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A flame war? Really?

Allies are a cool concept. The application was on par with most of GW rules work, and then doing what they did to Chaos drove me nuts. They are going to fix all this mess by removing the entire lot of it. Better than giving everyone else alling systems or even just taking another whack at it given their track record. Ah well, live and learn. The models are still great though.

But if they remove the allies concept from the codex(s), what do you have left? I mean, aren't Inquisitors supposed to be able to call upon other Imperial forces? If so, then why change an allies system that's, IMO, pretty good as is?

augfubuoy wrote:But if they remove the allies concept from the codex(s), what do you have left? I mean, aren't Inquisitors supposed to be able to call upon other Imperial forces? If so, then why change an allies system that's, IMO, pretty good as is?

Its true, Inquisitors are supposed to be feared by all (except for a few quirky SM) and they are supposed to be able to take command of both IG and SM forces to see their objectives completed. The fact you cant take both IG and SM is probably just to keep balance as we dont need SM running around with Leman Russes and Valks *shudder*
Bad enough as is that IG can hop some GK Termies into a valk and rush the enemy real quick. Not broken, but a little crazy as it is.

It'll be interesting to see what they decide, although a dissolution of the Imperium Allies system will be kinda sad. Even if it is fair in comparison to the other races.

Oh well, I guess I'll just wait and see....

I do think allies will go away completely or be self contained within the codex's (do do confusing outdated rules). That way we don't have GKT droping from Valks, or this Vulkan/Sisters stupidity.

WH - goes to Codex: SOB - they really don't need allies, just round out their units a bit more, keep the assasins and Inquizition.

DH - as they are in need of more reworking that WH here is where I see allies staying. However like others have said, everthing they are allowed to ally with is containd in the DH codex for simplicity and balance. That way we don't have to wonder what units are still legal when the SM or Guard codex's are updated.

Gwar! wrote:

Elric of Grans wrote:If you care, try searching for it because I cant link it because it is unsubstantiated; I have better things to do with my time than justify myself on the Internet because I know I am not right.

Fixed it for you.

Refusing to answer a Challenge is the same as losing it

Oh jeez. Do a bit of research, and you might find that he is right. If you do and he is wrong, okay. Get off your high horse for a minute.

I am gonna go along with the general consensus and say they are going to remove allies in the new codices, its the way the game is headed. As a sister's player I actuality like the idea. By taking out allies it will probably grant more options to those lists. From a metagame stand point its also a good thing frees up possibly for more builds since inquisitor 2 mystics + hood and sanctuary isn't a requirement anymore. I think Gwars idea of how the codex should work is actually pretty good, of course GW won't do it because its a good idea.

I do say this with one caveat, that is the rules for the 4 assassin models. Since 2nd edition (maybe even before I didn't play rogue trader) imperial assassins were able to be taken by all imperial army forces. If they do allow any allies at all, I think it will only be the 4 assassins which is in the fluff and has had clear precedents set.

dumplingman wrote:I do say this with one caveat, that is the rules for the 4 assassin models. Since 2nd edition (maybe even before I didn't play rogue trader) imperial assassins were able to be taken by all imperial army forces. If they do allow any allies at all, I think it will only be the 4 assassins which is in the fluff and has had clear precedents set.

There are actually 6 Assassin Houses, the two that have not had any rules so far are the Venenum Temple (specialists in poisoning their targets) and the Vanus Temple (unknown methods)

Gwar! wrote:

There are actually 6 Assassin Houses, the two that have not had any rules so far are the Venenum Temple (specialists in poisoning their targets) and the Vanus Temple (unknown methods)

I rather like the allies rules, even though everyone throws a hissy fit about DH Inq with Mystics. I suspect that if Daemon and Drop Pod assault armies were not so popular all of the sudden, no one would care at all, just like no one really cared for the past what, 5 years?

I do think the allies rules could stand some simplification, and I really think that CSM and Daemons needed allies rules something fierce, but I think removing them totally would be a mistake.