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 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

Voss wrote:
Best unexpected change (assuming goonhammer is right): terminator sergeants can swap power sword for power fist.

The long, long legacy of the sergeant being the worst guy in the squad is finally gone.

They mentioned this in the Designer Interview article. It's intentional.

Well, yeah. Of course it is. I said unexpected, not unintentional.

You also said "assuming goonhammer is right"

Dang. was really hoping they'd let Shrike join some reivers with grav chutes at least...

Ah well. Guess I'll just wait for the full release to figure out how to best use him and make a raven guard force.

Voss wrote:
Best unexpected change (assuming goonhammer is right): terminator sergeants can swap power sword for power fist.

The long, long legacy of the sergeant being the worst guy in the squad is finally gone.

Too bad Deathwing sergeants didn't get the memo, they can't even swap for claws or hammer anymore.

Model-wise, does the company ancient not get an iron halo/icon on his backpack? Is it because his standard has one..?

 GaroRobe wrote:
Model-wise, does the company ancient not get an iron halo/icon on his backpack? Is it because his standard has one..?

He doesn't even actually get the company banner...

Welp, just watched the new codex videos and I'm going back to second edition from now on. That TACTICUS keyword addition on everything was the last straw, although the fact that my unfinished TDA Cap which cost me over 100€ in bitz alone is now unfieldable as well.

Great stuff #Nothingham

 tauist wrote:
Welp, just watched the new codex videos and I'm going back to second edition from now on. That TACTICUS keyword addition on everything was the last straw, although the fact that my unfinished TDA Cap which cost me over 100€ in bitz alone is now unfieldable as well.

Great stuff #Nothingham

Nice model, though.

 tauist wrote:
Welp, just watched the new codex videos and I'm going back to second edition from now on. That TACTICUS keyword addition on everything was the last straw, although the fact that my unfinished TDA Cap which cost me over 100€ in bitz alone is now unfieldable as well.

Great stuff #Nothingham

First of all, great recreation of a classic mini !

Pretty much feel the same way rules-wise..

I'll be picking up some new termies for Space Hulk myself. Already have twenty Deathwatch Overkill purestrain Stealers.

 tauist wrote:
Welp, just watched the new codex videos and I'm going back to second edition from now on. That TACTICUS keyword addition on everything was the last straw, although the fact that my unfinished TDA Cap which cost me over 100€ in bitz alone is now unfieldable as well.

Great stuff #Nothingham

It's still a very nice update on him though



I will say, it feels good to know that I'm not the only person spending way too much on warhammer bits

 tauist wrote:
Welp, just watched the new codex videos and I'm going back to second edition from now on. That TACTICUS keyword addition on everything was the last straw, although the fact that my unfinished TDA Cap which cost me over 100€ in bitz alone is now unfieldable as well.

Great stuff #Nothingham

Looks to me like he could be quite reasonably fielded as a termi captain with sword and storm bolter.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
All gone. He gets combi-weapon or SB and either sword or fist.

Everything else is gone.

Becasue the new kit only has those four weapons. Hammer? Gone. Claws? Gone. Shield? Gone. Doesn't even have the grenade thingy!

Lame.

I'm just jazzed that Razorbacks are usable (lost TL AssCans)

Lame about the Assault Cannons.

I'll still be finishing my conversions though, since I'll still play older editions, and they'll look the nutz.

And for those that speculated: Sniper Rifles are 1 per 5 in the new Scout squad, not one per unit.

Only one in five Scouts gets a rifle? That's a bizzare decision. Guess I'll use the Legends unit with my full metal Scout Sniper squad. Or again, just play an older edition/alternative rule set.

 Insectum7 wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
All gone. He gets combi-weapon or SB and either sword or fist.

Everything else is gone.

Becasue the new kit only has those four weapons. Hammer? Gone. Claws? Gone. Shield? Gone. Doesn't even have the grenade thingy!

Lame.

I'm just jazzed that Razorbacks are usable (lost TL AssCans)

Lame about the Assault Cannons.

I'll still be finishing my conversions though, since I'll still play older editions, and they'll look the nutz.

And for those that speculated: Sniper Rifles are 1 per 5 in the new Scout squad, not one per unit.

Only one in five Scouts gets a rifle? That's a bizzare decision. Guess I'll use the Legends unit with my full metal Scout Sniper squad. Or again, just play an older edition/alternative rule set.

not that bizzare given that they allow split fire now, and it's actually more akin to how a small squad WORKS, with a single dedicated sniper

 Insectum7 wrote:
Lame about the Assault Cannons.

I'm still gonna take 'em. Ditto for Heavy Flamers in Tac Squads and Lightning Claws on Captains.

Why?

Well everything is free! There are no points costs anymore, and we know what their rules were, so why not still take them?

I'll still be finishing my conversions though, since I'll still play older editions, and they'll look the nutz.

 Insectum7 wrote:
Only one in five Scouts gets a rifle? That's a bizzare decision.

It's not a decision. It's just what the kit has. If the sprue of 5 Scouts had 2 Sniper Rifles then it'd be 2 out of every 5. It's the same idiocy that allows Tyranid Warriors to take one Venom Canon and one Barbed Stranger per 3 Warriors because the box has one of each.

First it was no mode/no rule. Then it was kit-based weapon restrictions (starting with Skitarii, I believe). 10th has now gone hard on box-based unit structure (why we get things like 2-model Carnifex broods, 2-model Spawn units, and the utter psychotic nonsense that is the Custodes unit sizes). It's maddeningly unnecessary, and doesn't help anyone. Not even "new players".

Really I should be more annoyed at this book: They just invalidated 60% of my Marine models in a single fell swoop. Thing is I'm far more annoyed at the loss of weapon options than the loss of units. And at absurdly stupid set units like the Company Heroes, which always has a dude with Heavy Bolter, and a dude with a Bolter, and a guy with a slightly less-good bolter, and a guy with a sword... always. Everywhere. All the time. With absolutely no options whatsoever, because that's all the kit has. Abso-fething-lutely asinine.

BrianDavion wrote:
not that bizzare given that they allow split fire now, and it's actually more akin to how a small squad WORKS, with a single dedicated sniper

But that's not the reason its 1-in-5. It's 1-in-5 simply because of how the kit is. There is no other reason beyond that.

BrianDavion wrote:

Only one in five Scouts gets a rifle? That's a bizzare decision. Guess I'll use the Legends unit with my full metal Scout Sniper squad. Or again, just play an older edition/alternative rule set.

not that bizzare given that they allow split fire now, and it's actually more akin to how a small squad WORKS, with a single dedicated sniper

Considering Intercessors can't get a Heavy or Special and numerous other Primaris (*spits*) units are mono-weapon loadout (all flamers?!), I contend that a single sniper rifle remains bizzare.

Every 1 in 10 Scout gets a Sniper rifle because that's what the Kill Team is going to have.

If you hadn't heard the next KT is Scouts vs Striking Scorpions.

Forget the Kill Team, the’yve already previewed the Scouts kit on WHC and told us this by telling us what’s on the sprue.

Devastator sergeants have lost the option to take a storm bolter, even though there is a storm bolter in the box! Hopefully they fix this.

OrkPlayer137 wrote:
Devastator sergeants have lost the option to take a storm bolter, even though there is a storm bolter in the box! Hopefully they fix this.

I'm sure they'll have an updated kit to remove that problematic defect from the box right away!

 tauist wrote:
Welp, just watched the new codex videos and I'm going back to second edition from now on. That TACTICUS keyword addition on everything was the last straw, although the fact that my unfinished TDA Cap which cost me over 100€ in bitz alone is now unfieldable as well.

Great stuff #Nothingham

I know the pain, I did one too...

[url=https://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/1176158-.html]

Hmmm, so I wonder how well the new detachments are balanced with legends units. My Ravenwing would like to try the stormlance detachment but it is heavily loaded with bike squads, attack bikes and landspeeders.

Overall I'm very excited about the way detachments are handled. They really enable creating a cool collection of space marine stuff and run it with a variety of styles in whatever paint scheme you like. Granted, this was always effectively possible, but it feels quite encouraged.

Most of the stuff cut I'm pretty okay with. I've never been a fan of some of the excessive requirements for certain weapon loadouts and putting limits that are more in line with actual purchases is largely okay with me. Honestly, this kind of setup feels more open to random conversions mixed in for character than when it changes what the model really does. I think the one place I don't love that is with the captains though. The monopose, mono loadout trend is silly and these kits would greatly benefit from being the place where you get to really customize something with bespoke gear. That's to me a failing of the kits themselves though.

A bit worried about the actual effectiveness of this though. Glad they're keeping the power creep in check, but its been a while since I've seen what appears to be an actual downgrade for a codex. There's more "create a problem to sell you a solution" going on here than I'd like, which mostly comes down to a difference in how I feel about the codex in isolation and how it stacks up to the rest of the game.

I'm actually kind of disappointed with how detachments were handled here. They should have been more akin to Armies of Renown.

The 'Pick whichever detachment gives you the best free rules for the units which you were going to take anyway' approach remains horrible.

 Kanluwen wrote:
I'm actually kind of disappointed with how detachments were handled here. They should have been more akin to Armies of Renown.

What do you mean?

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
I'm actually kind of disappointed with how detachments were handled here. They should have been more akin to Armies of Renown.

What do you mean?

Look at the Vanguard Detachment and discussion surrounding it. Most of it is centered on what isn't Phobos that lets you exploit its perks the best.

Should have been locked out of taking some stuff in exchange for increased availability of other.

Having played theme forces in a lot of game systems, I think I've come around to the idea that providing rewards for restricting builds isn't terribly healthy. It makes logical sense, but creates a notable barrier for players, where starting a new theme gets close to starting a new army. The main reason it exists that way is that it evolved from the idea that these are deviations from a vanilla standard.

The "all carrot, no stick" approach we have here means that while the different themes incentivize different units, shifting from one to another doesn't demand the theme be a fully thought out army. The tech pieces developed are always available and for most players they can try something new by picking up a few units and fill the gaps with their existing army.

I actually really like the new detachment system, particularly its application to a Space Marine force. I collect Ultramarines and it always bothered me that someone who had a custom chapter could pick and choose which army rules to use based on what was strong at that particular time, dipping into Iron Hands or Dark Angels etc as the current meta dictated.
This was always difficult to navigate if you were using a first founding or well developed chapter as it soft locked you from thematic armies, even if the background was full of examples of full terminator forces, scout battalions and so on.
The new detachments system lets me field that 1st company army of my dreams or the balanced tactical force (Gladius) that I feel exemplifies marines as a whole. It levels the playing field AND lets me mix it up a little to keep games interesting.
I play AoS too, and without changing a model, my Hedonites have 3 different play styles to choose from, my Seraphon have 4. I don’t need to repaint everything because ‘only red crested skinks can be blessed by Sotek’. The detachments bring this to 40K in a way that hasn’t been available before.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 VladimirHerzog wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
I'm actually kind of disappointed with how detachments were handled here. They should have been more akin to Armies of Renown.

What do you mean?

Look at the Vanguard Detachment and discussion surrounding it. Most of it is centered on what isn't Phobos that lets you exploit its perks the best.

Should have been locked out of taking some stuff in exchange for increased availability of other.

This is mostly a result of the detachment largely giving abilities that Phobos units already have rather than things than benefit Phobos units. Locking stuff out doesn't really fix that.

I agree with the above, I like that the new detachment system incentivises certain things while not locking you out from taking anything. I think too many people are hung up on the "everything in my army must benefit from detachment rules " style of thinking, instead of "how can i build a great army, that my detachment give bonuses to the things i really like". For example, my current unending swarm nid list still has a considerable number of monsters, its just that my little guys are better.

Specifically for the marine codex....tactical squads are back on the menu boys! Combat squads returning is great.

I like the idea of an anvilus(?) detachment made of whirlwinds and preds with dreads or devs for approx half the army,with faster moving assault elements as the other half. the problem with some previous versions of this idea (and absolutely with the theme list system in warmahordes) was being too restricive.

Admittedly i am a dark angels player, but this system is much better than "everything in your army must have the deathwing keyword" approach we have had before, as it alloows a collect to skew towards what they like, without limiting them.