the normal you would be trounced

I take a glass of water from my nightstand. Then I rise from my bed and escort my drunken brother to bed.

12thRonin wrote:+1 to about all Frazz said. Unless you train for Israeli carry or practice loading every time you pick it up, keeping an unloaded gun is next to useless. In a panic situation, you revert to whatever training you have and if you're not used to picking it up and racking it all you are going to hear is the loudest sound a gun can make. That's the click of nothing happening when you pull the trigger. And yes, it's going to be a panic situation and introduces one more thing that can go wrong in an already bad situation.

So someone too befuddled in the middle of night to load a gun is going to be okay to shoot straight?

Really, anyone owning a gun should get used to handling it so that's it's still second nature in a panic, this is why military people are better trusted with weapons than civilians. You don't want one of your few times handling a gun to be when someone breaks into your house in the middle of the night.

This article is very interesting and contains heaps of figures on the subject, I don't expect some of the more gung-ho members to read their way through but it's addresses a lot of issues and isn't that long.
http://ajl.sagepub.com/content/early/2011/02/01/1559827610396294.full.pdf
A few quotes but that doesn't really reflect the wider article.

However, it is important to recognize that the home is a relatively safe place, especially from strangers. For example, fewer than 30% of burglaries in the United States (2003-2007) occur when someone is at home. In the 7% of burglaries when violence does occur, the burglar is more likely to be an intimate (current or former) and also more likely to be a relative or known acquaintance than a stranger

In the rare instance of a real-world shooting situation, confusion, stress, and fear can become overwhelming. Heart rates skyrocket, and it is difficult to think clearly and act deliberately. This creates 2 major problems for civilians with guns, particularly those who are not well trained. The first is that they may act inappropriately. Indeed, police officers, who receive large amounts of training, are still often inadequately prepared to handle ambiguous but potentially dangerous situations, and they often make serious mistakes. Individuals without practical training do much worse.

The second problem is that the pounding heart, muscle tension, trembling, dizziness, and nausea that may accompany a real-world shooting situation will degrade the owner’s ability not only to use the gun wisely but to use it effectively. Although adrenaline may enhance animal fighting skills and be useful for either flight or fighting, it creates a severe loss in the fine motor coordination needed for the accurate shooting of a handgun as well as the ability to think rationally, reflectively, or creatively.

A study of all gunshot injuries in Galveston, Texas, over a 3-year period found only 2 that were related to residential burglary or robbery. In one, the homeowner was shot and killed by a burglar; in the other, the homeowner shot the burglar. During the same interval, guns in the home were involved in the death and injury of more than 100 residents, family
members, friends, or acquaintances

Home invasion plan=Pull out a 12 gauge, capture the home intruder, knock the intruder unconscious, call up Zed to come on over, and bring out the gimp.

That made me feel a little dirty


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Zed?....Maynard....Looks like the spider caught himself a couple flies

.357 Magnum w/hydrashok, ask questions later.

schadenfreude wrote:Home invasion plan=Pull out a 12 gauge, capture the home intruder, knock the intruder unconscious, call up Zed to come on over, and bring out the gimp.

Howard A Treesong wrote:
So someone too befuddled in the middle of night to load a gun is going to be okay to shoot straight?

It's not about befuddlement, it's about time. Unless you train on doing that, reloading is the worst thing you can do in the middle of a fight. There are so many points of failure involved with loading or reloading a weapon. Shooting straight is easy.

Really, anyone owning a gun should get used to handling it so that's it's still second nature in a panic, this is why military people are better trusted with weapons than civilians. You don't want one of your few times handling a gun to be when someone breaks into your house in the middle of the night.

Actually, they're not. Unless they are deployed, weapons are forbidden on military bases. To the rest of this, I do agree 100% and have said the same thing. And I do train on it, all the time.

This article is very interesting and contains heaps of figures on the subject, I don't expect some of the more gung-ho members to read their way through but it's addresses a lot of issues and isn't that long.
http://ajl.sagepub.com/content/early/2011/02/01/1559827610396294.full.pdf
A few quotes but that doesn't really reflect the wider article.

However, it is important to recognize that the home is a relatively safe place, especially from strangers. For example, fewer than 30% of burglaries in the United States (2003-2007) occur when someone is at home. In the 7% of burglaries when violence does occur, the burglar is more likely to be an intimate (current or former) and also more likely to be a relative or known acquaintance than a stranger

I have read this before actually. The statistics are out of date at this point for this. And to be honest, the identity of the person is irrelevant. This is why you don't let the pizza delivery guy see the inside of your house for the same reason you look for cars that don't belong on your street or "repair people" pulling up to your neighbors when they aren't home.

In the rare instance of a real-world shooting situation, confusion, stress, and fear can become overwhelming. Heart rates skyrocket, and it is difficult to think clearly and act deliberately. This creates 2 major problems for civilians with guns, particularly those who are not well trained. The first is that they may act inappropriately. Indeed, police officers, who receive large amounts of training, are still often inadequately prepared to handle ambiguous but potentially dangerous situations, and they often make serious mistakes. Individuals without practical training do much worse.

The second problem is that the pounding heart, muscle tension, trembling, dizziness, and nausea that may accompany a real-world shooting situation will degrade the owner’s ability not only to use the gun wisely but to use it effectively. Although adrenaline may enhance animal fighting skills and be useful for either flight or fighting, it creates a severe loss in the fine motor coordination needed for the accurate shooting of a handgun as well as the ability to think rationally, reflectively, or creatively.

Your regular patrol officer does not receive any special tactical training with their firearms. They do not get this unless they are in SWAT or other special units like it. To your other point, the same goes for any other weapon or method of self defense. Guess you're saying we shouldn't defend ourselves at all.

Just remember also that when seconds count, the police are minutes away.

A study of all gunshot injuries in Galveston, Texas, over a 3-year period found only 2 that were related to residential burglary or robbery. In one, the homeowner was shot and killed by a burglar; in the other, the homeowner shot the burglar. During the same interval, guns in the home were involved in the death and injury of more than 100 residents, family members, friends, or acquaintances

Cars killed and injured more people in the same period of time. Guess people shouldn't have cars in their home either.

Besides, we're not talking about cat burgler when discussing a home invasion. Home invasions are an different breed of bad.

Lol...



Good luck, ghetto goblins.

biccat wrote:

Sckitzo wrote:The best advice I have is if you do injure or kill someone breaking into your home, don't tell the cops , be polite and respectful, just state that your really shaken up and would prefer to talk to a lawyer first.

Officer, you were there after the victim was shot, what did the defendant say to you?
"He said he was really shaken up."
In your experience, do people who are "really shaken up" exhibit rational behavior when handling firearms?
"No."
If the defendant wasn't rational, would you say that the defendant acted out of a rational fear that his life was threatened?
"No."
Thank you officer, I have no further questions.

The proper response when dealing with police is "I do not consent to a search, I'm not answering any questions, I want a lawyer."

If your not shaken up after shooting someone, you have something wrong going on in the head. You just injured a fellow human, most likely fatally if your cool, calm and collected after that while seemingly indifferent the other lawyer is just going to spin that like your a sociopath. Talk to the cops if you want, but when I was doing joint training with TPD and they specifically told me not to talk to the patrol upon response when the topic came up in conversation I'm going with their advice.


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NuggzTheNinja wrote:Lol...



Good luck, ghetto goblins.

What is that Optic? EoTech? Looks odd for some reason.

hmm, i once saw a MARS sight like it

Sckitzo wrote:
What is that Optic? EoTech? Looks odd for some reason.

It's an IR MARS. It's like an Aimpoint in that it uses a red dot, but has an integrated 850 nm laser (IR, can only be seen with night vision) that zeroes automatically to the point of aim of the red dot.

In other words, you zero the red dot, and your laser is zeroed. Useful, because unless you have a range that will let you turn out the lights and shoot with your night vision, it's going to be hard to zero.

Was originally designed for the IDF's Tavor rifle but works fine on an AR.