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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Phoenix Lords are antiques now, hence the price hike.
   
Made in us
Awesome Autarch






Not in finecast. They're antiques that no one wants That's like an antique Pontiac Aztek...

 
   
Made in us
Furious Raptor





Looks like the standalone Death Guard elite units got bumped five dollars.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut






 totalfailure wrote:
 gorgon wrote:


This is the opposite of how things work.

There's a reason they offered a bunch of steep discount bundles along with apoc. It is because you make more money prodding people to buy it with offers of DEALS DEALS DEALS! compared to the price of the product without the deals. Upping the prices immediately after apoc is a very bad look for those kits, and only works in making bundles even more psychologically appealing, but i doubt that makes up the loss of sales a price hike entailed. It takes time for people to forget this sort of gak, you should raise prices between major releases, not just after one. And in the era of the internet, you aren't gonna get away with sneak hiking the prices either.


Disagree with just about everything you wrote. Every time GW raises prices, which has been FREQUENTLY, people get on and complain about them and tell us how they’re done and have been priced out. Yet somehow, despite all the internet blather, GW stays in business. Why? Because despite the complaining MOST PEOPLE KEEP BUYING ANYWAY! And GW knows this! Sure, they may lose some customers, but the higher prices paid by the vast majority of old and new customers who keep buying MORE than offsets it. History is greatly on my side if you don’t believe that. ‘Whales’ keep GW in business. Some guy complaining on the internet that hasn’t bought anything anyway since third edition 40K is irrelevant.

And in the modern era of gaming, which can be considered both a golden and dark age, there really is no such thing as ‘time in between major releases’. GW, and many other companies, it must be noted, are flooding the market with releases pretty much every week. Some weeks may be ‘bigger’ than others, but in the churn and burn game market of 2019, shoving out mountains of product is the business plan most places. When was the last week GW did not release SOMETHING? That doesn’t happen often. I bet you can’t name many weeks that has happened. And don’t say I’m some kind of GW defender based on this; their prices are too high in my opinion, even if the model quality is usually very high. The only way it will change is if people stop buying. And so far, the last 30 years, the score in this game prices are too high is GW - 80000000, internet complainers that this time they’ve gone too far - 0. And there is NO reason to believe this price increase will be any different from the many that have preceded it.


Yeah but none if that is exactly right either, yes during the last period of big price hikes they did not go bust but they screwed they sales numbers into the ground because after a price hike people did leave and so to keep profits up/the same they increased prices which caused people to leave and for them to need to increase prices, that’s why a lot of Kirby’s critics said he had put GW into a death spiral.

However luckily for GW the dark lord got the boot before the problem became terminal and then GW got a FB page and cracked a few jokes and everyone flocked back to pay the same high prices. So now sales are at a record high and GW know exactly how many sales they lose from a price increase from experience so they must have decided that a 17% increase will make them more than they will lose in volume, if your cynical they could well have everything planned to attempt to take the prices right up to the tipping point they have calculated.

I would guess on another full range 17-20% rise next year and probably the year after as well by then they will have shed the cheapskates and free loaders and can get back to being luxury goods

Your last point is especially laughable and comical, because not only the 7th ed Valkyrie shown dumber things (like being able to throw the troopers without parachutes out of its hatches, no harm done) - Irbis 
   
Made in de
Fresh-Faced New User




 ArcaneHorror wrote:
Looks like the standalone Death Guard elite units got bumped five dollars.


Honestly 5 dollars appairs to be nice. I'm surpriced that they even increased the price for brand new products like STE Evocators from 40 to 45 Euro. Or this Fireslayer Dragon from 65 to 80. And the Tau got struck hard too, Riptide from 65 to 85 Euros, that's an 30% increase.
   
Made in ca
Nasty Nob






Pricing me out of the hobby without a doubt.

Fang, son of Great Fang, the traitor we seek, The laws of the brethren say this: That only the king sees the crown of the gods, And he, the usurper, must die.
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Made in de
Big Mek in Kustom Dragster with Soopa-Gun





Death Guard elite units are single plague marines with fancy gear.

Drager wrote:
I'd heard there would be a clatter, then perhaps a hiss, but that's not what it's like. We'd all been told that these things lurked in vents and crevices, that they could sneak up on a man no matter how alert, but that just wasn't what happened. We saw them coming, well, we heard them first, an ear-splitting boom as they accelerated across the plain. They must have been 2 miles away when we heard the crack, but we barely had time to lift our weapons before they were on us and then... past us. Running faster than I could follow. They didn't attack, didn't even try and it was then, as the whole platoon stared after them that a dread crept through me and I turned to see that which they had been running from.

-Infantryman Collins, 5th Umbra Rifles
 
   
Made in vn
Longtime Dakkanaut




Expect every new 2 sprue multi part kit in the coming year will be 60US$ from now on. If they keep this price I simply won't buy or won't be able to keep up buying more than 1 kit across multiple game lol, my budget allowance is only 80-100 monthly.

Also someone please inform GW that their blood bowl troll is a character on 2 sprue and is currently listing at TOO LOW price, pump it to 40$ please, lol.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/07/09 08:02:17


 
   
Made in pl
Fresh-Faced New User




Seems like honeymoon is over. They spent three years convincing everyone they aren't the bad guys anymore, and decided they can now reap benefits of it by going back to their old game of pricing.
   
Made in jp
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Only thing that improved past years was theirpr department anyway.

It's simple. Either price is acceptable to you and you pay or not and you don't.

“Nothing has a definite nature, so people cannot be purely evil. Even so-called evil people will aspire to follow a moral path when they feel a sense of community.” – Kukai

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Made in is
Courageous Beastmaster




Iceland

I am glad I have a ton of the stuff I already have with only a missing unit here and there. I'll probably end up buying less from now on after this price hike and just focus on painting what I already have.

Cypher | Craftworlds | Drukhari | Dark Angels | Necrons | Emperor's Children(30k/40k) | Tyranids | Orks | Death Guard

Daughters of Khaine | Blades of Khorne | Stormcast Eternals | Flesh-Eater Courts
 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




UK

 Eldarsif wrote:
I am glad I have a ton of the stuff I already have with only a missing unit here and there. I'll probably end up buying less from now on after this price hike and just focus on painting what I already have.


In fairness this is the kind of reply I see a lot with regard to price rises. Ergo people who already have tonnes of models and stuff who basically find their buying eases off in the combo of the prices going up, but also in having a large backlog to finish already. Ergo there's already some pressure to "not buy" stuff and the price rise just tips it over. It's likely healthy for that segment of the market because it helps slow down their unfinished piles. that can remove a lot of inhibitions to playing and encourage more gaming which means more games for more customers and thus more chance to get new gamers buying more for GW.

A Blog in Miniature - now featuring reviews of many new Black Library books (latest Novellas) 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




 Overread wrote:
 Eldarsif wrote:
I am glad I have a ton of the stuff I already have with only a missing unit here and there. I'll probably end up buying less from now on after this price hike and just focus on painting what I already have.


In fairness this is the kind of reply I see a lot with regard to price rises. Ergo people who already have tonnes of models and stuff who basically find their buying eases off in the combo of the prices going up, but also in having a large backlog to finish already. Ergo there's already some pressure to "not buy" stuff and the price rise just tips it over. It's likely healthy for that segment of the market because it helps slow down their unfinished piles. that can remove a lot of inhibitions to playing and encourage more gaming which means more games for more customers and thus more chance to get new gamers buying more for GW.


New gamers aren't gonna be enticed by the pricing of models in the least.

The price raises are so sweeping and drastic that I'm convinced its a ploy to drive people away from single kits and into buying bundles
   
Made in is
Courageous Beastmaster




Iceland

New gamers aren't gonna be enticed by the pricing of models in the least.

The price raises are so sweeping and drastic that I'm convinced its a ploy to drive people away from single kits and into buying bundles


Yep, it is going to hard to get people invested in the game when the entry point has been increased. I know this will affect my local group as we've been trying to cross-pollinate between 40k and AoS and price increases are going to discourage people from going outside of their game.

I am also just going to focus on buying the bundles from now on unless I feel like I need some competitive edge all of a sudden in my existing stuff.

Cypher | Craftworlds | Drukhari | Dark Angels | Necrons | Emperor's Children(30k/40k) | Tyranids | Orks | Death Guard

Daughters of Khaine | Blades of Khorne | Stormcast Eternals | Flesh-Eater Courts
 
   
Made in us
Tough Tyrant Guard




Lake County, Illinois

"if your cynical they could well have everything planned to attempt to take the prices right up to the tipping point they have calculated"

Why would that be cynical? That's how every business works. Of course they are going to attempt to set prices where they think they will maximize profit. That's what they are supposed to do.
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




UK

stratigo wrote:
 Overread wrote:
 Eldarsif wrote:
I am glad I have a ton of the stuff I already have with only a missing unit here and there. I'll probably end up buying less from now on after this price hike and just focus on painting what I already have.


In fairness this is the kind of reply I see a lot with regard to price rises. Ergo people who already have tonnes of models and stuff who basically find their buying eases off in the combo of the prices going up, but also in having a large backlog to finish already. Ergo there's already some pressure to "not buy" stuff and the price rise just tips it over. It's likely healthy for that segment of the market because it helps slow down their unfinished piles. that can remove a lot of inhibitions to playing and encourage more gaming which means more games for more customers and thus more chance to get new gamers buying more for GW.


New gamers aren't gonna be enticed by the pricing of models in the least.

The price raises are so sweeping and drastic that I'm convinced its a ploy to drive people away from single kits and into buying bundles


I never said prices were going to encourage customers directly, I said gamers gaming were more likely to attract new customers

Basically those who are in the door and building/growing armies will hate price rises but are more likely to soak the increase because they are still excited for the game, the social group and the sculpts. It's those at the other end, who already have 3K or so of models and who have bought more than they've built recently who are more likely to rein in their buying. Of course for GW that isn't totally a good thing as many of that segment can be big long term customers; but in general they are the ones more likely to fall out of buying. Ergo the were already limiting their buying and the price rise just tips them over the edge.

A Blog in Miniature - now featuring reviews of many new Black Library books (latest Novellas) 
   
Made in us
Dominating Dominatrix






Southeastern PA, USA

 totalfailure wrote:


This is the opposite of how things work.

There's a reason they offered a bunch of steep discount bundles along with apoc. It is because you make more money prodding people to buy it with offers of DEALS DEALS DEALS! compared to the price of the product without the deals. Upping the prices immediately after apoc is a very bad look for those kits, and only works in making bundles even more psychologically appealing, but i doubt that makes up the loss of sales a price hike entailed. It takes time for people to forget this sort of gak, you should raise prices between major releases, not just after one. And in the era of the internet, you aren't gonna get away with sneak hiking the prices either.


Disagree with just about everything you wrote. Every time GW raises prices, which has been FREQUENTLY, people get on and complain about them and tell us how they’re done and have been priced out. Yet somehow, despite all the internet blather, GW stays in business. Why? Because despite the complaining MOST PEOPLE KEEP BUYING ANYWAY! And GW knows this! Sure, they may lose some customers, but the higher prices paid by the vast majority of old and new customers who keep buying MORE than offsets it. History is greatly on my side if you don’t believe that. ‘Whales’ keep GW in business. Some guy complaining on the internet that hasn’t bought anything anyway since third edition 40K is irrelevant.

And in the modern era of gaming, which can be considered both a golden and dark age, there really is no such thing as ‘time in between major releases’. GW, and many other companies, it must be noted, are flooding the market with releases pretty much every week. Some weeks may be ‘bigger’ than others, but in the churn and burn game market of 2019, shoving out mountains of product is the business plan most places. When was the last week GW did not release SOMETHING? That doesn’t happen often. I bet you can’t name many weeks that has happened. And don’t say I’m some kind of GW defender based on this; their prices are too high in my opinion, even if the model quality is usually very high. The only way it will change is if people stop buying. And so far, the last 30 years, the score in this game prices are too high is GW - 80000000, internet complainers that this time they’ve gone too far - 0. And there is NO reason to believe this price increase will be any different from the many that have preceded it.


I agree -- note that the quote wasn't from me.

The reaction here could be straight out of rec.games.miniatures.warhammer during the mid-90s. Hell, I remember being surprised by an $8 price tag for a blister of Aspect Warriors around 1990. It was probably twice what I would have paid from any other manufacturer at the time. Their prices have always been high, but people always like to think that their experiences are unique and new.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/07/09 13:59:36


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Made in us
Dakka Veteran




 Albino Squirrel wrote:
"if your cynical they could well have everything planned to attempt to take the prices right up to the tipping point they have calculated"

Why would that be cynical? That's how every business works. Of course they are going to attempt to set prices where they think they will maximize profit. That's what they are supposed to do.


Is this okay though? I mean, companies can maximize profit by breaking laws and bribing officials to look the other way. Where do you draw the line of "Maximize every cent"

And, again, companies are self destructive because all the incentives are organized for short term profit now for maximum shareholder return that must increase every year. So companies don't invest in sustainable profit. They chase bubbles.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 gorgon wrote:
 totalfailure wrote:


This is the opposite of how things work.

There's a reason they offered a bunch of steep discount bundles along with apoc. It is because you make more money prodding people to buy it with offers of DEALS DEALS DEALS! compared to the price of the product without the deals. Upping the prices immediately after apoc is a very bad look for those kits, and only works in making bundles even more psychologically appealing, but i doubt that makes up the loss of sales a price hike entailed. It takes time for people to forget this sort of gak, you should raise prices between major releases, not just after one. And in the era of the internet, you aren't gonna get away with sneak hiking the prices either.


Disagree with just about everything you wrote. Every time GW raises prices, which has been FREQUENTLY, people get on and complain about them and tell us how they’re done and have been priced out. Yet somehow, despite all the internet blather, GW stays in business. Why? Because despite the complaining MOST PEOPLE KEEP BUYING ANYWAY! And GW knows this! Sure, they may lose some customers, but the higher prices paid by the vast majority of old and new customers who keep buying MORE than offsets it. History is greatly on my side if you don’t believe that. ‘Whales’ keep GW in business. Some guy complaining on the internet that hasn’t bought anything anyway since third edition 40K is irrelevant.

And in the modern era of gaming, which can be considered both a golden and dark age, there really is no such thing as ‘time in between major releases’. GW, and many other companies, it must be noted, are flooding the market with releases pretty much every week. Some weeks may be ‘bigger’ than others, but in the churn and burn game market of 2019, shoving out mountains of product is the business plan most places. When was the last week GW did not release SOMETHING? That doesn’t happen often. I bet you can’t name many weeks that has happened. And don’t say I’m some kind of GW defender based on this; their prices are too high in my opinion, even if the model quality is usually very high. The only way it will change is if people stop buying. And so far, the last 30 years, the score in this game prices are too high is GW - 80000000, internet complainers that this time they’ve gone too far - 0. And there is NO reason to believe this price increase will be any different from the many that have preceded it.


I agree -- note that the quote wasn't from me.

The reaction here could be straight out of rec.games.miniatures.warhammer during the mid-90s. Hell, I remember being surprised by an $8 price tag for a blister of Aspect Warriors around 1990. It was probably twice what I would have paid from any other manufacturer at the time. Their prices have always been high, but people always like to think that their experiences are unique and new.


This is pretending that GW is immune to market trends and has always been on an upward incline. They aren't, and they have suffered as a company before. But, here's a thing, big companies, and GW is fairly big, It's not a small business, as those are actually legally defined, are quite resilient, and so they can eat a few bad years, and survive, often by farming out ownership and shares of the company (it is why we got kirby in the first place). There's a level of inertia in every corporation, it can take a decade or more of mismanagement to kill a company of any appreciable size. But GW suffered for a few years, it has not always had the glorious resurgence of the modern day. And it can suffer again in the future.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/07/09 14:12:21


 
   
Made in us
Tough Tyrant Guard




Lake County, Illinois

You're asking if it is okay for companies to choose what price they sell their products at? Uh, of course it is. That's how it works.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/07/09 14:21:11


 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




 Albino Squirrel wrote:
You're asking if it is okay for companies to choose what price they sell their products at? Uh, of course it is. That's how it works.


Are you sure? If GW suddenly decided every kit cost 1000 pounds or dollars or euros and the company quickly went out of business, would this have been an okay decision?
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




UK

stratigo wrote:
 Albino Squirrel wrote:
You're asking if it is okay for companies to choose what price they sell their products at? Uh, of course it is. That's how it works.


Are you sure? If GW suddenly decided every kit cost 1000 pounds or dollars or euros and the company quickly went out of business, would this have been an okay decision?


It's ok in terms that GW is allowed to charge whatever they want for their kits; its a luxury product and thus not regulated/monitored by governments in that way. So yeah if they want to charge £1000 per box they can do so.

However its not ok in terms of consumer value; its not ok in terms of health of the company nor the game and such a choice would likely see their sales collapse. However one would hope that such a choice would see a loss of faith in the management and internal systems/major shareholders bring pressure to avoid such an outcome occurring.

A Blog in Miniature - now featuring reviews of many new Black Library books (latest Novellas) 
   
Made in is
Courageous Beastmaster




Iceland

Personally I like the hypothesis that GW would prefer to sell you bundles instead of standalone models. I know that for myself I have been buying more of the bundles for the past year than single models unless I am going for specific gaps in my collection.

Focusing more on bundles means GW can control their production to aim for those bundles instead of meeting a demand on single kits that have forced them to put some on DO.

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Devon, UK

This is pretending that GW is immune to market trends and has always been on an upward incline.


In as much as any company can be, these days they are, and have been for some time.

They mishandled things for years and were still posting a profit. Their demand seems to be quite ineleastic.

Which is what makes all the "I'm out" posts so laughable, clearly the percentage of people who actually follow through is tiny, when even when the game was in the worst state I'd ever seen it they were still earning money. All the price rises actually mean in reality is that GW are going to have to spend less money on product to get their entire hobby budget each month.

If people want to make a difference, don't just not buy GW (which is daft anyway, they sometimes make the best, and often the most accessible, stuff on the market, don't cut your nose off to spite your face) but spend your hobby budget one month on a starter or two small factions for another, non-GW, game (so you can teach and recruit) and explore the hobby, rather than the hhhobby.

We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark

The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.

The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox

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[DCM]
Custodes Shield Captain





Where ever the Emperor needs his eyes

 Overread wrote:

its a luxury product .


Then they should be taxed as one, but they arent.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/07/09 16:06:38


 
   
Made in pl
Fresh-Faced New User





They mishandled things for years and were still posting a profit. Their demand seems to be quite ineleastic.

They booted the long-time CEO from the position because of this attitude, because it was hurting the company. Then they somewhat toned down the price gouging (see releasing 10-size Stormcast boxes soon after, at discounted prices compared to buying 2x5, no new kits being quite as insane as the price for Blood Knights or Witch Elves) and offered discounted entry point in shape of Start Collecting.

I can only speak for my locale of course, but at this point a SC! box is more than a new Switch game, which is just silly.
   
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Skilled SDF-1 Pin-Point Barrier Jockey






Oh, I don't think I'm out, but this decision has soured me a bit. So I'll probably be more selective from now on, at least for a while and certainly over anything they might have made more expensive.
   
Made in ca
Mighty Kroxigor Ancient





California the Southern

Makes me wonder if we'll see more third party companies try to pick up any slack that GW puts out.

Prices go too high then more boutique stuff might seem more palatable.

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Devon, UK

Cronch wrote:

They mishandled things for years and were still posting a profit. Their demand seems to be quite ineleastic.

They booted the long-time CEO from the position because of this attitude, because it was hurting the company.


No they didn't.

Kirby retired (he was in his 60s, so no real suspicion it was PR spin,) stayed on in a senior non-executive capacity and is still, afaik, a major private shareholder.

While there are certainly things that have happened under Rountree that have been positive, I don't think you can overlook the fact that he was a senior figure under Kirby, and also that the departure of Alan Merret was massively impactful as well.

We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark

The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.

The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox

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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Steelcity

It is getting fairly difficult to convince new people to try 40k when there are other games out there with relatively free rules, better testing and their vision tends to be “make a good game for gamers” rather than a good game for their share price.

Right now the matched play rules have 29 pages of FAQ and something like 27 pages of actual rules. There are a large amount of rules either spread out between books like chapter approved or you cant even download or buy anymore (assassin book for example), and prices for models that are a decade old keep going up (when real adjusted for inflation income has actually gone down over decades for the average american). The army I play at events is getting close to 1000$ without factoring in time or money to paint or assemble.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/07/09 18:11:57


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