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changemod wrote:
Isn’t the Heraldor the sculpt that was so universally mocked they changed it?

Well, the 2 Heraldors were out too close together to not have be created simultaneously.

And GW doesn't change sculpt based on Internet trolling.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/18/18th-may-rules-preview-command-abilities-and-command-pointsgw-homepage-post-2/

There's no stratagems! Hooray!

Lord Kragan wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/18/18th-may-rules-preview-command-abilities-and-command-pointsgw-homepage-post-2/

There's no stratagems! Hooray!

Doesn't seem that different from stratagems, its just also tied to hero-hammer.
Command points from warscrolls to activate hero abilities.

Oh good they're adding the thing I hate in 8th to AoS.

They are adding the thing I love to AoS!

 streetsamurai wrote:

 Crimson wrote:

 mmzero252 wrote:
I'd have preferred the double turn gone rather than barely changed. I don't think persistent spells and being able to choose on a tie are going to make up for the awful system.

Yep. It is massively impactful, and doesn't even simulate anything. It is pure game mechanics, and bad game mechanics at that.

yeah that's terrible. I hope that this is not their idea of adding more depth to the game, or else 2nd edition will be as shallow as the first one

Aye, suppose I won't be moving on the Snake Lady Army then, which my wallet is happy about. AOS has far too many NPE for me, although I could have been interested if they removed my #1 ... but so it goes. Will keep watching from the sidelines, see what cool minis come out to be parlayed into tighter games.

- Salvage

I love AoS' take on CP infinitely more than 40k's. Linking it to abilities on characters makes some potentially new interesting choices at the list-building level, and they're far more finite in scope, so no formation abuse to farm obscene amounts.

Also, not-linking them to strategems means retroactive books won't be at an instant deficit (or in the case of 40k armies without books yet)

Voss wrote:

Lord Kragan wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/18/18th-may-rules-preview-command-abilities-and-command-pointsgw-homepage-post-2/

There's no stratagems! Hooray!

Doesn't seem that different from stratagems, its just also tied to hero-hammer.
Command points from warscrolls to activate hero abilities.

Which you get one per round. Which is a fancy way of saying: one per turn unless you picked a batallion, then you get one more point per game. So basically business as usual bar, in some fringe cases, a turn where you get two command abilities. That's nowhere close the level of saturation that 40k has.

Lord Kragan wrote:

Voss wrote:

Lord Kragan wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/18/18th-may-rules-preview-command-abilities-and-command-pointsgw-homepage-post-2/

There's no stratagems! Hooray!

Doesn't seem that different from stratagems, its just also tied to hero-hammer.
Command points from warscrolls to activate hero abilities.

Which you get one per round. Which is a fancy way of saying: one per turn unless you picked a batallion, then you get one more point per game. So basically business as usual bar, in some fringe cases, a turn where you get two command abilities. That's nowhere close the level of saturation that 40k has.

Still pretty bad. Armies that have useful battalions get multiple command abilities and those without don't get a thing as they watch the others get buffs. Fun.

pm713 wrote:

don't get a thing.

I gotta love that hyperbole. WHOW they can do two abilities once out of five times per game! Meanwhile mine only gets to be stuck at once per battleround all game long.

And it becomes more funny once you hear that, according to a guy with insider info, battallions no longer give bonus artifacts unless you spend a command point to get get another artifiact.

One thing to keep in mind is that you can save yours for later turns.

Lord Kragan wrote:

pm713 wrote:

don't get a thing.

I gotta love that hyperbole. WHOW they can do two abilities once out of five times per game! Meanwhile mine only gets to be stuck at once per battleround all game long.

And it becomes more funny once you hear that, according to a guy with insider info, battallions no longer give bonus artifacts unless you spend a command point to get get another artifiact.

That's not the hyperbole. The hyperbole is me saying that GW simply wants to push out everyone who played Fantasy so they cover up their awful treatment of it and before you know it AOS will get the same thing and then you'll all be like me.

Hyperbole is fun.

It seems to me like a better option for alternate turns, CP, and stratagems would to have a small pool of CP generated each turn, each player secretly bids none to all their CP to see who goes first that turn, and ties go to the loser of the previous turn or a roll off on the 1st.

Lord Kragan wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/18/18th-may-rules-preview-command-abilities-and-command-pointsgw-homepage-post-2/

There's no stratagems! Hooray!

The three generic command abilities is pretty much exactly the same way stratagems were introduced

Lord Kragan wrote:

Voss wrote:

Lord Kragan wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/18/18th-may-rules-preview-command-abilities-and-command-pointsgw-homepage-post-2/

There's no stratagems! Hooray!

Doesn't seem that different from stratagems, its just also tied to hero-hammer.
Command points from warscrolls to activate hero abilities.

Which you get one per round. Which is a fancy way of saying: one per turn unless you picked a batallion, then you get one more point per game. So basically business as usual bar, in some fringe cases, a turn where you get two command abilities. That's nowhere close the level of saturation that 40k has.

One per round plus one for each battalion at the start of the game. So not 'one turn where you can get two'. But turns where you can accumulate and a pile you can cheese during list building. That sounds a lot like 40k strats to me.

Just stack em up and use a bunch at once to hand out extra attacks, rerolls, immunity to battleshock and etc when it matters.

I like it overall. Allows for more tactical play by letting players use extra command avilities but only in a limited fashion.

My hope is that armies do not get army-specific stratagems, instead the focus is placed mostly on the characters and their Command Abilities.

Combine that with the method by which you generate Command points and it really helps to stem the problems 40k has with the Command Dice.

EDIT: Even if they do include army-specific strategms, the way you generate command points is so much more elegant. I wish 40k did it this way. Everyone is generally equal and the system does not massively favor battalion/detachment spam.

We don't have 100% of the rules, but it doesn't take long for the whiners and salt shakers to come out of the woodworks.

I just got into Idoneth Deepkin. Our cheapest Battalion is 100 points. Paying that and then also getting ONE extra command point through the entire game seems like a decent trade-off.

I'm sure they'll make more adjustments to other battalions through older battletomes, and they've already announced that some commanders have gotten cheaper, probably to count for the fact that they may not be able to get their command ability off every turn depending on how you use those points. Like I said, we don't have 100% of the rules, so a lot of this is just conjecture.

So far, I like the changes to the rules. One per turn is easy to keep track of. Getting one whole extra point for having a battalion isn't game breaking. It's not an auto-win, and it's often more a tax than anything. Many players will still prefer to have better efficiency of points rather than a situational bonus.

Here's hoping AoS keeps going in, what I perceive to be, the right direction.

 Red_Five wrote:
My hope is that armies do not get army-specific stratagems, instead the focus is placed mostly on the characters and their Command Abilities.

Combine that with the method by which you generate Command points and it really helps to stem the problems 40k has with the Command Dice.

EDIT: Even if they do include army-specific strategms, the way you generate command points is so much more elegant. I wish 40k did it this way. Everyone is generally equal and the system does not massively favor battalion/detachment spam.

I hope they don't add stratagems at all, just let command points be for command abilities and all is well. Army allegiance already fills the gap that army-specific stratagems do in 40k (and then some).

I was mistaken I guess :(

 Eldarain wrote:

 Red_Five wrote:
My hope is that armies do not get army-specific stratagems, instead the focus is placed mostly on the characters and their Command Abilities.

Combine that with the method by which you generate Command points and it really helps to stem the problems 40k has with the Command Dice.

EDIT: Even if they do include army-specific strategms, the way you generate command points is so much more elegant. I wish 40k did it this way. Everyone is generally equal and the system does not massively favor battalion/detachment spam.

They specifically said in the article that new books are going to have more ways of generating points though so there will be a codex/index type disparity between those who have to save up over turns and those who have extra from relics etc.

They didn't say it was related to relics or anything of that nature.

If I had to guess, it's not going to be tied strictly to army books. I'd guess we'll see scenarios and various other situational things to change it added via campaign books and the GHB.

pm713 wrote:

Lord Kragan wrote:

Voss wrote:

Lord Kragan wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/18/18th-may-rules-preview-command-abilities-and-command-pointsgw-homepage-post-2/

There's no stratagems! Hooray!

Doesn't seem that different from stratagems, its just also tied to hero-hammer.
Command points from warscrolls to activate hero abilities.

Which you get one per round. Which is a fancy way of saying: one per turn unless you picked a batallion, then you get one more point per game. So basically business as usual bar, in some fringe cases, a turn where you get two command abilities. That's nowhere close the level of saturation that 40k has.

Still pretty bad. Armies that have useful battalions get multiple command abilities and those without don't get a thing as they watch the others get buffs. Fun.

I don't think this is right.

I read is as everyone generates 1 per turn, which goes into a pool that can be used at any time, plus you get 1 at the start of the game per Warscroll Battalion. So everyone will get 5 to use over the course of the game, plus 1 or 2 depending on the number of battalions you use (because most won't be able to squeeze more than this number of battalions in.

I think this opens up some interesting strategies, particularly with the new generic command abilities. You could save your points up to use on turn 2 or 3, giving you perhaps a pool of 2-5 command points to help you charge, run, avoid battleshock, or one of your hero's abilities, or perhaps you play one every turn. And of course, you need your heroes nearby in order to use them, meaning movement is a bit more important.

Hopefully the battalions go down in points or at least stay the same.

What I hope to see is some wascroll tweaks to have more Command Abilities on some factions. Sylvaneths for instance only have Alarielle having a command ability, thus making the "Everyone can use their command abilities" useless for Sylvaneths. Similar case goes for Kharadrons, with only the Admiral and Brokk having command abilities.

I really, really like this take on command points. Introducing strategems would've increased the complexity of the game and slowed it down (as we have seen in 40k from index > codex). What we get instead is a way to make more use of existing abilities, introducing more tactical choice without requiring any sort of change to existing units or battletomes. Very clever!

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/05/19/19th-may-faction-focus-hosts-of-slaaneshgw-homepage-post-3/

Summoning

That’s not all – Slaanesh is receiving some powerful new summoning mechanics in the new edition. Using the new Depravity Points system, you’ll be able to bring anything from Daemonettes to a Keeper of Secrets onto the tabletop WITHOUT spending reinforcement points. Generating Depravity Points is very thematic– you’ll score one for every wound your Heroes inflict on a foe without killing them, or every non-fatal wound they receive in return – representing how the servants of the Dark Prince draw power from suffering and cruelty. They’re not the only faction to be receiving summoning changes, either…

Interesting summoning mechanic. So have all single wound models and then your opponent can't summon? Don't attack the multi wound enemies as well? I guess not a good tactic but a tactic to play mind games if you know your opponent wants to summon and it's a way he/she can't.

As they dont cost reinforcement points, if you dont summon anything, they you dont lost anything. You can only go up.

How many demons can you summon per depravity point though?
If its a whole unit of demonettes for 1 point then that "wound but no killing" restriction doesn't matter.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
How many demons can you summon per depravity point though?
If its a whole unit of demonettes for 1 point then that "wound but no killing" restriction doesn't matter.

Going off of how Maggotkin works, it's whole units/monsters with different amounts of points for different sizes of units and a restriction of no named characters.

It's probably increments of 6, Slaanesh's favored number. Named characters may more may noy be present since maggotkin can summon in named ones with their version.