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At least most of you have been able to look at the codex. I just got back from my FLGS and was todl that it will be another week or two before they get the black box of DE.

It was explained to me that it is not their fault, its because they are on a lower tier in regards to GW and they do not get stuff as fast as higher volume stores. While I can understand this, if its another 2 weeks before it comes in thats 3 WEEKS after it others have been able to look at it.
I'm for supporting my local store but this is ridiculous.

So in reviewing what I've seen here, are DE going to have as much trouble with mech as they used to?

Trouble with mech? Really? The dark lance army?

Actually DE would seem to have a pretty easy time against mech. Besides the Dark Lance, there are quite a few new "toys" to help them against mech(ie., Heat Lances, Haywire blasters, blasters, and void lances just to name a few). It's just have to use them effectively, before they get blown out of the sky.

Dark Lances are highly over-rated on taking out mass armor. Sure, if someone shows up with 3 landraiders and I have 20 Dark Lances the DE will be in good shape. But if someone drops 6-9 land speeders and 3-5 razorbacks the DE are toast. That's why I'm asking if they have gained anything that might help - maybe medium str multiple shot weapons.

DE versus Mech have:

Dark Lances nearly everywhere
Blasters on warriors, reavers, scourges, archons, etc.
Blast pistol upgrades for squad leaders, HQ
Heat Lances for scourges, trueborn, reavers, Talos
Haywire Grenade Launchers for scourges, Talos
Haywire Grenade upgrades on wyches and other squads
Shredders on warriors, trueborn
Void Lances (S9 lance) on Voidravens
Fusion guns on Harlequins
Talos S7 monstrous creature
Miscellaneous other avenues such as high strength special characters, Grotesques (S5 or S6)

Frankly, we have PLENTY of options for armor and, further, the codex is designed so that you can easily have multipurpose units that can do everything.

Pity the FW Raven fighter really doesn't look so hot, and certainly doesn't match with the new line.

Yeah, we're already seeing list (less than 2000 pts) with 30+ Dark Lance like weapons (Blaster and Void Lances), most on very mobile platforms, that mech really shouldn't be too much of a problem.

I think the main thing to point out is that the distribution of those weapons have shifted around, placing a greater emphasis on non-troop units.

If I got my numbers right, can have a trueborn unit with 4x blaster, 2x dark lance in a raider w/ flicker and nightshield for 262 points.

that's 3 dark lances and 4 blasters, essentially 7 dark lances at 18"
so, if you wanted to, that's 21 "dark lances" at 18" for 786 points, or 37 points per gun.

airmang wrote:Yeah, we're already seeing list (less than 2000 pts) with 30+ Dark Lance like weapons (Blaster and Void Lances), most on very mobile platforms, that mech really shouldn't be too much of a problem.

30+ lances? where are you getting this from?.

Yea it's more like 20+.

you can get 21 lances from just 3 Trueborn squads described in greenbay924's post. And that's less than 800 points.

you can also add another 9 from ravagers for just a bit over 300 (unupgraded). then just sprinkle some more in troops (looking at 3 per squad + 1 per raider). Heck even add an Archon or 2 with a blaster. Heck if you wanted, you could probably get 30+ in 1500!

Apparently, we can expect a Battleforce before long. What's in it, I dunno. But it is en-route.

Right, next you'll be telling us that FW are releasing some kind of Tomb Stalker!
Fool us once shame on the fool that twice fools, fool...fool.

Take those 3 trueborn squads, add 3 ravagers w/ flickerfields and nightshields at 125 points each, and for 1161 points you can get 30 "dark lances"

And if you really wanted to get crazy, take 3 units of 10 warriors with blaster and dark lance in a raider for 215 per unit, or another 645.

take two archons with blasters at 75 each, or another 150

so, that's under 2k (at 1956) and the total is:

Blasters x17
Dark lances x21

so 38 "dark lances" I highly doubt that would be a competitive build. Would just be really annoying to go against.

Actually you can pretty easily get closer to 50. I squeezed 42 in 1689. Granted 6 of them are blast pistols but still

Hulksmash wrote:Actually you can pretty easily get closer to 50. I squeezed 42 in 1689. Granted 6 of them are blast pistols but still

And here we were fearing Dark Lance Spam would be dead!

Oh it's not competitive Gwar. At least not from where I sit but you can do it

Gwar! wrote:

Hulksmash wrote:Actually you can pretty easily get closer to 50. I squeezed 42 in 1689. Granted 6 of them are blast pistols but still

And here we were fearing Dark Lance Spam would be dead!

It's just a set up to make lance-immune monoliths and their Necron masters the new kings of the metagame, once they get a new dex.

I'm just sad to see my lovely Dissintegrators reduced to a shadow of their former glory....

puma713 wrote:

Gwar! wrote:

Hulksmash wrote:Actually you can pretty easily get closer to 50. I squeezed 42 in 1689. Granted 6 of them are blast pistols but still

And here we were fearing Dark Lance Spam would be dead!

It's just a set up to make lance-immune monoliths and their Necron masters the new kings of the metagame, once they get a new dex.

Lets not forget Black Templar LRC spam!

Blessed Hull FTW!

I personally would like to see Monolith's Living Metal rule lose the freakyness like Lance and Melta immunities as it just hoses some armies while leaving others untouched, and replace it with a standard 4++ save, if for no other reason than to hear Gwar! constantly complain it doesn't actually do anything.

Aduro wrote:I personally would like to see Monolith's Living Metal rule lose the freakyness like Lance and Melta immunities as it just hoses some armies while leaving others untouched, and replace it with a standard 4++ save, if for no other reason than to hear Gwar! constantly complain it doesn't actually do anything.

I see what you did there.

But yeah, I seriously see Living Metal turning into a 4++ save (with perhaps a 3++ if its melta or lance?) rather than the silliness it is now.

gardeth wrote:I'm just sad to see my lovely Dissintegrators reduced to a shadow of their former glory....

Can you elaborate on this? I've played against DE maybe once in a blue moon in all of the times I've played 40K. What were they and why have they been so reduced?

puma713 wrote:

gardeth wrote:I'm just sad to see my lovely Dissintegrators reduced to a shadow of their former glory....

Can you elaborate on this? I've played against DE maybe once in a blue moon in all of the times I've played 40K. What were they and why have they been so reduced?

They used to be Plasma Cannons.

Gwar! wrote:

puma713 wrote:

gardeth wrote:I'm just sad to see my lovely Dissintegrators reduced to a shadow of their former glory....

Can you elaborate on this? I've played against DE maybe once in a blue moon in all of the times I've played 40K. What were they and why have they been so reduced?

They used to be Plasma Cannons.

whatever. They're still pretty damn hot.

What are they now? I have not got to look at the codex yet.

syanticraven wrote:What are they now? I have not got to look at the codex yet.

Str 5, AP 2, Heavy 3. 36"

i.e. Nerfed to bits. Take DL instead.

Scottywan82 wrote:

syanticraven wrote:What are they now? I have not got to look at the codex yet.

Str 5, AP 2, Heavy 3. 36"

But...but that is such a nerf ;-; why did they do this too my baby?! Why? (I actually ne ver used them anyway lol I used DLs)
Did they give a gun a similar function as its old sustained mode? Or Does the dis-integrator do a good enough?