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Melissia wrote:If you had read the actual unit's fluff, which you did not I should note, it was part of a compromise between the Sororitas and the Mechanicus. A number of Novitiates skilled in technical work are to be trained as techpriests while maintaining their Sororitas duties, with the justification that the Omnissiah is the Emperor, and the two organizations want to ease their relations in order to combat real enemies. To add a bit of grimdark to it, elements of the ecclesiarchy and inquisition aren't all that fond of this decision. But not everything has to be stupidly grimdark. The Imperial organizations DO cooperate with eachother occasionally to the benefit of both!

Fluff that you created. Most of your fandex has strange stuff that has no basis in any existing fluff and thankfully will no appear in any official codex.

The new Sisters codex may or may not allow Inquisitorial units, it may or may not allow units from the Ecclesiarchy, it may or may not be pure Sisters of Battle. I think that at the very least it will be Sisters of Battle + Ecclesiarchy with a strong chance that Inquisitorial units.

I don't think the actual army list will chance very much and will probably look like this:

HQ
Canoness
Priest
Bishop
Celestian Retinue/Honor Guard

Elites
Celestians
Sisters Repentia
Arco-Flaggellants

Troops
Sisters of Battle
Fanatics

Fast Attack
Dominions
Seraphim

Heavy Support
Penitent Engine
Excorcist
Retributor

I could see them adding 3-4 new units.

Perhaps a SoB walker, new transport (official Repressor?), counter charge unit, ranged vehicle.

I wouldn't be surprised if they got access to either Valkyries, Vendettas or Stormravens.

If its the one and only forgeworld model out for Sisters, the repressor will probably be a new model and basic unit.

I would be shocked if SoB got a Stormraven actually. Sisters seem to be like the red headed step children of the imperial armies and they have stuff from the basic armies and groups(Tanks from IG and Transports from Arbites) while not really getting too much from the Space Marines(Rhino sure but they get the really, really old ones).

If anything they may get their own version of the Valkryie, one with flamers in every conceivable place.

halonachos wrote:I would be shocked if SoB got a Stormraven actually. Sisters seem to be like the red headed step children of the imperial armies and they have stuff from the basic armies and groups(Tanks from IG and Transports from Arbites) while not really getting too much from the Space Marines(Rhino sure but they get the really, really old ones).

Umm. Power Armor and Bolters are high-end gear. There is nothing to indicate that their Rhinos are old ones either and they have their own STC for Immolators and Exorcists. So where are you getting this from?

If anything they may get their own version of the Valkryie, one with flamers in every conceivable place.

A flyer with flamers? Umm. Yeah.

pretre wrote:

halonachos wrote:I would be shocked if SoB got a Stormraven actually. Sisters seem to be like the red headed step children of the imperial armies and they have stuff from the basic armies and groups(Tanks from IG and Transports from Arbites) while not really getting too much from the Space Marines(Rhino sure but they get the really, really old ones).

Umm. Power Armor and Bolters are high-end gear. There is nothing to indicate that their Rhinos are old ones either and they have their own STC for Immolators and Exorcists. So where are you getting this from?

The fact they have nothing besides the Exorcist and Immolaters(both of them based off of the Rhino chassis with added flamers for the immolater)

pretre wrote:

If anything they may get their own version of the Valkryie, one with flamers in every conceivable place.

A flyer with flamers? Umm. Yeah.

The sisters add flamers to everything, the whole "flame weapons that ignore invulnerable saves" is kind of their deal.

halonachos wrote:

pretre wrote:

halonachos wrote:I would be shocked if SoB got a Stormraven actually. Sisters seem to be like the red headed step children of the imperial armies and they have stuff from the basic armies and groups(Tanks from IG and Transports from Arbites) while not really getting too much from the Space Marines(Rhino sure but they get the really, really old ones).

Umm. Power Armor and Bolters are high-end gear. There is nothing to indicate that their Rhinos are old ones either and they have their own STC for Immolators and Exorcists. So where are you getting this from?

The fact they have nothing besides the Exorcist and Immolaters(both of them based off of the Rhino chassis with added flamers for the immolater)

And they have power armor, jump packs and bolters. Power armor isn't 'stuff from basic armies' and neither are bolters. As for the Exo/Immo, that's like saying that SM don't have much because Predators and Razorbacks are just added onto Rhinos.

Sisters are equipped with the best equipment that non-astartes can use. Page 2 'Armed with the best arms and armor the Ecclesiarchy can provide...'

pretre wrote:

If anything they may get their own version of the Valkryie, one with flamers in every conceivable place.

A flyer with flamers? Umm. Yeah.

The sisters add flamers to everything, the whole "flame weapons that ignore invulnerable saves" is kind of their deal.

I know what their schtick is. But why would they put Flame weapons on a Valkyrie? Unless you can shoot like a hellhound, it makes little fluff or game sense. More appropriate would be Melta weapons, if you are follwing 'their deal'. Now a Valk with 3 TL Multimeltas would be hot.

Best the eccleshiary can provide my ass. IG can use storm bolters and IG also have jump packs(in fluff but not in game).

SM started with the rhinos and also have a landraider. I would love to see different models for them, something not based off of the standard transport of another army bcause if they truly were given the best that the eccleshiary can provide then they would at least have a truly unique chassis for their army.

The meltas on the Valkryie would make sense and so would a flamer using some kind of special rule(like maybe something similar to the deffchoppa's bib bomm).

Amaya wrote:Fluff that you created.

No gak Captain Sherlock McObvious, just like any other new codex adding in new units.

Your unit list is so woefully inadequate as to be a laughable suggestion for a fifth edition codex. You would suggest that Sisters of Battle should have half to a third of the amount of options as other factions get. The most polite way I can describe that is nonsensical. If you refuse to add in new units your suggestions and ideas are pointless in a discussion of a new codex to replace the one which currently is SEVERELY lacking in unit choices.

Guys, again, canon fluff exists allowing the possibility of emperor worshiping female tech priests. They just can't 'also' be SoB. Therefor, if they were 'attached' to a Sororitas group, it would make sense, but they, themselves, would not be sororitas.

BaronIveagh wrote:Guys, again, canon fluff exists allowing the possibility of emperor worshiping female tech priests. They just can't 'also' be SoB.

Sure they can, all that needs to happen is that a codex writer decides to change that.

Just like how they changed the fluff to add in the Dreadknight, and the flying librarian dreadnoughts, and the various new Leman Russ variants, and so on and so forth.

Melissia wrote:

BaronIveagh wrote:Guys, again, canon fluff exists allowing the possibility of emperor worshiping female tech priests. They just can't 'also' be SoB.

Sure they can, all that needs to happen is that a codex writer decides to change that.

Granted, but I was talking to work within existing fluff. Unless you're Matt Ward, you try and match new fluff to existing fluff as much as possible.

halonachos wrote:Best the eccleshiary can provide my ass. IG can use storm bolters and IG also have jump packs(in fluff but not in game).

Just because you disagree with the fluff, doesn't mean it isn't the fluff. Sisters get BOLTERS for every girl in the army. What is the basic gun for IG? Oh yeah, a lasgun, not a bolter. Why? Because they are cheap. Why don't guard get bolters/storm bolters standard? Oh yeah, because they are expensive and relatively rare. Do IG have power armor or even carapace standard? And IG don't get JP, they get grav assist chutes and those only for super elite units. In very rare situations, they get jump packs and that was limited to one BL novel that I know of and they were not combat JP, but transport ones to get them to a hard to get to zone.

SM started with the rhinos and also have a landraider. I would love to see different models for them, something not based off of the standard transport of another army bcause if they truly were given the best that the eccleshiary can provide then they would at least have a truly unique chassis for their army.

Sure, I'd like to see something new, but that doesn't mean they aren't well provisioned. And Rhinos are not 'the standard transport of another army'. Rhinos are the standard Imperial transport. If you go back to Rogue Trader, all imperial factions had access to Rhinos before there even were Chimeras.

The meltas on the Valkryie would make sense and so would a flamer using some kind of special rule(like maybe something similar to the deffchoppa's bib bomm).

Keep in mind that if they would release Valk/Vend, that the sisters do not need more anti-infantry. They have that in spades. They need more anti-tank and long range at that. So multi-meltas or lascannons.

BaronIveagh wrote:

Melissia wrote:

BaronIveagh wrote:Guys, again, canon fluff exists allowing the possibility of emperor worshiping female tech priests. They just can't 'also' be SoB.

Sure they can, all that needs to happen is that a codex writer decides to change that.

Granted, but I was talking to work within existing fluff. Unless you're Matt Ward, you try and match new fluff to existing fluff as much as possible.

Not when existing fluff is laughably inadequate to create a full fifth edition codex.

Sisters will probably get some new vehicles, and hopefully something unique to them.

SM=Rhino and Landraider chassis
IG=Chimera and Leman Russ chassis
SoB=Rhino chassis

Seriously GW, give them something new.

BaronIveagh wrote:
Granted, but I was talking to work within existing fluff. Unless you're Matt Ward, you try and match new fluff to existing fluff as much as possible.

And the thread just got Draigo'd. Good job.

As much as your haterade is quaint, you know that fluff is updated with EVERY edition by practically every single codex writer, not just Ward, right?

Melissia wrote:Not when existing fluff is laughably inadequate to create a full fifth edition codex.

Can't argue that, but what would most likely get 'ok'd' by GW would be to have them as female tech priests 'on loan' to the ecclesiarchy.

pretre wrote:As much as your haterade is quaint, you know that fluff is updated with EVERY edition by practically every single codex writer, not just Ward, right?

For once I agree with pretre, and add that this is a GOOD thing as it expands the universe.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

BaronIveagh wrote:

Melissia wrote:Not when existing fluff is laughably inadequate to create a full fifth edition codex.

Can't argue that, but what would most likely get 'ok'd' by GW would be to have them as female tech priests 'on loan' to the ecclesiarchy.

But then, if they're already making a female techpriest model, the fluff work to make them tied to the Sisters is minimal in comparison.

Melissia wrote:For once I agree with pretre, and add that this is a GOOD thing as it expands the universe.

Oh no!!! I must reverse my position immediately!!! We should go back to beastman IG, half-eldar SM and everyone with Rhinos! Rogue Trader forevas!

pretre wrote:

halonachos wrote:Best the eccleshiary can provide my ass. IG can use storm bolters and IG also have jump packs(in fluff but not in game).

Just because you disagree with the fluff, doesn't mean it isn't the fluff. Sisters get BOLTERS for every girl in the army. What is the basic gun for IG? Oh yeah, a lasgun, not a bolter. Why? Because they are cheap. Why don't guard get bolters/storm bolters standard? Oh yeah, because they are expensive and relatively rare. Do IG have power armor or even carapace standard? And IG don't get JP, they get grav assist chutes and those only for super elite units. In very rare situations, they get jump packs and that was limited to one BL novel that I know of and they were not combat JP, but transport ones to get them to a hard to get to zone.

Actually in the previous edition of the IG codex they had doctrines. These doctrines applied to the entire IG army you played and actually had the ability to make Carapace a standard armor you also had the ability to have up to 3 stormtrooper squads as one troop choice. In fact there is a planet where the IG get training similar to that of a commissar standard and receive carapace armor as a standard. Then there are the more barbarous worlds that use a lighter armor which is a 6+ save. Saying that the standard IG have flak armor is incredibly misleading when the standard varies planet by planet.

Also, if it exists in a Gaunt's Ghosts novel it pretty much is canon. And it wasn't a rare occassion, the company that normally used the jump packs(the phantines in the novel) used them normally, it was just a rare occurance for the Ghosts to use them.

Melissia wrote:

Amaya wrote:Fluff that you created.

No gak Captain Sherlock McObvious, just like any other new codex adding in new units.

Your unit list is so woefully inadequate as to be a laughable suggestion for a fifth edition codex. You would suggest that Sisters of Battle should have half to a third of the maount of options as other factions get, which is nonsensical.

The fact that you insult everyone who disagrees with you speaks volumes.

And pray tell, how many armies have 42+ different units that are actually useful?

The only army that the Sisters can be compared to would be Grey Knights and only on the basis that both are Chambers Militant of the Inquisition.

GK have

Grandmaster
Brother Captain
Brother Champion
Librarian

Paladins
Purifiers
Ven Dreadnaughts

Terminators
Strike Squads

Interceptors
Stormravens

Landraiders (and variants)
Dreadnaught
Dreadknight
Purgation Squad

15 GK units...17 if you consider all types of LRs


I see no reason for the new SoB to include a Palatine, but if they do SoB will have the minimum

Canoness
Palatine
Priest

Celestians
Sisters Repentia

Sisters of Battle

Seraphims
Dominions

Retributors
Excorcist
Penitent Engine

And as I said earlier, probably 3-4 new units.

Having a wide variety of units is really irrelevant.

The only killer weakness that Sisters have is a lack of ranged AT, which only ever bothered me against DE.

pretre wrote:
As much as your haterade is quaint, you know that fluff is updated with EVERY edition by practically every single codex writer, not just Ward, right?

Normally I ignore obvious trolls, but there's a difference between adding a new unit and adjusting fluff in small ways to have it make sense (I point to all the disappearing/reappearing IG tanks or my above suggestion of having a tech preist on loan to the ecchelisiarchy) and declaring your personal favorite SM chapter to be the greatest of all time and how it's primarch was worshiped by all other chapters except those inferior heretical idiots obviously on their way out. (Who's codecies you will then go on to write as GW attempts to drive home how they 'are not a game company').

halonachos wrote:
Actually in the previous edition of the IG codex they had doctrines. These doctrines applied to the entire IG army you played and actually had the ability to make Carapace a standard armor you also had the ability to have up to 3 stormtrooper squads as one troop choice. In fact there is a planet where the IG get training similar to that of a commissar standard and receive carapace armor as a standard. Then there are the more barbarous worlds that use a lighter armor which is a 6+ save. Saying that the standard IG have flak armor is incredibly misleading when the standard varies planet by planet.

I'm aware of doctrines. But the default armor/armament for IG is flak/lasgun. Exceptions are not the rule. As well, there are no Guard regiments that I am aware of that come stock with Power Armor and Bolter. Most of the worlds that come stock with Carapace are very rich worlds and even they can't afford PA.
The default armor/armament for SoB is Power Armor / Bolter. That's a significant upgrade.

Also, if it exists in a Gaunt's Ghosts novel it pretty much is canon. And it wasn't a rare occassion, the company that normally used the jump packs(the phantines in the novel) used them normally, it was just a rare occurance for the Ghosts to use them.

You're a bit mixed up. The Phantines are an almost-wholly air regiment. They have a tiny regiment of drop troopers that were used in Op Larisel, but the majority of the regiment is pilots and aircrew. And again, they are not combat jump-packs, but transport jump-packs.

Lexicanum (referencing GG) "With the exception of a tiny force of dedicated drop-troopers (the Phantine Skyborne), the Phantine Planetary Defence Force fields no ground troopers."


Automatically Appended Next Post:

BaronIveagh wrote:

pretre wrote:
As much as your haterade is quaint, you know that fluff is updated with EVERY edition by practically every single codex writer, not just Ward, right?

Normally I ignore obvious trolls, but there's a difference between adding a new unit and adjusting fluff in small ways to have it make sense (I point to all the disappearing/reappearing IG tanks or my above suggestion of having a tech preist on loan to the ecchelisiarchy) and declaring your personal favorite SM chapter to be the greatest of all time and how it's primarch was worshiped by all other chapters except those inferior heretical idiots obviously on their way out. (Who's codecies you will then go on to write as GW attempts to drive home how they 'are not a game company').

Aww, I'm a troll because you don't like me picking apart your hate with facts? Good times.

Small ways, eh? Have you paid attention to codexes since Rogue Trader? Heck, Sisters alone went from being entirely an independent org of the Ecclesiarcy to also the Militant Arm of the Inquisition in the WH book. I also realize (or hope) your statement is hyperbole, but when did any codex said that all the other chapters worship one primarch or that one codex was the greatest of all time. Oh yeah, they didn't.

Bah, IG still have better tanks.

halonachos wrote:Bah, IG still have different tanks.

FTFY.

halonachos wrote:Bah, IG still have better tanks.

And Sisters are the best point for point troops in the game.

Amaya wrote:

halonachos wrote:Bah, IG still have better tanks.

And Sisters are the best point for point troops in the game.

Debatable*, but I like where you are going.


*Some folks argue Ork Boyz.

So shall we start a competition of a sweepstake for when sob will be released?

Amaya wrote:And pray tell, how many armies have 30+ different units that are actually useful?

Fixed.

Oh, and the answer is "every fifth edition codex."

pretre wrote:

halonachos wrote:Bah, IG still have dbetter tanks.

FTFY.

Fixed your fix.

That and IG now have stormtrooper with hot-shot lasguns that ignore power armor saves. Nice rapid fire AP3 weapons they are.

pretre wrote:

Amaya wrote:

halonachos wrote:Bah, IG still have better tanks.

And Sisters are the best point for point troops in the game.

Debatable*, but I like where you are going.


*Some folks argue Ork Boyz.

I like Ork Boyz for CC and Sisters for shooting.

DE, GK and SW don't have 30 units, unless you count SC and then they're up in the 32-35 range.

Heck, SOB codex has 24 or so if you count SC.

And that's ignoring usefulness. One could argue SW don't make 30 useful units when you drop the 'Claw' units and Tyranids definitely drop below 30 once you get rid of the dead weight.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

halonachos wrote:That and IG now have stormtrooper with hot-shot lasguns that ignore power armor saves. Nice rapid fire AP3 weapons they are.

Umm, okay. On their elite troops. How does that equate to 'the sisters get second rate equipment'? Oh yeah, it doesn't.