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Rimmy wrote:

gorgon wrote:

Rimmy wrote:except once you run out of fuel because they SUCK diesel, it will drift and you'll have no control over it and you'll run aground.

Alcatraz. isloated rock, 12 foot tall walls near 2 feet thick, easily defendable, enough land to grow crops, large city near by to raid if you had to.

as for the water, well, alcatraz has a constant current so if a zombie were to try to walk there they would be swept out into the bay. so highly unlikely they would get there.

more to the point, they aren't undead, they're zombies. they lack the focus to pusth their bodies (this isn't pirates of the carribbean here)

a large ship wouldn't be bad as per, but the long term logistics don't support salvation, just temporary relief.

You ever been to Alcatraz? One of the reasons that Alcatraz shut down was the cost of shipping supplies to the island. That includes fresh water, because there's none on the island. NO FRESH WATER THAT ISN'T A LONGISH BOAT RIDE AWAY. Ponder that.

Here's something specifically on the topic.

http://www.zombiesurvivalwiki.com/page/Alcatraz+Island


Personally, I think these exercises inevitably tend to overrate the need for fortresses and guns and underrate the need for a massive amount of food and supplies.

yes, I have been to Alcatraz. I live near San Francisco. so i'm well versed on the climate in this area (born and raised Bay Area native)

are you familiar with de-salination? have you ever considered removing the salt from the watter in the ocean THAT ITS SITTING IN! its not impossible to make salt water drinkeable you know.

not to mention a constant supply of fish in the ocean and the surrounding wildlife in the area.

and yes, row-boats work just fine on a small crew.

It makes zero sense to me why you'd intentionally make your #1 survival need your biggest challenge. That's just really awful survival strategy to me. Again, the island closed *because of supply issues.* So good luck with that. I'd much rather have a ordinary but well-stocked basement with supply sources nearby in case of emergency.

gorgon wrote:

Rimmy wrote:

gorgon wrote:

Rimmy wrote:except once you run out of fuel because they SUCK diesel, it will drift and you'll have no control over it and you'll run aground.

Alcatraz. isloated rock, 12 foot tall walls near 2 feet thick, easily defendable, enough land to grow crops, large city near by to raid if you had to.

as for the water, well, alcatraz has a constant current so if a zombie were to try to walk there they would be swept out into the bay. so highly unlikely they would get there.

more to the point, they aren't undead, they're zombies. they lack the focus to pusth their bodies (this isn't pirates of the carribbean here)

a large ship wouldn't be bad as per, but the long term logistics don't support salvation, just temporary relief.

You ever been to Alcatraz? One of the reasons that Alcatraz shut down was the cost of shipping supplies to the island. That includes fresh water, because there's none on the island. NO FRESH WATER THAT ISN'T A LONGISH BOAT RIDE AWAY. Ponder that.

Here's something specifically on the topic.

http://www.zombiesurvivalwiki.com/page/Alcatraz+Island


Personally, I think these exercises inevitably tend to overrate the need for fortresses and guns and underrate the need for a massive amount of food and supplies.

yes, I have been to Alcatraz. I live near San Francisco. so i'm well versed on the climate in this area (born and raised Bay Area native)

are you familiar with de-salination? have you ever considered removing the salt from the watter in the ocean THAT ITS SITTING IN! its not impossible to make salt water drinkeable you know.

not to mention a constant supply of fish in the ocean and the surrounding wildlife in the area.

and yes, row-boats work just fine on a small crew.

It makes zero sense to me why you'd intentionally make your #1 survival need your biggest challenge. That's just really awful survival strategy to me. Again, the island closed *because of supply issues.* So good luck with that. I'd much rather have a ordinary but well-stocked basement with supply sources nearby in case of emergency.

Oh, I don't know, I'd rather deal with the desalination process and fishing/foraging than trying to not get eaten in my sleep.

Jakka wrote:

gorgon wrote:

Rimmy wrote:

gorgon wrote:

Rimmy wrote:except once you run out of fuel because they SUCK diesel, it will drift and you'll have no control over it and you'll run aground.

Alcatraz. isloated rock, 12 foot tall walls near 2 feet thick, easily defendable, enough land to grow crops, large city near by to raid if you had to.

as for the water, well, alcatraz has a constant current so if a zombie were to try to walk there they would be swept out into the bay. so highly unlikely they would get there.

more to the point, they aren't undead, they're zombies. they lack the focus to pusth their bodies (this isn't pirates of the carribbean here)

a large ship wouldn't be bad as per, but the long term logistics don't support salvation, just temporary relief.

You ever been to Alcatraz? One of the reasons that Alcatraz shut down was the cost of shipping supplies to the island. That includes fresh water, because there's none on the island. NO FRESH WATER THAT ISN'T A LONGISH BOAT RIDE AWAY. Ponder that.

Here's something specifically on the topic.

http://www.zombiesurvivalwiki.com/page/Alcatraz+Island


Personally, I think these exercises inevitably tend to overrate the need for fortresses and guns and underrate the need for a massive amount of food and supplies.

yes, I have been to Alcatraz. I live near San Francisco. so i'm well versed on the climate in this area (born and raised Bay Area native)

are you familiar with de-salination? have you ever considered removing the salt from the watter in the ocean THAT ITS SITTING IN! its not impossible to make salt water drinkeable you know.

not to mention a constant supply of fish in the ocean and the surrounding wildlife in the area.

and yes, row-boats work just fine on a small crew.

It makes zero sense to me why you'd intentionally make your #1 survival need your biggest challenge. That's just really awful survival strategy to me. Again, the island closed *because of supply issues.* So good luck with that. I'd much rather have a ordinary but well-stocked basement with supply sources nearby in case of emergency.

Oh, I don't know, I'd rather deal with the desalination process and fishing/foraging than trying to not get eaten in my sleep.

THIS!!

survival is survival. the methods and practices don't change no matter where you go, it is what it is.

the difference in the Z day scenario, is dealing with being actively hunted by a predator that does not sleep, never stops, and will not die or go away.

so you're really trying to keep them away, and rebuild. what better than a fortified isolated place to completely eliminate their presence?

to me it makes perfect sense.

lokcing yourself TOO far away from being able to produce food, access to water (or any kind) is just a countdown until you run out and are forced to return.

NOW, take one of those tankers and load op the cargo hold with dirt and farm down there (gotta get sunlight to it) then ya there ya go. self sustaining mobile ground.

good, water, shelter. the very minimum of survival.

add in the risk of now becoming prey, you have to consider defense as a large part of that shelter. for me, its a prison on an island. (a very large one at that)

Alcatraz: abundant food, abundant water, abundant shelter, difficult to get to..... vs (basement )limited food, limited water, limited shelter, single point of egress

seriously, tell me what the flaw is again?

Rimmy wrote:

Jakka wrote:

gorgon wrote:

Rimmy wrote:

gorgon wrote:

Rimmy wrote:except once you run out of fuel because they SUCK diesel, it will drift and you'll have no control over it and you'll run aground.

Alcatraz. isloated rock, 12 foot tall walls near 2 feet thick, easily defendable, enough land to grow crops, large city near by to raid if you had to.

as for the water, well, alcatraz has a constant current so if a zombie were to try to walk there they would be swept out into the bay. so highly unlikely they would get there.

more to the point, they aren't undead, they're zombies. they lack the focus to pusth their bodies (this isn't pirates of the carribbean here)

a large ship wouldn't be bad as per, but the long term logistics don't support salvation, just temporary relief.

You ever been to Alcatraz? One of the reasons that Alcatraz shut down was the cost of shipping supplies to the island. That includes fresh water, because there's none on the island. NO FRESH WATER THAT ISN'T A LONGISH BOAT RIDE AWAY. Ponder that.

Here's something specifically on the topic.

http://www.zombiesurvivalwiki.com/page/Alcatraz+Island


Personally, I think these exercises inevitably tend to overrate the need for fortresses and guns and underrate the need for a massive amount of food and supplies.

yes, I have been to Alcatraz. I live near San Francisco. so i'm well versed on the climate in this area (born and raised Bay Area native)

are you familiar with de-salination? have you ever considered removing the salt from the watter in the ocean THAT ITS SITTING IN! its not impossible to make salt water drinkeable you know.

not to mention a constant supply of fish in the ocean and the surrounding wildlife in the area.

and yes, row-boats work just fine on a small crew.

It makes zero sense to me why you'd intentionally make your #1 survival need your biggest challenge. That's just really awful survival strategy to me. Again, the island closed *because of supply issues.* So good luck with that. I'd much rather have a ordinary but well-stocked basement with supply sources nearby in case of emergency.

Oh, I don't know, I'd rather deal with the desalination process and fishing/foraging than trying to not get eaten in my sleep.

THIS!!

survival is survival. the methods and practices don't change no matter where you go, it is what it is.

the difference in the Z day scenario, is dealing with being actively hunted by a predator that does not sleep, never stops, and will not die or go away.

so you're really trying to keep them away, and rebuild. what better than a fortified isolated place to completely eliminate their presence?

to me it makes perfect sense.

lokcing yourself TOO far away from being able to produce food, access to water (or any kind) is just a countdown until you run out and are forced to return.

NOW, take one of those tankers and load op the cargo hold with dirt and farm down there (gotta get sunlight to it) then ya there ya go. self sustaining mobile ground.

good, water, shelter. the very minimum of survival.

add in the risk of now becoming prey, you have to consider defense as a large part of that shelter. for me, its a prison on an island. (a very large one at that)

Alcatraz: abundant food, abundant water, abundant shelter, difficult to get to..... vs (basement )limited food, limited water, limited shelter, single point of egress

seriously, tell me what the flaw is again?

How are you going to create a working ecosystem on acatraz or a tanker? You will need lots of water (unsalted), and the time to get all the dirt and supplies to make it work. It'll take a few months at best, and how are you going to not get nommed on by zombies? Now, there's two thing I like about alcatraz, and that's the armory and the fact its basically a fortress. The downside is getting it well stocked on non-contaminated supplies, which due to it's isolated nature would be very difficult.

Of course, if you are rich, you could easily do some planning in advance...

CthuluIsSpy wrote:
How are you going to create a working ecosystem on acatraz or a tanker? You will need lots of water (unsalted), and the time to get all the dirt and supplies to make it work. It'll take a few months at best, and how are you going to not get nommed on by zombies? Now, there's two thing I like about alcatraz, and that's the armory and the fact its basically a fortress. The downside is getting it well stocked on non-contaminated supplies, which due to it's isolated nature would be very difficult.

Of course, if you are rich, you could easily do some planning in advance...

The armory? You mean the one in the prison that's been abandoned for almost 50 years?

Jakka wrote:

CthuluIsSpy wrote:
How are you going to create a working ecosystem on acatraz or a tanker? You will need lots of water (unsalted), and the time to get all the dirt and supplies to make it work. It'll take a few months at best, and how are you going to not get nommed on by zombies? Now, there's two thing I like about alcatraz, and that's the armory and the fact its basically a fortress. The downside is getting it well stocked on non-contaminated supplies, which due to it's isolated nature would be very difficult.

Of course, if you are rich, you could easily do some planning in advance...

The armory? You mean the one in the prison that's been abandoned for almost 50 years?

Oh crap, that's right its not in use . Well, there goes Alcatraz as a good safehouse.

CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Jakka wrote:

CthuluIsSpy wrote:
How are you going to create a working ecosystem on acatraz or a tanker? You will need lots of water (unsalted), and the time to get all the dirt and supplies to make it work. It'll take a few months at best, and how are you going to not get nommed on by zombies? Now, there's two thing I like about alcatraz, and that's the armory and the fact its basically a fortress. The downside is getting it well stocked on non-contaminated supplies, which due to it's isolated nature would be very difficult.

Of course, if you are rich, you could easily do some planning in advance...

The armory? You mean the one in the prison that's been abandoned for almost 50 years?

Oh crap, that's right its not in use . Well, there goes Alcatraz as a good safehouse.

nah not for me. it can be done.

there are plenty of LARGE boats in the near by marinas that can be pilfered.

its ok, you guys don't have to come. more room for us

Rimmy wrote:

CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Jakka wrote:

CthuluIsSpy wrote:
How are you going to create a working ecosystem on acatraz or a tanker? You will need lots of water (unsalted), and the time to get all the dirt and supplies to make it work. It'll take a few months at best, and how are you going to not get nommed on by zombies? Now, there's two thing I like about alcatraz, and that's the armory and the fact its basically a fortress. The downside is getting it well stocked on non-contaminated supplies, which due to it's isolated nature would be very difficult.

Of course, if you are rich, you could easily do some planning in advance...

The armory? You mean the one in the prison that's been abandoned for almost 50 years?

Oh crap, that's right its not in use . Well, there goes Alcatraz as a good safehouse.

nah not for me. it can be done.

there are plenty of LARGE boats in the near by marinas that can be pilfered.

its ok, you guys don't have to come. more room for us

Oh I'll come...but I call dibs on any .45 weapons. For some reason, I really like that caliber. I dunno why.
Oh and cats...and owls...and bacon, sweet, delicious bacon.

If the Zompocalypse starts, me nd my friends execute plan A...

Learn from the pros, people.

CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Rimmy wrote:

CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Jakka wrote:

CthuluIsSpy wrote:
How are you going to create a working ecosystem on acatraz or a tanker? You will need lots of water (unsalted), and the time to get all the dirt and supplies to make it work. It'll take a few months at best, and how are you going to not get nommed on by zombies? Now, there's two thing I like about alcatraz, and that's the armory and the fact its basically a fortress. The downside is getting it well stocked on non-contaminated supplies, which due to it's isolated nature would be very difficult.

Of course, if you are rich, you could easily do some planning in advance...

The armory? You mean the one in the prison that's been abandoned for almost 50 years?

Oh crap, that's right its not in use . Well, there goes Alcatraz as a good safehouse.

nah not for me. it can be done.

there are plenty of LARGE boats in the near by marinas that can be pilfered.

its ok, you guys don't have to come. more room for us

Oh I'll come...but I call dibs on any .45 weapons. For some reason, I really like that caliber. I dunno why.
Oh and cats...and owls...and bacon, sweet, delicious bacon.

if you don't already have one by then the ammo is mine.

bought mine 6 years ago. SPringfield Armory 1911 GI-Spec in OD Green, rubber molded gribs. yet to change the sights on it, but I love how it feels.

and I'm not going anywhere without my shotguns. the .22 is for hunting food.

Wait out the couple days or whatever it would take the military to respond, or the 2 weeks or so it would take for the walking corpses to decompose to safe levels... Seriously not threatened by it given reality. Besides that, I dont think its quite as easy as the movies make it out to be to tear chunks of flesh out of a person with your teeth...


Now, if reality failed me and I was forced to go through a movie-zombie situation, then I would get some underarmor (spandex type stuff) and suit up in denim/leather/MOPP gear/gas mask/helmet/combat boots, make sure the joined areas (where one article of clothing starts and another ends) are well sealed/protected so that if I get surrounded the zombie hordes cant pull my protective gear apart and chomp away at me, grab myself a crossbow for a backup, and a reliable small-caliber assault rifle (the more ammo I can carry and the less recoil I experience,the better) and go hunting. With a decent scope and a protected firing position I can clear hundreds of zombies a day.

Anything larger than NATO 5.56 is a waste of weight and effort. A bullet through the brain is a bullet through the brain when it comes to zombies. Having more ammo trumps having bigger ammo in any survival type situation, especially when your enemy is soft, fleshy, and unarmored.

Theres a MAJOR problem with using a vessel to hold a crap ton of dirt to farm with. Dirt holds moisture (Innorite?) and because of that will cause the metal belly of any ship, to rot incredibly quickly. So itll last for a few years Im sure, but after that, once it finally springs a leak, the bottom will be so weakened from all the rotting and the weight of the soil, that once it goes, itll REALLY go, and your ship and everything on it will go under like a rock

Rimmy wrote:

KingCracker wrote:Your gunna be able to find all that explosive, AND set all those booby traps, with a boat load of flesh eaters around? Wow, good luck

not even remotely.

alcatraz, here I come. after I raid several Costco's.

Hey, might see you there.

I'd make a thread about it.

Step 1 Gather all foodstuffs, water, weapons, and books, load it into the vehicles and trailers

Step 2: Print as much information on agriculture, tanning, fletching, and other associated ancient techniques as possible before the internet crashes.

Step 3 Drive out to family owned territory and begin to fortify it, start preparing the ground and planting seeds. All fortifications will be planned by someone other than me (i imagine pits that zombies won't be able to get out of, punji pits, and thick concrete block walls with relatives and friends manning the top of it, maybe IED's at critical locations, etc)

Download and print off any information needed for survival. Afterwards start the download of cultural, historical, and scientific information for preservation.

Step 4 Hunt for food for several seasons. Trade meat for food from local farms (which I'm assuming the owners would fortify immediately). Trade our own crops in the spring for more substantive food sources (we have crops now, prior to z-day so waiting on the new ones isn't necessary for trade)

Well, at least that's the attempt at coming up with a plan at 7am with no sleep.

Luco wrote:Step 1 Gather all foodstuffs, water, weapons, and books, load it into the vehicles and trailers

Step 2: Print as much information on agriculture, tanning, fletching, and other associated ancient techniques as possible before the internet crashes.

Step 3 Drive out to family owned territory and begin to fortify it, start preparing the ground and planting seeds. All fortifications will be planned by someone other than me (i imagine pits that zombies won't be able to get out of, punji pits, and thick concrete block walls with relatives and friends manning the top of it, maybe IED's at critical locations, etc)

Download and print off any information needed for survival. Afterwards start the download of cultural, historical, and scientific information for preservation.

Step 4 Hunt for food for several seasons. Trade meat for food from local farms (which I'm assuming the owners would fortify immediately). Trade our own crops in the spring for more substantive food sources (we have crops now, prior to z-day so waiting on the new ones isn't necessary for trade)

Well, at least that's the attempt at coming up with a plan at 7am with no sleep.

Dammit, someone always has to come along and put to much thought into it. Im sorry man, this just makes way to much sense




So your stocking up on pinter ink and paper this year Im guessing?

KingCracker wrote:

Luco wrote:Step 1 Gather all foodstuffs, water, weapons, and books, load it into the vehicles and trailers

Step 2: Print as much information on agriculture, tanning, fletching, and other associated ancient techniques as possible before the internet crashes.

Step 3 Drive out to family owned territory and begin to fortify it, start preparing the ground and planting seeds. All fortifications will be planned by someone other than me (i imagine pits that zombies won't be able to get out of, punji pits, and thick concrete block walls with relatives and friends manning the top of it, maybe IED's at critical locations, etc)

Download and print off any information needed for survival. Afterwards start the download of cultural, historical, and scientific information for preservation.

Step 4 Hunt for food for several seasons. Trade meat for food from local farms (which I'm assuming the owners would fortify immediately). Trade our own crops in the spring for more substantive food sources (we have crops now, prior to z-day so waiting on the new ones isn't necessary for trade)

Well, at least that's the attempt at coming up with a plan at 7am with no sleep.

Dammit, someone always has to come along and put to much thought into it. Im sorry man, this just makes way to much sense




So your stocking up on pinter ink and paper this year Im guessing?

Well there is always plan B: Go to the pub, which is conveniently located next to the gun shop, and get smashed to the point I won't feel a thing when the zombies break down the door.

Yes, there will be a room dedicated to ink. Which will also help with that thesis and 120 pages of research papers I've got to do in the next two years in the meantime.

CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Sonophos wrote:Hmm... I had not factored this into my plan.

More research into container ships is needed. Perhaps I should just go straight for a naval vessel.

Can you anchor a container ship? set sail to some isolated area and dig in?

My plan included filling the cargo area with top soil from uninhabitted islands (possibly impractical) and farming on it but if farming an island would be more practical I could do that.

I had the idea of using the big ship to attract attention of Zombies whilst a smaller craft goes further down the coast to pick up survivors. If we could get a naval vessel working then we could find out what a barrage weapon can manage headshots.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

KingCracker wrote:Theres a MAJOR problem with using a vessel to hold a crap ton of dirt to farm with. Dirt holds moisture (Innorite?) and because of that will cause the metal belly of any ship, to rot incredibly quickly. So itll last for a few years Im sure, but after that, once it finally springs a leak, the bottom will be so weakened from all the rotting and the weight of the soil, that once it goes, itll REALLY go, and your ship and everything on it will go under like a rock

Surely the Zs will rot faster than the ship if I could get a decent one.

Surely the Zs will rot faster than the ship if I could get a decent one.

Depends on the zombies in question. Romero zombies dont really rot. And youd be pretty surprised how fast ships rot from seawater all on their own, and youd be further surprised how fast a bunch of damp soil rots metal. They have to constantly inspect ships, and usually repaint the anti rust paint yearly. You wont have that in Zday, as Im sure the stocks would be between you and 50k zombies. My guess, 2 years tops and your ship would spring leaks

The Scottish isles it is then.

On second thoughts sod it I'm going to Jersey and Guernsey. Much better weather.

Of course I will need some way of clearing the Zs from a boat so I will have to trade up some where on the mainland some how.

Sonophos wrote:The Scottish isles it is then.

On second thoughts sod it I'm going to Jersey and Guernsey. Much better weather.

Of course I will need some way of clearing the Zs from a boat so I will have to trade up some where on the mainland some how.

If your heading for an island I'd suggest a RIB. They are fast, manoverable and easy to lanunch and can easily carry enough fuel for the trip. I a now considering Muck as my choice of place to go on Z day. Good call!

Depending on where this virus starts, Australia can pretty much be sealed up and become self reliant without any need for outside help or travel. If the zombies can walk on the sea bed or "Boat people" bring them over then we're screwed.

Private_Joker wrote:Depending on where this virus starts, Australia can pretty much be sealed up and become self reliant without any need for outside help or travel. If the zombies can walk on the sea bed or "Boat people" bring them over then we're screwed.

Hmm... you have a good point. I will have to do my Zombification experiments in Oz.

Private_Joker wrote:Depending on where this virus starts, Australia can pretty much be sealed up and become self reliant without any need for outside help or travel. If the zombies can walk on the sea bed or "Boat people" bring them over then we're screwed.

Indeed, the thought of ZOmbies roaming the ocean floor is ludicrous. In addition to being a far, far more hostile environment from the water and currents, you have wee beaties down there would love extra din din.

Not to mention the actual terrain is incredibly different with severe mountain ranges, trenches etc. .

PLus wouldn't the pressures kind of mess them up? I don't know how the pressure thing works, but you would at least have to be the dead zombie type.

Not to mention the zombies aren't exactly aiming for specific points.

I think people are pretty safe. In fact a half ass decent river would probably do the trick with currents and such.

Yea, the water trick really only works for still waters and ponds. An Ocean, cmon you guys would be safe. The Zeds would be be food for something awesome, or get crushed by the pressure alone. If none of that does the trick, he Fraz said, the valley's down there would trap them for ever.

My answer: go to an island. Zombies can't swim or walk through the sea after all..

Me and my friends have made a plan.

Me: Get a 2 buses weld bits of metal on it one for people the other for supplies. Keep on the move then when we run out of fuel make a camp out of cars our buses and hold out.

I still don't believe we did a plan lol.

Private_Joker wrote:Depending on where this virus starts, Australia can pretty much be sealed up and become self reliant without any need for outside help or travel. If the zombies can walk on the sea bed or "Boat people" bring them over then we're screwed.

Hate to break it to you but I think Oz is a net importer of food. You would be better off in NZ where they have a net export of food.

My biggest point to the WHOLE argument, is this is all under the condition that the governments and armies of the world fail to kill of a gak ton of them.

I personally believe that the military is capable of majorly controlling the situation.