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I can't see Ordos Xenos having a codex - what do they have aside from the Deathwatch? Give some slightly modified Sternguard to the Inquisition, and you'd have your Deathwatch right there.

Brother SRM wrote:I can't see Ordos Xenos having a codex - what do they have aside from the Deathwatch? Give some slightly modified Sternguard to the Inquisition, and you'd have your Deathwatch right there.

Well, what does Ordo Malleus have besides GKs, and a bunch of Daemonhosts solely there for fluff? And the same goes for Ordo Hereticus and SoB?

If GW can make GKs different enough to warrant a codex, I'm confident they could do the same for Deathwatch.

Or they can, you know, roll it into one codex. No need to come up with 3 different half codexes then CopyPaste the Inq part as filler.

Luke_Prowler wrote:Or they can, you know, roll it into one codex. No need to come up with 3 different half codexes then CopyPaste the Inq part as filler.

I'd rather see Codex: SoB, Codex GK, Codex: DW, AND Codex: Inquisition. The latter would focus more on inquisitorial warbands and stormtroopers. Depending on what kind of Inquisitor you take, you get SoB/GK/DW as allies in your Elites slots. Or something along those lines, anyhow.

Definitely the best way would be to have one codex for all 3. But my gut instinct for some reason says "drop WH, just have GK, and forget about Xenos." I hope GW don't do that. But for some reason that's what my gut tell some they'll do =[

Oshova

I also agree with the one codex option, but GW never will. They'd much rather gouge us for the price of three if they can.

Since GW gets less money from codex and more from models, one codex would make more sense. Players buy codex, look at all the unit options, and buy all the models. multi-codexs will end in less model sales. My opinion, anyway.

I'd want a single Codex as well, saves repeating the same entry for Inquisitorial Storm Troopers three times over.

Assuming there even is such a thing come the revision and we don't just get Codex: Defacto Grey Knights & Sisters.

I'd rather have two Codices where the specialties of GKs (Elite Elite SM with psionics and assaulty stuff) and Sororitas (Ecclesia, including certainly some fanatics/redemptionists) are expanded. Even if I will miss the Inquisitors.

I want a single codex as long as they dont turn GKs into a couple of units for decoration, I'm not big on inquisitors really so i'd like to be able to field varied GK, SOB, and DW armies (and possibly cominations of those).

Actually I'd be happy if they gave Purgation squads a good anti-tank/MC weapon, and lowered the cost of PAGKs and teleport attack squads.

Oh yeah and I want plastic

I want two or three codices. A single united codex would result in the following:

1) You can only have so many unit choices in a codex
2) If you've got three types of armies in one book you cut down on the options each can have in the different slots
3) If the codices are split, more slots are open to be filled with units and so each army can be better defined and developed creatively
4) Unit are balanced against each other, leading to "SoB troops better, GK Elites more powerful, Inq HQ overshadow the rest..." if you so much care about tournaments AND pure armies

I personally don't like the Sisters of Battle, so a single codex getting marred with them would be immensely disappointing.

But I'm not worried, GW employees have come out and said that the three factions were not getting compacted into one codex and just about every rumor right now points to a full-on GK/DH army, not combined forces.

I'd also like DW to have the captain/librarian still instead of the sarge

Yeah that was awesome. Worked out being quite expensive though. I also liked the ability to have one in each of your usual Marine squads. Added a lot of points to your army. But really gave you the ability to add some kick ass firepower.

Oshova

Kroothawk wrote:I'd rather have two Codices where the specialties of GKs (Elite Elite SM with psionics and assaulty stuff) and Sororitas (Ecclesia, including certainly some fanatics/redemptionists) are expanded. Even if I will miss the Inquisitors.

This. Separate lists will allow for more variety and unique units and models. Inquisitors and Assassins need to get their own mini-book in the old Heroes of the Imperium-style. Sororitas should be completely self-contained. Grey Knights too, except one unit of terminators can be taken as HQ or Elites as allies (again, in old school-style). Nothing beyond that.

I want to see some actual CC specialists for GK's
(they're not cc specialists in my eye until they at least get 3 attacks on the charge )

Edit I know the termi's do but what about a fast attack unit?

DEATH89 wrote:I want to see some actual CC specialists for GK's
(they're not cc specialists in my eye until they at least get 3 attacks on the charge )

Edit I know the termi's do but what about a fast attack unit?

Uh... don't they get 3 attacks on the charge with their S6 weapons thanks to NFWs and true grit?

What I would like to see is this

HQ/IC
Inquisitor Ira: Unlocks all of the Inquisitorial Forces
Brother Bob: Unlocks all of the Grey Knights
Sister Sara: Unlocks all Sisters
Billy Bob Death Watch: Unlocks all the Death Watch

Elites
Inquisitors: Assassins 0-1
Grey Knights: Terminators 0-1
Sisters of Battle: 0-1 Elite
Death Watch: 0-1 Terminators
Storm Troopers 0-3

Troops
Inquisition: Arbiters [with Marine Shotguns]
Grey Knights: Grey Knight Power Armor 0-2
Sisters: 0-2 Sisters
Death Watch: 0-2 Death Watch “Stern Guard”
IG style Veterans: 0-6

Ect.

It won’t be any more complicated/bloated as some of the others, but that won’t happen so I am not going to worry about it.

I actually like Anpu's idea. Would need some more refinement, but could work out pretty well.

Ostrakon wrote:
Uh... don't they get 3 attacks on the charge with their S6 weapons thanks to NFWs and true grit?

No. True Grit only works when they aren't charging. Basically, standard PAGK always have 2 attacks.

Which is why GK's should have A2...

I like Anpu's idea as well. It gives a sense of separation but also allow for unification without having to jump hoops with an allies system. As for 2A GKs, I'm not really sure if that would be wise, unless they get more expensive.

Pretty sure everyone thinks that it's going to turn out like Anpu describes...maybe not as defined as he put it...but as there already are restrictions on what you can take depending on your leaders already in the GK Codex it's not too far off...

Anyone think this has anything to do with Inquisition Deathwatch?

http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2010/02/40k-wfb-hidden-in-plain-sight.html

Luke_Prowler wrote:I like Anpu's idea as well. It gives a sense of separation but also allow for unification without having to jump hoops with an allies system. As for 2A GKs, I'm not really sure if that would be wise, unless they get more expensive.

you dont think they're expensive enough to swap true grit for +1 attack? Sternguard have 2A basic and look at all their toys for 25 points, Vanguard are only 20 points each and get 2A each, Wolf Guard are only 18 and they get 2A basic aswell.

GK's were a good deal in 3rd (i thought) but faced with equal points of any of those or even grey hunters or blood claws they will struggle, its not impossible to win with them like some seem to think but with basic troops being so cheap and well equipped now they are looking a bit strained

GK definitely need A2. Every Marine veterean has it. And GK are just that.

Plus it would cement their role as engaging their enemies in meelee which should be their forte. Shooting demons thats what the IG can do ^^.

So you based the point reduction on the fact that they don't have access to the same special weapons or cheap transport? I mean, I can see where you're coming from, but that's not how it works. You don't base the cost of a unit on the meta game, but on it's stats and abilities

True and I never claimed otherwise. Simply compared GK cost to the average in game troop cost in the scenarios I said, nothing more nothing less.
If there are certain slow people afterwards who keep yelling math doesnt work or that the game doesnt work like that, well I never claimed it does but soem people just dont get it and love to spew hate instead.

I specifically mentioned several times that GKs as they are against troops without upgrades are far more powerful (S6 attack and SB) and that it is the tiny difference in wargear options that skews things that much.
Ergo: It is very easy to fix without touching point costs to much...something I also mentioned.

It is also up to GW to bake in all this in the wider game mechanic picture.

But hey, its easier for retards like youknowwho to scream obscenities instead of grasping this but I understand that too, I was also 13 years old once.

So even with space marines shooting first, and not correcting for less GK's dying each round, that would be 2.6 GK's left vs 1.5 marines.

That was my point and that is also called point balance which I by now have proven beyond doubt. If you re read the above things and take them into context there is no problem with this.
As said, statline alone produce a very different set of balance then statline + wargear options. This is what I tried to highlite.
Granted I might have done it differently but the point remains.
Plus things really dont get improved when retards like Mr peebrain here start spewing hate from the first second. It just escalates.

You have proved absolutely nothing. Your conclusions are meaningless and your math is flawed. The more you clamor on about age, the more I'm convinced you are what you accuse others of being. Stop, just stop.

I think shrouding should be upgraded as well...there average sight on a squad right now is 30.5" if I remember right. Hardly ever helps at that distance...though I must say it has helped me win games.

I would like to see a Codex:Inquisition, Codex:Sisters of Battle, and Codex:Grey Knights myself. Make it so the Troops from the Sisters and Knights can be used at Elites in the Inquisition book to keep the blended feel if you want.

Of course I'm biased though as I've got a couple k points in Grey Knights, and would love a full Grey Knights book to expand my selection.

DEATH89 wrote:

Luke_Prowler wrote:I like Anpu's idea as well. It gives a sense of separation but also allow for unification without having to jump hoops with an allies system. As for 2A GKs, I'm not really sure if that would be wise, unless they get more expensive.

you dont think they're expensive enough to swap true grit for +1 attack? Sternguard have 2A basic and look at all their toys for 25 points, Vanguard are only 20 points each and get 2A each, Wolf Guard are only 18 and they get 2A basic aswell.

GK's were a good deal in 3rd (i thought) but faced with equal points of any of those or even grey hunters or blood claws they will struggle, its not impossible to win with them like some seem to think but with basic troops being so cheap and well equipped now they are looking a bit strained

Well, Grey Knights are the only space marines I've played so I didn't really have something to compare. With that, it does seem like they need an additional attack

Also, just to compare notes, can we have why people want separate codexes? Because to me the "More units/expanded fluff" can just as easily be done in a combined codex

Because it *is* a limiting factor. You can only pack so much within a codex, and instead of being creative and expanding the choices each army has to offer you end up with a mish mash of various units and trying to field a pure army becomes a problem.

Imagine the following:
"Grey Knights could do with some anti-vehicle, they're pretty at it."
"Not really, the Sister troops in the codex handle them extremely well already."
"Alright then, let's leave this gaping hole in the Grey Knight! Players will just field some Sisters if they want AV."

And really, that's the issue: fielding a pure army, with its own strengths and weaknesses. Plus, not everyone likes both the Grey Knights AND the Sisters of Battle. I know I have zero interest in the SoB and would be annoyed at having to field some. That's why both codices were split, so that people who enjoyed one or the other could pick their favorite army.

But the real question is why should they be combined? We have Codex: Space Blood Wolves Black Angels, but having Codex: Grey Knights and Codex: Sisters of Battle is apparently a sin for some people.

My wish is for Codex: Grey Knights with an Inquisitor HQ, the various assassins and the Stormtroopers. They all mesh together extremely well, but the spotlight remains cast on the Knights.

Edit: And I've forgotten the most important point, Jervis said that there would not be a combined Inquisition codex

Ah. Well, I had assumed that a combined codex wouldn't force you to mix and match, instead lets you play a pure army or mix.

And to be honest, I not really interested in SoB, I'd just like the option without having to buy a separate codex.

Wait, when and where did Jervis say this?