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ncshooter426 wrote: I missed it -- Avenger fighter? Just the shakedown info, no scans per rules
S6 AP-2 Heavy 8 cannon. Heavy stubbed that hits "fly" keyword things with a +1 (even if they've been standing on the ground for the entire game), up to 10 mortal wounds using tactical bombs and a minimum move of 20" (max is 45, then 30" then 20"
xttz wrote: Assuming they're still produced in China, the lead time for printing like this would be months. Goods like this are normally sent via container ships which are typically on the water for 4-6 weeks then you have land transport & customs delays on top.
Just glanced at my Index Imperium 2, says printed by Belmont Press in the UK. Still, printing takes a significant amount of time no matter where you do it. Add to that the fact they have done the Main Rulebook, the 5 Indices, the 4 FW indices and also the miscellaneous printed materials. Then they have to get all of that distributed worldwide, I can guess a significant lead time would be needed.
Edit: Main rule book says Westdale in UK. Maybe they gave the hardbacks to a different company.
Both SM & Chaos forgeworld Indexes say that they are printed in the UK.
GW Indexes are a mix, some China, some UK. My rulebooks says UK also.
Quite likely that they used a selection of places for all the books due to the volumes needed.
Completely normal publishing practice. First print runs done in Far East for cost reasons, reprints in Europe/UK once volumes needed are established after preorders are in to avoid the 3-month China leadtime (which is standard for even big publishing houses... paper is too heavy to fly economically so books literally sit at the docks or on a boat for weeks and weeks). I doubt FW got sorted in time to print Far East, and likely also expecting lower volumes, so had to stump up for domestic printing.
Stormonu wrote: For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules"
Just flipping through the books I've found numerous problems.
Haven't read the whole thread so if these have been mentioned before then so be it.
Sent these to FW asking for answers
Imperial Armour - Index - Forces of the Astra Militarum page 46
Arvis Lighter
Transport : This model can transport 12 Astra Militarum Infantry
I bought mine for my Sisters of Battle army as the Arvus Lighter was the only flying transport in the game that Sisters had access to. So my purchase is now completely useless for my sisters army?
Shouldn't the rule say:
This model can transport 12 Astra Militarum, Adepta Sororitas or Vraksian Renegade Infantry models. As per the IA Apocalypse 2E which is the most recent book with the Arvus if I'm not mistaken.
Imperial Armour - Index - Xenos
A model armed with a Macro weapon may not fire if it has moved previously in the turn, unless the firing unit also has the TITANIC keyword.
Tau Tiger Shark AX-1-0 has a Heavy rail cannon that is Macro, it can't hover and must move a minimum of 20" a turn, it does NOT have the Titanic keyword...
So by RAW it can never fire this weapon?
Orks don't have the MEGA DREAD and there are no rules for the kill saw or kill kannon arm.
FW site says the rules for the Mega Dread can be found in Xenos but they are missing.
Found these from just 10 minutes of flipping through the book. As always there is no quality control with FWs books as with their models...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/23 17:31:51
So I've wanted to make a converted salamander recon/command tank for a while now. Do they still give the -1 cover save rule or do they have something a bit more useful now? Also does the scout vehicle have transport abilities and/or 'outflank'??? (*crosses fingers)
Twoshoes23 wrote: So I've wanted to make a converted salamander recon/command tank for a while now. Do they still give the -1 cover save rule or do they have something a bit more useful now? Also does the scout vehicle have transport abilities and/or 'outflank'??? (*crosses fingers)
The command gets to give a vehicle within 6" a +1 to hit. They both get a 9" scout move, no outflank. Also, the command variant lost the ability to take 2x bolters, and is fixed with flamer/bolter.
Twoshoes23 wrote: So I've wanted to make a converted salamander recon/command tank for a while now. Do they still give the -1 cover save rule or do they have something a bit more useful now? Also does the scout vehicle have transport abilities and/or 'outflank'??? (*crosses fingers)
Salamander Command Vehicle
Auspex Surveyor: During shooting phase, a single friendly regiment vehicle within 6" adds 1 to all hit rolls.
Scout Vehicle: At the start of the first battle round but before first turn can be moved 9" but cannot end it's move within 9" of enemy models.
Salamander Scout Tank: 1-3 Vehicles per fast attack.
Doesn't have Auspex Surveyor but does have Vehicle Squadron: When models are set up they have to be within 6" of each other but then act independently.
No transport capacity that I can see.
I hope FW can shift some of its Horus Heresy work ethic and resources over to 40k soon and update these books, because the Renegades and Heretics 8th army is the worst and laziest thing FW has ever produced (which is saying something, considering that IA:13 and IA: Vraks were both riddled with typos and omissions that desperately needed errata that never got published).
The army lost the few interesting rules and units it had, what it kept got worse and more expensive, and now almost everything is a worse LD and BS version of the Astra Militarum equivalent, except without orders. And there are tons of mistakes (missing character keywords, can't ride in transports, some unit rules missing, etc.).
Whichever intern wrote the R&H rules for 8th must have been drunk as heck. This publication makes no sense at all.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/06/23 18:49:31
So the only benefit of the scout vehicle is switching to autocannon load outs changes and squadrons? Dang gw, missed a chance with special weapon squads in salamanders ...the command one giving plus 1 To hit isn't that bad for my leman russ's
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/23 19:58:57
Well just to remove any doubt about the number of ork datasheets in the FW book, I bought
the digital version... and there is only 13 datasheets and not 19 as stated on the website.
This is just bad advertisement people!
The treatment the FW ork range received with this book is just a shame.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/23 20:43:55
What. Is. The. Issue. With Renegades getting the malcador Infernus! I want to burn things!
#
And there definitely were renegade sabre platform models. FW forget this.. shame as the new searchlights some amazing
At least the last list from The IA 13 didn't have the infernus either.
But for exemple, the valdor is also missing now (still sold with the renegade tank commander!) which is .
I have a pair of them which should see no more use that most of my ork FW models...
Leman russ variants which were avalaible before also vanished...
This might be the first product I ask a refund on and return it. I can't believe the index isn't even alphabetized. Quitr possibly the worst book I've seen produced.
Keeper of the DomBox
Warhammer Armies - Click to see galleries of fully painted armies
32,000, 19,000, Renegades - 10,000 , 7,500,
I may be missing something,
but Renegades and Heretics can choose a Medusa battery... which is not in the book!
(the old platform: the earthshaker is in the list, the medusa seems not).
They lost, the valdor, the malcador destructor, the maccharius omega...
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/06/24 02:28:44
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2017/06/24 03:30:18
No madam, 40,000 is the year that this game is set in. Not how much it costs. Though you may have a point. - GW Fulchester The Gatling Guns have flamethrowers on them because this is 40k - DOW III
wyomingfox wrote: So comparing a match-up of a Taunar with Pulse Ordnance and Dual Tri-Axis Ion Cannons (Plus 4 SS and 4 BC) vs a Revenant with Dual Pulsars and Cloudburst Missiles, the Taunar will do 24 unsaved damage per turn on average (27 if within range of burst cannons & Smart missiles) where as the Revenant will do 34 unsaved damage on average.
Now comparing their power points of 55 for the Taunar vs 60 for Revenant, this seems fair. However if you played match play, the Revenant is 1200 points vs the Taunar at 1202, yet the Revenant has 2 more wounds, +1 toughness, does more damage, and has 16" more movement.
Tau 8th ed balancing at its finest. Our AX-1-0 Tigershark can't fire it's heavy rail cannon arrays either because it lacks a keyword. So we effectively have no titan scale weaponry left worth a damn except the Manta. Great... got to read three more shiny new Tau battle reports today. Three more losses. Tau rebalance when?
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2017/06/24 05:20:42
mortar_crew wrote: I may be missing something,
but Renegades and Heretics can choose a Medusa battery... which is not in the book!
(the old platform: the earthshaker is in the list, the medusa seems not).
They lost, the valdor, the malcador destructor, the maccharius omega...
The Medusa Carriage Battery is absolutely in the book, page 26 of the digital one. The Armageddon pattern Medusa is on page 14. RAI, these should be the Medusa Battery and the Medusa the R&H list refers to. Of course, RAW, none of these are called "Medusa Battery" or "Medusa", and I personally think they should have the normal Medusa tank as well, but take what you can get.
If you refer to the Earthshaker Platform from the Earthshaker Battery, I don't think the Medusa had a model for this one?
~5000 points of IG and DKoK
I'm awful at reading private messages, so just reply to the threads I'm visiting.
mortar_crew wrote: I may be missing something,
but Renegades and Heretics can choose a Medusa battery... which is not in the book!
(the old platform: the earthshaker is in the list, the medusa seems not).
They lost, the valdor, the malcador destructor, the maccharius omega...
The Medusa Carriage Battery is absolutely in the book, page 26 of the digital one. The Armageddon pattern Medusa is on page 14. RAI, these should be the Medusa Battery and the Medusa the R&H list refers to. Of course, RAW, none of these are called "Medusa Battery" or "Medusa", and I personally think they should have the normal Medusa tank as well, but take what you can get.
If you refer to the Earthshaker Platform from the Earthshaker Battery, I don't think the Medusa had a model for this one?
Yes I spotted the Medusa Carriage Battery at the page you refer to, and as you understood I was refering to the the Earthshaker Platform, fitted with the Medusa gun,
which was in thw old list (IA 13) if my memory serves. Basically it is the same rules as the carriage version anyway but I find this lack of care annoying.
And as you wrote, the reason why they lost the tank version of the guns (Basilisc and Medusa) is beyond me. (there is even one painted in the FW masterclass book!)
The sabre platforms were lost long ago (which I still find annoying also, owning them), but as for the russes and the valdor tank hunter,
(which also were painted in the FW masterclass book!) these where axed without any reason I can understand.
Well, at least we lept the griffon, which is still one of my favorite model...
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/24 07:59:42
mortar_crew wrote: I may be missing something, but Renegades and Heretics can choose a Medusa battery... which is not in the book! (the old platform: the earthshaker is in the list, the medusa seems not).
They lost, the valdor, the malcador destructor, the maccharius omega...
The Medusa Carriage Battery is absolutely in the book, page 26 of the digital one. The Armageddon pattern Medusa is on page 14. RAI, these should be the Medusa Battery and the Medusa the R&H list refers to. Of course, RAW, none of these are called "Medusa Battery" or "Medusa", and I personally think they should have the normal Medusa tank as well, but take what you can get.
If you refer to the Earthshaker Platform from the Earthshaker Battery, I don't think the Medusa had a model for this one?
Yes I spotted the Medusa Carriage Battery at the page you refer to, and as you understood I was refering to the the Earthshaker Platform, fitted with the Medusa gun, which was in thw old list (IA 13) if my memory serves. Basically it is the same rules as the carriage version anyway but I find this lack of care annoying. And as you wrote, the reason why they lost the tank version of the guns (Basilisc and Medusa) is beyond me. (there is even one painted in the FW masterclass book!)
The sabre platforms were lost long ago (which I still find annoying also, owning them), but as for the russes and the valdor tank hunter, (which also were painted in the FW masterclass book!) these where axed without any reason I can understand.
Well, at least we lept the griffon, which is still one of my favorite model...
A Medusa Platform was not in the IA13?
In R&H heavy support in that book, you have Renegade Artillery Battery, which are the Basilisk and Medusa Tanks, Renegade Griffon and Wyvern Tanks, Renegade Hydra, Renegade Bombard (The Colossus Bombard Tank), Renegade Heavy Ordnance Battery (Earthshaker and Medusa Carriages), Renegade Heavy Weapons Teams, Renegade Laser Destroyers and Renegade Field Artillery.
The Earthshaker Platform was an entirely different unit, shown in the spoilers below, and never had a Medusa counterpart from what I know. I added the Earthshaker/Medusa Carriage as well, to show the difference.
Spoiler:
Both the Manticore and Hydra had platforms as well, and they are both in Index Astra Militarum.
And just for reference, I'll show the platform and the carriage versions of the Earthshaker
Spoiler:
Platform:
Carriage:
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2017/06/24 08:58:34
~5000 points of IG and DKoK
I'm awful at reading private messages, so just reply to the threads I'm visiting.
mortar_crew wrote: I may be missing something,
but Renegades and Heretics can choose a Medusa battery... which is not in the book!
(the old platform: the earthshaker is in the list, the medusa seems not).
They lost, the valdor, the malcador destructor, the maccharius omega...
The Medusa Carriage Battery is absolutely in the book, page 26 of the digital one. The Armageddon pattern Medusa is on page 14. RAI, these should be the Medusa Battery and the Medusa the R&H list refers to. Of course, RAW, none of these are called "Medusa Battery" or "Medusa", and I personally think they should have the normal Medusa tank as well, but take what you can get.
If you refer to the Earthshaker Platform from the Earthshaker Battery, I don't think the Medusa had a model for this one?
Yes I spotted the Medusa Carriage Battery at the page you refer to, and as you understood I was refering to the the Earthshaker Platform, fitted with the Medusa gun,
which was in thw old list (IA 13) if my memory serves. Basically it is the same rules as the carriage version anyway but I find this lack of care annoying.
And as you wrote, the reason why they lost the tank version of the guns (Basilisc and Medusa) is beyond me. (there is even one painted in the FW masterclass book!)
The sabre platforms were lost long ago (which I still find annoying also, owning them), but as for the russes and the valdor tank hunter,
(which also were painted in the FW masterclass book!) these where axed without any reason I can understand.
Well, at least we lept the griffon, which is still one of my favorite model...
A Medusa Platform was not in the IA13?
In R&H heavy support in that book, you have Renegade Artillery Battery, which are the Basilisk and Medusa Tanks, Renegade Griffon and Wyvern Tanks, Renegade Hydra, Renegade Bombard (The Colossus Bombard Tank), Renegade Heavy Ordnance Battery (Earthshaker and Medusa Carriages), Renegade Heavy Weapons Teams, Renegade Laser Destroyers and Renegade Field Artillery.
The Earthshaker Platform was an entirely different unit, shown in the spoilers below, and never had a Medusa counterpart from what I know. I added the Earthshaker/Medusa Carriage as well, to show the difference.
Spoiler:
Both the Manticore and Hydra had platforms as well, and they are both in Index Astra Militarum.
And just for reference, I'll show the platform and the carriage versions of the Earthshaker
Spoiler:
Platform:
Carriage:
I checked back and you are absolutely right, there was no medusa upgrade option for the medusa platform then.
Only the later carriage entry has this option.
But the list for R&H from the index for 8th shows "Earthshaker battery" (the platform if you see details in the datasheet), a "Medusa battery" (in theory... a platform?)
which is nowhere to be found in the index itself, so I believe there is some kind of miss in this list (the list for R&H has no carriage for example).
And some of the rarer stuff (the valdor, damnit!) found missing is pretty annoying in my opinion.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/24 09:50:40
I checked back and you are absolutely right, there was no medusa upgrade option for the medusa platform then.
Only the later carriage entry has this option.
But the list for R&H from the index for 8th shows "Earthshaker battery" (the platform if you see details in the datasheet), a "Medusa battery" (in theory... a platform?)
which is nowhere to be found in the index itself, so I believe there is some kind of miss in this list (the list for R&H has no carriage for example).
And some of the rarer stuff (the valdor, damnit!) found missing is pretty annoying in my opinion.
I believe they simply refer to the Carriage Battery as the Earthshaker or Medusa Battery, and the fact that there happens to be another, entirely different unit with that name is one of the many errors in the book. Since there never has been any Medusa Platform, and that the Earthshaker one is now out of production (and only remains for the benefit of the ones who bought it before that), I don't see why they would ever want to make rules for a Medusa Platform.
For the Valdor, I have two theories. The simplest one is just that they missed it, so an accident. The other is that since the Valdor could only be taken if you had a Heretek Magos Demagogue Devotion in IA13, they removed it becuase it wouldn't fit with the barebones, "generalist" renegade list you have here. While maybe not entirely likely, if you look at the DKoK list, it is more or less a copy of the Assault Brigade in IA12 and thus loses all the Carriage Batteries or Combat Engineer troops it previously had. If they get around to updating the Imperial Armour books for 8th, you might see a return to the full lists.
But yeah, R&H god shafted hard and are more or less worse AM with some Chaotic options, and the ability to include units with CHAOS instead of IMPERIUM.
~5000 points of IG and DKoK
I'm awful at reading private messages, so just reply to the threads I'm visiting.
For the XV9 Hazard support team, it says that a suit can take one of the abilities listed on the support systems list. Does that mean its free? Since you are not taking a support system, but the ability. It's worded different from normal crisis suits. Not sure if design intent... Or just bad rules.
I checked back and you are absolutely right, there was no medusa upgrade option for the medusa platform then.
Only the later carriage entry has this option.
But the list for R&H from the index for 8th shows "Earthshaker battery" (the platform if you see details in the datasheet), a "Medusa battery" (in theory... a platform?)
which is nowhere to be found in the index itself, so I believe there is some kind of miss in this list (the list for R&H has no carriage for example).
And some of the rarer stuff (the valdor, damnit!) found missing is pretty annoying in my opinion.
I believe they simply refer to the Carriage Battery as the Earthshaker or Medusa Battery, and the fact that there happens to be another, entirely different unit with that name is one of the many errors in the book. Since there never has been any Medusa Platform, and that the Earthshaker one is now out of production (and only remains for the benefit of the ones who bought it before that), I don't see why they would ever want to make rules for a Medusa Platform.
For the Valdor, I have two theories. The simplest one is just that they missed it, so an accident. The other is that since the Valdor could only be taken if you had a Heretek Magos Demagogue Devotion in IA13, they removed it becuase it wouldn't fit with the barebones, "generalist" renegade list you have here. While maybe not entirely likely, if you look at the DKoK list, it is more or less a copy of the Assault Brigade in IA12 and thus loses all the Carriage Batteries or Combat Engineer troops it previously had. If they get around to updating the Imperial Armour books for 8th, you might see a return to the full lists.
But yeah, R&H god shafted hard and are more or less worse AM with some Chaotic options, and the ability to include units with CHAOS instead of IMPERIUM.
Agree 100%
Got shafted for sure. Still better than the treatment the the ork range received in the index Xenos... So much stuff is simply missing.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/24 11:22:24
I have a question: I read the rules for my thunderbolt a saw it can take four hellstrike missiles.
Is it one use per game per missile or can I shoot all four each turn?
I can't find anything on this.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2017/06/24 11:27:29
Check out my gallery here Also I've started taking photos to use as reference for weathering which can be found here. Please send me your photos so they can be found all in one place!!
Renegades - 
No madam, 40,000 is the year that this game is set in. Not how much it costs. Though you may have a point. - GW Fulchester 
The Gatling Guns have flamethrowers on them because this is 40k 
<Dynasty> 
War Coven of the Coruscating Gaze 
Thrice-Damned Plague Corps 
~3250pts
Admech (TBN) 
