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 TheWaspinator wrote:
Well, they ARE failing their commitments by missing their original deadline. That alone is enough to make me uneasy, especially since we can not know for certain how late it will be until they actually deliver.

Yes, I confirm the deadline will not be met so under that aspect we are indeed failing our commitment. I would like to note that noone is "attacking" you (I'm sorry, I don't know what the exact word is) as you are only voicing a concern of others as well, more than fair.

It was my decision to risk the deadline. Mine alone, I take the entire fall for that. I was either going to knowingly deliver a faulty product or risk delaying, with a little luck we would have met the deadline. We weren't lucky and we are going to indeed delay. It's not how it should have worked, but that's how things went.
If I could turn back time would have I done the same? You bet. Did this also cost me additional money in having stuff reprinted and effort in trying to find an even higher detailed 3D printer to commission (mind you the first didn't come cheap either)? Yes, I can certainly live with that. The final result will be worth it and the delay is a 2-3 month on a 9+ month precommunicated estimated delivery date.

Associating a crowdfunding project with less than superb product is not the modus operandi of this company. And as long as I'm in charge, nor will it ever be.

Your support on the Shieldmaiden project is already more than I could ask for since it allowed a unique kit to be created (along with other miniatures in resin). I also thank you for allowing me to address the delivery issue on it as many people won't have read the last update.

Angelos.

 TheWaspinator wrote:
Well, they ARE failing their commitments by missing their original deadline. That alone is enough to make me uneasy, especially since we can not know for certain how late it will be until they actually deliver.

I would rather the 'Maidens were late rather than get a product that doesnt live up to the standard of what was promised during the KS

This is Shieldwolfs 3rd KS and their first was delivered without any real problems, it was 3 or 4 weeks late but a large majority of KS mini projects run late, its only a small percentage, the very small KS less than 50 backers that seem to fulfil on time, i dont know one big company that has run a mini KS and fulfilled on time and lots of companies run KS while waiting to fulfil the previous ones!

If people are worried about the quality of shieldwolf products il leave my review of their 1st KS http://kickstarteraddict.blogspot.co.uk/

 TheWaspinator wrote:
Well, they ARE failing their commitments by missing their original deadline. That alone is enough to make me uneasy, especially since we can not know for certain how late it will be until they actually deliver.

I don't think it will be by much of a margin and I believe it was due to a quality issue and the want to deliver the best for the pledger, plus how many KS have you backed a slight delay is expected we ain't talking years unlike some KS I pledged for believe me that is sole destroying.

Like I said its your choice but I think your being overly unfair with your reason for it, like I said the delivery date hasn't even passed for the SM KS and they warned of the slight delay as soon as they knew of it, hell they could have kept it hush and threw excuses after the event but no they were up front and honest about it which I can respect them for.

Waspinator's points are valid and reasonable, and he's not having a go at SW. He's just being cautious with his money, which is fine and reasonable. And this isn't an attack, but at this point in the game it's reasonable to think that straight-talking and honest KS producers will have a bit of leeway baked into their estimates. Those bs levels of time blowouts are one reason I no longer back most KS. I appreciate SW being honest, upfront and frank about the delays well in advance. I'm backing, but I won't take issue with others not wanting to back another KS from anyone until their previous one is delivered on. In full.

Though I still take issue with the "yourcountry-friendly shipping" logos being used incorrectly, even though it's sort of explained in the FAQ.

Nobody's asked, but I'll throw in my two cents.

I am not able to back it, mainly because I happened to get a large dentists bill just as it started, but I have a few issues with the project anyway, that may have prevented me from backing it anyway.

Firstly, the big difference between this one and the shieldmaidens kickstarter is that the shieldmaidens were clearly an *army*. They had basic infantry, characters, a big monster and some monstrous cavalry.

This one... if I pledged, I'd be getting characters from an entirely different army (common goblins), a big monster (though that wasn't guaranteed at the start), and some infantry. I think that it would have helped majorly if there were some actual forest goblin characters, and a few more details given about the plans for the KS.

Flexibility is one thing, but when you're running a 14 day campaign, the flip side of the major changes is seemingly bad preparation.I don't know how long it was advertised before launch, but 2 weeks where there's only one single render to get people excited, with further renders not appearing until the last couple of days makes me think the KS was a bit rushed, maybe?

It would have been good to see the individual renders that appeared in the last couple of days, along with the renders of them arranged as a unit, multiple angles, etc.

Anyway, I wish Shieldwolf the best of luck. If love them to be able to make forest goblins a viable army. I will say though, don't be afraid of resin, shieldwolf. Sure, everyone would probably like plastic units of whatever, but if the choice is waiting years for plastics that may never appear, or getting them to market sooner in a different medium, I'd choose resin any day.

IF this doesn't fund (and there's still a good chance that it does fund, don't get me wrong) I think there's still a good chance a reboot would make it if the campaign is better designed.

I don't think there's any problem with the product but rather the presentation. Having so much flip-flopping on so basic a feature as what the sprues contain creates a lot of uncertainty.

If the sprue-layout is more finalized, the pictures show more varied goblin designs and the number of initially available pledges that's dependent on stretchgoals being reached is lessened. I think it can do better than what we have now.

3d printing a few physical models as examples would work wonders as well I believe. You have the renders, so I assume it could pretty easily be done.

I do think more renders would have helped, and also that the huge challenge here is plastic production - that's also the reason for the (very slight!) delay on the Shieldmaidens, and kind of comes with the territory with HIPS. I think it's awesome that Shieldwolf goes for it and is looking to have plastic kits made, but I'm also really excited for their resin offerings here - in fact it's what I'm pledging for (Brutgoth and Arachnomaidens) since I love the idea of the gobbos but I already have 120 here queued up for paint one day

I hope this takes the last step and funds and then some, I'd actually be pretty shocked if it didn't - projects that get this far almost always finish over the top on the final day! Good luck guys

MattW wrote:
Nobody's asked, but I'll throw in my two cents.

Opinions have always been welcome in our threads :-)

MattW wrote:

[...] Firstly, the big difference between this one and the shieldmaidens kickstarter is that the shieldmaidens were clearly an *army*. They had basic infantry, characters, a big monster and some monstrous cavalry.

This one... if I pledged, I'd be getting characters from an entirely different army (common goblins), a big monster (though that wasn't guaranteed at the start), and some infantry. I think that it would have helped majorly if there were some actual forest goblin characters, and a few more details given about the plans for the KS.

Funny how we are so interested in keeping great communication yet during a live project we fail; this too would have been a complete army. We commenced with basic infantry that unlike the shieldmaidens would have various weapon options. After which we would go wtih cavalry in HIPS. Should that have funded, we would have used the momentum to either go with converting the Spiderladies into plastic and tripling the amount (3 resin or 9 in plastic) or shoot for plastic chariots, by using the same mounts of the cavalry to keep SGs tighter. After which, another last infantry set, then the project ended, no more SGs planned.

The great beast could not be made available from the start, there are costs to cover and considering we are already backing the project ourselves we put it as a stretch goal instead. The fact that Angelos believes in his project and is willing to fork the money on his own to make this work was not in the initial layout. I would also like to note that unlike the Mammoth & Dragons from our Shieldmaiden project, this was a new mini, so it wasn't just about production costs but also concept artwork, sculpting and printing.
You are definitely right though that should this project not fund, there's certainly some reflection to be done in our HQ.

MattW wrote:

Flexibility is one thing, but when you're running a 14 day campaign, the flip side of the major changes is seemingly bad preparation.I don't know how long it was advertised before launch, but 2 weeks where there's only one single render to get people excited, with further renders not appearing until the last couple of days makes me think the KS was a bit rushed, maybe?

It would have been good to see the individual renders that appeared in the last couple of days, along with the renders of them arranged as a unit, multiple angles, etc.

No argument there, apart that there was not a single render, there were already four unique sculpts shown.

MattW wrote:

Anyway, I wish Shieldwolf the best of luck. I'd love them to be able to make forest goblins a viable army. I will say though, don't be afraid of resin, shieldwolf. Sure, everyone would probably like plastic units of whatever, but if the choice is waiting years for plastics that may never appear, or getting them to market sooner in a different medium, I'd choose resin any day.

Thank you. Resin for regiments doesn't work for our plans. Plastic gives us more time for other things to work on and our vision & schedule has sooo many more things that we want to do. Besides, our supporters have seen our plastics and prefer these, and TBH so do we.

Once again, regardless of how this ends, we appreciate the support and interaction from all of you, it means a lot to us. Whether this funds or not the experience is bound to make us better.

If I had money, I'd be in for 2-4 boxes of goblins for sure. I am genuinely confused why this KS didn't do better. Maybe, with WHFB being gone, there simply isn't a demand for resculpts of existing units. Heaven knows 9th age isn't drawing in new players, and anyone already playing greenskins in Warhammer already has heaps of GW ones.

I like a lot of the Shieldwolf designs, just don't have any need for greenskins atm.

Now, if they did hard plastic multi-part Halflings, I think my wallet would scream...

I'll be going in tomorrow morning as I get cash through just in time to contribute, but I think the campaign could have done with being longer tbh.

I am afraid that I just don't have a use for lots of forest goblins. I had RiTides in for a set of the spider ladies for me, but I just don't care for gobbers outside the occasional giggle project.

Yeah we've got a combined pledge in for the resin addons (I'm all about that Brutgoth!). Still about $3500 to go, seems doable on the final day here! Ends at 2pm EST:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1273312680/war-is-coming-forest-goblins/

Jump in if you've been tempted folks, your pledge will make a difference on this one!

Final hour, the comment section (as always) has been great to partecipate in :-)

Talk about stumbling just before the finish line, too bad you guys and hope you can get these made some other way! They look cool even though they're not for me.

I wonder if a Brutgoth and spider lady resin- only campaign at a lower funding cost might be a possibility?

There was certainly a lot of interest in those items. Almost more so than the actual goblins at times.

Something to consider?

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
I wonder if a Brutgoth and spider lady resin- only campaign at a lower funding cost might be a possibility?

There was certainly a lot of interest in those items. Almost more so than the actual goblins at times.

Something to consider?

Nope. :-)
While the suggestion is highly appreciated, we don't need a crowdfunding project for these items alone, they were placed to boost funding for what we consider the main dish, our plastics. You might even see these hit retail regardless, but they are obviously expected to have a much higher price than the one we had during the KS.

Hope to see the goblins again at some point, and hope more people are interested when we do

A real shame, hopefully the gobbos appear again in future.

 Shieldwolf Miniatures wrote:

Thank you. Resin for regiments doesn't work for our plans. Plastic gives us more time for other things to work on and our vision & schedule has sooo many more things that we want to do. Besides, our supporters have seen our plastics and prefer these, and TBH so do we.

Once again, regardless of how this ends, we appreciate the support and interaction from all of you, it means a lot to us. Whether this funds or not the experience is bound to make us better.

Yeah, I understand your reticence to do resin for regiments- but I think that when you've only been able to fund plastic kits for basic infantry so far, your ambition might be greater than your ability to deliver? I can't word that without sounding snarky, sorry. It's not intended to be so.

My only desires for the next campaign would be clearer direction from the get-go; you were still taking suggestions on cavalry halfway through the last campaign. If you have the funding/time, get at least the chieftain and/or shaman sculpted, so that people have some idea of how the concepts will look in actual miniature form.

So far we know that if we put our money into this army, we'll get infantry, a couple of characters and a brutgoth. Maybe at least tell us what the range will expand to include? We know that the shield maidens range has/will have characters, infantry, bear riders, mammoths, spider ladies, war maidens, etc... I don't (not sure about others) really want to invest in an army that will stay at basic infantry and a monster for the next few years. Finally, other companies sometimes allow access to a preview version of their KS pages, so that people can have a look at them before the official launch- this is generally a good thing, I think. Lets people budget better, spot anything that's confusing before launch, so that you're not madly fixing things up in the middle of the campaign.

Anyway, good luck with the reboot!

You don't sound snarky @MattW, on hte contrary we try our best listening to what people have to say. Basic plastic infantry kits is a way to start. We have the Mountain Orc kit, we have the Shieldmaiden Infantry/Rangers, we missed today the Forest Goblins plastics for less than $1,7K.
I'm not saying it's going to be easy but if it was easy, then everyone would have been doing it. At the end of the day, it's all about keeping our heads down and pursuing our goals with the same passion. We trust that once the Shieldmaiden plastics reach people's hands we can only be looked at with an even better perspective :-)

All your suggestions make perfect sense, we will try our best to improve. The Shieldmaiden Army is due to expand. A lot actually, as we have lots and lots planned for them! And yes, a preview page (at least for the Shieldmaiden backers) will probably be made available. As I said, there's lots to do still! :-D

I'm very disappointed this campaign fell just short. I'd backed for 4 boxes plus the unit filler. Happy to hear that the project isn't totally dead and hopefully be re-launched next year. I've been waiting 20 years for this kit, I can wait another couple.

If I could throw my 2c in as advice for the future:

Not sure how possible this is, given this is a 'true' kickstarter vs. a glorified pre-order, but I think there were too few details around what was planned to be on the sprue - I understand there were stretch goals to add additional components, but I think a more detailed explanation of the base sprue layout would have been beneficial. Multi-option kits from the start seems to be the way to go given the positive response to the change with a couple of days to go.

It would be great to have a more rounded out army offered as add-ons from the start or through the campaign, such as resin warmachines, special units or characters - eg. chariots, trolls, wolf riders, totems, resin command upgrades. I loved the unit filler concept.

I'd go with showing more work on the goblins from Day 1. More renders and perhaps even some sprue mockups?

Offering Command parts - banner arm, leader head, musician arm(s) - included in every box in resin - GW used to do the same with metal as they were slowly improving their plastics and potentually as a sprue (along with hand weapons and more bows, etc) if funding goes high enough.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

I second that motion. Also having more stretch goals clearly laid out, pledges that don't need to be unlocked and not having things cut and changed half way through the campaign.

Whilst I love the fact that SW clearly takes on feedback from the customers, a lot of things that were mentioned on this campaign should have been resolved before the Kickstarter launched and clearly communicated (pics and writing).

I found it quite jarring that the command options were a (distant) stretch goal, it took ages to work out whether shields were included (not to mention moulded on or not) and the fact that the Gobbo characters did not really match the aesthetic of the proposed box and didn't have a banner included (which I was expecting instead of the unit filler thing).
Furthermore on the SM starter there was a pledge for OrcsvSM, this one included Gobbos and orcs which are seen as being pretty aligned so I wonder if a Gobbo vs SM pledge would have been advisable?

This Kickstarter also really suffered from bad timing, it seems to have been a busy month for mini related kickstarters and I wonder if it had been a month earlier or later it would have struggled as badly.

Still, hope you either relaunch it or fund yourselves as I really liked the concept and would buy/pledge again and eagerly await the Maidens.

ingtaer, those are all great points. The Shieldmaidens obviously did well with a reboot, so hopefully the same happens here! However, I think being clear about at least what is planned for the sprue as the base stretch goal would really, really help so hopefully you guys can go and do that in the interim.

The other main things would be having more renders if at all possible (maybe even a few posed ones) and having a clearer way to get more people involved / pledging (such as a resin add-ons pledge... you added Arachnomaidens but had no clear way to get Shieldmaidens backers into the campaign and pledging for them, unless they wanted goblins too).

Yeah, someone mentioned that there are 2 or 3 other goblin KS running right now, and one of those is a Kev Adams one. Mantic's latest escapades are also something that, while less shiny now, still attracts a lot of backers.

GW's new surge of worthwhile releases and Start Collecting boxes, etc are probably affecting Mini KS pledge dollars to some extent. I know I'd rather save my bucks for Prospero than Space Dungeon Saga, and money for Orruks today could well be affecting money for forest goblins next September.

Everything you've written down has been screenshot, printed and placed in the Forest Goblin envelope we have.
The project @wilb2064 is anything but dead, we said we will relaunch it and that's exactly what we intend to do. First we must put more work into it though + fix the mistakes that were pointed out though... :-)

Edit:
@ingtaer @Azazelx @RiTides
All very good points.

Shieldwolf Miniatures Newsletter, October 4th 2016

A number of very interesting things have been happening behind the scenes and it is time to reveal some of them; a number of plans have been formulated and will be put into motion in 2017, as it will take a while to implement and have them completely ready for launch. But, let’s take it one thing at a time.

In the Shieldwolf Team everyone is in great health and spirit. The recent Forest Goblin campaign might not have funded (even for a measly $1,7K!), but the support was great regardless and we are confident ever more people will support future endeavors of the company. The release of the Shieldmaiden plastic dual kit early 2017, the quality and possibilities of which can be matched by only one company worldwide will help to ensure this.

In the meanwhile the company as you might already know decided to take a lead role concerning the support of T9A game and community, something soon many other companies followed. For the time being Shieldwolf Miniatures stands alone in the sponsoring of T9A by supporting all major tournaments worldwide, having mailed to more than 40 tournaments in 17 countries around the world. We love this hobby and we mean to show it!

Another initiative the company took was to communicate on June 25th its intention to collaborate with other manufacturers in the creation of a starter set that would be fully compatible for T9A. Shieldwolf Miniatures was the first to announce that it will release such a boxed set (and we are certain that once again more will eventually do the same), but we find a potential collaboration with other companies would lead to an even greater product that would help T9A community in both exposure and miniature support.
The first among the companies that responded to our call was a Spanish one named Avatars of War. We therefore responded back and engaged with the person running it, being hopeful it would lead to a great starter set with products combined from the two companies. Unfortunately we quickly found out a collaboration was going to be quite problematic from the start while on the same time it resulted impossible to create any type of concrete communicative bridge with said company. Despite our efforts and patience, we were left with no choice but inform him on the 26th of September that we are dismissing any collaboration. We wish him luck on the agenda he wants to follow.
On the other hand, a more positive note for T9A as we are currently involved with 3 more companies that want part of this combined starter set, one from Poland, one from France and one from Spain again. Communication and substantial ideas have already been droppped on the table and we are looking forward to seeing how it all works out. All companies implicated have naturally their schedules full at the moment, so any actual doings will take place in 2017.

Another matter that has been communicated to us is the future and availability of the Krumvaal Light Infantry regiment. The reason the regiment has been unavailable is because we are looking forward to resculpting and retooling said regiment in hard plastic (HIPS), maintaining however the same unique fantasy concept we first introduced for our nordic barbarian race.
We are confident we will be able to create a much better product at the same MSRP, so we are working harder than ever to provide it.

To close this October newsletter, we are very happy to announce two new retailers who are now carrying our range. The first is CCGWinkel and is located in Holland (http://www.ccgwinkel.nl) and the other one Figures For sale is which has taken over the distribution for the United Kingdom (http://figuresforsale.co.uk/).
We appreciate their trust and hope the expanding retailer web will facilitate even more our supporters.

Thank you.

The Shieldwolf Team.

Piling up the rewards and renewing stock.... work, work, work! :-)

Much excite.