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Gal Vorbak are kind of the second-choice model for possessed, so you'd have to let your opponent know that they're NOT that every game ... I say possessed. Decent unit these days, and very "Word Bearers".

You could distinguish the Greater Possessed with their paintjob. Some powerful OSL coming from their eyes, inside their armour, suggesting that they are vessels for a power far greater than the Possessed. Also, build up their bases so they loom over the rank & file.

Snugiraffe wrote:
No obsec, of course, and they'll take up elite slots. But if you're not going to worry about CPs anyway, the whole lot could be a vanguard detachment.

That's what the Heretical 17 are for anyway.

Damnit, the Purge trait is rerolling to hits, which is so much worse than rerolling wounds that I initially thought. Ughhhhhhh.... Probably not worth giving up VOTLW in that case. What a shame, I really did like it when I thought it was rerolling wounds!

gruyere wrote:
Damnit, the Purge trait is rerolling to hits, which is so much worse than rerolling wounds that I initially thought. Ughhhhhhh.... Probably not worth giving up VOTLW in that case. What a shame, I really did like it when I thought it was rerolling wounds!

Just ally in IW OR AL, there good to go.
Has the added benefit off some nice other combos.

gruyere wrote:
Damnit, the Purge trait is rerolling to hits, which is so much worse than rerolling wounds that I initially thought. Ughhhhhhh.... Probably not worth giving up VOTLW in that case. What a shame, I really did like it when I thought it was rerolling wounds!

You're joking right? The Purge "re-roll hit rolls for attacks made by units with this trait that target enemy units that have lost one or more wounds already this turn" is probably the best of the Renegades, I'd argue that it's going to be the one we see in competitive builds. I ran it in a list with Contemptors and Oblits to try it out and my opponent was shocked at how powerful it was.

If you like re-rolling wounds then Arch-contaminator Death Guard are exactly that, super fun & powerful too IMO and experience.

Kuklops wrote:

gruyere wrote:
Damnit, the Purge trait is rerolling to hits, which is so much worse than rerolling wounds that I initially thought. Ughhhhhhh.... Probably not worth giving up VOTLW in that case. What a shame, I really did like it when I thought it was rerolling wounds!

You're joking right? The Purge "re-roll hit rolls for attacks made by units with this trait that target enemy units that have lost one or more wounds already this turn" is probably the best of the Renegades, I'd argue that it's going to be the one we see in competitive builds. I ran it in a list with Contemptors and Oblits to try it out and my opponent was shocked at how powerful it was.

If you like re-rolling wounds then Arch-contaminator Death Guard are exactly that, super fun & powerful too IMO and experience.

I mean, sticking them beside a Chaos Lord/DP gives them rerolling 1s, already, so you are basically only getting rerolling 2s on the purge units. This is at the cost of losing VOTLW. I guess it depends on how you run your army and I could very well be wrong, but I think i'd rather stick an HQ near my guns and have access to another legion trait and/or VOTLW. Not to mention you do have to turn on your Legion trait. The Purge is fine, but it is just worse than what I thought is all

 Binabik15 wrote:
I did a stupid and I now have a squad of Ghal Vorbak and the dude with blade-slaves coming my way for "Word Bearers" (rules-wise their keyword is yet to be decided).

What do I do with those guys?! It's not just about effectiveness of different choices - I'm already taking sub-optimal loadouts on other squads because they're bigger, badder remakes of models I did in my early teens - but even what to run them as is stumping me a bit. If I run them as 5/7 possessed the Shadowspear GP won't actually deserve that name anymore. 9 GP seem a tad too much, though I could build even bigger Greater Possessed and use all the others as a 9 man squad of Possessed, but then *those* GP would start to be Mutilator-sized or be confused with small Demon Princes. I could run the blade-slaves and Ghal Vorbak as a load of spawns, but they're still a bit on the tame side for spawns. Giant Chosen could be an option that works, but why some big guys in mutated armour give buffs to demons and others stand back and shoot combi-bolters would still be a head-scratcher, even with the right guns on the resin dudes.

I have over 20 Gal Vorbak (converted to Nurgle) and use mine as Possessed, for Greater Possessed I have made 2 out of the Gellerpox dude with the big claw as they're a touch bigger than Gal Vorbak and fit the Nurgle theme. Honestly, you have 2 options: 1) run them all as Possessed, a unit of 7 is cool, stick them in a Rhino or Dreadclaw and stuff them down someone's flank with a few GP and a MoP). 2) IMO two of the Gal Vorbak are kinda meh models (the two smaller ones stood still with no mutations to their legs) so I would run them all as Greater Possessed as I think a new Possessed kit is due next year from inferences made from Jes Goodwin.

gruyere wrote:

Spoiler:

Kuklops wrote:

gruyere wrote:
Damnit, the Purge trait is rerolling to hits, which is so much worse than rerolling wounds that I initially thought. Ughhhhhhh.... Probably not worth giving up VOTLW in that case. What a shame, I really did like it when I thought it was rerolling wounds!

You're joking right? The Purge "re-roll hit rolls for attacks made by units with this trait that target enemy units that have lost one or more wounds already this turn" is probably the best of the Renegades, I'd argue that it's going to be the one we see in competitive builds. I ran it in a list with Contemptors and Oblits to try it out and my opponent was shocked at how powerful it was.

If you like re-rolling wounds then Arch-contaminator Death Guard are exactly that, super fun & powerful too IMO and experience.

I mean, sticking them beside a Chaos Lord/DP gives them rerolling 1s, already, so you are basically only getting rerolling 2s on the purge units. This is at the cost of losing VOTLW. I guess it depends on how you run your army and I could very well be wrong, but I think i'd rather stick an HQ near my guns and have access to another legion trait and/or VOTLW. Not to mention you do have to turn on your Legion trait. The Purge is fine, but it is just worse than what I thought is all

The trait gives CSM MSU with heavy weapons and helbrutes extra versatility, because you get to re-roll your 3s as well. It also helps massively versus anything that reduces your to-hit roll even when you're not moving around, like Stormravens. And for Berzerkers it's lovely, as they can use their first attack to activate the trait, then roflstomp with their free extras. But yeah, losing VotLW still makes high-T targets annoyingly difficult to kill without bringing expensive weapons.

gruyere wrote:

Kuklops wrote:

gruyere wrote:
Damnit, the Purge trait is rerolling to hits, which is so much worse than rerolling wounds that I initially thought. Ughhhhhhh.... Probably not worth giving up VOTLW in that case. What a shame, I really did like it when I thought it was rerolling wounds!

You're joking right? The Purge "re-roll hit rolls for attacks made by units with this trait that target enemy units that have lost one or more wounds already this turn" is probably the best of the Renegades, I'd argue that it's going to be the one we see in competitive builds. I ran it in a list with Contemptors and Oblits to try it out and my opponent was shocked at how powerful it was.

If you like re-rolling wounds then Arch-contaminator Death Guard are exactly that, super fun & powerful too IMO and experience.

I mean, sticking them beside a Chaos Lord/DP gives them rerolling 1s, already, so you are basically only getting rerolling 2s on the purge units. This is at the cost of losing VOTLW. I guess it depends on how you run your army and I could very well be wrong, but I think i'd rather stick an HQ near my guns and have access to another legion trait and/or VOTLW. Not to mention you do have to turn on your Legion trait. The Purge is fine, but it is just worse than what I thought is all

On first read it sounds good sure... but if you really think about it it's bonkers good if you're clever about your shooting and how you put wounds on units. Sure some stuff will be 2+ to hit but most is 3+ or 4+ in Chaos armies so already it doubles the Lord effectiveness, that stuff that has a 2+ probably degrades too as it takes damage and the game goes on... Because Purge helps there too. On the Lord, forget him, you don't need him now and you don't need to worry about keeping units within his 6" bubble either. This is big because now we can take other HQs that buff in other ways. Sure you won't get VOTLW but now you can take a Sorcerer with Death Hex, Warptime, Prescience, etc who also uses Smite to get a wound on a unit that you'll be shooting in the next phase (and re-rolling all hits). Also, as of now the Purge can be Slaanesh, so your Terminators or chaincannon Havocs can possibly shoot twice re-rolling all hits. Slaanesh Purge Terminators with a Terminator Sorcerer could be insanely brutal.
In melee re-roll all hits means you can fish for 5+/6+s to get extra attacks from DTTFE too if needs be.

I think the big draw of the Purge is that you don't need a lord or prince babysitting them. Is that enough? I mean, a lot of my lists do not love an 80 point tax sitting there by shooting units. I'd rather have a sorc in that spot. A prince is good, obviously, but good in no small part because of his melee stats; so I want him babysitting even less.

I think the purge is spiffy. VotLW is very valuable, and you should have people to use it on. But if you already do, in another detachment, then you're not really losing out on it in your purge detachment.

I think the bigger question to ask is "does this outweigh -1 to hit"? I think in certain cases it might, though I find myself always having a difficult time answering "yes" to that question >.>

Have to say that a Red Corsairs 10man csm squad with 2x RCC, bolters and combi-bolter on champion with, MoS is a decent screen/shield drone removal unit with " there's more where they came from" and endless cacocphony strat. Yes it's 4cp total, but at T1 it has proven really valuable. Anyone else have any similar success?

So the purge trait activates on any unit that has lost a wound in any way this turn right? So that includes psychic phase from another detachment? So with a bit of psychic support from Tson you will be sprinkling mortal wounds across the enemy units, handing out free rerolls to your purge detachment

 Continuity wrote:
So the purge trait activates on any unit that has lost a wound in any way this turn right? So that includes psychic phase from another detachment? So with a bit of psychic support from Tson you will be sprinkling mortal wounds across the enemy units, handing out free rerolls to your purge detachment

Yes exactly. Especially useful if you encounter -1/-2 to hit units. For competitive lists I can see Ahriman and friends in there as per usual.

Thanks, guys, so possessed it is. I was just worried that people might find them to big compared to the new GPs. The Gellerpox Hulks are already planned as Greater Possessed for my Death Guard, so I will build some other flavour of GPs for my Word Bearers. Maybe a Khornate one based on the AoS Warboss.

 Binabik15 wrote:
Thanks, guys, so possessed it is. I was just worried that people might find them to big compared to the new GPs. The Gellerpox Hulks are already planned as Greater Possessed for my Death Guard, so I will build some other flavour of GPs for my Word Bearers. Maybe a Khornate one based on the AoS Warboss.

It’s my understanding that you can’t take any of the Daemonkin stuff as DG (or, for that matter, TS)

Here is a list I've been working on. Let me know if there are any combos I might be missing. Everything has mark of slannesh to try and be Slannesh mono faction for ITC, and to use the locus of slannesh to run and charge.

Red Corsairs Battalion - Soulforged Pack:
2xLord D's w/ baleflamers (1 w/ Master of Soulforges, 1 w/ Intox Elixer)
3x5xChaos Space Marines
3xMaulerfiends w/ Lashers

Red Corsairs Spearhead - Soulforged Pack:
Lord D w/ Baleflamer
3xVenomcrawlers

Chaos Daemons Supreme Command Detachment:
Daemon Prince of Chaos - Warlord/2xtalons/The Forbidden Gem/Celerity of Slaanesh
2xHeralds on Steeds

This leaves me with 122 points to throw an extra support character in or fiends. What do you guys think? I could put in a chainlord (without a priest or mark of khorne/taking warlord from my slaanesh prince), a sorc w/ Jump pack, or a 3 man squad of fiends to hold stuff in combat, a priest (will be left behind immediately). My only worry is that I currently have no unit to use endless cacophony or veterans of the long war on and so am missing out on 2 of the best CSM strats (Although to be fair I only have 8CP at the start of the game and I might just use them all on re-rolls)

Kuklops wrote:

gruyere wrote:

Kuklops wrote:

gruyere wrote:
Damnit, the Purge trait is rerolling to hits, which is so much worse than rerolling wounds that I initially thought. Ughhhhhhh.... Probably not worth giving up VOTLW in that case. What a shame, I really did like it when I thought it was rerolling wounds!

You're joking right? The Purge "re-roll hit rolls for attacks made by units with this trait that target enemy units that have lost one or more wounds already this turn" is probably the best of the Renegades, I'd argue that it's going to be the one we see in competitive builds. I ran it in a list with Contemptors and Oblits to try it out and my opponent was shocked at how powerful it was.

If you like re-rolling wounds then Arch-contaminator Death Guard are exactly that, super fun & powerful too IMO and experience.

I mean, sticking them beside a Chaos Lord/DP gives them rerolling 1s, already, so you are basically only getting rerolling 2s on the purge units. This is at the cost of losing VOTLW. I guess it depends on how you run your army and I could very well be wrong, but I think i'd rather stick an HQ near my guns and have access to another legion trait and/or VOTLW. Not to mention you do have to turn on your Legion trait. The Purge is fine, but it is just worse than what I thought is all

On first read it sounds good sure... but if you really think about it it's bonkers good if you're clever about your shooting and how you put wounds on units. Sure some stuff will be 2+ to hit but most is 3+ or 4+ in Chaos armies so already it doubles the Lord effectiveness, that stuff that has a 2+ probably degrades too as it takes damage and the game goes on... Because Purge helps there too. On the Lord, forget him, you don't need him now and you don't need to worry about keeping units within his 6" bubble either. This is big because now we can take other HQs that buff in other ways. Sure you won't get VOTLW but now you can take a Sorcerer with Death Hex, Warptime, Prescience, etc who also uses Smite to get a wound on a unit that you'll be shooting in the next phase (and re-rolling all hits). Also, as of now the Purge can be Slaanesh, so your Terminators or chaincannon Havocs can possibly shoot twice re-rolling all hits. Slaanesh Purge Terminators with a Terminator Sorcerer could be insanely brutal.
In melee re-roll all hits means you can fish for 5+/6+s to get extra attacks from DTTFE too if needs be.

Slaanesh purged? They are a nurgle warband.

And gw did not fix then to a mark, so what.

Not Online!!! wrote:

Spoiler:

Heafstaag wrote:

Kuklops wrote:

gruyere wrote:

Kuklops wrote:

gruyere wrote:
Damnit, the Purge trait is rerolling to hits, which is so much worse than rerolling wounds that I initially thought. Ughhhhhhh.... Probably not worth giving up VOTLW in that case. What a shame, I really did like it when I thought it was rerolling wounds!

You're joking right? The Purge "re-roll hit rolls for attacks made by units with this trait that target enemy units that have lost one or more wounds already this turn" is probably the best of the Renegades, I'd argue that it's going to be the one we see in competitive builds. I ran it in a list with Contemptors and Oblits to try it out and my opponent was shocked at how powerful it was.

If you like re-rolling wounds then Arch-contaminator Death Guard are exactly that, super fun & powerful too IMO and experience.

I mean, sticking them beside a Chaos Lord/DP gives them rerolling 1s, already, so you are basically only getting rerolling 2s on the purge units. This is at the cost of losing VOTLW. I guess it depends on how you run your army and I could very well be wrong, but I think i'd rather stick an HQ near my guns and have access to another legion trait and/or VOTLW. Not to mention you do have to turn on your Legion trait. The Purge is fine, but it is just worse than what I thought is all

On first read it sounds good sure... but if you really think about it it's bonkers good if you're clever about your shooting and how you put wounds on units. Sure some stuff will be 2+ to hit but most is 3+ or 4+ in Chaos armies so already it doubles the Lord effectiveness, that stuff that has a 2+ probably degrades too as it takes damage and the game goes on... Because Purge helps there too. On the Lord, forget him, you don't need him now and you don't need to worry about keeping units within his 6" bubble either. This is big because now we can take other HQs that buff in other ways. Sure you won't get VOTLW but now you can take a Sorcerer with Death Hex, Warptime, Prescience, etc who also uses Smite to get a wound on a unit that you'll be shooting in the next phase (and re-rolling all hits). Also, as of now the Purge can be Slaanesh, so your Terminators or chaincannon Havocs can possibly shoot twice re-rolling all hits. Slaanesh Purge Terminators with a Terminator Sorcerer could be insanely brutal.
In melee re-roll all hits means you can fish for 5+/6+s to get extra attacks from DTTFE too if needs be.

Slaanesh purged? They are a nurgle warband.

And gw did not fix then to a mark, so what.

...Well I'm sure that will be fixed soon. Also, it butchers the narrative...its like having slaanesh thousand sons. Doesn't make sense.

Heafstaag wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

Spoiler:

Heafstaag wrote:

Kuklops wrote:

gruyere wrote:

Kuklops wrote:

gruyere wrote:
Damnit, the Purge trait is rerolling to hits, which is so much worse than rerolling wounds that I initially thought. Ughhhhhhh.... Probably not worth giving up VOTLW in that case. What a shame, I really did like it when I thought it was rerolling wounds!

You're joking right? The Purge "re-roll hit rolls for attacks made by units with this trait that target enemy units that have lost one or more wounds already this turn" is probably the best of the Renegades, I'd argue that it's going to be the one we see in competitive builds. I ran it in a list with Contemptors and Oblits to try it out and my opponent was shocked at how powerful it was.

If you like re-rolling wounds then Arch-contaminator Death Guard are exactly that, super fun & powerful too IMO and experience.

I mean, sticking them beside a Chaos Lord/DP gives them rerolling 1s, already, so you are basically only getting rerolling 2s on the purge units. This is at the cost of losing VOTLW. I guess it depends on how you run your army and I could very well be wrong, but I think i'd rather stick an HQ near my guns and have access to another legion trait and/or VOTLW. Not to mention you do have to turn on your Legion trait. The Purge is fine, but it is just worse than what I thought is all

On first read it sounds good sure... but if you really think about it it's bonkers good if you're clever about your shooting and how you put wounds on units. Sure some stuff will be 2+ to hit but most is 3+ or 4+ in Chaos armies so already it doubles the Lord effectiveness, that stuff that has a 2+ probably degrades too as it takes damage and the game goes on... Because Purge helps there too. On the Lord, forget him, you don't need him now and you don't need to worry about keeping units within his 6" bubble either. This is big because now we can take other HQs that buff in other ways. Sure you won't get VOTLW but now you can take a Sorcerer with Death Hex, Warptime, Prescience, etc who also uses Smite to get a wound on a unit that you'll be shooting in the next phase (and re-rolling all hits). Also, as of now the Purge can be Slaanesh, so your Terminators or chaincannon Havocs can possibly shoot twice re-rolling all hits. Slaanesh Purge Terminators with a Terminator Sorcerer could be insanely brutal.
In melee re-roll all hits means you can fish for 5+/6+s to get extra attacks from DTTFE too if needs be.

Slaanesh purged? They are a nurgle warband.

And gw did not fix then to a mark, so what.

...Well I'm sure that will be fixed soon. Also, it butchers the narrative...its like having slaanesh thousand sons. Doesn't make sense.

So what gw butchered the narrative quite often.
Also like the typo situation, stop making me laugh.

urzaplanewalker wrote:
Here is a list I've been working on. Let me know if there are any combos I might be missing. Everything has mark of slannesh to try and be Slannesh mono faction for ITC, and to use the locus of slannesh to run and charge.

Red Corsairs Battalion - Soulforged Pack:
2xLord D's w/ baleflamers (1 w/ Master of Soulforges, 1 w/ Intox Elixer)
3x5xChaos Space Marines
3xMaulerfiends w/ Lashers

Red Corsairs Spearhead - Soulforged Pack:
Lord D w/ Baleflamer
3xVenomcrawlers

Chaos Daemons Supreme Command Detachment:
Daemon Prince of Chaos - Warlord/2xtalons/The Forbidden Gem/Celerity of Slaanesh
2xHeralds on Steeds

This leaves me with 122 points to throw an extra support character in or fiends. What do you guys think? I could put in a chainlord (without a priest or mark of khorne/taking warlord from my slaanesh prince), a sorc w/ Jump pack, or a 3 man squad of fiends to hold stuff in combat, a priest (will be left behind immediately). My only worry is that I currently have no unit to use endless cacophony or veterans of the long war on and so am missing out on 2 of the best CSM strats (Although to be fair I only have 8CP at the start of the game and I might just use them all on re-rolls)

TBH I’d be inclined to drop a Herald and make it a Vanguard with multiple Fiend units. You’ve got a pretty good chance of executing multiple T1 charges, seizing an opportunity to keep something manacled to take more licks (and maybe even a Hysterical Frenzy) perhaps ought not rely on a single unit not rolling badly on its Advance.

I wouldn’t worry about lacking VOTLW, you’re going to get some good Daemonforges in. Lacking Warptime feels like more of a concern. How are you working out 8CP, I see ten? 3+5+1+1+3+1=14, -2 -1 -1 =10


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Not Online!!! wrote:

Heafstaag wrote:

Not Online!!! wrote:

Spoiler:

Heafstaag wrote:

Kuklops wrote:

gruyere wrote:

Kuklops wrote:

gruyere wrote:
Damnit, the Purge trait is rerolling to hits, which is so much worse than rerolling wounds that I initially thought. Ughhhhhhh.... Probably not worth giving up VOTLW in that case. What a shame, I really did like it when I thought it was rerolling wounds!

You're joking right? The Purge "re-roll hit rolls for attacks made by units with this trait that target enemy units that have lost one or more wounds already this turn" is probably the best of the Renegades, I'd argue that it's going to be the one we see in competitive builds. I ran it in a list with Contemptors and Oblits to try it out and my opponent was shocked at how powerful it was.

If you like re-rolling wounds then Arch-contaminator Death Guard are exactly that, super fun & powerful too IMO and experience.

I mean, sticking them beside a Chaos Lord/DP gives them rerolling 1s, already, so you are basically only getting rerolling 2s on the purge units. This is at the cost of losing VOTLW. I guess it depends on how you run your army and I could very well be wrong, but I think i'd rather stick an HQ near my guns and have access to another legion trait and/or VOTLW. Not to mention you do have to turn on your Legion trait. The Purge is fine, but it is just worse than what I thought is all

On first read it sounds good sure... but if you really think about it it's bonkers good if you're clever about your shooting and how you put wounds on units. Sure some stuff will be 2+ to hit but most is 3+ or 4+ in Chaos armies so already it doubles the Lord effectiveness, that stuff that has a 2+ probably degrades too as it takes damage and the game goes on... Because Purge helps there too. On the Lord, forget him, you don't need him now and you don't need to worry about keeping units within his 6" bubble either. This is big because now we can take other HQs that buff in other ways. Sure you won't get VOTLW but now you can take a Sorcerer with Death Hex, Warptime, Prescience, etc who also uses Smite to get a wound on a unit that you'll be shooting in the next phase (and re-rolling all hits). Also, as of now the Purge can be Slaanesh, so your Terminators or chaincannon Havocs can possibly shoot twice re-rolling all hits. Slaanesh Purge Terminators with a Terminator Sorcerer could be insanely brutal.
In melee re-roll all hits means you can fish for 5+/6+s to get extra attacks from DTTFE too if needs be.

Slaanesh purged? They are a nurgle warband.

And gw did not fix then to a mark, so what.

...Well I'm sure that will be fixed soon. Also, it butchers the narrative...its like having slaanesh thousand sons. Doesn't make sense.

So what gw butchered the narrative quite often.
Also like the typo situation, stop making me laugh.

I’d like to strongly advise against ordering a crate of Havocs and painting them lilac & green until we’ve seen the first FAQ. And even then, it’d be risky.

Again, i have a inkling they won't make renegades god specific due to that beeing a even worse disadvantage then losing out on VotLW.

Sure gw might do it but then i also think cult marine like units would need to be implemented to improve the specific god renegades Bands.

 lindsay40k wrote:

 Binabik15 wrote:
Thanks, guys, so possessed it is. I was just worried that people might find them to big compared to the new GPs. The Gellerpox Hulks are already planned as Greater Possessed for my Death Guard, so I will build some other flavour of GPs for my Word Bearers. Maybe a Khornate one based on the AoS Warboss.

It’s my understanding that you can’t take any of the Daemonkin stuff as DG (or, for that matter, TS)

This is correct. None of the new stuff can use Death Guard or Thousand Sons to replace <Legion>.

 lindsay40k wrote:


TBH I’d be inclined to drop a Herald and make it a Vanguard with multiple Fiend units. You’ve got a pretty good chance of executing multiple T1 charges, seizing an opportunity to keep something manacled to take more licks (and maybe even a Hysterical Frenzy) perhaps ought not rely on a single unit not rolling badly on its Advance.

I wouldn’t worry about lacking VOTLW, you’re going to get some good Daemonforges in. Lacking Warptime feels like more of a concern. How are you working out 8CP, I see ten? 3+5+1+1+3+1=14, -2 -1 -1 =10

It would actually be 9. Was missing 1 from the spearhead. 3+5+3+1+1=13, -3-1=9

I'm afraid of taking a bunch of small units (T4 4-8W at 5++) for the opponent to get easy kills for ITC scoring. Also, I'd prefer having 2 heralds as assassins are really stepping up and I'd hate to lose by +1 strength bubble to a lucky turn 1 shot. I'd also like to be able to go wide and have multiple locii hanging around. Do you think having 1-2 more fiends is worth all these issues? Have you had a lot of luck with them?

I could take a sorc on jump pack instead for some warp timing/Diabolical strength/Death hex stuff. Do you think that the sorc is worth dropping the fiends?

urzaplanewalker wrote:

 lindsay40k wrote:


TBH I’d be inclined to drop a Herald and make it a Vanguard with multiple Fiend units. You’ve got a pretty good chance of executing multiple T1 charges, seizing an opportunity to keep something manacled to take more licks (and maybe even a Hysterical Frenzy) perhaps ought not rely on a single unit not rolling badly on its Advance.

I wouldn’t worry about lacking VOTLW, you’re going to get some good Daemonforges in. Lacking Warptime feels like more of a concern. How are you working out 8CP, I see ten? 3+5+1+1+3+1=14, -2 -1 -1 =10

It would actually be 9. Was missing 1 from the spearhead. 3+5+3+1+1=13, -3-1=9

I'm afraid of taking a bunch of small units (T4 4-8W at 5++) for the opponent to get easy kills for ITC scoring. Also, I'd prefer having 2 heralds as assassins are really stepping up and I'd hate to lose by +1 strength bubble to a lucky turn 1 shot. I'd also like to be able to go wide and have multiple locii hanging around. Do you think having 1-2 more fiends is worth all these issues? Have you had a lot of luck with them?

I could take a sorc on jump pack instead for some warp timing/Diabolical strength/Death hex stuff. Do you think that the sorc is worth dropping the fiends?

Not sure... I’ve been using both together to decent effect. If you budget 2CP to reroll their advance and charge, a single unit can work. Perhaps a Venomcrawler could free up the points for a sorcerer? (If you’re worried about snipers and Index units are allowed, a Steed would have nice Daemonkin synergy and drop the INFANTRY vulnerability)

Speaking of finding two CP, I make your totals:
Turning up +3
Battalion +5
Red Corsairs detachment with three Heretac units +3
Spearhead +1
Red Corsairs detachment with three units +1
Supreme Command +1
Subtotal 14
Soulforged Pack -1
Field Commander -1
Gifts of Chaos -1
Soulforged Pack -1
Total 10

 lindsay40k wrote:


Not sure... I’ve been using both together to decent effect. If you budget 2CP to reroll their advance and charge, a single unit can work. Perhaps a Venomcrawler could free up the points for a sorcerer? (If you’re worried about snipers and Index units are allowed, a Steed would have nice Daemonkin synergy and drop the INFANTRY vulnerability)

Speaking of finding two CP, I make your totals:
Turning up +3
Battalion +5
Red Corsairs detachment with three Heretac units +3
Spearhead +1
Red Corsairs detachment with three units +1
Supreme Command +1
Subtotal 14
Soulforged Pack -1
Field Commander -1
Gifts of Chaos -1
Soulforged Pack -1
Total 10

Red corsair trait says that you get +1 for having 3 units with trait and +3 INSTEAD if you have 3 CSM units, so they don't stack unf.

I'll try it both ways (sorc or fiends / sorc first because I don't have any fiends yet) and mess around with stuff. I'm not sure if I'd be willing to drop a Venomwalker with all the Synergies it has. The steed on the Sorc was an idea, but then he loses Infantry and so is harder to hide in ruins and jump to exactly where I need him, which I would take over making him -1 to wound from a vindicare. The steed also costs significantly more and doesn't fit in 122 points (127).

urzaplanewalker wrote:

 lindsay40k wrote:


Not sure... I’ve been using both together to decent effect. If you budget 2CP to reroll their advance and charge, a single unit can work. Perhaps a Venomcrawler could free up the points for a sorcerer? (If you’re worried about snipers and Index units are allowed, a Steed would have nice Daemonkin synergy and drop the INFANTRY vulnerability)

Speaking of finding two CP, I make your totals:
Turning up +3
Battalion +5
Red Corsairs detachment with three Heretac units +3
Spearhead +1
Red Corsairs detachment with three units +1
Supreme Command +1
Subtotal 14
Soulforged Pack -1
Field Commander -1
Gifts of Chaos -1
Soulforged Pack -1
Total 10

Red corsair trait says that you get +1 for having 3 units with trait and +3 INSTEAD if you have 3 CSM units, so they don't stack unf.

Ooooh, it has to be foot troops or bikes or Helbrutes. You’re right, three Venomcrawlers (or Forgefiends) doesn’t qualify. Gah, why did they have to write our abilities backwards from a conclusion of ‘put everyone’s converted cavalry on notice for Squatting’

So I would actually consider changing that red corsairs to black legion and take the half damage warlord trait. Yes, it does expose the warlord, but you're distorting their target priority so hard by luring them to shoot at a lord discordant with twice the endurance. I'd also pick up the mechadentrils on one of them in place of the forbiden gem.

I like the mounted heralds, but I think a decent use of your 122 remaining points would be to boost them up to heralds on chariots; I think they are well worth the not-too-many-more points and handing out a few chain cannons to your msu marines.

I'm actually considering a very similar list, but with keepers of secrets in place of mauler fiends. I really have a soft spot for KoS and I feel they're decently survivable in a list with as much saturation of 'vehicle-like' stats as this one.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also I think the baleflamers are a trap; I get that you want an assault weapon because you're going to be advancing, but it still feels like a waste of points.

So I just got a my first game in with 3 x lord discordants. Honestly they preformed up to my high expectations, which is a good overall sign for their usefulness. Let me go into specifics

Durability: as expected this is his weakest area. 12 2+ 5++ wounds is enough to protect him from a stiff breeze, but dedicated firepower will wipe out Lord Discordants. I used the +1 wound 6+++ warlord trait on 1 guy as I was running red Corsairs over black legion for the CP, but now I’m seriously considering black legion even though I lose CP.

Offense: the lord discordant hits like a truck. I played knights today and he is certainly up to killing them. Daemon forge re-rolls plus 5+ death to false emporer triggers ensure the lord pumps out tons of attacks that will hit and wound fairly constantly. Even more so with buffs like diabloc strength, virluent touch, and Elixir. Point for point there isn’t anything as Efficient at killing as a lord discordant.

Speed: lord discordants are fast. You already knew this.

So if you get around the lord’s durbitly issues, he is well worth it. I think you’ll always have to run 3, and you’ll want something else to draw fire away from them (primarchs, Kitan, knight/, etc). Overall anyway you can increase the lord discordants ability to survive is a good thing as he wrecks face with only a little help.