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Greetings all, after playing against my buddy's Tyranid list I've decided to pick up the codex and give it a shot. My theme is going to be an all burrowing very "snakey" type list full of Trygons, Mawlocs and Raveners. Unfortunately, my friend didn't have nor use any of these in our game so I haven't seen them in action. All along Dakka people seem to be split on whether they are awesome or awful same with Raveners. I've seen that rippers burrow now so I was thinking about having two Trygon Primes, a Mawloc, three broods of Raveners (not sure as to numbers or weapon kits so any help would be greatly appreciated). Some burrowing rippers as a distraction force and then having warriors and either a warrior prime or the swarmlord to lead them. Can't the warriors/prime/swarmlord go into reserve and arrive through the Trygon tunnels?

Also, I was thinking about maybe a few lictors to act as locator beacons for the Mawloc/Trygons and Raveners. Any thoughts?

I had him pick up the 'dex for me but I won't be able to get it from him until Friday so I don't actually have the copy in front of me. This is just a sounding board for my general idea. Any help tactically or list-wise would be very helpful.

I'm just worried about popping up with nothing else on the table and getting blasted to my component atoms before being able to strike back. I also figure that vehicle heavy lists may be a problem, as would very fast lists.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I've not put a lot of thought into the Deep Strike armies myself, but I do know one thing... If you buy the new Raveners you need to send me the heads.

Mh... I don't think that your Trygons/Mawlocs need a lictor beacon. They are highly unlikely to mishap or are supposed to appear between the enemy lines anyway.
Raveners are a tricker: if they deep strike, they should deep strike behind cover and not through the trygon tunnel and attack the next turn. But then you look at a turn 3 charge at best. So you have to consider fielding them right away for a guaranteed turn 3 charge but possibly more casualties on the way in.

I plan on using a Hive tyrant with +1 to reserves (possibly hormagaunt as a flanker) and try to get one lictor/deathleaper and trygon onto the field asap. The lictor is pretty unnecessary for his reserve, though. The Tyrant grants +1 to reserve rolls, if the lictor arrives turn 2, then it's a +2 to reserve roll. But it would be 2+ in the third turn anyway. With the lictor on field or without. So if you want to use the lictor it's as an assassin or a beacon for the raveners.

Greets
Schepp himself

Lictors aren't very good beacons because they have to start in reserves and can't help other units the turn they arrive from reserves. That ability just ends up being a bonus.

My buddy was looking at doing Reserve 'Nids, using something like this:

Tyrant, Wings, Tactical Insight
Hive Guard in Spore
Gaunts (coming in through the Trygon's hole)
Tervigon (Outflanking with Tactical Insight)
Many Genestealers
Gargoyles
Raveners
Trygon Prime

Nothing starts on the field, and around turn 3 you are being eaten. Man, I'm going to be thankful for Blight Grenades.

Hive guard can't have a spore.

Sorry, you're correct. Swap that with Deathleaper. +2 to reserves FTW. All units save one coming in on turn 2 directly on top of you. He doesn't have a lot to open the transports, so you'll have to rely on one two punches of MCs busting it and infantry engaging. All in all, the army saves you an entire turn of enemy shooting, two if you go second, while still progressing up the board. I think it can afford to open transports with melee.

I opened up a vindicator with deathleaper. He is pretty good at tank popping. (5/6 rending helps)

Lictors and Death Leapers do not confer Reserve Bonuses until they are on the table themselves, Unlike a hive tyrant in reserve which gives you +1 as long as he is "alive". Basically, though, you are guaranteed your entire force by turn 3. A reserve-heavy list has many pitfalls as well as benefits, which i will show here:

Main problem: Bad reserve rolling, plain and simple. it is much easier for your opponent to handle your force when he needs not pick and choose between multiple targets. Taking out tyranids one by one is much akin to a shooting gallery at a county fair. The bugs need to work as one or they fall down quickly.

Main Benefits: #1 - Where are they coming from?? The 'scare factor' we used to get from outflanking genestealers (18.1" deployment away from edges ring a bell?) now comes across the entire board. Are there ymgarls in that piece of terrain? Is a drop spore going to drop zoeys right behind my vendetta? Where are those gargoyles and trygons going to appear? Making an opponent worry more about what YOU are going to do takes away from the battle plan that HE had in mind, thus giving a mental advantage to your side.
#2 - Surgery. Zoanthropes are best for this tactic. Placing a much-needed s10 ap1 volley of shots to take out a leman russ, vendetta, or even using a spod full of gaunts to take out a thunderfire cannon keeps those particular items from destroying your forces before we get to the best part of our army: Close Combat!

I believe the benefits far outweigh the negatives for reserve-heavy armies. It's for sure a very fun list to play. However, the randomness of reserves makes me wary of taking such lists to a tournament setting, where the gameplay is less about fun and more about winning (which to some people makes it fun again).

Thanks for the insight, I don't plan this to be my tournament army anyway (that'd be the Ork Speed Freeks btw). This is a purely fun army themed from Dune Sandworms, the Tremors films and any movie where the horrible alien beasties are bursting from the floors/walls/vents/ceilings or what have you and tearing the poor defenders into tiny little red pieces. That's why I'm using up so many of my points on the three "terror" MCs. I love the imagery of these titanic armored worm beasts bursting through the ground and toppling tanks and troops like tenpens. All the while the other smaller creatures burst up and engage the reeling defenders.

Any word on if the Tyranid Prime and warriors can emerge through the Trygon tunnels? I'd love the Tyrant for his +1 but my buddy said that he's a MC and thus can't use the tunnel. Only infantry. He said my only HQ that could use it would be the Tyranid Prime. Kinda like an uber-warrior right?

Need to check my book, but I'm pretty sure that any unit listed as Infantry can come up through the Tunnells?

Sandman wrote:Thanks for the insight, I don't plan this to be my tournament army anyway (that'd be the Ork Speed Freeks btw). This is a purely fun army themed from Dune Sandworms, the Tremors films and any movie where the horrible alien beasties are bursting from the floors/walls/vents/ceilings or what have you and tearing the poor defenders into tiny little red pieces. That's why I'm using up so many of my points on the three "terror" MCs. I love the imagery of these titanic armored worm beasts bursting through the ground and toppling tanks and troops like tenpens. All the while the other smaller creatures burst up and engage the reeling defenders.

Any word on if the Tyranid Prime and warriors can emerge through the Trygon tunnels? I'd love the Tyrant for his +1 but my buddy said that he's a MC and thus can't use the tunnel. Only infantry. He said my only HQ that could use it would be the Tyranid Prime. Kinda like an uber-warrior right?

The big problem with the all-tunnelling list is that you can't guarantee that the Warriors will get to use the tunnel. If they happen to arrive before or on the same turn as the Trygon, they'll be walking on from the board edge.

The big problem with the all-tunnelling list is that you can't guarantee that the Warriors will get to use the tunnel. If they happen to arrive before or on the same turn as the Trygon, they'll be walking on from the board edge.

Damn... that's a good point. But even then I'll still have two groups of Raveners, two Trygon Primes and a Mawloc to ruin his day, that should take a lot of shooting from the warriors... though they might all be dead by then.

anything without wings or that isnt a MC can use the tunnel.

Really? I was fairly sure that Beasts (or Raveners, as they are also known) can't use it either?

I'm pretty sure it just says infantry.

Oh great, beasts arnt infantry?

I have some experience with the whole DSing the new nids. I played 2 games yesterday and tabled an eldar player (admittedly the list was pretty awful) and then got a draw against a very experienced tau player. Bear in mind this was the first/second time I used this list.

My 1k list plans on hitting fast and early with a lot of MCs. For this to work you need a tyrant with the hive Commander upgrade...a 4+ just doesn't cut it as I found out 2 days ago). Simply put 2 trygons, doom of Malantai and a winged tyrant DSing into your opponents lines and a tervigon coming in from the side hits very hard. Most armies will struggle to bring down a single MC a turn, which in turn means you have a lot left to strike the killing blow.

At larger points values it just scales up with more DSing stuff and in 2k it comes in on a 2+ (Swarmlord FTW).

I wouldn't worry about the trygon tunnels. You want everything coming in together...not piecemeal.

thekerrick wrote:Oh great, beasts arnt infantry?

Indeed not. Beasts are Beasts, Infantry are Infantry, two totally seperate classifications.

But hey, Raveners can always deepstrike anyways, and if within 6" of a Lictor/Deathleaper, spot on deployment to boot (which can be awesome if you sneak behind a Tank with AV10 to the rear. My 8 Raveners will open that up when they arrive using their Deathspitters.

I should mention it's currently up for debate on if a Tyrant with Wings can Deep Strike or not, though I am of the opinion that it can.

Aduro wrote:I should mention it's currently up for debate on if a Tyrant with Wings can Deep Strike or not, though I am of the opinion that it can.

As the rules for being able to Deep Strike are listed under the movement rules of jump infantry, I think winged Hive Tyrants can deep strike, too!

Greets
Schepp himself

Yeah, I discussed it with my group and we have all decided that it can unless explicitly stated by GW that it can't.