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Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka





Bathing in elitist French expats fumes

It'll go up. it'll boom like other KS. There's a lot of people on the fence, but there's a lot of them, I would bet, that are already sold and are just waiting for the last few minutes because there's no incentive otherwise, the EBs are long gone.

I'm paying a beer to everyone who says "no big upswing" if it does happen.

 GamesWorkshop wrote:
And I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for you meddling kids!

 
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

No big upswing.

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"For this thread to have some utility and remain useful, please refrain from spamming it with 'jokes'." - Alpharius
"Irrational negativity is the engine that drives the forums" - BrassScorpion
"It's too early to be crying about this. Maybe next month all your tears will be valid." - Redbeard

200+ Successful Trades on Dakka.
My trade list: http://mindtaker.org/trade.html 
   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Jolly bringer of death and suspensions






Cozy cockpit of an Imperial Knight

We'll see, I'm a bit skeptical myself about how this one will end.

Be ash and cinder forevermore!

V - 11 | T - 3 | 敗 - 40

DakkaDakka | Where you thank the mods for baning you! 
   
Made in gb
Aspirant Tech-Adept





UK

It might not go crazy, but I'm sure there'll the be a bit of a lift. It's not going to collapse or anything.

Angels Amaranthine - growing slowly

P&M blog ; http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/488077.page

Currently 200pts 
   
Made in us
Blood Angel Terminator with Lightning Claws





Norfolk, NE

I already said it, but there won't be the "big" upswing at the end.

It will increase, but not anywhere near what other Kicks have seen in the final 48 like; Myth, DZ, KoW, Robotech, etc..

I wouldn't be surprised if there was an upswing around the time reminders go out, and then a drop-off within 12 hours of that because RH can't react fast enough with Updates and fresh Goals to ride the frenzy.



Something is happening on the 24th, we sent you a poster.
 
   
Made in ca
Been Around the Block




Vancouver, Canada

 Kroothawk wrote:
 Fafnir wrote:
With that in mind, why are we not seeing any works in progress?

With so many people desperate to post negative comments, showing imperfect early WIP pics is not a good idea.


That's pretty odd logic...

"People are angry about our lack up updates and us not showing WIP pics..."
"Should we show them our WIP pictures?"
"What are you nuts?"
   
Made in us
Sickening Carrion



I forgot

 TalonZahn wrote:
I wouldn't be surprised if there was an upswing around the time reminders go out, and then a drop-off within 12 hours of that because RH can't react fast enough with Updates and fresh Goals to ride the frenzy.


I agree, but to a point, I don't believe there will be a frenzy unless the unlocks keep flowing fully and completely. If the unlocks are as slow to being unlocked as they are now, we may not reach the frenzied masses. There is hope, there is time, but will they capitalize on it is the question.
   
Made in ca
Been Around the Block




Vancouver, Canada

 TalonZahn wrote:
I already said it, but there won't be the "big" upswing at the end.

It will increase, but not anywhere near what other Kicks have seen in the final 48 like; Myth, DZ, KoW, Robotech, etc..

I wouldn't be surprised if there was an upswing around the time reminders go out, and then a drop-off within 12 hours of that because RH can't react fast enough with Updates and fresh Goals to ride the frenzy.


I agree with this... there's no momentum and everyone who's would pledged, already has. Unless the do a huge blowout at the end, I wouldn't be surprised if I saw people drop off.

In the end, it's a bunch of great looking miniatures from a poorly run kickstarter. It's a good lesson for people in the future. Kickstarter is not a pre-order system. People are investing in a hypothetical product with no guarantee they'll get it or when. If you're not going to reward them (there's no arguing that the freebies are lackluster), then there's no reason for them to risk their money.

   
Made in de
Camouflaged Zero






 TalonZahn wrote:
and then a drop-off within 12 hours of that because RH can't react fast enough with Updates and fresh Goals to ride the frenzy.


They were pretty quick with the EB during the first minutes of the kickstarter campaign and i am sure they set aside some time (or more likely all of it) to maintain the kickstarter page during the final hours. They'll manage.
   
Made in nl
[MOD]
Jolly bringer of death and suspensions






Cozy cockpit of an Imperial Knight

We'll see won't we?

Be ash and cinder forevermore!

V - 11 | T - 3 | 敗 - 40

DakkaDakka | Where you thank the mods for baning you! 
   
Made in de
Camouflaged Zero






Twelvecarpileup 530736 5771347 wrote:there's no arguing that the freebies are lackluster


They are? I thought they were pretty cool miniatures. I would pledge just for them actually.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/06/23 21:29:58


 
   
Made in us
Sickening Carrion



I forgot

 Minx wrote:
 TalonZahn wrote:
and then a drop-off within 12 hours of that because RH can't react fast enough with Updates and fresh Goals to ride the frenzy.


They were pretty quick with the EB during the first minutes of the kickstarter campaign and i am sure they set aside some time (or more likely all of it) to maintain the kickstarter page during the final hours. They'll manage.


Someone seems to have forgotten the lack luster performance of the first 3 days. Or that Update 1 was a FORCED update, that came close to 5 hours after the initial release of the bad EBs.
   
Made in de
Camouflaged Zero






somewheresomehow wrote:
 Minx wrote:
They were pretty quick with the EB during the first minutes of the kickstarter campaign and i am sure they set aside some time (or more likely all of it) to maintain the kickstarter page during the final hours. They'll manage.


Someone seems to have forgotten the lack luster performance of the first 3 days. Or that Update 1 was a FORCED update, that came close to 5 hours after the initial release of the bad EBs.


I was only talking about the first minutes and the additional pledge levels back then.

Edit: And yes, the updates since then weren't on time, esp. during the first days. I assume they were quite busy sketching, sculpting and organizing things related to the miniatures of this campaign. Stuff that is either finished or set aside in about two weeks time for the last hours.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/06/23 21:46:34


 
   
Made in us
Sickening Carrion



I forgot

That was within the first minutes. The bad EBs came with the first press. The 350 commander being an example (it is actually the original Captain EB release.)

I am just saying, unless they set aside time NOW, to start working on fast crack updates, they won't be able to even come close to retaining the strength of a strong upswing at the end, and kill it pre-maturely.

Kind of like Arena Rex, another 3 person team. They lost some momentum at the end as they ran out of things to throw to the hungry masses. I can see that easily happening with RH, who has worse communication skills, and less signs of having WIPs or renders. Heck, people heckled the AR figures, they still showed em! Unlike RH, they are literally a true starter company, whereas RH has been around a bit.
   
Made in gr
Thermo-Optical Spekter





Greece

ONE SHOT BLONDIE, FROM CONCEPT TO 3D-PRINT

Update #24 · Jun 24, 2013 · comment
You've been asking a lot about how the finalized miniatures would look in the end. So first off, here is an image of One-Shot Blondie that will help you understand get a better feel of what you can expect. (Story continues below image)


http://i918.photobucket.com/albums/ad27/Raging-Heroes/TGG/comparatif-one-shot-concept-3D-print_zps82850262.jpg

One-Shot Blondie is a character we've been working on for quite some time now. And so she's a good example for us to use to share with you how we work on a miniature.
It also is a good example of how we translate concept art into sculpts, and what you can expect as a final product based on the concepts we are showing in the Toughest Girls of the Galaxy Kickstarter.

In traditional sculpting, a sculptor works alone on his sculpt in a linear fashion. He begins by setting up an armature, then adds masses to define the silhouette, and keeps on adding details until the miniature is finished.

At Raging Heroes, our sculpts come to life through a very collaborative process that is not entirely linear. Once the concept art is finalized and approved, there are generally 4 persons involved in the sculpt of a miniature.

Posing comes first

Let's take the example of One-Shot Blondie. Once they've created a nude body with the correct proportions, Art Director Benoit and Sculpt Supervisor Jean-Romain start researching the pose in 3D. Benoit is the vision behind Raging Heroes. He's the one developing the characters and the Raging Heroes look, stye and feel. His work goes from the very early ideas to the final touches on a sculpt. Jean-Romain supervises all the sculpts. In addition to sculpting himself and bringing his own personal take to a miniature, he also makes sure that all the sculpts fit the technical specs needed for printing and casting. He also supervises a good chunk of the freelancers' work, and he also liaise with the foundries to make sure everything goes right once the minis are in production.

The first iteration of posing is in general very fast. In the case of a character like Blondie, we sometimes also add mock-ups accessories like the cape and the gun to get a better feel of the general silhouette.

Once we have this first version, Mireille comes in and helps revise the pose. She's very talented at detecting minor mistakes and deviations from the concept art, or, on the contrary, at slightly changing small element of the pose to powerfully translate the 2D image in a 3D sculpture because sometimes, the concept art uses visual cheat that cannot be reproduced in 3D. Mireille's background in actors' coaching helps her to add nuances to the body language of the character so that we can get the strongest possible expressivity.

Once we're at this stage, you'd still find the sculpt pretty ugly, and that's one of the reasons we tend to refrain showing work-in-progress sculpts unless we are very close to the last stages. In fact, there's always an amazing difference between what you see during 90% of the sculpting work, and what happens in the last 10% of it. It's really at that time that characters come to life and acquire their unique personality and definitive look.

Getting dressed

Depending on the character, Jean-Romain, Benoit, or Andrea will then start dressing it up by creating all the clothing, props and accessories for the character. Andrea Tarabella is a young Italian sculptor who's been working with us for several months now. He works fast and generally is in charge of the first stages of sculpt development, laying down all the elements that give their basic shape to the sculpts. He's also begun to do more and more posing work, and has been a key element in developing the troops sculpts of the TGG Kickstarter.

During this stage, there are 2 distinct jobs to do: creating all the accessories while being true to the concept and making sure that these accessories can actually fit the posing of the character, and ensuring that they fit the requirement of production (being thick enough so they won't break, not creating undercuts that could be problematic with mould-making, etc.).

Refining the sculpt

After this stage, we've got a sculpt that is acceptable, but really lacks in charisma and elegance. So, once again, Benoit, Mireille and Jean-Romain sit in front of the screen together to correct the posing and adjust the proportions of the main elements so that the silhouette comes very close to its final version. Sometimes, we even go back and recreate the pose entirely from scratch, now that all the clothing and accessories are there to give us a better feel of the bulk and proportions of the character.

In the next step, Jean-Romain and sometimes Benoit refine all the accessories and add the last details. They often work on the character alternatively to regularly provide a fresh eye to the sculpt.

Getting the proportions right

Once that's done, we finally have a decent work-in-progress sculpt. But generally, at that point, we once again tweak the proportions. It's very subtle, but it really makes a difference. With now 4 years of experience, we have come to learn that what we see on the screen will be exactly the same in terms of details in the final miniature.

However, we also know that the perception of proportion on a 2D screen and on an actual cast is in fact very different. On a screen, sculpts tend to appear more squat and with bigger heads or hands, and most of the time, the weapons seem truly enormous. However, once you have the miniature in hand, it looks slender and what looked like a heavy log is now a very elegant sword.

That is another reason why it can be misleading for us to show you 3D renders. When we do that, we often see on forums many comments on proportion issues and then, a few weeks later, when people finally get their mini, we read rave reviews on how well they are proportioned and “just the right size”.

By the way, this is the reason why, when we work, we have to keep on zooming out the sculpts on our screens to their actual 28mm size or even smaller. And believe me, that looks very small on a 21-inch screen! But this helps us get a better feel for the final proportions and product.

Final steps

Anyway, once we are there, Jean-Romain takes the sculpt through its final sculpting stage. First of all, he starts by completely cleaning the model. That means resharpening all angles and edges, smoothing lines, etc., while still keeping a very organic feel to the model. He also removes all the little problems like undercuts, fills gap we might have missed before, makes sure that all the details are strong enough for the printing process, etc.

Once again, Mireille and Benoit then stand behind him in front of the screen to do a final round of last-minute touch-ups. Constantly bringing a fresh eye to the sculpt is essential until the final moments to detect previously unnoticed problems and make sure that the under all angles. Because a mini can look great when we look at it full-front, but not work at all once we spin it by 45°, for example.

And, at last, the sculpt is cut in pieces and prepared for 3D printing. So until this very last minute, the scaling and proportion is subject to refinement to make sure we get the best possible result.

Of course, this is a general example of our workflow and sometimes Benoit, Jean-Romain or Andrea will do a full sculpt nearly all by themselves before the rest of the team comes in.

This workflow, while being demanding on the entire team, is not only a guarantee of a great result, but it is also very efficient when we need to work with new sculptors while still preserving the Raging Heroes style and feel.

Last-minute changes

Is is not unusual for us to make a final change to a sculpt AFTER it comes back from 3D printing. When we begin a new series of characters, having an actual physical miniature in hand helps us assess its final proportions. And so it is with Blondie. There will be a very minor tweak to her head, because when we compare it to other minis, it is a tiny bit too small.

We hope this helps you to understand our process a bit more, and to give you an insight on how very special the minis you are pledging for will be, from full-blown Heroines to Troopers. Indeed, if you look at the Units we've done in the past (Mantis, SF Blood Vestals Troops and Command Group, for example), you'll see that the attention to detail and posing for those is the same as for our other Hero miniatures.

We'll talk a bit more about the Troops and show you photos of the first test 3D-printed trooper on Tuesday. But meanwhile, here's another look at the 3D-printed prototype of One-Shot Blondie:

   
Made in us
Sickening Carrion



I forgot

So... I was going to quote the above.. but it broke, so...

THIS! This is what I am talking about! This can push them forwards! More like this, and we can all breath easier!

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/06/23 21:56:47


 
   
Made in de
Camouflaged Zero






The print came out very nice indeed.

And i guess we'll see more prints in the coming days. Can't wait.
   
Made in gb
Hard-Wired Sentinel Pilot





Usually somewhere in England

Looks amazing - one shot blondie is definitely on my list now!

More like this and we might get moving.
   
Made in gb
Da Head Honcho Boss Grot





UK

I am even considering upping my pledge now, this is all I wanted to see, now I have I am pretty dam happy
   
Made in gb
Swift Swooping Hawk






That looks pretty perfect.
   
Made in au
Three Color Minimum






Is it just me, or does her left arm look a bit... off?

   
Made in gb
Swift Swooping Hawk






In what sense? Looks ok to me (although tricky to tell with one angle)
   
Made in us
Hallowed Canoness





The Void

Looks alright to me, I've held rifles in that position enough.

I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long

Oorah to ashes

SoB, IG, SM, SW, FoW Germans
DR:90-SG+M+B+I+Pw40k12+ID+++A+++/are/WD-R+++T(S)DM+ 
   
Made in us
Sickening Carrion



I forgot

Left as we view the mini, or real left? I think there might be a tad bit of elongation to the left as we see it mini arm (to place it in the proper length of weapon to human as a ratio,) but it doesn't look like enough to make it "off."

And... now I am confused. Great update, great looking 3D printed mini, pledges are dropping. This kickstarter is starting to make no sense. All rules are off! THE END IS NIGH!
   
Made in us
Mutating Changebringer





Pennsylvania

Be calm somewheresomehow...




Far from being off, things are hewing closely to established patterns.

   
Made in se
Dakka Veteran




A 3d print will not make existing backers add more to their current pledge right now. The current backers will wait, just like on any other KS, until the final 1-2 days to adjust their pledge up or down. Any big boost mid-campaign will come purely out of new backers joining. But, the better stuff RH can provide until the final days, the better the boost will become, obviously.

Everyone should be quite familiar with how KS works these days.

   
Made in us
Sickening Carrion



I forgot

grefven wrote:
A 3d print will not make existing backers add more to their current pledge right now. The current backers will wait, just like on any other KS, until the final 1-2 days to adjust their pledge up or down. Any big boost mid-campaign will come purely out of new backers joining. But, the better stuff RH can provide until the final days, the better the boost will become, obviously.

Everyone should be quite familiar with how KS works these days.


That is the thing, there are people here, who were not backing because there were almost no WIPs, or renders, etc etc etc. This is but a small demographic slice, which then equates to possibly larger slices of the populations.

My assumption of pledge increases was that fence sitters would move in, choosing to back now that they have the information they may not have had that they wanted. Sliding backwards, I assumed would have happened yesterday, due to the somewhat mediocre updates. Not vice a versa.
   
Made in gr
Thermo-Optical Spekter





Greece

Buzzsaw, beyond proclaiming you are right, have you tried contacting them and try to make them fix this?
   
Made in se
Dakka Veteran




somewheresomehow wrote:
grefven wrote:
A 3d print will not make existing backers add more to their current pledge right now. The current backers will wait, just like on any other KS, until the final 1-2 days to adjust their pledge up or down. Any big boost mid-campaign will come purely out of new backers joining. But, the better stuff RH can provide until the final days, the better the boost will become, obviously.

Everyone should be quite familiar with how KS works these days.


That is the thing, there are people here, who were not backing because there were almost no WIPs, or renders, etc etc etc. This is but a small demographic slice, which then equates to possibly larger slices of the populations.

My assumption of pledge increases was that fence sitters would move in, choosing to back now that they have the information they may not have had that they wanted. Sliding backwards, I assumed would have happened yesterday, due to the somewhat mediocre updates. Not vice a versa.


Even if they were to move in, any "seasoned" KS-backer would only pledge the minimum $1, still to adjust it in the final 1-2 days. The only "reason" to go higher is to get an Early Bird special pledge level.

   
Made in us
Sickening Carrion



I forgot

That is assuming the veterans aren't already in, and don't already have EBs. Most of the veterans probably were part of the massive first wave, simply to grab the EBs in the beginning.

Though, "seasoned" backer implies they are not pulling in new faces who can still be quite squimish from reading everything, and seeing a lot of black silhouettes.

I know my first mini KS had me going through ups and downs of "Do I back now? Do I back later? Oh man!" And then an EB opened up, and I was all "yoink!"

Not saying that their aren't waiting veterans, but whose to say people aren't going to be vindictive with their pledges, so to speak? Did anyone ever notice that there are some mini campaigns that end with a large handful of empty EBs, that probably would have been full if people moved or dropped earlier? And this is somewhat going off topic, but into interesting territory!

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/06/23 23:25:47


 
   
 
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